I'm Jhin against Syndra

ACENOX·Oct 8, 2016·33 votes·2,899 views

we're both in late game, 6 slotted.

And i can't do shit, but watch her press R and kill me with a point and click spell. I tried everything, buying maw, buying phantom dancer (and i need to hit her) but i still get one-shot. Her E alone removed 60% of my hp.

So how did i win? i charged my 4th hit, pressed youmu, then flashed to unleash a crit with infinity edge+900 ad+RFC proc to oneshot her. Before she kills me.

Is this the game you want people? to win by killing someone in 0.2 sec before they kill you in 0.2 sec, instead of showing your skill, your vision on the game and your decision?

because i sure don't want

season 6 is the worst fucking season.

76 Comments

DunkinNoobsOct 8, 201637 votes

Don't 1v1 Syndra as the adc. Jesus christ people this isn't rocket science.

RavenMagusOct 8, 20169 votes

That wasn't the point of the post.

The point was that League in many cases has become rocket tag, where you either kill your opponent instantly or they kill you instantly.

This has become the case in just about any late game with ADCs. Syndra - and other mages - have to have the burst to kill an ADC instantly in under a second, or the ADC will kill them just as fast (and with undodgeable auto attacks too).

AbyssphereOct 8, 201612 votes

When has Burst Mage vs ADC in the late game ever not been "kill them immediately or die", though? The problem with this thread is that it talks about this as if it's a new thing when champions like Syndra have always had 100-0ing enemies in one combo as their modus operandi. The only part of this situation that's reliant on new developments is Jhin, because he himself is a newly released champion, and he happens to be one of the more bursty ADCs in the game.

I mean, what could Riot actually do to make 6 item squishy duels not about instagibbing? You're talking about glass cannon vs glass cannon here. At least if you were talking about something like Jinx vs Azir you could have an argument that sustained damage champions shouldn't be killing people instantly but Syndra and Jhin are designed to have tons of burst. Jhin's auto attack paradigm in particular is supposed to be "I sacrifice sustained damage in exchange for having a lot of upfront damage".

The damage creep stuff the boards have latched onto this season is nonsense only coming from "keystones do damage, therefore there's more damage than before". If damage was noticeably lower at six items than it currently is then nobody would even bother to itemise for damage.

It Hertz When IPOct 8, 20162 votes

The OP isn't talking about getting deleted by a combo, he's talking about Syndra's ult ALONE 100-0'ing him, even with resistances.

SinlaireOct 8, 20169 votes

which is a fallacy. Syndra's ult doesnt do shit if she hasn't stacked up 1-3 orbs from her Q before hand and placed them within ult range with her E.

EVEN if the only thing she landed on Jhin was an R, she still had to prep before hand with Q and E placement.

which is EXACTLY no different from how OP stated he went and readied 4th shot, popped youmuu's, and flash crit her to kill her.

people are placing too much importance on Syndra's R when it literally has to be scaling into a fight by throwing her entire rotation first to get maximum effect. even if she only landed R, she still had to do the first bit to get the most out of atleast the R.

R is not a one shot kill ever. Idiots who dont understand kits are the biggest killers.

Auz the RipperOct 8, 20161 votes

the post clearly said her E did 60% of his health

DarkSunSovereignOct 8, 20163 votes

Well, that's impossible. Don't believe me? I'm getting this from my other comment.

Syndra full combo with 7 spheres is

1980 + 345%AP

Jhin has 1985 hp at level 18. You had 30+13+40=83 MR. With PD her damage would be reduced to (100/183)*0.88 = 0.48 48% of her original damage. That is 950+ 166%AP. So, to deal all of your HP as damage, she would need 1035/1.66=623 AP to kill you (assuming no penetration, this I calculated just for fun).

I can't find the game you're talking about in your match history, so let's assume her build is something like item 3165 item 3116 item 3089 item 3135 item 3157 item 3020 , which is a reasonable Syndra build. There she has 634 AP. There she has say 15 pen from sorcs+ 15 from runes and masteries+35% from void staff. Since you have 83 MR, that is reduced to 24 effective MR. That means her damage is reduced to 70% of her original dmg (with PD).

Now, since you have Maw, that means you get a 353 hp shield for free. That means your effective hp is 2338 (not counting MR). So her damage becomes...

