PSA:Kill stealing(it doesn't exist and if you think it does and happened to you, you shouldn't care)

HappyHazard07·May 25, 2015·78 votes·7,043 views

Ok, so you got a great 2 for zero trade bot and are about to take out the low jungler, then out of nowhere your friendly throws her e-q combo , taking him out. While many might say, "thanks for the ks ahri," there are multiple issues with that choice of action, A, it's better for everyone to get some gold, especially someone who is sacrificing their farm just to help you out, B, better safe than sorry(kill secure guys, kill secure) , C, you sound like a self-entitled schmuck, D, your setting the grounds for a flame war.

Like seriously ya'll. This isn't COD, If your sense of achievement comes the amount of kills you have then this isn't really the game for you.

P.S. this applies especially to adcs, if your support says sorry(reminds me of a battered girlfriend for pete's sake) for accidentally taking the kill than your morally obligated to say the mandatory ,"no prob" and whatnot because A: they probably were 83% of the reason that kill went through B: at least you got a kill.

94 Comments

Loken StoneheartMay 25, 201522 votes

It screws Draven. He midaswell not have a passive if people are going to dive in to take kills from him.

T RexHasTinyArmsMay 25, 20155 votes

In this case maybe, but then it's a sliding scale. If his passive is stacked high and it's a huge bonus to draven who is doing well, I'm trying as hard as possible to give him the kill. If he gets a kill it resets entirely right? So if he just got one, the next one doesn't matter. Also he loses half stacks on death, so after a death when he hasn't got passive stacked back up, it matters less for him to get kills.

Sozan5May 25, 20158 votes

Actually, he always gets 50 gold more for kills, no matter how stacked his passive is.

IcyPepperMay 25, 201520 votes

If that's enough for a Draven to be entitled to a kill, I have a simple solution for Draven players to make up that 50 gold from their passive!

Last-hit two minions.

Singing LarkMay 25, 20152 votes

Minions OP.

Rinky DinkyMay 25, 20157 votes

That gave me a chuckle

But what if he gets the kill, and two minions

IcyPepperMay 25, 20155 votes

Then he's a very good Draven who can last-hit champions in the fray of a teamfight.

And then decides to press his advantage by taking some minions instead of immediately recalling.

Rinky DinkyMay 25, 20157 votes

There was once an adc main named Peemo

Peemo loved his cs.

After winning an all in and getting some kills, he loved to stay in lane for dem cs's, even if he had 50 hp.

Some say he never learned the error of his ways, and to this day, the mystical teemo jungle continues to visit the botlane, hoping that peemo will contribute to his charity.

rampaging poetMay 26, 20152 votes

The bigger problem for Draven is that he loses half his stacks on death. KSing Draven might mean 50 lost gold from the minimum passive amount. It could also be 200 gold if he's shut down after stacking for ages because people took his kills. Then again, that's the risk of playing Draven: you don't have a passive unless you're already winning.

IcyPepperMay 26, 20153 votes

Draven, in the right hands, doesn't need to worry about KSing (unless people go out of their way to do it, in which case they're assholes).

Draven doesn't farm minions.

Draven farms champions.

LeeDarkMay 26, 20152 votes

Or, you know, if you are the Draven's support, and you can clearly see that, having already used flash and heal, the enemy has no chance whatsoever of escaping before Draven throws another axe, you could NOT TAKE THE KILL.

If he was clearly going to die anyway, it isn't "kill secured." It was already secured.

IcyPepperMay 26, 20153 votes

What's with the all caps there?

Yes, it's always best for the adc to get the kill. Yeah, we get that. We're talking about the cases where accidents happen, or someone other than the carry takes the kill to secure it. There's no point in getting angry over that.

If a support takes a kill in that situation, yeah it's dumb. We know that. But don't let kill entitlement cloud your judgement too much, especially in teamfights.

LeeDarkMay 26, 20153 votes

Accidents are one thing, but when your support does it repeatedly, even going so far as to use their FLASH to get in range to take a kill, it's more than just dumb. When the ADC is someone who actually depends on kills because their passive is balanced around them being able to get them, it's even worse.

It's like taking the big monster when your jungler would get MORE gold from it. It's not just "entitlement." It's you being a moron in regards to overall strategy.

IcyPepperMay 26, 20153 votes

Obviously that isn't the case here. That's just being dumb, that isn't kill securing. I'm talking about actual kill securing if a champion escapes the Draven, or accidents in the chaos of teamfights.

It's you being a moron in regards to overall strategy.

That insult is completely unnecessary. If you can't hold a civil discussion, don't bother responding to me because this discussion is over.

MaratsuneMay 25, 201515 votes

Sona "Oh god, sorry!" "Oh, I didn't mean to steal that!" "I'm sorry ;-;" "Sorry I got the kill..." At this point, I don't even know if I'm being sincere anymore.

YOLO420SWAGSCOPEMay 25, 20153 votes

I just gave up at a certain point I only apologize if my adc is a nice dude (warding etc.) although admittedly I haven't played a lot of support recently

FastAsHeckMay 26, 20153 votes

i'm always building item 3100 ... i feel your pain bro item 3070

PL55May 25, 201512 votes

It isn't even your kill until you get it, so kill stealing would be you getting a kill then someone transferring your kill and gold to themselves.

5000000000000000May 25, 201511 votes

Remember the last time the fed guy on your team gave up kills to help other people on your team? Me neither.

DeynaTaggerungMay 26, 20153 votes

I do that as often as I can. The proper progression is Get fed in the early game --> Start to snowball everyone else on your team through ganking, objectives, teamfights Being the only fed person on your team means every time you die or aren't around, your team gets screwed. So unless you're playing perfectly it's a disadvantage.

