Have Riot ever created an evil Demacian yet? Or hints of something shady in Demacia?

5G8Nri0B54·Oct 26, 2014·12 votes·4,380 views

Looking at their champion roster, the worst Demacia's gotten is just an over-confident french girl and maybe Jarvan who may or may not be influenced by something from some story-arc Riot left to collect dust years ago. Asides from that, all the world's evil seem to come from either Zaun, Shadow Isles, Ionia, or Noxus. Demacia seems a little too squeaky clean.

If evil does exist within the walls of Demacia, what kind of character would it be?

A corrupted clergyman whose mission is to wipe out all non-believers in some holy genocide? A corrupt government official? An over-zealous version of Vayne that extends his list of targets to "anyone not literally kissing Jarvan's ass"? If Demacian, it'd have to be someone who is Lawful Evil I suspect.

As far as preference goes, I'm kinda leaning on a corrupted high priest, pope, or whatever Runeterra's equivalent would be. Lives a lavish life-style, eats like a king, locks women away in his private chamber, blackmails royalty, leads genocides against meglings, impose ridiculous taxes, etc. Like High Overseer Campbell from Dishonored or that douche from Hellsing.

Or anyone from Guild Orzhov from MTG

http://www.metaplay.com/media/catalog/product/cache/2/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/g/p/gpt-it_pontefice-orzhov_orzhov-pontiff_patto-delle-gilde_124-165_magic_metaplay.jpg

God DAMN I loved Ravnica. Easily one of the best MTG expansions by a mile.

45 Comments

Terra BoomaOct 26, 20146 votes

Go check out Lux's Judgement.

Trust me, Demacia's pretty fucked up.

and so is Lux

DreamspitterOct 26, 20145 votes

Go check out Lux's Judgement.

Trust me, Demacia's pretty fucked up.

and so is Lux

#Let's have a look!

Garen, the Might of Demacia, her long-lost brother, stood before her. His face was stern, yet kind, and exactly how she had imagined he would look in real life, having only seen him in the League match broadcasts since he had been taken away.

#“Why do you want to join the League?”

Lux allowed herself a smile, trying to not seem smug. While anyone who had been subject to a League judgment was forbidden to discuss the trial, Lux had done her research, and she knew that they summoned illusions to extract their answers. It was mere child’s play for her; she could see right through it, and she knew what they wanted to hear.

She straightened and looked the illusion of her brother straight in the eye.

#“To fight for justice in the name of Demacia.”

“What is the real reason, Luxanna?”

#“Victory for our allies, defeat for our enemies, and justice for all.”

They were both quotes from The Measured Tread, the handbook that any self-respecting Demacian could recite on command, but they did not make them any less true for her own purposes.

Her brother frowned, and that was the last thing Lux saw before an explosion of light consumed them.

#Then the flashback....

Lux burst into the Crownguard residence. To her delight, she heard familiar voices speaking quietly in the kitchen. She found three military officials standing at attention, speaking to her parents. Her heart skipped a beat as she started to retreat back into the living room; they were discussing important business, and she had been taught better than to interrupt. She would have left the house entirely, except at that one dreadful moment, she heard her name.

She froze.

“It is the greatest honor you could bestow upon our household to take Luxanna. She will serve you well, just as Garen has before her.” A chair scraped along the floor as her mother stood.

“You are sure, Lilia? Your daughter is at the age where she needs her parents the most, especially after taking her older brother away.”

“It is all in the King’s name. You will provide all the parenting that she will need.” Her father’s tone was dismissive.

“Very well. It is done.”

Lux fell to the ground, the repressed memories unforgivingly rushing back into her mind. Her parents delivering the news. Lux barricading herself in her room. The pain in her arms as they forcibly dragged her away from her home. Her hair draped across her face as she refused to look at her parents. The burn of her tears as she cried herself to sleep every night. The booming voices yelling at her to focus. Her screams as she cursed her family for doing this to her.

Then, her own voice echoing back at her, reciting the Justice Pledge alongside her fellow recruits. The comfort of re-reading The Measured Tread cover to cover countless times. The indoctrination of the new incoming class, led by Lux herself. The pride swelling in her heart as she marched forth under Demacia’s shining banner. The accolades in praise of her exemplary work. The absolute love for her country. The emptiness of realization of what she had willingly grown to love.