(1980 + 3,45*634)0.7=2917 damage. Wow. 579 less damage and you'd live. That's a single ability's worth of damage. That means a support shielding you means you live. That means dodging ANYTHING would have let you live. A GA would have let you live. Someone standing next to you would scare Syndra into letting you live.

Now please explain how you managed to get hit by her Q, her W and her E and how she then didn't die after getting in range to ult, and how you didn't hit a single auto attack to lifesteal.

Auz the RipperOct 8, 20163 votes

A: not the OP, not my game B: What probably happened is the Syndra used Q and E at the same time, giving the illusion of 60% in one hit. C: I'm part of the party that believes the Jhin shouldn't be in 1000 units of Syndra if he can at all help it D: i'm not sure what the rest of your post is responding to

Vistha KaiOct 13, 20161 votes

Not only will kill them as fast, but failing to kill an ADC results in them lifestealing back to full at the same time.

2yordles1cupcakeOct 8, 201613 votes

Riot "It will seperate the good 0.2 sec killers from the bad 0.2 sec killers."

TyrekGoldenspearOct 8, 201613 votes

Syndra is a burst mage though, and you're a squishy ADC.

What did you expect would happen?

You cannot build enough defensive stuff to survive a combo without skimping damage items, which is what the tanks are for.

AhristocatsOct 8, 20163 votes

i expected not to survive a burst, but to be able to play around it, if oneshoting her before she does the burst is playing around it, then alright.

LankPantsOct 8, 20164 votes

You play around her burst in the same way you do any other burst. Rather than going ham and trying to pull some dumb 1v1 or running out ahead of your frontline you play back and let your frontline tank the damage first. Unless your tanks are godawful Syndra can't just walk past them to burst you, she'd get CCed and killed the second she walked into their range. If your tanks are terrible enough that Syndra can walk past them to burst you your chances in that game probably weren't great in the first place.

Vistha KaiOct 8, 201612 votes

Ya know. With 6 items I could do that in Season 3 with just her basic spells.

Sure there's a problem, but at this point you are complaining about every glass cannon in the game. Even about yourself, since you did the same thing with Jhin.

ACENOXOct 8, 20164 votes

i prefer dying by her Q which has a delay, or her W since when i crit i have more movespeed than master yi, rather than dying by a point and click 2k damage with the only way to survive is to do a 2k damage no counterplay basic attack.

welcome to season 6, a billion of damage point and click spells, a billion of damage crit autoattacks, where you must kill your target in a fraction of second before it kills you, and there are no other way. Annie Viktor Veigar exactly the same shit happens with those champs, Orianna being the only one i can think about where you must not kill her before she kills you.

Vistha KaiOct 8, 20167 votes

Except the QEW combo I do, gives you less time to react than her ult, which actually requires a setup, unless she walked up to you with 3 balls ready, at which point why are you even in a position to get ulted just like that?

Champion SkinOct 8, 201612 votes

And i can't do shit, but watch her press R and kill me with a point and click spell. I tried everything, buying maw, buying phantom dancer (and i need to hit her) but i still get one-shot. Her E alone removed 60% of my hp.

If your problem is being bursted 100-0... why not get item 3102 ... which will make her E... deal 0 damage and it won't stun you (unless she moves close enough to knock off the shield with her Q or W)

Also even without the spell shield it still gives 70 MR and 300 hp

paperbIadeOct 8, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Champion Skin,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6GoEccpo,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2016-10-08T13:17:32.376+0000)

If your problem is being bursted 100-0... why not get ... which will make her E... deal 0 damage and it won't stun you (unless she moves close enough to knock off the shield with her Q or W)

Also even without the spell shield it still gives 70 MR and 300 hp

item 3135

DarkSunSovereignOct 8, 20161 votes

I'm getting this from my other comment.

Syndra full combo with 7 spheres is

1980 + 345%AP

Now, since you have Maw, that means you get a 353 hp shield for free. That means your effective hp is 2338 (not counting MR). So her damage becomes...

Now please explain how you managed to get hit by her Q, her W and her E and how she then didn't die after getting in range to ult, and how you didn't hit a single auto attack to lifesteal.

SmileInABoxOct 8, 201610 votes

I think you made your skill in desision making abundantly clear by trying to 1v1 a six item Syndra as a squishy carry.

