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My ability to transition is completely gone

oldsouth baron··21 votes·8,444 views

I dont mind fighting hextech, but the swelling of characters in the pool has killed my late game. i just cant get what i need anymore, and ive dropped 2 brackets because of it.

my build is complicated and i dont think its good for the game to kill complicated builds. we need some way to mitigate the bloated character pool. thats all im saying.

19 Comments

Worst JG Wins8 votes

Yeah Riot really took a lot of skill expression out of the game with the new champ additions. It's much harder to hit 2stars and the correct champ for ideal synergies. Because it's generally just better to push levels and hit random OP 4s and 5s instead of trying to transition into a new comp.

For example i had a 4 knight+3noble comp earlier and instead of transitioning into some late game synergies i just pushed 8 hit a random 2s Jinx and 2s Yasuo and just slapped them in the comp. Ended up winning with like 0 synergies 4knight 2gs 2 hextec was really stupid IMO.

oldsouth baron3 votes

yes well said, build diversity took a major hit.

Metal Janna5 votes

It'd be nice if the chance to roll a champion didn't decrease with level if you already have one. For example when you're running Noble and three of the champions you're trying to upgrade are 1 cost units, it'd be nice if you could keep your economy rather than spending all your gold on rerolls trying to grab them up before your level gets too high to roll them. Now this may or may not be the most effective strat depending on if any other players are also taking Garen/Vayne/Fiora, but it'd be cool if it was sometimes.

With this bias helping people finish their upgrades more cards could be in the deck without making it harder to roll for a champion you don't have yet but want.

Titanium702 votes

What are you talking about? With increased chances of seeing 1-Stars as long as you have one (aka EVERYONE the ENTIRE mid-game) you obviously decrease the chance of seeing else!

GREAT I can finish my Darius now - BUT WTF am I doing with all the damn Garens/Elise I already have at 2 at dont even want at 3 because I throw em out anyway later one?

Metal Janna2 votes

{quoted}

What are you talking about? With increased chances of seeing 1-Stars as long as you have one (aka EVERYONE the ENTIRE mid-game) you obviously decrease the chance of seeing else!

Increased chance to see 1-cost units that you already have. If you're swapping out 1-cost units for 2s and 3s throughout the game, then the only ones you're going to keep are the ones that are part of the comp you're going for. Therefore you won't be seeing more Dariuses when you're building Noble or more Nidalees when you're building Ranger, unless you're using those specific champs as stopgaps to cover the lack of a champion you're planning to pick up later.

GREAT I can finish my Darius now - BUT WTF am I doing with all the damn Garens/Elise I already have at 2 at dont even want at 3 because I throw em out anyway later one?

Ok so you leveled up right? You stand good chances of rolling 2 cost, 3 cost units in each hand now. Why would you keep 1-cost units that you no longer need? And if you need them for just a while longer but are planning on throwing them out later, why would you mind seeing more of them? You realize those Garens and Elises sell for exactly the amount you put into buying them right? Upgrading champions is never a loss. Even if you're only going to be using it for a couple more rounds, it's still good to upgrade a champion to 3*!

Titanium701 votes

Wait I think I misunderstood you idea: You want to change the 1-Cost youget at higher level anyway to have a chance to be the one you have. That's another story and would work.

I though you want to simply add a chance for additional 1-Cost you have, which would take up space of a 4-Cost.


Still I don't really like such a system - it would need to be such a minor boost you barely notice it. If not you'd see one or two 3-Star 1-Cost every single game without even trying. That would be overkill.

Subdue1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Metal Janna,realm=NA,application-id=RaE1aOE7,discussion-id=AaUATVOg,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-08-15T21:46:22.719+0000)

Increased chance to see 1-cost units that you already have. If you're swapping out 1-cost units for 2s and 3s throughout the game, then the only ones you're going to keep are the ones that are part of the comp you're going for. Therefore you won't be seeing more Dariuses when you're building Noble or more Nidalees when you're building Ranger, unless you're using those specific champs as stopgaps to cover the lack of a champion you're planning to pick up later.

Ok so you leveled up right? You stand good chances of rolling 2 cost, 3 cost units in each hand now. Why would you keep 1-cost units that you no longer need? And if you need them for just a while longer but are planning on throwing them out later, why would you mind seeing more of them? You realize those Garens and Elises sell for exactly the amount you put into buying them right? Upgrading champions is never a loss. Even if you're only going to be using it for a couple more rounds, it's still good to upgrade a champion to 3*!

This isn't how it works. Take for example, Garen. Garen is great at the beginning, okay in the middle, and nothing special in the late game. This is all doubly true if you don't plan to have items on the Garen. Most of the time I'll pick Garen up and 2 star him to have an early-mid game front line, but I don't want any more of Garen after that. I'll be selling him off and replacing him with Chogath or Sejuani, or some other frontline champion.

