"Omg why is there a champ that can counter my hyper mobile champ who can zip around people. There should be no champs like that! :("
FYI there are plenty of other ults that can stun/ knock up entire teams instantly if you're dumb enough to clump together 
to name a few.
http://33.media.tumblr.com/ab1e2bab6e3954bc2091d30fcd0ca56b/tumblr_nab4vnOL591r9a32bo1_400.gif
stealthfox945 votesI have no idea why so many people are crying about Annie all of a sudden. She's just a stun bot who gets wrecked in lane by long range mages.
Cosmic Warper1 votesI have no idea why so many people are crying about Annie all of a sudden. She's just a stun bot who gets wrecked in lane by long range mages.
I agree with you, but you have to understand it's probably extremely frustrating playing against annie as a melee or a champion whose effective range doesn't hover at or above 650.
Lugg4 votesSorry, but all 3 of the champs you named take time to get into position, so there is actually time to flash away. The Annie flash/Tibbers has basically zero counterplay. Any ability with zero counterplay needs nerfed.
SlampieceHawke3 votesAnd annie doesn't take time to get into position? She has to walk up to people and flash into them if she wants a whole team to get hit. It's easily telegraphed. All a sensible team has to do is scatter. Mal has a much further range on his ult and is much easier to hit more people with if you ask me. Not to mention she is squishy so if she doesn't hit enough people or the right targets, then it's not going well for her AND she just burned her flash.
Lugg3 votesHmm, let's see. Flash is instant and travels a distance of 400. Tibbers is also instant with a range of 600. So Annie can instantly stun you from 1000 range. Yeah, tons of counterplay in that.
Plus lets add in the fact that most Annies build Zhyonas. So even if you somehow survive her insane inescapable burst, you can't even do any return damage on her since her team easily finishes you off.
SlampieceHawke2 votesUnless she was in an unwarded bush, that is still very telegraphed/ escapeable despite the 1000 range you are going on about. Now we might as well talk about how vision is op or bushes need to be nerfed. I don't even have the best reflexes around, but I can still flash the moment I see an annie flash.
TotalJerk4 votesThere's also the fact that flash has a 5 minute cooldown and that she's just given up her only form of mobility whatsoever for that period once she does a flash-ult. If you can force annie to repeatedly burn flash, her job gets a lot harder.
SlampieceHawke1 votesRight! Right!
Rueian2 votesuntil she uses flash you need to stay 1000 units away from her. You cant tell if she has 3 stacks for instant stun since they havn't added a counter yet, unless you are targeting her.
TotalJerk1 votesThe 3 stack thing is bullshit, I'll concede. Last time I tried her, I'd sit on three stacks in lane and pull the Q>W combo every time I wanted to trade. I got 2 stacks? Then I Q>E>W.
Q goes out, W instantly adds the final stack and makes Q turn into a stun mid-air. An Annie with 3 stacks and all her spells up might as well have 4.
SlampieceHawke1 votesRight!
Lugg1 votesAnnie players GLADLY give up that 5 min CD since it usually results in an Ace.
Malix Farwin1 votesAnnie players GLADLY give up that 5 min CD since it usually results in an Ace.
As amumu if i miss my Q i can flash ult and create an ace as well. The fact that i have the option to either land a Q or Flash means he has more options then annie, so does every other champ with AOE CC. They could always Flash AoE CC however not all of them are reliant on it.
Malix Farwin1 votesSorry, but all 3 of the champs you named take time to get into position, so there is actually time to flash away. The Annie flash/Tibbers has basically zero counterplay. Any ability with zero counterplay needs nerfed.
All three of those champions can flash ult they just dont have to unlike annie.
Rueian2 votesthe travel skills they have are slow, and they are tanks and dont have the burst follow up unless they arn't built tank.
Lugg1 votesMalphite has travel time on his ult, so you have at least a little reaction time. It's rare to see Amumu flash ult, he usually tries the Q first which gives you warning. Gnar is the most telegraphed of the 3.
MudintheWater1 votesMost of the time Q works just because if you landed on a carry they won't be able to escape. But if you miss Q the enemy team often relaxes and thinks they have 9s of safety. I can't tell you how many times I've landed a 5 man stun with Mumu by missing a Q then flash ulting because they let me get too close after.
