Can Eve's skins receive some love?

Bârd·Jan 30, 2016·4 votes·759 views

I like her skins, but they have a problem.

Because Eve is constantly stealthed, the skins can often go unappreciated.

What if the range indicator on her passive look different on each skin?

16 Comments

GreenLoreJan 30, 20162 votes

Overall eve needs a big rework,so I guess they'll look into that once they get to it.

Sadly this is most likely going to be in 2017 at best,since Taric Yorick and Urgot will most likely receive their reworks before Eve.

RavenhaleJan 30, 20161 votes

What exactly needs to be reworked? I can see a VU but no real need for a kit overhaul. She's a sustained damage fighter with stealth to get her past wards and a MS buff to close her range indicator. Think of her assassin tag in terms of Yi and Fiora.

GreenLoreJan 30, 20161 votes

Well just look at Eves kit in detail: Her passive and W are clearly meant for her to be an assassin(which also fits her character) However her Q is best used for damage over time and her ult is an ability that is best used to engage into a fight,both things that fit the most for Tanks. Then there is the fact that regardless if you go AP or AD,it'll always feel like you are leaving out some abilities(you go ap and her ult is rather weak,you go ad and you feel like the E is rather useless).

RavenhaleJan 30, 20161 votes

Her AP scaling and AD scaling are the same on her E. Her Ult scales with AP, but is only notable if you have 300+. Her Q scales a little better with AD, but has AP scaling.

She's a genuine hybrid champion though she works fine straight AP or straight AD. And like Yi, she can build health or AS. I really don't view versatility as detrimental.

GreenLoreJan 30, 20161 votes

Her E does increase her attack speed which is fairly useless if you go AP(not to mention it also triggers onhit effects,which are rarely part of AP-items) And overall hybrid champs were always a mess to balance,since going full ap or full ad will pretty much always be the superior choice(its better do one thing right than to do 2 things bad),for example despite her Q and E having Ad scalings she is still played most often(and most successful) when she goes full AP.

Not to mention that going tanky doesn't match her character at all since she is an assassin who wears nothing to protect her,its like pre-rework sion being played as a mage,its something that turned out working rather well on her because of the design errors in her kit,not because it was ever intended to be like this.

RavenhaleJan 31, 20161 votes

Malphite doesn't wear armor either. There's nothing in Evelynn's lore that states her skin is soft and squishy so I don't see your point in her appearance dictating what sort of stats she should have. It's not like we reduce Leona's armor for her Pool Party skin.

But I do understand the argument of her stated roles being somewhat misleading. People see Assassin/Mage and expect a burst assassin, not some DoT AA masher with Assassin like ability to get to the carries. Her Mage qualities are more like a melee version of Twisted Fate, the other half of her Tango which I don't think to be coincidence. It's hard for me to definitely say she was never intended to be exactly as she was. This is not as clear as Poppy, the Protector, that assassinated entire teams because of an abused mechanic of her Ult.

As for your statement about attack speed being useless... you probably haven't tried the Nashor's Tooth/Rageblade version of Evelynn. Of course this is largely due to the Rageblade changes being relatively new, but adding this to an AP heavy Evelynn is an interesting way to Carry and Split Push.

The issue with hybrid remains in the numbers. If Evelynn's skills scaled off base AD instead of bonus AD, her AD version might have stood a better chance. But Rabadon's exists, so that will never be the case. If you want to carry, AP is the only way to go. Whether you do that with Health or not (Rylai/Liandry is fun) is up to you.

GreenLoreJan 31, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Malphite doesn't wear armor either. There's nothing in Evelynn's lore that states her skin is soft and squishy so I don't see your point in her appearance dictating what sort of stats she should have. It's not like we reduce Leona's armor for her Pool Party skin.

The point is that tanky champs usually look that way. They either have huge amounts of muscle mass Braum ),wear armor Leona ) or are some sort of tanky looking monster( Malphite ) Eve is none of that. Sure Leona doesn't wear armor in some skins,but those are skins,they don't have to correctly reflect the champion. But the standard-skin should represent the champion correctly in all regards.

People see Assassin/Mage and expect a burst assassin, not some DoT AA masher with Assassin like ability to get to the carries. Her Mage qualities are more like a melee version of Twisted Fate, the other half of her Tango which I don't think to be coincidence.

