What Are The Advantages of Retconterra Over Runeterra?
None that I can see.
It seems to lack creative writing and i interesting champion lore.
None that I can see.
It seems to lack creative writing and i interesting champion lore.
My coffee hasn't kicked in yet, but I'll give it a go.
Ahem.. "No, not yet, quiet down.")
Change is goood! "No get the hell out of here you wanker.") The IoW did allow SOME character development, but it makes a lot harder for some champions, like Nautilus, Lissandra, Zed, and so on.{quoted} The IoW did allow SOME character development, but it makes a lot harder for some champions, like Nautilus, Lissandra, Zed, and so on.
Actually, they were developing Lissandra in the old cannon before her release.
Yes but Narasimha didn't say it didn't allow for character development altogether, just that for some champions it's harder.
Yes but Narasimha didn't say it didn't allow for character development altogether, just that for some champions it's harder.
I know, but Chogath and Fiddlesticks are better examples than Lissandra... except that they have recived 0 changes for now
Are you sure? That seems unlikely to me, considering they stopped putting anyone in the old cannon since Darius.
Are you sure? That seems unlikely to me, considering they stopped putting anyone in the old cannon since Darius.
Yes, in the JoJ they talked about the "human" Lissandra (the political figure, not the Ice Witch)
http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/The_Journal_of_Justice:_Volume_1,_Issue_02
And this still making sense in the "new" cannon... because "The Ice Witch" is deceiving Ashe, using the "mask" of the "Ice Dervish".
(Sejuani is also mentioned in the JoJ)
That's interesting. I mean, REALLY interesting. Considering how much later she came out, its actually super zeta interesting to think about what they may or may not have planned there. That's a pretty major change from the old lore to the new one. The Ice Dervish clan seems to have been replaced with the Frostguard. And obviously, the Frostguard doesn't have fealty to Avarosan. This makes Lissandra one of the biggest retcon targets. Gaah I can't believe I missed that.
That's interesting. I mean, REALLY interesting. Considering how much later she came out, its actually super zeta interesting to think about what they may or may not have planned there. That's a pretty major change from the old lore to the new one. The Ice Dervish clan seems to have been replaced with the Frostguard. And obviously, the Frostguard doesn't have fealty to Avarosan. This makes Lissandra one of the biggest retcon targets. Gaah I can't believe I missed that.
Actually, the Frostguard is the Clan of the Ice Dervish. Her clan is seen as "as a noble and peaceful tribe that guards against evil creatures like the Ice Witch." and they are "allied" with the Avarosan... even if they actually serve the Ice Witch.
When the lore of Lissandra talks about "... she launched her greatest deception. She murdered and stole the identity of the Frostguard leader. Then she slowly began to warp the tribe's proud traditions. When her human form grew old, she faked her own death and then murdered her successor to steal her identity." Is referring to the article in the JoJ.
Canonically, Sejuani and Ashe do not know who is The Ice Witch: this is explained in http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Journey_Into_the_Freljord
Quinn suspects of Lissandra, but nothing more.
Can you give any specific examples where the retconned lore has given us something cool that the old lore couldn't?
Personally, I really find it frustrating when the Riot Narrative team says the old lore was too restricting, and then see them continue to produce lore that could have easily existed within the old lore's context.
Black Mist invasion. Under the IoW, such events would have been stopped and controlled. If things got too bad, just time stop the area and extract people. Now, the Shadow Isles actually are a threat creeping up on the world.
Can you give any specific examples where the retconned lore has given us something cool that the old lore couldn't?
Personally, I really find it frustrating when the Riot Narrative team says the old lore was too restricting, and then see them continue to produce lore that could have easily existed within the old lore's context.
One thing I would say is that Demacia and Noxus could never really do something interesting because they were tied to the IoW. However in the new lore they could actually go to war... Of course, that would depend on new lore actually being written.
[Insert complaint about new lore]
I'm gonna jump in here and say it lets them rehash the old stories and claim them for themselves! Like Sion! He was an undead juggernaut and now he's an....Undead...Juggernaut.. Yeah nothing changes...
