Why are people mad about Lee Sin Buffs?

SKT Uzi Vert·Aug 21, 2015·5 votes·1,127 views

For me that has 250+ games with Lee sin, I think the buffs on Lee sin are nothing to get mad at. Think about it •Lee sin late game sucks ass (unless you are fed) just think about, who would you rather have late game, Lee sin or Master Yi, Sej, Nid? •people hate when they have a Lee sin on their team (low Elo) because he is very hard to use unlike Darius. So the buffs are to help people. •finally one of the buffs are just energy buff which is not even big. Honestly Lee sin arent even that big

26 Comments

jjookkeerrAug 21, 20153 votes

bad lee sins says that his late game is bad

SKT Uzi VertAug 21, 20152 votes

Umm in every lcs game if a team picks Lee sin, the casters always say how he falls off late game hard so I don't know what you are talking about

Knight SoIaire Aug 21, 20152 votes

damage wise yes

but the thing is ... lee isnt a late game damage dealer the fact that he changes his role depending on the time into the game ... means he doesnt fall off

to fall off is to stop being as effective as you are supposed to be at everything you do in late game lee sin doesnt fall off because the hole left after his damage is filled by his utility in teamfights

SKT Uzi VertAug 21, 20151 votes

Yea but it's like blitz and his hook. Lcs team don't pick blitz because if he can't lane a hook for his life he is useless. Similar to Lee sin kick late game, if you can't hit it then he is useless in late game team fights.

Knight SoIaire Aug 21, 20151 votes

useless ... he still is an extremaly mobile peeler and fighter

in sec isnt the only thing lee sin can do in his life

SKT Uzi VertAug 21, 20151 votes

Don't get me wrong he is a good jg at the end but I don't know why people are mad about his buffs

Knight SoIaire Aug 21, 20151 votes

because load of the work riot did on the jungle archieved only one thing

jungler like lee sin stopped being the best in the jungle

buffing lee sin is basicaly asking for everything to fk up since he can easily overtake the meta ... just like elise after a slight buff

IcepawAug 21, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Don't get me wrong he is a good jg at the end but I don't know why people are mad about his buffs

Because Lee Sin are the strongest and most versatile jungler out there. He can tower dive safely at lvl 3 and duel ANY other champion in the game, outright decimating all marksmen and mages. He will fight even with warriors and just dash away if he looses the trade. He can kite tanks easy until they die if they are not smart enough to run. Lee Sin is close to toxic in for those that actually can play him. The early power of his is so insane a godd Lee has very little risk to avoid snowballing all his teams lanes-.

I GANK LANESAug 22, 20151 votes

what, lmao. go record a tower dive on lee at lvl 3 and let me see how it goes.

Duel any other champ? Duel skarner, shyv, warwick, udyr, PLENTY of others, you can't.

Dash away? Akali Ekko Corki Caitlyn Fizz Fiora Aatrox Ezreal JarvanIV Leblanc Ight pretty sure that's enough, plenty of others.

There's other junglers with just as strong and stronger early games than lee. Elise after buffs, gragas, reksai, just a few off the top of my head.

You know where Lee was placed in the jungle in 5.15? 41/42. He was 2nd to last overall as a jungler. His win rate was like 46%. Stop being a sheep and complaining about something when you don't have facts about jack shit

Yosuke ApperuAug 21, 20151 votes

He can also Gripex XD

Yosuke ApperuAug 21, 20151 votes

Try building lee as an assassin and tell me how much you fall off :P

I GANK LANESAug 22, 20151 votes

you die instantly

Yosuke ApperuAug 22, 20151 votes

Sounds like every assassin :p

SEKAIAug 22, 20153 votes

•Lee sin late game sucks ass

This is the same ignorant attitude that some people still take the idea of God literally and not analogically, same misconception attitude people still believing in stereotypes of someone he/she has never met and same denial attitude where factual and statistical studies gets thrown out of the window because apparently what they "think" holds more weight than everything else.

Seriously, do your own research, get on with the time and most importantly, think and not just repeat.

We're living in 2015 and not 2011 atm, anyone who says Lee has a weak late game is trying to be a comedian and just utterly fails, so much and so often it's no longer funny ever since the start of 2013.

people hate when they have a Lee sin on their team (low Elo) because he is very hard to use unlike Darius

Define "hard to use" in this case. Answer this:

Which one is harder,

Pressing buttons correctly and landing a frigging skill shot, or
Knowing matchups, builds, clear advantages & trade offs, utilise non spammable spells, resource management, kill evaluation, assessing situations and zoning with nearly no range presence?

