About the new "Runes Reforged" system.

IPlayToTiltYou·Sep 25, 2017·2 votes·6,164 views

Hi there Riot, I've been watching the stream, yet I wasn't able to get my question answered through the wall of text from Twitch chat, so I'll just post mine here.

So, do you think that this new system will dramatically shift the "meta", effectively bringing some out some of the less successful champions out of the woodwork, while booting some meta champions out?

I say this because i'm pretty sure that everyone is afraid (especially the mains who play mostly out of meta champions.) that their champions will be worse than it is, and maybe making them unplayable. I don't my fat fish to be a goner.

And if this does happen, would you tweak the runes system more? Or re-balance some of the champions that have been boot of the meta?

Thank you for answering! (If you choose to do so!)

15 Comments

RiotMeddlerSep 25, 20174 votes

Sorry we didn't get to your question, navigating the Twitch spam was tricky. We're expecting some degree of meta shift certainly, though trying to keep the game feeling pretty similar overall. There will almost certainly be some individual champions that get too strong off Runes, and some that struggle too much, and we're expecting we'll do a lot of balance work on the system both while it's on PBE and after it goes live. That will include both regular patches and likely some micro patches to respond to stuff quicker as well. Odds are we'll probably need to adjust mechanics on some individual runes too at some point if they're revealed to be too effective in some circumstances or just not very useful. Possible that even means replacing some, or, if the issue is that some champs just aren't catered to enough, adding additional ones in (3 per slot's not a maximum necessarily).

PennsSep 25, 20171 votes

Hey, how much do I have to pay you guys to put Electrocute in Sorcery?

I want dat cdr at level 10 but I also want dat Electrocute. But I also need dat Stopwatch and 45% cdr :(

IPlayToTiltYouSep 25, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Sorry we didn't get to your question, navigating the Twitch spam was tricky. We're expecting some degree of meta shift certainly, though trying to keep the game feeling pretty similar overall. There will almost certainly be some individual champions that get too strong off Runes, and some that struggle too much, and we're expecting we'll do a lot of balance work on the system both while it's on PBE and after it goes live. That will include both regular patches and likely some micro patches to respond to stuff quicker as well. Odds are we'll probably need to adjust mechanics on some individual runes too at some point if they're revealed to be too effective in some circumstances or just not very useful. Possible that even means replacing some, or, if the issue is that some champs just aren't catered to enough, adding additional ones in (3 per slot's not a maximum necessarily).

Wow, I didn't expect a response from Meddler. But yeah I could see what you mean. I also checked out "Forge your Path". I have seen some runes that are based around Summ spells when they are used/on cool down You think these might be a bit less useful since summ spells have a long cool down? or do you think the runes that lower the cool down could counteract it?

Jar Jar binks lSep 25, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Sorry we didn't get to your question, navigating the Twitch spam was tricky. We're expecting some degree of meta shift certainly, though trying to keep the game feeling pretty similar overall. There will almost certainly be some individual champions that get too strong off Runes, and some that struggle too much, and we're expecting we'll do a lot of balance work on the system both while it's on PBE and after it goes live. That will include both regular patches and likely some micro patches to respond to stuff quicker as well. Odds are we'll probably need to adjust mechanics on some individual runes too at some point if they're revealed to be too effective in some circumstances or just not very useful. Possible that even means replacing some, or, if the issue is that some champs just aren't catered to enough, adding additional ones in (3 per slot's not a maximum necessarily).

Where are the lethality runes.... u said u have lethality Source in the system but I don't see any

RiotMeddlerSep 25, 20172 votes

Sudden Impact will be swapping to Lethality/Flat Pen shortly. Might or might not add another source too.

Critmaster GarenSep 25, 20173 votes

{quoted}

Sudden Impact will be swapping to Lethality/Flat Pen shortly. Might or might not add another source too.

will overheal work with garens passive?

pls. make it so.

also, perseverence dependence on using summoner spells kindof sucks. makes it pretty good for junglers as smite makes the tenacity freqzently available and the tradeoff for the resistances low. but the condition is kinda bad for everyone else.

ThryaleSep 25, 20171 votes

I have a question about this "adaptive ap or ad" thing. is the bonus ap/ad chosen by the player or is it preset based upon the champ played?

cuz I'm an avid ap tryn player, and I'll be pretty annoyed if all my runes are forcing me to play him ad.