[{quoted}](name=Shadow Merchant,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=Ku5n9RQo,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2015-03-29T17:15:37.602+0000)
I'm gonna jump in here and say it lets them rehash the old stories and claim them for themselves! Like Sion! He was an undead juggernaut and now he's an....Undead...Juggernaut.. Yeah nothing changes...
actually, he was "The Undead Champion" and died/was revived in a very different way.
What the old lore gave us - A overall passably defined world and setting that explained the purpose of the matches we were playing and had an overarching story about politics, intrigue and war that was directly tied to the setting and those very matches... but a lot of loose or dangling bits of lore/champions that didn't really have a place in the lore as a whole and were just kinda.... there.
What the new lore gives us - Short stories involving several characters at a time that describe and detail one place, event or character's past/present and what the characters involved in that story did/are attempting to do in the world as a whole... but without any real interconnection between these stories or the world as a whole, or any closure to the stories in question before the next little bit of lore is released elsewhere.
It all depends on which you prefer. The old lore gave the world as a whole a story and the players and game a place in it... but it couldn't give focus to each and every character or event involved due to the scope of things. The new lore struggles to give every character a tie to the stories, but those stories may as well take place in alternate universes for how much they affect each other. Also, some characters are just as minor and insignificant in the new lore as the old. The story just can't focus hard on 120+ characters to a satisfactory level.
I myself preferred the old lore. Take the Shurima event as an example. In the old lore none of the champions involved had any real interaction. Xerath was a power-hungry mage who sold his body for magic, Sivir was an ex-mercenary, Cassiopeia was cursed to be a snake, Nasus and Renekton were gods from another world, and Skarner was a scorpion from an ancient race that hadn't all woken up yet. (We'll leave Azir out, since he didn't exist in the old lore) Now Azir and Xerath have a story... and it's a decent one that fleshes them both out well and has some emotional impact to it. Fair. Cassiopeia and Sivir have a new story as well... Sivir's old lore was woefully vague so the change for her is decent (Anything is better than nothing) and while I personally don't like the change in Cass's new lore I can't say they didn't give her a fairly major part in the story. But the other champions seem shoehorned in. Nasus and Renek were... animal people who lived back in Shurima and were wise and stuff. Renekton is now crazy for a somewhat more heroic reason, but why being trapped with Xerath made him like he is doesn't make much sense. Skarner got hit the worst, with his new lore being reduced to "Skarner is a big, ancient bug that guards a tomb or something.". His old lore was hardly detailed, but it gave the big guy something. He missed his kind. He was lonely.
By adding more depth and details to things they've made the complete LACK of depth to others stand out all the more... while also crushing fan canon a bit. Old league was vaguely defined enough to imagine stories in yourself about how the champs fit together, how your summoner fit in with the insitute, how the matches mattered and what they were over. The lore and bios gave you impressions of who the characters were and what they were like... and even some small tidbits of info on how they interacted together. Small bits that people worked around to make some really amazing stories. Things like this or this.
I'm not saying the new lore is impossible to work around like this. Someone could write up a whole story about how Sivir deals with being the Azir's heir, or about how Ashe and Sejuani react to learning about the truth behind Lissandra. But with Riot showing how willing they are to scrap their own lore and setting if they decide they want to make a new space hamster champion who doesn't fit into it, it gives a lot less incentive to care about the lore at all. Instead we can just look forward to the next big "event" that probably will connect a handful of characters and tell a little story that doesn't have a conclusion and doesn't affect the game at all.
Really great post. Really.
But... go read Skarner's League Judgement if you think his Lore was hardly detailed.
There's a surprising amount of detail to his entire species.
P.S. But yeah, great post.
I'm sure the new lore has potential, I just wish they were more prepared to bring new stories forward before dropping the bomb on us.
The short bios are supposed to be accompanied by long ones, but technical problems are preventing them.
Many champions also had incredibly un-influential stories ,
to name a few. But at least the league existed to give them even a remote purpose. Now without it, they may as well no exist in the world at all.
Dude, it doesnt help. They already said they have no intention of reverting the retcon
Now they don't have to have a stupid game in the lore they're creating for a game.