Dodges are making ranked suck - auto fill is the problem

gottrjr·Dec 15, 2016·83 votes·5,023 views

Riot Q'ing up for ranked is becoming a pain in the ass. Everyone is dodging because of auto fill. It is ring around the dodge right now. Please, you fucking morons, remove auto fill.

119 Comments

OleandervineDec 15, 201616 votes

People not willing to learn roles is the problem. The game wasn't a heaping pile of chaos for the 5 years it had been around when every player essentially auto filled.

gottrjrDec 15, 201612 votes

{quoted}

People not willing to learn roles is the problem. The game wasn't a heaping pile of chaos for the 5 years it had been around when every player essentially auto filled.

It's about playing your best role and not a role you not the best at.

OleandervineDec 15, 201615 votes

{quoted}

It's about playing your best role and not a role you not the best at.

Again, the game flourished for years before role selection was even a thing. Autofill is not the problem. People refusing to learn the game is the problem.

HazyCloud7Dec 16, 201616 votes

And then riot replaced it with a much better system at the beginning of season 6.

Just because something was the status quo for so long doesn't mean it's the best system. I highly doubt you'd feel this way if you weren't a support main; autofill is totally irrelevant to you because you'll essentially always get support if you queue up for it.

What if your least favorite role was the least popular role instead? Would you still feel the same about autofill?

RoranaDec 16, 20164 votes

wasn't a "better system" for people like me who like to sometimes offrole support. it got so bad that I had to make a smurf at the end of the season and queue adc/mid just so i could reteach myself adc because I could not get adc on my main queueing up adc/supp

ChaoticPineconeDec 16, 20161 votes

....I'm not the guy you asked the question to, but yes - I would still feel the same about autofill.

Lets be 100% honest here - I didnt start playing support because I enjoy it (I was a top main previously, then a mid main). I go support to win. I noticed early on that support was an undesirable role, and people just dont support when they dont have to. When rank didnt have role selection, going "fill" every game and ending up support eliminated the problem of "who is going support", all the troll supports, and all the inexperienced feeding supports that seemed to plague all my games. If someone was a support main, by all means take the role.

So as a support main since the middle of S3, its not that autofill is irrelevant to me. Its just that in the middle of S3 I willingly accepted the "fill" and became a support main as a result.

HazyCloud7Dec 16, 20164 votes

Good for you for being so selfless, but what does that have to do with putting people in roles they don't want to play at all elos at all times in all queues?

People in favor of autofill are going to need to explain to me why in the world we need it in the likes of ~Bronze-Plat during peak hours or in normals.

Remember that this is a game people play during their free time (aside from professionals), it is totally illogical to spend 20-60 mins playing a role you don't enjoy playing when you can wait 1-2 minutes more in queue and get a role you want to play.

ChaoticPineconeDec 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Good for you for being so selfless, but what does that have to do with putting people in roles they don't want to play at all elos at all times in all queues?

People in favor of autofill are going to need to explain to me why in the world we need it in the likes of ~Bronze-Plat during peak hours or in normals.

I'm not saying that autofill is the best possible outcome, but I think it solves a problem. The problem is that people dont like playing support - was true 5 years ago and is true today. Support is overwhelmingly always the least desired role, outside of maybe 2-3 weeks when Spellthiefs was first introduced and full AP supports actually had a super noticeable effect on the meta.

Autofill wouldnt be necessary if the problem were small. In an ideal world, the distributions would be 20% top, 20% mid, 20% jungle, 20% ADC, 20% support. In a less-then-ideal-but-still-workable world, it would be something like 85% other roles, 15% support. Personally, I think support queues are even lower than that - so much lower that Autofill is actually necessary to avoid 5+ minute queue times.

Remember that this is a game people play during their free time (aside from professionals), it is totally illogical to spend 20-60 mins playing a role you don't enjoy playing when you can wait 1-2 minutes more in queue and get a role you want to play.

