Juggernaut Update Discussion

Thread about Juggernaut Update

I would post on the PBE boards, but no one ever seems to check there and they (Riot) have flat out said they dont listen to PBE when it comes to balance testing and that its really more for major bugs.

My Thoughts: Sorry but it needs to be said, you guys kinda dropped the ball on this one. By now you should be well aware how people feel about your "reworks" ESPECIALLY when you change fundamental play patterns that are considered core to their character cough Cass cough.

Darius: I'm not a Darius main by any means, but I do love to use him as a counterpick when I can. When I pick/play Darius I want to feel like a bully, a bully that that dunks all who dare to challenge him. Now I love the bloodrage passive change, what I hate is the removal of his ability to effectively bully or even really threaten other laners. His Q took major base damage hits (even with the total AD change if my math isnt wrong) along with losing the bonus damage for knicking your oppponent, while you might say them being close halving the damage is functionally the same, the numbers/meaning is not. Before the skill had the base of a regular ability and just hit like a truck along the edge, now it hits like a normal ability at the edge and is laughable if they are close (not even a passive stack). Sure you added healing to his Q, but that just pushes him into a different style of lane annoyance. I'm not gonna mention the disgusting Q cast time. The ability to trade while healing is something that most people don't like to play against see renekton as an example. Next his W was gutted, like what the hell man? You removed the AS slow AND the CD reduction from his passive stacks? Ok you lowered the CD do to compensate, but you just took off an interactive part of his kit even if it was minor. AS slow was the only reason Darius could actually stand up to some of the great late game duelists like Jax, and even outside of late game its a major hit to his laning trades. You increased the slow intensity at the cost of the duration, why? Duration is more important than the intensity a majority of the time, once you get slowed by more than 25% you are screwed whats more important is how long you have to get to them. The duration and repeat application is what gave him some sticking power. His E, you added a slow to it. Why? A majority of the time E was followed up with auto W for a slow anyway. Seems like unnecessary minor power than could be elsewhere. His ult is largely a null change, except for the terrifying minions/monsters thing. As much as I love the flavor, if that is actually taking up power budget pls remove it to make darius feel more like darius.

In short: You changed darius from a powerful lane bully to a renekton esqe annoyance (vs melees anyway). Now I get trades offs for him being a better teamfighter and all but those shouldnt come at the expense of a core part of his character. Shouldve given him the old tristana power curve/trough if you wanted to be able to make him a stronger teamfighter. Respectably Strong early, horrid mid-game, beast late game.

Garen: See Darius as for when I play him. Similarly to Darius I want to be a lane bull when i pick him. You shortened his silence duration, huge nerf, but one I'm not mad at. Personally I hate silences more than stuns, being able to move but not cast is frustrating. Regardless it was a huge hit. W armor/mr change is fine, removing tenacity? Really? Garen the master of getting kited no longer has tenacity to try to prevent that from happening? Plus you make him move slower while in his E? These are really gonna hurt his laning phase, your intention no doubt, but Garen has always been used as a bully. Why are you taking that away? To give him a useful late game? I don't think these are mutually exclusive ideas, as I said earlier.

I don't get why you guys are taking champs known for their bullying ability, and then removing their ability to really bully in exchange for tons of late game power. I don't think anyone was complaining about darius being not STRONG enough late game, they just wanted him to be less vulnerable to kite. Garen I think people actually did want to be able to do something later, but I don't think anyone wanted either of them to get changes at the cost of their bully identity.

Skarner: No real complaints here, I like everything I see. His W scales with HP, his E is better, and this came at the expense of some of his dueling power. While Skarner is a currently a decent duelist, he is a deceptive duelist. Most people don't realize how strong he is in a 1 v 1 and as a result its not really a core part of his identity to lose out on. His Passive im not crazy about, but im not outwardly against it. My main concern is burden of knowledge for newer/unfamiliar players, but i guess its not hard to understand just might be a wtf.

Morde: I love the idea of him being a juggernaut, I think the idea of forcing him into a duo lane is a bit of a slap in the face to the loyal mord players. You changed a skill so that it is absolutely useless in a solo lane, why? For the purpose of uniqueness? Morde's shield passive and ult are unique enough that he doesnt need to be the duo "replacement/alternative" as his gimmick. Making him into a hybrid carry with AD scaling E and Q changes? Love it. Trying to funnel him into bot/duo lane by punishing solo lane play? Hate it. Add an incentive to play him with a partner, don't make him weaker for not doing so.

Items - Not much to say, like both the new ones so far.

Let me know what you guys think though.