The assault of memories subsided, and she was left slumped in the darkness. She knew the League had retreated from her mind, but the test wasn’t over yet. Someone was standing before her, and she didn’t even have to look up to know who it was.

#“Will you admit the real reason why you want to join the League now?”

Her labored breaths caught in her throat just long enough for her to whisper,

#“Because I have nothing else…”

The darkness shattered around her, falling to the ground in shards. **She crumpled to the ground, heaving sobs racking her body. **

#That was sad.

A Superb VillainOct 27, 20144 votes

#That was sad.

I found it entertaining. Veigar

OuttaControl56Oct 26, 20145 votes

Vayne is pretty evil and harsh if you ask me.

Anyhow:

Vayne's family is murdered, Fiora's father is framed, and Demacian guards suddenly rush at Katarina when she's trying to converse with J4. There's obviously someone manipulating the strings in Demacia, taking out nobility who stand against their rise in political power.

In my opinion, its the Black Rose. Take what you will from that thought process, but an extremely old cult in Valoran is definitely not confined to Noxus alone....

5G8Nri0B54Oct 26, 20145 votes

Vayne is pretty evil and harsh if you ask me.

Anyhow:

Vayne's family is murdered, Fiora's father is framed, and Demacian guards suddenly rush at Katarina when she's trying to converse with J4. There's obviously someone manipulating the strings in Demacia, taking out nobility who stand against their rise in political power.

In my opinion, its the Black Rose. Take what you will from that thought process, but an extremely old cult in Valoran is definitely not confined to Noxus alone....

Unless they changed the lores...

Vayne's family was killed by a witch or something, or some sort of night creature.

Fiora's father was disgraced because it was found out that he cheated by poisoning his blade for his duels, hence why he's been undefeated all this time.

OuttaControl56Oct 26, 20141 votes

Vayne's family was implied to be killed by Leblanc, which is why Vayne is stalking the Black Rose.

Fiora's father was found out, but he could have easily been framed. Nothing about the lore has to be explained, the Black Rose did a good job of covering their tracks and take no blame for these events. That's the whole point!

ModWulf HelhammerOct 28, 20141 votes

I'm pretty sure Fiora's father was disgraced because he slipped a slow acting poison into his opponents drink the night before the dual. It was just one guy, not all of them

5G8Nri0B54Oct 28, 20143 votes

I'm pretty sure Fiora's father was disgraced because he slipped a slow acting poison into his opponents drink the night before the dual. It was just one guy, not all of them

Sounds like he's done it for quite a while. He was probably a decent duelist back in his days, but it sounds like he eventually resorted to poisoning his opponent.

Her devotion turned out to be misplaced. On the eve of an arranged duel, authorities caught Fiora's father slipping a paralysis poison into his opponent's drink. His treachery destroyed the family’s reputation, and Fiora's own honor fell under question. Outraged and desperate to clear her name, she challenged her father to a duel. Though he fought with power and style, Fiora realized the man had long forgotten the discipline that defined a true duelist.

GreenLoreOct 26, 20141 votes

can you really blame demacian gurads rushing at katarina one of the top assassins of noxus approaching the prince?

Also while vayne might be harsh,that doesn't mean she is evil,as far as we know she only hunts evil beings(her character page lists vlad and warwick who are both murderers)

OuttaControl56Oct 27, 20141 votes

Well, Garen had the forethought to defend her, even though she's standing next to his best friend and could slit his throat. I refuse to believe that Garen's men would be so foolish and rash: Jarvan had walked with Katarina all the way through the city in disguise, and they still think she's here to kill him?

Doesn't make much sense.

Vayne wants to purge all dark magic....Does that mean Annie should die as well? Sure, I can get her crusade, but the problem is we don't know how far she'll take it.

GreenLoreOct 27, 20141 votes

Overall I wouldn't expect too much from demacian no-names,they probably saw her and attacked the moment they saw this.But in the end it is a possibility and either way I think it is quite possible that the black rose has its spies in other countries too.

And I doubt Vayne is against dark magic in general,but those who use it carelessely/for selfish reasons.I mean she lists WW and Vlad as her enemies,both are known to be pretty evil killers. annie for example is someone who wields dark magic,but she doesn't go around to hurt others with it.