Then feel free to dodge or play ARAM. If you really dont enjoy playing that much, thats what you WOULD do. Not sure about you, but for me playing a game is better than not playing a game. Of course, playing as Mid or Top would be my first preference - but I'm still happier being in a game as support than not being in a game at all.

If it was really such a terrible experience as you suggest it is, then show Riot through your actions - dont play.

HazyCloud7Dec 16, 20164 votes

Then feel free to dodge or play ARAM. If you really dont enjoy playing that much, thats what you WOULD do. Not sure about you, but for me playing a game is better than not playing a game. Of course, playing as Mid or Top would be my first preference - but I'm still happier being in a game as support than not being in a game at all. If it was really such a terrible experience as you suggest it is, then show Riot through your actions - dont play.

If given the option to play your least favorite role and spend less time in queue or play a role you want to play at the expense of waiting a few minutes extra which would you choose? If the former, you're lying to yourself. It's not "play or not play" its "wait longer and play or wait less and play something you don't want to play"

I play a lot of ARAM anyway because I enjoy the change of pace from other modes, and when I start ranked for season 7 I'm sure I will be doing some dodging. As will quite a few other people as well.

You see, when everybody starts to dodge because they don't want to play a particular suddenly the "lowered queue times" becomes totally irrelevant. Oh you saved 2 minutes in queue because of autofill? Too bad someone just dodged at the last minute in champion select and you just wasted your time. And now you're the one that got autofilled this time, so you dodge. And all the people in your lobby waste their time too.

We do not need autofill in all elos at all times in all queues. I've yet to see somebody who ISN'T a support player argue otherwise, and that's what I'm arguing for. I don't want to get rid of it entirely, I want to get rid of it where and when it isn't needed.

Troll for TrumpDec 16, 20166 votes

The problem is the weighing of games. Specifically, how much a loss means to you.

There are many who are stuck in an "elo hell", where they gain 10 or so Lp per win but lose 20 every loss. For them, it's not worth doing their least best role, because that reduces their chance of victory; It's not that they won't learn the role. They know how it works, they can play in it, but they're less likely to do as well in it then they'd be in their main role.

In addition, this is a huge problem for those in series/promos. You can't even dodge in those. You get filled as support and you get,say, a varus who's got no idea what he's doing. If you were an ADC main, the reason you lost wasn't because of anything you could really control.

gottrjrDec 16, 20166 votes

{quoted}

Again, the game flourished for years before role selection was even a thing. Autofill is not the problem. People refusing to learn the game is the problem.

How can you not understand this? I want to WIN!!!!!!!!!!! I cannot be expected to be amazing at every role. I want to play the role I have the highest chances of winning with. Auto fill is contrary to this logic.

DarkRitualDec 15, 20167 votes

It was about having a best role and not sucking at support in case you got last pick.

Worked fine for 5 seasons. Don't see why it wouldn't still work. People are just whining now because S6 spoiled them.

LostFr0stDec 15, 20166 votes

Yup, and your team automatically knew you were 'autofilled' support if you were last pick. They wouldn't just assume you knew what you were doing since you're tagged "support" in select.

Xela SyabDec 17, 20161 votes

Idk I main support and I've been autofilled to other lanes where I pretty much watch my team feed and die and I'm just sitting there with more cs and the only tower taken thinking WTF happened. Also had a circumstance where my jungler dcd at champ select, nabbed smite at the last minute and jungled to victory as Trundle. If people just learned champs that can take multiple roles that could fix it too. I think autofill is better than the no system we had before where people pretty much said X or feed. I'm ok with people dodging, they don't want their lp, and I want to play.

VoraciousXDec 17, 20163 votes

[{quoted}](name=Xela Syab,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2kE4hsbI,comment-id=000100000003,timestamp=2016-12-17T02:17:29.609+0000)

Idk I main support and I've been autofilled to other lanes where I pretty much watch my team feed and die and I'm just sitting there with more cs and the only tower taken thinking WTF happened. Also had a circumstance where my jungler dcd at champ select, nabbed smite at the last minute and jungled to victory as Trundle. If people just learned champs that can take multiple roles that could fix it too. I think autofill is better than the no system we had before where people pretty much said X or feed. I'm ok with people dodging, they don't want their lp, and I want to play.