I'm not even sure if DoT assassination could be even considered a thing,considering that DoT means you'll do damage over a certain amount of time,but assassins are supposed to kill their target rather quick. In terms of fighting style she's more like an offensive-oriented fighter... Also I dunno how she is similar to TF in any way,the only similarity would be the fact that both go AP and have an E that has to do with autoattacks.

As for your statement about attack speed being useless... you probably haven't tried the Nashor's Tooth/Rageblade version of Evelynn. Of course this is largely due to the Rageblade changes being relatively new, but adding this to an AP heavy Evelynn is an interesting way to Carry and Split Push.

The thing is that Eves hybrid qualities are generally too bad for these items to be useful. If you look through the internet you find that the most popular and successful eve builds are those who go full ap,with some tankier items mixed into it

The issue with hybrid remains in the numbers. If Evelynn's skills scaled off base AD instead of bonus AD, her AD version might have stood a better chance. But Rabadon's exists, so that will never be the case. If you want to carry, AP is the only way to go. Whether you do that with Health or not (Rylai/Liandry is fun) is up to you.

The problem here is that if they buff the AD-scaling,then she'll be simply played full ad instead of full ap. This pretty much happened with Kayle in the past,Riot tried to make her a good hybrid champ,where you'd buy some ad and some ap items,but people always either went full ap or full ad with her(though by now the rageblade is at least useful on her).

RavenhaleJan 31, 20161 votes

The point is that tanky champs usually look that way. They either have huge amounts of muscle mass ),wear armor) or are some sort of tanky looking monster( ) Eve is none of that.

Eve doesn't exactly look human, so I don't see the argument that she must be squishy. We're talking about a creature that rends and kicks you to death. She's not a trained ninja.

I'm not even sure if DoT assassination could be even considered a thing,considering that DoT means you'll do damage over a certain amount of time,but assassins are supposed to kill their target rather quick. In terms of fighting style she's more like an offensive-oriented fighter... Also I dunno how she is similar to TF in any way,the only similarity would be the fact that both go AP and have an E that has to do with autoattacks.

I agree that DoT doesn't feel like assassination at all. She's more of a fighter with some assassin skills. The only reason why I bring up TF, is because he is regarded as a Mage and might be why Evelynn gets a Mage tag instead of a Fighter tag.

Her kit resembles a Fighter/Assassin that works best building AP and some health.

The thing is that Eves hybrid qualities are generally too bad for these items to be useful. If you look through the internet you find that the most popular and successful eve builds are those who go full ap,with some tankier items mixed into it

Nashor's Tooth is straight AP and CDR. It works fine in an AP build, though it often gets passed up because Evelynn has fairly decent AS built into her kit. It would be more viable if Spell Vamp was decent.

Rageblade is more of an item to hit your max AS. You could also Wit's End for similar results and more On-Hit effects. But usually you're sacrificing Deathcap to get one of these items, so it's a decision of Carry or Hurt them All so someone else can Carry after you die.

The problem here is that if they buff the AD-scaling,then she'll be simply played full ad instead of full ap. This pretty much happened with Kayle in the past,Riot tried to make her a good hybrid champ,where you'd buy some ad and some ap items,but people always either went full ap or full ad with her(though by now the rageblade is at least useful on her).

I honestly don't want them buffing her AD scalings. I wouldn't care if they removed them entirely and buffed her AP ratios, though I doubt that would ever happen. I was simply stating that even if her kit had included her natural AD, the AP version would still scale better. That's why people prefer AP Evelynn, because you control your fate much more as a Carry.

GreenLoreJan 31, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Eve doesn't exactly look human, so I don't see the argument that she must be squishy. We're talking about a creature that rends and kicks you to death. She's not a trained ninja.

The thing is that tanks visually show their tankyness to some degree.It has to do with their design fitting their role. Eve does not look like a tank in the slightest. Yes she doesn't look human,but without any muscle mass or armor she doesn't look tanky at all. Meanwhile you can look at other tank champions and pretty much instantly know that they are tanks.

he only reason why I bring up TF, is because he is regarded as a Mage and might be why Evelynn gets a Mage tag instead of a Fighter tag.

That doesn't really make sense.No champ gets a different tag just because of their relationship to another champ...

Her kit resembles a Fighter/Assassin that works best building AP and some health.

Nashor's Tooth is straight AP and CDR. It works fine in an AP build, though it often gets passed up because Evelynn has fairly decent AS built into her kit. It would be more viable if Spell Vamp was decent.