OuttaControl56Oct 30, 20141 votes

Considering that General Du Coteau was able to infiltrate Demacia on his lonesome, pretty sure the Black Rose can do it too. Its headcanon, but its a mighty compelling one.

Her VO and her lore makes it uncertain. I know it could be that simple, but there's a chance she just might be cruel enough to deem Annie extinguishable.

5G8Nri0B54Oct 30, 20141 votes

I won't lie. I'm questioning whether the General even exists with Riot's new retconned lore. Cassiopeia herself changed so drastically already.

OuttaControl56Nov 1, 20141 votes

Please, don't even let that possibility into the discussion. It scares me to the core.

GreenLoreOct 26, 20145 votes

I agree with you. Demacia has its shades of grey in the story,but none of that gets really represented in the game.

I am not sure about a priest,there aren't many known religions in LoL aside from the sun/moon-worshippers and those who worship eldritch-abominations(also karthus is a bit like an evil priest already,since he really worships death)

Some ideas of mine would be: -A fanatic,someone who sees the world in a black and white-morality,who thinks everyone from noxus/Zaun/whatever is evil and thus deserves death -A brutal general who will put his soldiers on suicide-missions and who will kill his own troops if they are fleeing(after all a true demacian will never retreat) -some sort of sinister minister,demacia is said to have a council that also holds some political power,one of the council-men could be quite corrupt. -a noble who sees everyone who isn't a noble as insects who should bow to the nobles -more of a personality-thing,but I'd love someone who puts an extremely polite and calm facade on his face while actually being some kind of insane/sadistic person

Of course these ideas can be combined too(brutal general and fanatic would match pretty fine)

5G8Nri0B54Oct 26, 20141 votes

Demacia has its shades of grey in the story,but none of that gets really represented in the game.

Correct...this is kinda reflected on other things too. Nautilus is supposedly a tanky juggernaut who can really swing his anchor around with great force. In-game...he's relatively squishy for a tank, and his attacks aren't exactly all that hard hititing.

I am not sure about a priest,there aren't many known religions in LoL aside from the sun/moon-worshippers and those who worship eldritch-abominations(also karthus is a bit like an evil priest already,since he really worships death)

Well I was assuming Demacia is religious based on assumptions. You very well know what kind of place Demacia is already just from looking at the champions they give, even moreso if you read some other materials. It's more than obvious where Riot got Demacia's inspirations from.

Literally all works with this kind of civilization as a setting will have a religion that is a less than subtle reference to a certain major religion in real life that was extremely prominent in a certain setting places like Demacia and other fictional kingdoms are based on.

And one defining characteristic they all have is that it is often run by, or have an extremely corrupt or dangerously fanatical member in a high ranking position. I feel the Orzhov should give a pretty good idea of what I'm getting at. This religion and it's members would usually involve itself into some sort of corruption up-top plot, or a genocide plot, or some sort of inquisition plot, or oppressing the lesser people with tax and moral watchdogs plot.

Ever played Dishonoured? Think Campbell and his Overseers and their crazy religion with those commandments.

-A brutal general who will put his soldiers on suicide-missions and who will kill his own troops if they are fleeing(after all a true demacian will never retreat)

That's a little too Noxian I think. In fact, I'd wager Darius probably did the second thing a lot.

-some sort of sinister minister,demacia is said to have a council that also holds some political power,one of the council-men could be quite corrupt.

Yeah that's also a possibility I had in mind. Although a corrupted clergy man is a lot more "doable". He can use the power of holy light or other abilities that are normally associated with "good", but in a much more sinister fashion. A corrupt aristocrat or some other type of politician would be...difficult for a champion. A character mention in lore atmost like Kat and Cass's father. But that's a bit of a dead-end.

Weenie Lord ShenOct 26, 20144 votes

What we really need is Rakdos as a league champion.

Lesbihonest here.

ZkaiserOct 26, 20143 votes

As much as Riot likes to say that they paint characters as shades of grey, they can't write anything other than black and white. I say can't but in reality they just won't because they feel like cognitive dissonance is bad for the visual design of their game and the general populace likes having generic GOOD GUY VS BAD GUY faction wars. Riven is proof of this as they looked like they were going to deliver on a good Noxian but then they have her basically change factions and even tried to make her Redeemed skin have a Demacian color scheme (It used to be blue instead of green).