The thing about autofill is it's autofilling people who don't NEED to be autofilled. You can get your role in one game, someone dodges and 1 second later you're autofilled into another role. There are situations where two people are autofilled into each others roles. And there are situations where a queue takes a minute and you're autofilled. The system is purely random with barely any intent to give you your preferred roles. It's chaos.

Lord LigmaDec 15, 201610 votes

People want to play a role that they are comfortable with. I'll take longer q's if it means I have a team that's happy with what they are playing. If someone gets top and they are an bot main then feds out the whazzu then they're gonna do even worse when their team starts to flame them for it(AND THEY WILL SO DON'T EVEN TRY TO SAY THEY WON'T). People can al kinds of roles. But everyone has a preferred role that they would want to rank with.

JorenciceDec 16, 20161 votes

They could easily play varus, cait, vayne, quinn, graves top lane.

Those are all adcs that can be played top lane.

NineTailedMysticDec 16, 20163 votes

And then they don't know match ups, powerspikes, TP potentials...

HazyCloud7Dec 16, 20166 votes

Even if I learned how to play support well I wouldn't want to play it. I don't enjoy it anywhere near as much as mid, or top/bot/jungle for that matter.

People play this game in their free time and individual games last a while, why would people want to play a role I don't enjoy? At least in high Diamond+ the queue time thing becomes a relevant factor.

People can't seriously tell me we need autofill in every elo at all times in all queues.

gottrjrDec 16, 20164 votes

{quoted}

Even if I learned how to play support well I wouldn't want to play it. I don't enjoy it anywhere near as much as mid, or top/bot/jungle for that matter.

People play this game in their free time and individual games last a while, why would people want to play a role I don't enjoy? At least in high Diamond+ the queue time thing becomes a relevant factor.

People can't seriously tell me we need autofill in every elo at all times in all queues.

I agree 100%. I want to play the role I am best at to support the TEAM the best. Putting me as ADC or TOP is nothing but a detriment to the team and counter logical to what this game is about.

GayFluffyUnicornDec 16, 20163 votes

The real problem imo is that back in the days i had to consistently swap roles and play support atleast a few times a day when i play 10 games a day (not accurate just for highlighting). Right now i have to supp maybe every 20 games on a pretty high level without having any practice on it... Right now with role selection i'd take long q times and good match quality over shorter times and bad match quality.

A FLUFFY BUNNY 1Dec 16, 20167 votes

Auto fill is just too overused to save about a min of waiting time. But then someone dodges and I end up waiting 3 more mins anyways so what's the point? I don't have a problem getting auto filled sometimes but it seems like it happens a lot.

gottrjrDec 16, 20163 votes

[{quoted}](name=A FLUFFY BUNNY 1,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2kE4hsbI,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2016-12-16T01:04:41.280+0000)

Auto fill is just too overused to save about a min of waiting time. But then someone dodges and I end up waiting 3 more mins anyways so what's the point? I don't have a problem getting auto filled sometimes but it seems like it happens a lot.

Here is the kicker. When this entire two role selection came out they said it they needed people to select two roles to keep the q times down. Now they need people to auto fill to keep the Q times down. I mean the Q times didnt seem that long with two role selections. They never even tried just one role selection. The assumption was always made that the Q times would be two long with one role selection. I might be ok with a bit longer Q times if the dodges are also scaled back.

HazyCloud7Dec 16, 20167 votes

That's what happens when you create a system that only benefits people that play support secondary and enable it in all queues at all times in all elos.

You think anybody in bronze-plat actually wants to get autofilled to a role they don't enjoy playing just to save a minute or two of queue time? No, that would be illogical given that the games themselves last 20-50~ mins and there's no fun in playing a role you have no interest in.