Strat3 votesMalphite ult is actually really slow and highly dodgable especially if he doesn't flash. Mumu ult is much shorter range than Annie ult (550 range vs nearly 900 range).
That said I don't think Annie needs a rework. She has weaknesses and strengths like any other champ.
SlampieceHawke1 votesThank you.
Marthian2 votesMeanwhile the rest of the champions that have no mobility for annie to counter.
SlampieceHawke1 votesWell many of those immobile champs have tankyness or range to compensate. And when I'm playing 
who has very low escape potential in a fight, I know to respect annie in teamfights and not facecheck bushes.
Malix Farwin2 votesMeanwhile the rest of the champions that have no mobility for annie to counter.
All these champions can beat annie if played half decently however the 3-4 assassins that people play that she can beat are the ones crying the most. i love it. I bet you forgot most of these champions even existed.
Marthian2 votesI see no ADCs.
SlampieceHawke1 votesAs a player who has low escape in teamfights, I can easily tell you that I fear champs like 
far more than I fear Annie. They have a far easier time getting to me and sticking to me without dying/ getting peeled off me than annie does.
DarthSpectrum2 votesHold on a second. Annie's CC hurts immobile champions just as much, maybe even more, than it hurts mobile champions.
A champion like LeBlanc can at least close the gap in between Annie's stuns and get out quickly, but if it is a Cassiopeia or Varus for example, good luck surviving 1 or 2 more stuns while trying to run away.
Annie has as much counterplay as 
, which is quite frankly a lot. However, until the enemy team can buy 
, 
or 
, there is nothing they can do about Annie. (Unless they ran 
of course)
Not clumping together is a good idea to mitigate some of the CC, but Annie only has to prioritize the carries, she doesn't care if she stuns the Mundo on the side or not.
Annie has high pick rate and high win rate across every ELO. When Annie can cast Tibbers instantly, there is no indication before she ults. Unlike Amumu or Malphite, it is too late by the time you see the animation play.
Amumu needs to land a skill shot on the right person or flash in to cast his ultimate. Malphite's ultimate has travel time in which enemies can escape. For Annie, it is just point and click the area you want to stun.
SlampieceHawke1 votesI get some of what you are saying, but as an ADC, I would very rarely be face checking bushes with an mia annie and I certainly wouldn't be sitting on top of my team when traveling around. And if I did do any of that and got assblasted by an annie, then I can easily say I deserved it. Also, she may not care if she ults a mundo on the side, but if she only lands it on mundo, then i'll bet you she will care... which is easily preventable by not sticking on top of your team when traveling around bushes.
DarthSpectrum1 votesThe problem isn't just limited to Annie's team fighting potential.
Annie is one of the worst champions to lane against. You either counter her, or you don't.
Even some long range mages such as are countered by Annie because she can 100-0 them in a flash Tibbers, Q, W, Ignite combo after poking them down to ~70% health.
However, if she goes against or , they can stun her before she even gets close and combo her first. Unless she dodges the stun with her own flash, there is not much she can do to fight back.
As support, Annie's high base damage and on demand stun practically guarantees that every trade will be even or in her favor. However, as a support she isn't necessary OP since she doesn't build the damage to 100-0 an ADC as part of her combo and many other supports such as 
or 
does somewhat the same things as she does.
Annie's infamous flash Tibbers combo is likely the strongest engage in the game. There is no way to proactive avoid it. Even at high ELO and in the LCS players pick Annie for her ability to fight without a warning. The advice to not clump together simply applies to all engages like 's or 
's.
It is simply not interesting to play against an Annie. Since her actions are so binary and difficult to counter early on, whether who wins or loses the lane and even team fights can be decided in champion select.
SlampieceHawke1 votesSo she has champs she counters and there are champs that counters her. Can she really be considered OP then like some people are suggesting? Team fights can indeed be selected in champ select. It usually pains me to see the guy who has 1st pick go mid unless it's a generally safer champ like 
and then be open to a plethora of counters lol. That shit can indeed be frustrating.
TotalJerk2 votesImmobile champions are usually either statistically more durable or have builds that favor items with defensive stats. On the other hand champions like Zed are already squishy on top of building next to no defensive items. Annie drops a Tibbers on Zed, he'll die instantly. She drops one on a mage, that mage could have 
.
Annie's strong winrate is mainly because she counters the meta so hard. When you're statistically more likely to go against champions you do well against, your winrate will be high.