DreamspitterOct 26, 20149 votes

As much as Riot likes to say that they paint characters as shades of grey, they can't write anything other than black and white. I say can't but in reality they just won't because they feel like cognitive dissonance is bad for the visual design of their game and the general populace likes having generic GOOD GUY VS BAD GUY faction wars. Riven is proof of this as they looked like they were going to deliver on a good Noxian but then they have her basically change factions and even tried to make her Redeemed skin have a Demacian color scheme (It used to be blue instead of green).

What.

#As much as Riot likes to say that they paint characters as shades of grey, they can't write anything other than black and white.

#Varus? Twisted Fate? Graves? Gangplank? Diana? Viktor? Brand? Xerath? Aatrox? Jax? Sivir? Azir? Teemo? Sejuani? Poppy? Karthus? Malzahar? Rengar? Kayle? Morgana?

Just taking the first one off this list look at Varus. His "Retribution" may seem heroic, and he means well by it but....he's ultimately serving himself, and his own pain. And at WHAT COST? He was supposed to guard the Pit of Pallas, not drag out the VILE powers contained within and become a vessel for them. What happens when the power takes over him? And can he cure or kill himself before it does?

#Compare and contrast him with Kassadin and Zed.

Kassadin is GOOD. Zed is EVIL. Varus is a GRAY antihero.

MrBuffingtonOct 26, 20141 votes

Also ~~Kayle~~ and Riven, both are typically seen as good ~~guys~~ girls, but Kayle is pretty brutal about her brand of justice, Riven has killed a lot of people. Sona is typically seen as a harmless hero type, but her lore states that she's trained herself to use music as a deadly weapon.

I'm actually having more trouble listing characters that are purely good or purely evil. Good: Leona, Braum, Soraka, Taric? Evil: Veigar...uh.....Singed, Karthus?

EDIT: whoops didn't see y'all were already discussing Riven and Kayle.

5G8Nri0B54Oct 26, 20141 votes

Also ~~Kayle~~ and Riven, both are typically seen as good ~~guys~~ girls, but Kayle is pretty brutal about her brand of justice, Riven has killed a lot of people. Sona is typically seen as a harmless hero type, but her lore states that she's trained herself to use music as a deadly weapon.

I'm actually having more trouble listing characters that are purely good or purely evil. Good: Leona, Braum, Soraka, Taric? Evil: Veigar...uh.....Singed, Karthus?

EDIT: whoops didn't see y'all were already discussing Riven and Kayle.

There's also the issue of presentation.

Take Sona for example. She's hardly even gray at all, she learned to defend herself using her instrument. But Kayle, Lux, etc. Even if they do have some shades of grey, it's not presented in-game.

Melancholy ExileOct 26, 20145 votes

Riven is proof of this as they looked like they were going to deliver on a good Noxian but then they have her basically change factions and even tried to make her Redeemed skin have a Demacian color scheme (It used to be blue instead of green).

You do realise that the reason her Redeemed skin was once blue is because she was written as a Demacian and was recast as a Noxian specifically because that draft made her "gooder than good", right? She was originally going to be someone who was exiled for having the gall to try and aid Noxian refugees rather than showing them the hate they deserved.

Riven is a 'good' Noxian but even that means someone who sees justice in a society built on social darwinism and had no particular complaint in invading another nation on little grounds beyond the perceived weakness of its people (And thus the right of the strong to take from them). What does it matter if she's "basically changed factions" when her ideals are based in her Noxian upbringing and she still professes her love for all the state could be?

CriomhthannOct 26, 20143 votes

We have no idea until they're finished doing their lore work.

In previous lore, Lux was the result of a child soldier program which left her traumatized and useless for anything other than fighting. We don't know whether that's the case anymore.

J4's "judgment" implied he had quite a bit more in common with his Noxus counterparts than anyone would like to admit, but again, not canon anymore.

GreenLoreOct 26, 20142 votes

that doesn't mean that the characterization for those 2 has changed. They want to keep the characterization of the champs the way they are(they kinda failed with Xerath,but said that his current lore only shows one aspect and that his fascination with magic will be explored later,so we'll have to wait)

Shaded StrikerOct 26, 20142 votes

What was the point in mentioning Jinx isn't exactly evil? She's not from Demacia, she's from Zaun.