Suspicious XebraDec 16, 20166 votes

While I agree it is an issue, using the line

"Please, you fucking morons, remove auto fill."

isn't the way to go about trying to get a discussion going.

DanjengDec 16, 20166 votes

"May you fine gentlemen be so kind as to remove autofill?"

gottrjrDec 16, 20162 votes

[{quoted}](name=Suspicious Xebra,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2kE4hsbI,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2016-12-16T01:42:01.953+0000)

While I agree it is an issue, using the line

"Please, you fucking morons, remove auto fill."

isn't the way to go about trying to get a discussion going.

Just calling it how I see it. Not everything is bubble gum and rainbows.

NymzoDec 16, 20166 votes

Or, you know, make the support role more appealing for everyone?

BisaknospDec 16, 20165 votes

why ? because some dickholes cant play support (or some other role) once? get your shit together they shouldnt remove it if they would people would complain about having to support when they are last pick like before theres a better solution: worse penalties for people who dodge in ranked simple as that

YFisfabulousBRUHDec 16, 20163 votes

VerdadeDec 16, 20161 votes

Play supp for one game and get autofill protection for next 4 games. That way you won't play ADC/mid/supp if you queue as jg/top

ManiacalCoyoteDec 16, 20163 votes

I can mid and support just fine. It's when I get autofilled to ADC that I have trouble.

VerdadeDec 16, 20161 votes

Again, queue as supp and you won't be autofilled for 4 games

YFisfabulousBRUHDec 17, 20163 votes

If i queue as sup, and i get sup, then it wouldnt be counted as autofill. And why would i want to play as sup anyways?

gottrjrDec 16, 20166 votes

{quoted}

why ? because some dickholes cant play support (or some other role) once? get your shit together they shouldnt remove it if they would people would complain about having to support when they are last pick like before theres a better solution: worse penalties for people who dodge in ranked simple as that

It's not a matter of being able to play the role but being able to play the role well. I only have so much time to get good at so many champs and so many roles. You really cant expect the more casual players to be good at every role. It's unrealistic.

ManiacalCoyoteDec 16, 20164 votes

Let's look at each of your points.

Because some players who have a massive collection of melee champions queue up for top or jungle, and get autofilled into Bot, where they have no champions nor experience. The only marksmen I had were , , and , although the last doesn't really count. Yeah, I have a few marksmen, but they aren't competetively viable right now. So, I spent all of my IP on and , even though I wanted , simply because I keep getting thrown into the worst lane in the game. Every other lobby.
They should remove autofill, because it is absolutly, empirically, undeniably bad.
No, last pick wouldn't be forced to support, unless they decided to queue up for blind pick, although there is no reason to, since Draft Pick is vastly superior to Blind Pick.
Your "better" solution is a terrible idea. Let's say your idea is instituted, and people get 20 minutes per dodge. So, you queue up and get 3rd pick/1st ban for your team, and your team's Bot is 5th pick. For the sake of this, let's say that your team's top is 4th pick. They don't select their pick intent during the pick intent phase. Knowing that Vayne is FOTM and your team has no chance of grabbing Vayne early, so you decide to ban her. In the time between you clicking her icon and you clicking "BAN", your Bot selects her as their intent. You don't see this in time to select somebody else. So, they're tilted and select . Option 1: Play the game, and spend 20 minutes of hell, and lose LP and ELO. Option 2: Dodge, spend 20 minutes waiting for the dodge clock to count down, and lose LP. Either way, you lose valuable time, LP, and patience.

YFisfabulousBRUHDec 17, 20163 votes

Thank you.

Best princess EUDec 15, 20164 votes

{quoted}

Please, you fucking morons, remove auto fill.

that made me chuckle, Auto fill is needed to make queues not lasting too much time

though it should be removed in low elo

gottrjrDec 15, 20167 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sanji fanboy,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2kE4hsbI,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2016-12-15T23:01:48.084+0000)

that made me chuckle, Auto fill is needed to make queues not lasting too much time

though it should be removed in low elo

I mean I hear the logic but the constant dodging is getting old really fast.