Knight SoIaire 2 voteshaving stuff that counters mobility is fine
but not when its paired with lb tier burst
you cant escape ... you cant fight ... and she builds tanky as fk
Malix Farwin2 votes[{quoted}](name=Hagane No Arashi,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4qA9AGd5,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2015-08-27T06:06:06.920+0000)
having stuff that counters mobility is fine
but not when its paired with lb tier burst
you cant escape ... you cant fight ... and she builds tanky as fk
Doesnt take a whole lot of MR to counter her burst, hell 1 item and not only do you counter her burst but her stun as well.
Cosmic Warper1 votes[{quoted}](name=Malix Farwin,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4qA9AGd5,comment-id=00070000,timestamp=2015-08-27T06:11:20.508+0000)
Doesnt take a whole lot of MR to counter her burst, hell 1 item and not only do you counter her burst but her stun as well.
Once she has void she demolishes squishies. Squishy APCs and marksmen don't build many defensive items, so tanks and champs with on-demand shields can counter her burst. That shaves the champion list by about 80%.
Knight SoIaire 1 votesdoesnt help ina 5v5
LatetotheRace2 votesIf Annie was just an assassin counter, it would be fine. But since she butchers everything including other mages that's where the problem lies.
SlampieceHawke2 votespretty sure she has a hard time against plenty of mages. Many of em can safely harras her from a distance 
to name a few. I've seen plenty of annie mids on my team having to hug tower and request constant ganks with these match ups.
Cosmic Warper1 votes[{quoted}](name=Slampiece Hawke,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4qA9AGd5,comment-id=00080000,timestamp=2015-08-27T06:49:22.597+0000)
pretty sure she has a hard time against plenty of mages. Many of em can safely harras her from a distance
So the only counter to annie is range.... That's not really a counter when more than half of champions can't fight out of annie's effective range, especially when her flash is up. That's not counterplay. That's just champion countering.
SlampieceHawke2 votesChampion countering isn't counterplay? Regarding her flash, I don't have amazing reflexes and I can still flash the moment I see an annie flash. Seen plenty of these match ups put annie in the dirt and very far behind plenty of times...
Akali is SO HOT2 votesNone of those champions can 100-0 like Annie can.
Posui Gart1 votesAP Malphite can. AP Amumu can. Orianna can too
Sniper 01 votesOnly thing is that with all of those champs, you're going to end up on top of the enemy. lol Malph's kit is pretty outdated as well as amumu's but amumu's offers more counter play. Annie's burst is also much higher. You don't really get a chance to respond with Annie. She can pretty much eat a massive amount of your teams hp by herself.
Ratbert3 votesAnnie's burst is higher because she's a burst mage, and those are all tanks. If they build ap (or ad for gnar) they can burst just as hard.
With amumu, you can cast spells, but it's a massive radius and slightly longer.
Sniper 01 votesAnnie's burst is higher because she's a burst mage, and those are all tanks. If they build ap (or ad for gnar) they can burst just as hard.
With amumu, you can cast spells, but it's a massive radius and slightly longer.
I didn't say that shouldn't be a burst mage. The issue is that her ult is an insta cast massive burst aoe stun if she's doing it right. I main tanks so I don't really have a problem with her.
Ratbert2 votesAgain, if those tanks built ap, they have near instant or instant massive aoe nukes too + don't need to blow flash for it because they all have a dash.
Sniper 02 votesAgain, if those tanks built ap, they have near instant or instant massive aoe nukes too + don't need to blow flash for it because they all have a dash.
Can we just agree that she's a pain in the ass to play against? lol If you're building ap on a tank you're not doing your job. :P
Ratbert1 votesYou don't have to build tanky on classic tank champions. If you build ap on them, they turn into casters just as much.
She's only a pain to play against if you can't position properly/poke.
AtheosisX1 votesAnnie counters champion health, not just mobility. Immobile champs actually have an even worse time against her, unless they have long range that is.
AzureInTheDark1 votesPeople here complaining about Annie, meanwhile I'm sipping wine in lane with with a and insert typical AP Items here
Hullabaloo9071 votesIts much easier to dodge a malphite ult than a tibbers.
PiVoRx1 votesLets begin with that Annie does same thing as mentioned champions.. BUT AS A SUPPORT. How many champions in LoL can insta delete adc while supporting? I dont see any beside annie.