Though, I agree, if they put an evil archetype from Demacia, a Zealot would fit perfectly.

5G8Nri0B54Oct 26, 20142 votes

What was the point in mentioning Jinx isn't exactly evil? She's not from Demacia, she's from Zaun.

Though, I agree, if they put an evil archetype from Demacia, a Zealot would fit perfectly.

I derped.

I had two completely different points to make, accidentally selected the PREVIEW instead of BODY to make a correction, backspaced sending me to the previous page instead of deleting something, screwed the post up, and made quick repairs forgetting what one of the point involving Jinx was...

SchaakaKonOct 26, 20142 votes

Killing people for fun *isnt *evil? o.O

GreenLoreOct 26, 20143 votes

hey she doesn't kill people for fun......she just likes to blow up stuff for fun,its just that people don't tend to survive explosions,collapsing buildings and so on.....

5G8Nri0B54Oct 28, 20141 votes

Killing people for fun *isnt *evil? o.O

Well, she's less of a killing people type and more "BOOM MAKES THINGS EXPLODE!!!!" type. She's not Chaotic Evil, she's Chaotic Neutral.

Plus, she isn't exactly killing people so much as scores of robot according to her music video.

SchaakaKonOct 28, 20141 votes

http://www.pinterest.com/pin/134193263870155151/

On Jinx's wanted poster, she is wanted for murder and then some more murders (said in the smaller text at the bottom).

There sure is alot of denial around. I know Jinx may be a lot of peoples waifu but knowingly murdering many people whether its indirectly or not still is evil in my book.

5G8Nri0B54Oct 28, 20141 votes

Said wanted poster is also full of other ridiculous stuff and heavily hinted as being written by herself.

No one denies she hasn't probably killed a ton of people. But killing doesn't necessarily equate to Chaotic Evil. That's evil for the sake of evil. Again, Chaotic Neutral is by far the closest to classify her. She's the complete opposite of Lawful alignment, hence making her Chaotic. As for her Good to Evil alignment, she's CLEARLY not good, at the same time, she's never been out to cause destruction for the sake of harm. She's literally doing whatever the hell she likes because she finds it fun.

She has no allegiance and have neither good nor evil intentions, or any intentions at all in anything she does. Just shits and giggles. Hence, Neutral.

She's like a faerie carrying explosives. She's a trickster archetype plain and simple. Chaotic Neutral.

SchaakaKonOct 30, 20141 votes

Let me know if I took this out of context

"...killed a ton of people. But killing [for fun] doesn't necessarily equate to Evil."

So... Killing a ton of people is not.. Evil..? I would wholly recommend you stay out of the public and seek medical attention, if you believe your own words.

But lets talk DnD alignments. The PHB does not define alignments at all, so the task is up to us!

She has no allegiance and have neither good nor evil intentions

Please, define what is 'Evil'. "Murdering because its a fun thing to do" certainly meets a criteria of 'evil' in my definition. Your interpretation of 'Chaotic Evil' seems strictly niched into 'Saturday Cartoon Villain'. Hell, but even Skeletor laughs and giggles as he murders innocents, "Naw, hes just a silly billy chaotic neutral with a quirk of murder". If only Hitler had a big 'ol smile and danced to a jaunty tune as he sent Jews into a cooker, then he would not been seen as a historical icon of evil but a chaotic neutral whos merely enjoying himself.

**You seem to excuse collateral damage crimes and crimes of passion from being 'evil' or 'bad' because they were not premeditated. **

After so many DnD game sessions of pointless arguing Ive come to the conclusion that *Role Playing Games *are better off with out an enforced alignment system. Heres why, There is soooo much grey area. Lets go with a simple hypothetical: Killing is bad. Right? Well, not necessarily. Killing in battle is not considered bad. Killing because of justice isnt bad. Killing from mercy is not bad. So then what is bad, what is evil? Is evil only if you self identify as evil? Hitler never sat atop a perch and scream "Go Forth My Minions! MuHaHaHa" while twirling a mustache. Hitler (in his own minds eye) thought he was doing the right thing for his country and his people. So is evil a matter of perception? The English saw George Washington as a traitor who rebelled against his homeland and murdered his kinfolk. The victors write the history books so does that make the losers evil if the winners said they were? What about cause and effect? What if you intended to do good but it ended up doing evil? Are you evil? What if you intended to do an evil act but it ended up being seen as a good one in public opinion? Does public opinion determine what is 'good' or 'evil'? Then the minority will always be seen as evil if they do not conform. This is all just a fragment of one alignment and it is only a plethora of debate and grey area that ultimately never comes to a conclusion.