DarkRitualDec 15, 20164 votes

Autofill isn't the problem, the playerbase being spoiled by a season of role selection is the problem.

Actually people learn to have one or two champs for support that you don't suck with. League survived numerous seasons without role selection, where everyone had to deal with last pick support. Know how? They usually had one or two cheese picks that they could play at an acceptable level, and didn't complain because that's just how things worked.

DynikusDec 15, 201614 votes

and didn't complain

what fantasy world are you living in where people didn't complain?

gottrjrDec 15, 20168 votes

{quoted}

Autofill isn't the problem, the playerbase being spoiled by a season of role selection is the problem.

Actually people learn to have one or two champs for support that you don't suck with. League survived numerous seasons without role selection, where everyone had to deal with last pick support. Know how? They usually had one or two cheese picks that they could play at an acceptable level, and didn't complain because that's just how things worked.

Autofill is in fact the problem. In season 5, the last person to Q, was almost always support. Support is easy to learn and you are not expected to carry. But when you are auto filled into ADC or TOP or MID is the problem. You are expected to be good at those positions, and honestly, it isnt fair to the team to be auto filled into one of them.

I get that it worked in the past to a degree but it isnt working right now because everyone is dodging. There is a disconnect that needs to be addressed somehow. I vote for 1 role selection and 0 auto fill. I mean, why hasnt this been tried?

VoraciousXDec 16, 20164 votes

Autofill is a problem when it's put in NORMALS. You don't play normals to play something you don't want to play. It's frustrating, annoying, and stupid. You may as well be playing blind pick if you're gonna deal with getting autofilled. It's also a little ridiculous when you have a 1 minute queue that autofills you. At least set it up to where if the queue takes a decent amount of time you get autofilled THEN, don't put supports in top lane and top lane in support in the same game.

YFisfabulousBRUHDec 16, 20163 votes

I queued for jg/top. What do i get? ADC and mid, both of which i wasnt feeling like playing that day. I wanted a solo playing experience (solo compared to mid and adc) and i get autofilled into a game where i need to comm with people and i just didnt do well (i didnt feed but their adc sure got fed). Thats what you get out of autofill. I really hate autofill. There was a solution along the lines of asking you "There is a game with a role thats available that is not your primary. Accept?" Which would be so much better than this current shitfest. And looking at it, I think riot isnt going to change it for another season like dynamic queue.

coreychichiDec 16, 20163 votes

Idk about that, I play support and I dodge for lots of reasons that have nothing to do with autofill. Team toxic before match even starts, terrible bans that result in ridiculous enemy teams while simultaneously telling me my teammates are probably not educated about the game. Which in turn tells me it's probably going to be a bad game. The list goes on.

UwU MonkaSDec 16, 20162 votes

man 2 seasons ago you had to learn how to play every role efficiently. I personally don't mind getting autofilled, along with 90% of players who get auto filled. It is a great system where I don't have to wait 20 minutes in que, just to play a game that ends in 20 minutes.

LatetotheRaceDec 17, 20161 votes

5 Dodges in a month (Queue dodges of course.) in ranked should result in a one month ranked ban.

gottrjrDec 17, 20164 votes

{quoted}

5 Dodges in a month (Queue dodges of course.) in ranked should result in a one month ranked ban.

Who would keep playing and spending money on this game with rules this restrictive? Not me and I do spent money on this game.

LatetotheRaceDec 17, 20161 votes

So restrictive? I've dodged ranked queue probably 1-2 times tops in the last 6 months. What's your excuse?

gottrjrDec 17, 20162 votes

{quoted}

So restrictive? I've dodged ranked queue probably 1-2 times tops in the last 6 months. What's your excuse?

Uh. I want to play the role I am best at that gives me the best chance to win. I dodge auto frequently because it is idiotic. I mean, why am I being forced to play a role I have no interest in playing...