Warmogs change made it weird

Godalor·Jan 18, 2015·26 votes·2,366 views

The Warmogs change in the Preseason made the Item rather weird for me. First it seemed to function like Garens passive, but I never tried it, because I don't play tanks that often. But last week my friend told me the Passive timer for the 3% max HP regen would be procced by minions and monsters. Now I believe that makes the Item rather useless to buy since most other tankitems simply have a higher value in stats and fill an Itemslot much better than with a 2500G 800 HP 1%HP/5 (up to 3%maxHP/5 when being useless, aka not farming, not fighting, not tanking)

I'd suggest either making the Passive right now not to be stopped by minions and monsters from going up to 3%maxHP/5 or adding a new Passive like Athene's Unholy Grail's underappreciated second Passive. It would look a little bit like this:

UNIQUE Passive: Restores 10% of your maximum Health over 5 seconds on kill or assist.

Discuss...

23 Comments

FantasySniperJan 19, 20154 votes

The 3% passive comes up whenever roaming between lanes or camps and feels fairly noticeable when it's up, just 1% max health regen can be considered sustain, but 3 times that is insane.

There's a problem with a secondary passive like that: It becomes harder to shut down tanks. A tank is literally built to be hard to shut down, but if they or their team is fed it's even harder, and that's just plain making the problem worse. (Like Leviathan's)

junglerboy16Jan 19, 20152 votes

Yeah, except true tanks (the guys who would ever build warmog's) are in a pretty weak spot right now.

FantasySniperJan 19, 20151 votes

Sejuani and Braum are actually pretty good right now, and maybe a decent Nautilus or Shen will get a lot of use out of it. Otherwise, it's a known issue most of the playerbase is incapable of utilizing real tanks.

Champion SkinJan 19, 20152 votes

Let's say you are at 20% health it would take you 80%/3%=26,6666*5 (since it is hp per 5)= 133,33 sec

So it would take you about 2 min to regen from 20% to full hp if the passive is not knocked off And honestly it would probably be faster to back, buy and run back with homeguards

FantasySniperJan 19, 20151 votes

Let's say we got Zac at max level (He has the lowest value Hp5 out of those considered "true tanks"). With Warmog's alone, he'll get 108.2 Hp5. It'll take 140 secs to get to max health from 0. With a Spirit Visage, he has 165 Hp5, it takes 104 secs to get to max health from 0. (No masteries, because I'm not going to bother with Perseverance and Second Wind)

That much Hp5 ensures you don't need to back and can continue to keep a presence for teamfights or pushing. When roaming the map, which can take upwards of 10 seconds, that's a lot health being given back for free. A tank that can walk in and out of fights just to come back with their health reserves ready for combat again is scary.

kDrakariJan 19, 20151 votes

If you think about it as regening from low health, yeah it's a lot slower than backing. But if you're sieging lets say you're a tank and take 20% of your HP in poke when pushing in a minion wave. By the time the next wave comes 30 seconds later you'll have healed 18% of that back and be practically fresh. Even if you take more poke than that and you factor in that the time you have to regen goes from when the previous wave DIES rather than arrives, it still gets your team a lot more waves to siege with before having to back off. It also recovers ~10% of your HP during say 15 seconds it takes to rotate or roam or whatever. In other words, the passive may be worthless if you take 80% of your HP in a single fight since you'd have to back either way, but if you only take a small portion of your health at any given time then you can get a lot of it back.

Or, to put it more numerically, if you were to spend 2 minutes between each back, a champion without Warmog's would be able to take 100% of their max health in damage, while a champion WITH Warmog's would be able to take 180% of their max health in damage, hypothetically. Even if they never were out of combat the entire time they would still have 124% max health to work with.

At least, that's the theory. In reality tanks get 100-0 just like everyone else if they're on the losing team, with the best they can hope for is maybe managing to have it be only 100-10 instead, which makes the near immunity to small poke damage very occasionally seem pretty irrelevant.

GodalorJan 20, 20151 votes

Actually, you're forgetting the 8-second timer before the passive jumps to 3% regen, so getting poked once in a while by whatever champion there is will immediately reset the regen to 1% for the next 8 seconds, not to mention that the time you'll have 3% regen from one minionwave to another is cut down to a minimum of 22 seconds just by that already.

It would be nice if the regen could ramp up. I have something like this in mind: after 3 seconds of not taking damage you get 2% regen and after another 3 seconds it goes up to 3%. Taking damage will set it down to 2%. Taking damage again in the following 3 seconds will completely set it back to 1% again. This way an enemy would have to continually attack the tank to prevent him from healing up insanely fast again. Of course this is assuming that minions don't proc it all the time.

Meep ManJan 19, 20153 votes

A reminder to everyone that it is 3% max health per 5 seconds, not per second.

KidSpectreJan 18, 20152 votes

So, you want item 3084 ... but better.

sungoldJan 19, 20151 votes

its just a good item for tanks ^^ it would be cool on SR

CerbearusJan 19, 20152 votes

So you mean Overlord's Bloodmail? item 3084

sungoldJan 19, 20151 votes

i wish we could have this item or atleast the passive of this item on SR

junglerboy16Jan 19, 20152 votes

I'd love it if they had Overlord's Blood mail on SR, it always seemed like a cool item to me.

sungoldJan 19, 20151 votes

ikr i would like it too

qetzelJan 18, 20151 votes

If your change to the cooldown would go through it would cause many problems. Junglers could buy it first and have no trouble at all in the jungle. Laners would regen health far too easily.

I am against removing it for jungle monsters but would like to try removing it from minion damage, although the cooldown may have to be increased.

OperationDEEZ1Jan 18, 20151 votes

R.I.P Tanks 2009-2015

NarasimhaJan 19, 20151 votes

The issue with your idea is that it would make Baron much more trivial.

junglerboy16Jan 19, 20155 votes

I think he meant non epic monsters, meaning not Baron.

Remlap1223Jan 19, 20151 votes

Well that and the fact that you'd never build Sunfire and Warmog's on the same build. I dunno, I don't like it. The secondary passive will never be balanced the way it is.

gubigubiJan 19, 20151 votes

Ya the new warmog passive feels really strange I just don't buy it anymore. Even before I rarely did.

theDeblinJan 19, 20151 votes

Honestly, my major gripe isn't with the item itself, it seems designed to do something fairly specific (allow you to swap lanes directly between fights or ganks instead of relying on homeguard/roaming boots), it's more that it BECOMES useless in combination with sunfire, which would otherwise be the other half of the big-health build. Well, not useless, but you have to micromanage your path through the jungle instead of taking the shortest route, when it seems like the shortest route is kinda the point of the item.

Ale non è maleJan 20, 20151 votes

Warmog passive is actually no sense, because rewards Warmog buyers for not being in the middle of the battle...except that Warmog users are likely going to be tanks, which job IS to be in the middle of the right and soak up damage for the allies. On top of that, they subtracted 200 hp from it, which can be key for a tank to survive a bit longer and allow his mates to act, and the picture is complete

Warmog got to be tank item, and has to be thought for tanks that needs health

Hard PenetratorJan 20, 20151 votes

You want to make tank item only viable? Are you crazy? At least smack there some AD so ADC could use it.

Warmog mechanic is fine because hp regen is pretty powerful. If you want to see how that worked earlier recall old doran shield and philo stacking meta. You were literally winning your lanes by playing passive and focusing on csing because enemy wasn't able to poke you hard/long enough to kill you.

Warmog like some other items (gunblade, rageblade, nashor etc.) is only good on handful of champions. If you change it to be stronger ppl will start to abuse it.