Here is how I come to see the 5 alignments: Law vs Chaos. They have nothing to do with city regulations or 'following the rules'. It is a question of "Do you have a personal code?" lupin the third is a thief who is lawful, imo. Although he steals, he has a very strict set of codes he follows.

Good vs Evil. Evil will take from society (or those around them) and give to themselves meanwhile dogooders will take from themselves and give to society (or those around them). The only meager way I found a satisfactory definition of 'What is Evil or Good?' is selfishness or selflessness.

Neutrals are those that do not have strong convictions to any set of morals and/or are easily persuaded/gullible and tend to be very wishy washy on the alignment spectrum.

True Neutral if you are a lame druid (I honestly had a friend that thought True Neutral was a 'freedom of alignment' and meant he can do w/e the fuck he wanted without consequences).

TLDR: What does the word Evil truly mean?

5G8Nri0B54Oct 30, 20141 votes

Maaan...and now I'm trying to remember how Jinx was even brought into this from the beginning.

Anyways, I'm not gonna lie. My DnD experiences have largely consisted of my experience with a short session with some friends, and the Neverwinter Night series. And there were more than a few instances where I outright disagreed with what gave me Evil alignment and what gave me Good, etc.

Your comment that I frame "Chaotic Evil" as Saturday Cartoon Villain is quite correct, because that is EXACTLY what it is like in the games when you go for the Chaotic Evil route. Often times you sashay between Mother Teresa and Baby Eating with little in between. Many characters who are Evil even outright state their evilness or revel in the evil shit they do.

As for what is Good or Evil, for me, it is the perception of the do-er. Jinx appears like she does not really have any agenda beyond having funzies. She isn't trying to do any good or evil. In the eyes of her collateral victims and Vi, she's probably evil. But Jinx herself isn't doing her destruction for personal gain outside of simple enjoyment. She isn't trying to seize power, she isn't trying to rob all the resources in the world or coming up with some Captain Planet villain scheme.

That's my attempt at interpreting the alignment anyways.

LordHippomanOct 26, 20142 votes

Clergyman would be difficult, since there's no established religion in League.

The closest thing we really have to evil stuff going down in Demacia is in Lux's judgement, when she's forcibly drafted.

A Superb VillainOct 27, 20141 votes

Personally, I think Riot should give Demacia their own Thought Police. Their extreme nationalism, evidence of indoctrination, and strict hierarchy, lend to the existence of a secret police pretty well.

Terra BoomaOct 27, 20141 votes

Personally, I think Riot should give Demacia their own Thought Police. Their extreme nationalism, evidence of indoctrination, and strict hierarchy, lend to the existence of a secret police pretty well.

Well there's the Lux judgement

where you know

Lux gets drafted

indoctornated

then trains the next generation of indotees (Is that the right word?)

5G8Nri0B54Oct 28, 20141 votes

Yeah, but there isn't a single hint of it in-game.

Take Swain. He's supposedly a tactical genius and quite capable in a fight. In-game his dialogue reflects his strength and confidence. He harsh voice, hi

Fiora is a cocky french duelist who wants to be the very best.

Her selection line reflects her desire to find someone who is her equal, she constantly wants to find someone to duel, she's arrogant, etc.

Lux...and any other Demacians who may have a supposedly dark edge in their backstory, do not have any of it reflected in-game. In other words, those backstories are just afterthoughts, whereas for Shadow Isle and Noxian champions are presented as dark and evil in-game.

Terra BoomaOct 28, 20141 votes

Yeah, but there isn't a single hint of it in-game.

Take Swain. He's supposedly a tactical genius and quite capable in a fight. In-game his dialogue reflects his strength and confidence. He harsh voice, hi

Fiora is a cocky french duelist who wants to be the very best.

Her selection line reflects her desire to find someone who is her equal, she constantly wants to find someone to duel, she's arrogant, etc.

Lux...and any other Demacians who may have a supposedly dark edge in their backstory, do not have any of it reflected in-game. In other words, those backstories are just afterthoughts, whereas for Shadow Isle and Noxian champions are presented as dark and evil in-game.