And actually, there is a cost to upgrading a champion that you're going to dump anyway. It's up to 5 coins that could be triggering income, up to 5 spaces being taken up on your bench that could have more valuable champions there, and probably worst of all, in regards to your suggestion, it's having champions you don't want wasting your draws when you could be getting better ones.

tires5 votes

If you’ve dropped two brackets because you can’t build the comp you want, why not stop trying to force the comp?

Like if it’s not working (which it really sounds like it’s not), continuing to try to run it is just self sabotage.

Summoner SpeII5 votes

meta changes, learn to adapt, stop 1 tricking comps lol

Xhandel1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Summoner SpeII,realm=NA,application-id=RaE1aOE7,discussion-id=AaUATVOg,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-08-16T03:08:37.691+0000)

meta changes, learn to adapt, stop 1 tricking comps lol

Agree with him, even if i dont win, I have had plenty of second places with unorthodox and lack of synergy comps, because thats what the game throwed at me and i needed to build them in order to not lose, and those comps at least had resulted on podiums, and the majority of times, without 3 star champions.

Sukishoo2 votes

I think one tricking kind of died off after demon meta died. I've seen a lot more variety after they did away with that.

FireDrizzle4 votes

My gripe is that it is more likely you draw nothing that matches. Just played a match where I had 1 silver at 3-3.

Helmight3 votes

This is one of my biggest concerns with TFT. As more characters get added, it's going to be harder to actually find the synergies you want to go for. I feel like Riot are going to have to have the game pull specific synergies at the beginning of a game and leave out all the rest (i.e. Glacial/Shapeshifter/Elementalists are excluded from the pool, everything else is in) in order for it to still be possible to hit second- and third-tier units.

oldsouth baron2 votes

yes and they have to know it. but deciding how to handle it must be difficult, theyre too used to adding new things just to stop that now.

but i do believe the problem can be mitigated somehow, perhaps a 6th character slot per round or a preference % increase, etc.

Ventira4 votes

[{quoted}](name=oldsouth baron,realm=NA,application-id=RaE1aOE7,discussion-id=AaUATVOg,comment-id=00040000,timestamp=2019-08-16T00:22:28.285+0000)

yes and they have to know it. but deciding how to handle it must be difficult, theyre too used to adding new things just to stop that now.

but i do believe the problem can be mitigated somehow, perhaps a 6th character slot per round or a preference % increase, etc.

Should just add a Bad Luck protection system, to be honest. I've gone literally dozens of rerolls (this especially happened in my last match) where I got no higher then a 2.5 (A 2 star unit with another 2 star on the bench), while the enemy had THREE 3 star units, and never saw any of my units in the shop after that.

Remorseful221 votes

I think a 6th slot would be good for right now but if they continue to add more champions or champion packs, which I do kinda like by the way, I want to see some of my favorite champions come into TFT, they could implement a weekly rotation or gamely rotation where certain sets sit out for that game, which would allow good players to show skill expression in adapting and building different comps, while bad players are punished for searching for their one trick comp. This would probably only be viable after a large number of champions are added that saturate different origins/classes as removing an origin removes some of different classes and vice versa could result in frustration when someone is trying to build around a certain origin/class.

Semaj3xt4h1 votes

I think theres an easy way to fix this problem... they should just reduce the amount of exp you get per level so if you want to hang around level 3-5 longer to get those 3 star lvl 1-2's then just dont put any points in exp, granted it would pretty much screw over anyone who wasn't actually aware that people were like 4 levels higher then them... OR maybe you could just lock your exp too... Also I think they could just turn some units into like 6 gold costing units and you only see them when you are level 7 or higher.

There's several fixes, i've been experiencing the same thing you guys are, I tend to mitigate it by just forcing comps instead. With all the extra units now, its easy to get caught up buying too many units spreading yourself too thin. It's actually easier to get a 3 star 3 gold unit then a 1 star, you just have to pay attention to the drop rates and essentially the 3 gold units never dip below certain percentage after a certain level... Just position yourself accordingly and don't try to keep going for that 3 star trist/level 1 if you are past lvl 6 and only have 2/3rds of the total value.

Sukishoo1 votes

Bloated? They aren't even done yet, they wanted to add at least 60 champions to the total pool, so....

initialbc1 votes

The combination of increased Dmg Taken Late and Adding more Champions to the pool has really reduced my enjoyment and skill expression in the game. Suuuper hard to transition, forced to build items that don't scale well, win streaking is still king, and a lot of times strong champions are outweighing any cool Trait synergies.

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