DarkSunSovereignOct 8, 201610 votes

Syndra full combo with 7 spheres is

1980 + 345%AP

Now, since you have Maw, that means you get a 353 hp shield for free. That means your effective hp is 2338 (not counting MR). So her damage becomes...

Now please explain how you managed to get hit by her Q, her W and her E and how she then didn't die after getting in range to ult, and how you didn't hit a single auto attack to lifesteal.

CasterGilgameshOct 8, 20163 votes

people just like to complain about champions picked at worlds once a champion becomes flavor of the month at the LCS it instantly becomes op and everyone starts playing it same thing happened to my Soraka

SidestepOct 8, 20161 votes

I agree with everything, besides soraka part. She is braindead easy/safe for the positive results. Source: My raka win rates.

CasterGilgameshOct 8, 20161 votes

i wont say soraka didnt need nerfs but the rework honestly that was supposed to make her less "toxic" made it worse.Also she traded a lot of damage and CC for her healing :/.Also for the longest time every time i tried to pick soraka people would dodge saying "GG troll champion" yet the next day she sees play in the LCS people insta ban her. but thats besides the point every year a champion that hardly sees play gets picked up and then everyone blows the nerf whistle.

SidestepOct 8, 20161 votes

It's because people don't realize how strong healers are in league.

Also, I agree with your second statement about being picked and then people q.q about nerfs.

Champion SkinOct 8, 20162 votes

item 3102 seems pretty insane at preventing a mage from 100-0 someone with being able to negate 1 ability and giving 70 MR and 300 hp... though the problem is long range allies procing the shield (things like RekSai burrowed Q... doesn't deal much damage but it is still enough to break the shield and the shield has such a long cooldown where you have to stay far away from enemy champions)

It is also really useless if you end up against anyone dealing physical damage

LiofaOct 8, 20169 votes

How is this garbage being upvoted, is gameplay really that bad. Jhin literally has the most utility out of any ADC, with more range and pick potential than anyone but Ashe on top of his ridiculous execution damage but nah gotta cry about not being able to tank too. Syndra is bullshit but we past that, this is just flat out stupid.

Ace Access Oct 8, 20168 votes

late game syndra isn't someone the adc is meant to 1v1

CatastropOct 8, 20167 votes

Are you really complaining about a 6 item mage? Like why do you, the ADC feel it's your job to do anything against Syndra? I'm quite sure you wouldn't even try to fight a fed Talon/Zed.

Rock MDOct 8, 20165 votes

You're long ranged with ass tons of poke. Either force her out of fights with W/R or destroy her frontline first and engage on her after you team blows her important CDs.

Backup4nowOct 8, 20165 votes

A lot of people in the comments are talking about how the OP is dumb because he complained about a burst mage bursting a squishy, when it's pretty clear he's complaining about the fact that the matchup boils down to 'who pressed their oneshot button first'. He doesn't like the fact that the game revolves around completely undodgeable, ranged, obscene amounts of damage to the point where the first to fire wins the trade, especially when it boils down to ONE point and click ability vs ONE auto attack.

The Great DivideOct 12, 20162 votes

No.

They both had to go to prep to do what they did. Syndra ability prepping. And Jhin autoing 3 times.

I find it more absurd that jhin one shot her with just that crit auto, rather than syndra bursting him..... Like that's her job to burst him, not him to her (and in one auto -_-)

Backup4nowOct 13, 20161 votes

prep is not a valid counterplay or reason to be obnoxious. That's like saying "well annie had to press E a few times while walking around" or "well ryze (before the most recent rework) had to press Q a few times before entering the fight". Jhin can hold that auto for, what, 10 seconds at a time? You think that's an appropriate window of opportunity just because he auto attacked 3 times with his .9 or whatever attack speed? Meanwhile syndra can just place balls and grab them to pretty much indefinitely have a 7 sphere ult at all times, and it doesn't even ruin her mana bar like everyone says it does. God forbid one knows where the other is and has flash.

The Great DivideOct 13, 20161 votes

Yes it it is. If I have 7 balls out and am clearly waltzing into a fight while holding them with w: do something. It's not like the whole team is going to sit there and go "oh hey, make a path for syndra to get to the adc"

And again, if it's 1v1, then everything goes out the window, because some situations you should avoid 1v1s.