Well hold on just a second.

Maybe that's just IT

Demacia is brainwashing people from a VERY young age and doing it SO effectively that nobody realizes it.

Lux, broken inside shows nothing but pride

Shyvana's dad DIED (pre retcon) By the hands of Jarvan. Yet she guards him.

etc and etc.

Demacia has a lot of things moving in shadows.

5G8Nri0B54Oct 28, 20141 votes

There is a distinction between "brainwashing and hiding things so well to the point where nobody realizes it" and showing it in-game though.

Let's take, say...

Leblanc being behind this super-secret society literally no one but the elite few know about. She never speaks of it unless absolutely alone or with other members. But her in-game dialogue still talks about the Black Rose. Her personality and appearance shows the audience that she's a sexy cunning secret-laden woman. Her splash-art reveals she's cunning and tricky.

To take an unrelated example, one of 's identity is that as a cold-blooded remorseless killer. But until something lore-happens, or new voice-overs proves it, this is nothing more than a crappy joke Riot made up to make a really un-intimidating champion sound like more than what it really is.

So for Demacian champions to really fit your "they're just so indoctrinated that they no one is aware of it", there's a difference between being brainwashed and hidden, and completely hidden even from the audience.

Plenty of works of fictions have toyed with this concept before, and very often the fact is relatively obvious to the audience/player itself while it's completely fool-proof in-universe.

There are ways to represent what you have in mind in-game. Hence why I feel that if Riot really want to go that route, either they did a really bad job at it, or they weren't going that route.

Argomecha PerdixOct 27, 20141 votes

I like it how there are some "redeemable" champs, like Viktor, Xerath, Veigar and Vlad up to some point. And there is also quite a bunch of gray characters that are the bad guys for some factions and heroes to others, like Sejuani or Gangplank.

RainbowgasmOct 28, 20141 votes

I don't think Demacia would be much like the Orzhov, more like the Boros. If Demacia does wrong, it's usually through disproportionate punishment for people who break the law, and unfair trials.

5G8Nri0B54Oct 28, 20141 votes

I don't think Demacia would be much like the Orzhov, more like the Boros. If Demacia does wrong, it's usually through disproportionate punishment for people who break the law, and unfair trials.

Well technically you wouldn't see many city-state represented by a single guild in Ravnica, but rather multiple guilds as each guild holds their own archetype, and often times characters and places contain multiple archetypes.

For instance, I agree with you that Boros really fits Demacia (although I'd imagine Boros would much better fit whatever the heck Kayle is from). But rather than just Boros or Orzhov, Demacia looks like it's comprised of Boros, Orzhov, and that shitty boring Blue/White guild nobody can remember.

For more MTG fun, Noxus would be part Dimir, Rakdos, Boros (they're also militaristic like Demacia), and a shade of that crappy Blue/White guild. Sadly, nobody is Golgari in anyway except like, a single champion Zyra

SchaakaKonOct 30, 20141 votes

As Izzet being my favorite guild, by a planet sized difference. Which City state would be the Izzet? Would it be Zaun because they are reckless in their pursuit of advancement? Or Piltover because they are the 'City of Progress'? Or maybe Xerath and Syndra fit this because they are also recklessly seeking greater understanding of magic that caused harm around them? Or maybe Bandle City because there is literally very little known about this City state except that Ziggs, Heimer and Rumble come from there, whom are dangerous inventors.

5G8Nri0B54Oct 30, 20141 votes

It's prooobably Zaun and a Piltover. As in, both cities have shades of Izzet. Both are bastions of knowledge and progress, only in their own way.

But unlike Piltover, I feel Zaun also has heavy shades of the Simic guild mixed in as well. Especially thanks to a certain evolution-obsessed cyborg. Not to mention, Zac is essentially something you'd find in a Simic laboratory.

supes the lostNov 2, 20141 votes

I would like to point out that there has been some hints of shady under goings in Demacia, like Fiora's father, here is an exert from her lore.

"On the eve of an arranged duel, authorities caught Fiora's father slipping a paralysis poison into his opponent's drink. His treachery destroyed the family's reputation, and Fiora's own honor fell under question."

I haven't really checked any other lore's or anything, just Fiora's father came to mind when I saw this post.