JustMyBassCannonAug 22, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Anyone who says Lee has a weak late game is trying to be a comedian and just utterly fails, so much and so often it's no longer funny ever since the start of 2013.

Politicking bullshit aside, you'd have to be delusional to think Lee Sin actually has a good late-game. He has a powerful early-game and mid-game, and if he can keep that lead long enough to win the game, you never find out just how terrible he is late-game. Either he doesn't have the damage output necessary to remain a bigger threat in a fight, or he doesn't have the survivability to make use of his damage.

A coordinated team and time are Lee Sin's worst enemies.

SEKAIAug 22, 20152 votes

{quoted}

A coordinated team and time are Lee Sin's worst enemies.

Not when Lee's team is also coordinated.

Lee's enemy of the entire game is strictly only time, and to my knowledge, that's unhealthy and lacking proper counterplay even in Riot's definition of the terms.

So yeah there's that. IMHO this guy shouldn't just sit there receiving tweaks that ultimately achieve nothing meaningful. It's really about time Riot admits his kit is a bag of nonsense and should just get reworked.

JustMyBassCannonAug 22, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Not when Lee's team is also coordinated.

When both teams are coordinated, it comes down to which team makes better decisions.

Lee's enemy of the entire game is strictly only time, and to my knowledge, that's unhealthy and lacking proper counterplay even in Riot's definition of the terms.

Absolutely true; on a complete tangent, this is also why Shaco, Irelia and Cassiopeia are problem champions.

It's quite terrible when kit complexity (and/or gimmicks) allows for a champion's only weakness (or core strength) to be time.

So yeah there's that. IMHO this guy shouldn't just sit there receiving tweaks that ultimately achieve nothing meaningful. It's really about time Riot admits his kit is a bag of nonsense and should just get reworked.

They've been looking at reworking him, obviously. There was a huge outcry from people when they saw Riot do away with the "rework" that was on the PBE (the one that really only changed up his scaling rather than his problems), without understanding that the reason it was tossed was because Lee Sin's issues have far less to do with scaling than they do with the design of his kit.

The problem, from my perspective outside of Riot, is that they're stuck with an iconic champion playstyle, highly complex and rewarding if you know what you're doing, but not much fun for others playing against it. I wouldn't be surprised if they had to completely redesign parts of his kit so he could still have the highly-rewarding playstyle, but with some actual counter-play.

MLDzXnRRRAug 21, 20152 votes

There is no lategame vs Lee Sin. Good Lee is like a good Shaco = surrender @ 20, all the lanes are fed and pushing at least tier 2 towers...

GodarenAug 21, 20151 votes

{quoted}

There is no lategame vs Lee Sin. Good Lee is like a good Shaco = surrender @ 20, all the lanes are fed and pushing at least tier 2 towers...

also rare as hell in low elo i've prolly seen 1-2 god lee sins from silver-plat 5 this season

Sassmast3rAug 21, 20152 votes

I think it's more of how annoying he is to play against. I'm not saying that he's unbeatable. I'm not saying that he's OP. I am not ranked, I am not very knowledgeable about anything balance-wise. But can we just talk about how annoying it is when he can go in, destroy you, and escape so easily? I find it to be considerably toxic. Hey, it's entirely possible that this is incredibly hard to pull-off that the few people who can are actually really really good at this game and Lee Sin in particular, but sometimes it just feels like there's no way to prevent it. This is just a guess, but I'm assuming that this is why so many people are mad about Lee Sin buffs. Let's be honest, they aren't massive buffs at all, and his modified ultimate is not as easy to pull off as people think. But since so many people are frustrated with him in his already annoying state, seeing him get BUFFS makes quite a few people infuriated. Am I? No. I do not see Lee Sin much, and when I do, very rarely are they a massive problem. They're just REALLY ANNOYING.

AnomanderAug 21, 20152 votes

It only helps bad Leesin's and doesn't really affect the good one so I don't even care about the buffs.

SKT Uzi VertAug 21, 20151 votes

Exactly that's what I'm saying but people are just salty. At least Lee sin takes skill

GodarenAug 21, 20152 votes

I'm glad he got buffed love seeing him in games and he is really fun to watch.

stealthfox94Aug 21, 20151 votes

Yeah idk he's been borderline trash for the better part of S5. Guess he's just one of those champs everyone loves to hate for some reason. I've never had a problem with him his late game is bad and some of them use their ults poorly.