For all those wondering how Lee Sin falls off.

For Carthage··2 votes·624 views

http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Armor

This is why.

Since armor is the most scaling defense in the game and Lee lacks the Zed "% of damage dealt" and Talon's stupid amount of AoE damage + invis, straight damage Lee Sin's have a tendency to get eaten the moment they jump in. And due to the nature of armor as a defense (I.E., how the math actually works), that 200% bonus AD on his ult starts to factor to a much smaller number than you'd want.

Now, if you're wondering why Lee versing an unfed team is a much bigger problem now than before, that's more likely due to the change in scaling. Since Lee was designed with a strong early game with decidedly all right scaling, the change in how scaling by level works has actually given him a little bit of a buff by comparison to how other champions faired.

So the moral of this story is probably more along the lines of "unintended consequences to balancing actions makes players quite upset".

5 Comments

Cindikle3 votes

Lee falls off because he's single target focused. When teamfights start he doesn't bring the AoE damage a team would want. While he has ways to deal AoE damage, it's not that threatening. What's threatening about him is his ability to make plays and his mobility. Which is something easier to counter late game with a grouped team.

He's a strong duelist at all levels of the game, but doesn't actually bring much to a teamfight unless he makes a play happen. This is why he falls off. Has nothing to do with scaling.

And this doesn't mean he gets weak late game. Despite his early/mid game advantages, he's not weak late game at all.

Comparing him to Zed/Talon as well doesn't make sense. Lee can start a teamfight and make plays. Zed/Talon will only make kills. Even if they start the fight, it doesn't mean their team can back them up. Lee can make it so his team can back him up.

IMO what Lee needs is reduced range on his first Q and have it cost the total of both Q's energy. Refunding a little for landing the second Q's damage(so no Q in->fake out). This gives his Q stronger counterplay and punishes for over using it. As well as the range reduction making it so a champion with fast base movement speed doesn't get one of the longest gap closers in the game, skill shot or not. Most Lee's try to open with their W anyway to save their Q for a dash/flash. This would also further weaken his late game as he would have to get closer to Q into the enemy.

For Carthage1 votes

Straight damage Lee is basically built to be an assassin, which most assassins are single target (save your Talon and Kat).

Wise Squirrel2 votes

Lee Sin's problem is actually the fact that his kit facilitates killing newbies and getting away before competent allies of those team mates can kill you.

It is not his "power", it is his annoyance level, and god I wish I could kill him when he dives the tower to kill a squishy on my team, but I guess he just has too much bail potential (Too many dashes).

Lee Sin just pizses me off, same as Lucian and Jinx (The new generation ADCs with damage, dashes, and all the bells and whistles which they shouldn't have).

Long Dong Wukong2 votes

Can't fall off when you can send a carry across the screen to your team and then fight a 4v5

And he does plenty of AoE damage and has an AoE slow for the teamfight, and assuming he hasn't already kicked some one, has an AoE knockup ult. All of which have great ratios and missing health % on Q2.

He has everything in the game except for a (recently removed)Attack speed slow. He's been the best character in the game for like 3 years. It doesn't really matter if scrubs suck with him or not, he lets you do things other characters can't do and it makes him a premier pick. He'll stay that way too, most likely. Riot likes heavy outplay characters because of E-$ports

Earl Eulrich1 votes

prety much this. Its true that it´s a lot harder to make him work lategame than it is early on (hence the winrate), but a skilled Lee will always find a way to have a crucial impact in a fight.

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