This whole game is respecting when the other champions can do what they want to do. If syndra has 7 balls back/ have your tank tank/disrupt. Same for Jhin: if he's holding on to crit shot walking around like a monkey back off, or have a tank tank/disrupt.

All SkillzzOct 8, 20164 votes

you coulda ulted her since she got no mobility if 1 shot hit her she is 100% dead from the other 3 if she was alone.

AhristocatsOct 8, 20163 votes

new jhin ulti does no damage if you're full hp, it does 160(+20% bonus AD) before armor, if syndra dodges 1 or 2 shots, she will survives. and the slow duration is lower than the delay between shots.

and people must be really retarded to not block the shots, everytime the tank blocked the ulti.

Dominick DestineOct 8, 20164 votes

Did you try not getting into her face when her ult is up?

Positioninig and timing are a very important part of this game.

UlriahOct 8, 20164 votes

Syndra is a burst mage, she is and always has been meant to kill ADC's instantly.

What's the problem again?

TricolorStarOct 8, 20164 votes

Stop taking ADC's into the midlane and you'll fix your problem. The midlane is for high-octane laser light shows, not damage over time like the botlane. A skilled Syndra, Vel'Koz, or Lissandra will literally flip you inside out in less than 2 seconds before you can get your crits or ult off.

Remember when Quinn was everywhere? That stopped because nuclear reactors like Vel and Syndra came into play.

TyrekGoldenspearOct 8, 20161 votes

Lol, flip inside out.

Syndra would probably do that to anyone.

TricolorStarOct 8, 20161 votes

Actually I'm pretty sure she did that to some monks in her lore then proceeded to lift a 3 square mile chunk of Ionia into the air.

No wonder she wipes the floor with Jhin, he's just a crazy guy with a gun against a physical god.

TyrekGoldenspearOct 8, 20162 votes

Unfortunately for Jhin he imbued his bullets with magic, so depending on Syndra's power she will be impossible to snipe.

Plus it gets really cool when you realize that Syndra is holding her fortress up the entire time she does other things.

TricolorStarOct 8, 20161 votes

She literally has so much power it causes a pressure change around her. That's part of what killed the monks in her lore. I'm sure that if she actually focused on something all of our ears would pop.

The Great DivideOct 9, 20161 votes

The midlane is for high-octane laser light shows

I love this so much

RckwestOct 8, 20163 votes

use your ult from base

Papa SlothyOct 9, 20163 votes

first of all, her e does not do ANY damage at all, second, she is BUILT to kill squishies like jhin

stop being anecdotal

DengedenOct 8, 20162 votes

2 squishies vs 2 squishies late game and you blame it on S6? Sad.

ZT XperimentorOct 8, 20162 votes

Like I should sympathize with a champion that primarily points & clicks for their own damage; like it's hard for marksmen to auto-attack an immobile mage. Try building smarter, not tryharder. item 3156 item 3139 item 3091 item 3094

And no it's never been the game I wanted, I've been one of the few against speeding up the game; both in the escalation of damage & mobility, and the lack of positioning forethought.

NiyumiOct 8, 20162 votes

"Just play a tank!" -- except everyone can instagib a tank just as fast as a squishy.

The Great DivideOct 12, 20162 votes

I will agree that season 6 is the worst, but because they released Jhin. The fact that you're whining about Syndra while playing one of the worst designed ADCs in the game is just sad. Syndra pretty much only does damage and has conditional cc and is mid range. She is squishy af and has no mobility (not even ridiculous speed boosts).

Jhin has ridiculously long range that also acts as crippling CC, so even when he's behind he can do absurds amount of work (unlike any other adc who is more rewarding if you shut them down). I'm very very very sorry that your little busted champion can't beat every champ in the game 1v1. But honestly, I'm glad syndra kicked your butt. Jhin deserves every butt kicking in the world. (And to be very honest, you are one of the best adcs equipped to deal with her because of your high range - stop trying to display machissimo by fighting her 1v1 and be with your team)

Yes I'm salty, but even if he was UP, he still has a really stupidly designed kit (low risk ,high reward). And as an ADC, that design should never happen. Jinx gets very close when she's overtuned.