Rageblade is more of an item to hit your max AS. You could also Wit's End for similar results and more On-Hit effects. But usually you're sacrificing Deathcap to get one of these items, so it's a decision of Carry or Hurt them All so someone else can Carry after you die.

The thing is that pretty much no one wants to built those things on her,because they are overshadowed by other items. Building straight ap and some defense is just more suited on her. They are options,but very niche ones and most evelynn builds simply don't make use of her Attack-speed boost from her E.

YuGiHoJan 30, 20161 votes

Or give eve a different kind of indicator to tell her that she is in stealth without fading her all the time. its almost not worth it to buy an eve skin when half the game you cant even see it.

XicashinaJan 30, 20161 votes

I do feel sad when I can't see my skin but honestly half the reason I enjoy playing eve is the feeling of being an invisible menace constantly and the fading in and out of stealth really adds to that ambience.

On a similar note maybe if you made certain parts of her fade in or out like maybe keep her dress in tango or her mask in masquerade. Because f logic it would look cool.

OleandervineJan 30, 20161 votes

I view versatility as detrimental in this game as there is relatively very little support for it in itemization. Eve builds all over the place and her kit needs streamlining to make her less of a mess to build items for. Like they did with Miss Fortune, they need to desperately tinker with the types of ratios her kit uses. Alternatively, Eve needs a full blown rework. Her rigging is a mess and they don't want to just update her textures (Riot has stated such when I suggested they give her the Singed/Maokai/Allistar treatment), and reworking her kit would just be beneficial and make her infinitely more fun to play. She's awkward right now because she can't assassinate very well and she's too squishy to stay in fights long enough to reliably land kills.

BârdJan 30, 20161 votes

Ok, that is irrelivant.

I just want there to be a reason to buy Eve skins, because a transparent ass is not enough reason for me to buy Safecracker Eve.

RavenhaleJan 31, 20161 votes

She can't get in and out as reliably as other Assassins. It's not in her kit for some reason. Zed always has a shadow to jump back to. LeBlanc can blink in and out. Katarina gets a reset on her Shunpo if she gets a kill. Nidalee gets a reset on her Pounce if she hits her target.

Evelynn... she gets stealth which drops before she can get in range of her target. I end up using her "escape" to get to them, which unfortunately does not reset with a kill. It's kind of like Yi using his Ult to chase you down, only he gets to blink to you when you get in range of his skills. The problem with this comparison is that Life Steal seems to be so much better than Spell Vamp, so Evelynn can't do what Yi does.

Eveylnn doesn't seem to have a kit geared to making picks. I'm not convinced she was ever meant to, so I can't justify a rework.

OleandervineJan 31, 20161 votes

{quoted}

She can't get in and out as reliably as other Assassins. It's not in her kit for some reason. Zed always has a shadow to jump back to. LeBlanc can blink in and out. Katarina gets a reset on her Shunpo if she gets a kill. Nidalee gets a reset on her Pounce if she hits her target.

Evelynn... she gets stealth which drops before she can get in range of her target. I end up using her "escape" to get to them, which unfortunately does not reset with a kill. It's kind of like Yi using his Ult to chase you down, only he gets to blink to you when you get in range of his skills. The problem with this comparison is that Life Steal seems to be so much better than Spell Vamp, so Evelynn can't do what Yi does.

Eveylnn doesn't seem to have a kit geared to making picks. I'm not convinced she was ever meant to, so I can't justify a rework.

It sounds like everything you just mentioned was detrimental to her health as a character and thus clear justification that her current kit is dated and in dire need of an ovexhaustive to bring her into the modern era.

RavenhaleJan 31, 20161 votes

Apparently I was wrong. Dark Frenzy does reset with a kill or assist. I've just never noticed because surviving the "pick" is seldom unless you've built somewhat tank.

I certainly wouldn't mind having her E a ranged blink. I'm sure counterplay will always be a concern. Since her Shadow Walk has 700, her blink E should hover around the 500 range. That's not a huge overhaul and would at least help put her on par with other assassins when it comes to getting to her target.

If we want to make her even more like Yi, adding some inherent boost to spell vamp within her kit would be ideal. Like make it a passive in her kit that levels up with her rank of Q. Riot has always had an issue with Spell Vamp because it would get abused by mages. But if you put it directly in Evelynn's kit, it would only be an issue within Evelynn and you could tinker with the numbers till people are happy with it.