Critmaster GarenSep 25, 20172 votes

{quoted}

I have a question about this "adaptive ap or ad" thing. is the bonus ap/ad chosen by the player or is it preset based upon the champ played?

cuz I'm an avid ap tryn player, and I'll be pretty annoyed if all my runes are forcing me to play him ad.

its based upon the items your building.

if you buy a longsword, the adaptive bonus will grant you ad. if you build like a dorans ring, it gives you ap.

it depends on which stat you build the most of and you can even get it to swap over mid game.

like say you start dorans blade on kennen and get ad from your adaptive bonuses at the start of the game. but then you build into ap and the bonus flips over to ap.

ThryaleSep 25, 20171 votes

oh cool! thx for that, especially the example at the bottom, cuz I was just about ask that since when I play swain, I grab a d.blade to help with his atrocious last hitting.

Evil YasuoSep 26, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Sudden Impact will be swapping to Lethality/Flat Pen shortly. Might or might not add another source too.

Speaking of assassins, (lethality) Predator looks incredibly weak... You've obviously tested it, can you confirm or deny this for me? Compared to electrocute, it just looks so weak. Maybe i'm wrong though or missing the point of it?

Altonius AmakiirSep 26, 20171 votes

Can you make it so it gives both, because there are champions (like Warwick for example) that are played with very mixed damage(almost 50-50 the way I play him at least). I'm concerned that it won't be viable if you make it adaptive instead of what it is already. Adaptive is all well and good for AP/AD because it will always scale with what you want it to, but a lot of champions scale off of AD but do magic damage(again Warwick's Q is a good example).

The Yetii RiderSep 25, 20171 votes

Meddler, you already screwed Nunu players once with the removal of Strength of Ages and the addition of Courage of the Colossus. Now Stoneborn is dropping to a standard rune and we're getting Aftershock.

Don't make us wait another year. Please. PLEASE, Meddler, what else do you want me to say? If you are so damn insistent that wardens and vanguards have immobilizing crowd control, give Nunu an immobilizing ability. Don't make us wait for the VGU team. You gave Draven a brand new passive after only a bit of PBE testing. The full VGU can take its time but give us a new ability to tide us over until then. There is no reason Nunu shouldn't be able to use Aftershock like all the other Vanguards and Wardens.

What are we supposed to do, Meddler? Please, respond to this. This is not a rhetorical question, I really want to have a discussion with you about this. You've done this twice now, so surely you have an explanation for yourselves this time.

You nerfed Nunu's health scaling right before you removed Strength of the Ages, do you remember that? Literally the patch before, when no one knew you were going to remove SotA. So you nerfed his health scaling and then immediately took away 300 health after that. And gave us something we literally couldn't use.

Then there was like a five month period where Nunu just flat out did not have a keystone before you reworked Bond of Stone. Those were dark times, Meddler. And now they're rearing their head again.

What am I supposed to do? Tell me! I am sick and I am tired of playing Nunu like a juggernaut. He's not a juggernaut, Meddler! Why are you trying to force us to get Grasp of the Undying on a tank? Why are you trying to force us to look for ways to optimize in-combat sustain and damage to enemy champions on a tank, especially after the tank update where you refocused tank power into utility over damage. This is completely antithetical to everything 7.9 introduced.

And you nerfed Nunu's base stats twice this season because of his interactions with Cinderhulk. Now Nunu is losing Stoneborn Pact, and is he going to get some compensation for that? Probably not, but even if he does it won't make up for every champion in the game having a keystone but him. Why are you doing this a second time? Why?

Sun Wu RyuumokuSep 26, 20171 votes

Changing the meta ???

Like giving tanks so much strengh... and giving them splitt push power for no reason, without decreasing their other advantages. I guess carry champs at the top is over (was already the case tbh).

hewhokillsyaNov 10, 20172 votes

New rune system is so bad any one at riot on board should be fired no diversity builds are even more cookie xutfer than before tank and support tree worthless get new development team fide the rest like sheep in the heard 0 good things about lols bigest change ever think out side the box #you all nex new jobs

Jus de CastagneSep 26, 20171 votes

Do you plan any work for champions like Zyra who need a specific rune page ( full magic pen in the case of Zyra ) which will not be replaced by this new system, or who will be nerfed by the changes of Thunderlord ?