Truly PridefulMay 25, 201510 votes

I wish this is how everyone would think about it. Whenever I play AD and my support grabs a kill or double in lane they start saying sorry over and over. I'm just like "Dude, I don't care. Their AD isn't farming, I got two assists, and now we're up in levels." As long as the other team dies, it really doesn't matter who got the kill.

DUDE BROMay 25, 20159 votes

Malzahar W,E,R,Ignite on my enemy, about to kill him in 1.5 seconds with all these DoTs.

Warwick walks up, waits until the last second, then gives him 1 auto attack (getting the kill) and leaves.

If that's not KS I don't know what is.

BlackSunNocturneMay 26, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=DUDE BRO,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=jWyZr0Jw,comment-id=0014,timestamp=2015-05-25T23:50:59.799+0000)

W,E,R,Ignite on my enemy, about to kill him in 1.5 seconds with all these DoTs.

walks up, waits until the last second, then gives him 1 auto attack (getting the kill) and leaves.

If that's not KS I don't know what is.

I can one-up that: Talon : Blows entire combo plus ignite

Blitzcrank : waits until combo is finished, fires grab. Then says "I need a positive K/D as a support"

WAT

LeeDarkMay 26, 20154 votes

Twitch Blows up the enemy with the stealth attack bork ult combo, stacking up to expunge, and AS THE CAST ANIMATION FOR THE EXPUNGE THAT WOULD FINISH THE KILL IS PLAYING...

Taric Flashes in from behind, having walked up to the fight as it was happening and healed me (so he would have gotten the assist anyway) and lands a passive-enhanced autoattack for the kill. Says, "I helped, so I deserved it."

Yes, that's right. I said he wasted FLASH for it. You did not misread.

LordForrestMay 26, 20153 votes

I got the opposite here, granted it was ARAM and we were winning anyway. Well enemy Shaco got caught by me and an ally, he ulted to try and get away/possibly get kills, but he died to my ally with his clone still alive. I then proceed to kill his clone that was right next to my almost dead ally.

chat log was like this: Ally: .... Me: Sorry couldn't resist Ally: LOL

DeynaTaggerungMay 26, 20152 votes

k, that's a pity, but so what? Look at reasons A C and D

T RexHasTinyArmsMay 25, 20155 votes

Also important thing to note since you mentioned COD, not everyone has Draven passive. In COD you have kill streaks and lose the count on death so someone grabbing a kill you would have had may be the difference between a helicopter or not, but in League the only champ with this issue is Draven. If he loses a kill to someone grabbing it, it may mean he is short for the gold needed for IE when he would have had it if he got the kill instead of assist. Also then if he gets killed he loses a bunch of passive stacks, so he risks losing gold (by losing the passive stacks before he can cash them in later) if he doesn't get kills when he can.

IcyPepperMay 25, 20152 votes

True. But here's the thing.

Sometimes Draven can't get the kill (especially pre-6). Better to get an assist than nothing at all. Besides, it's Draven. He has enough damage to last-hit champions on his own mid/late-game anyway.

rebound2May 25, 20155 votes

KS = Kill Secured. Therefore, kill stealing doesn't exist.

DrathTurtle314May 25, 20154 votes

It exists IF you are playing a champ with a mechanic that triggers when getting a kill. Draven passive, viegar's stacking mechanic etc. (no Kat's resets don't count, you can get those on an assist and if you manage to KS katarina you deserve a cookie anyway)

But yeah, in the majority of situations, there is no KS in League of Legends, only in League of Draaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaven.

SteelflameMay 25, 20154 votes

Wrong. Kill stealing is where you blow massive important CDs (Flashes, high CD ults, ect) to steal a kill from an ally (Especially if you had already been set up for an assist) who had a 100% chance that the kill was secured with no escape or counterkill.

Kill securing is where the kill just happened to land on you and not another ally who might have been better able to use it, or you get a kill with a moderately important ability that was contested between them escaping or not. Big difference between a "spiteful" steal and an intentional secure, and furthermore between those and an accidental secure.

BLU MedicMay 26, 20153 votes

I once caught myself apologizing after taking a kill, before realizing I was the ADC. But seriously though, the enemy team has been forced out of the lane and you can get a nice easy free farm, so why complain?

HexaDecimelMay 26, 20153 votes

Playing as Nami I got flamed by an Akali in midlane for saving her life. They were both very low and the enemy Zed had just thrown his shuriken, my heal landed a split second before he hit her and I ended up getting the kill. Later on in a big team fight I noticed an ally was extremely low and healed him only to get another kill. Finally, close to the end of a game we were chasing the enemy through the jungle, one flashed over a wall and I blindly sent a bubble over and ended up with another kill. Throughout the entire game I only got 3 kills, but the jungler and midlaner flamed me for half the game for KSing. At no point throughout the game did I ever try to get a kill, I simply tried to help my team stay alive and win.

SoMNiaMay 26, 20152 votes

I feel this so much. But Nami is one of those supports that adds a lot of damage to her team, and she can't always completely control where it goes. Besides, it's GOOD for the team if Nami can pick up a little extra AP after her main support items are done. Her W can turn teamfights so well, and her E helps carries clean up, with even the slow scaling from AP. As long as you're not TRYING to starve your carries (because that's just bad teamwork), I don't think you should feel guilty as a support when you pick up a kill or 3. Even a first blood double kill going to the support means an early item 2049 , so really... (And yes, that can happen if Nami W's a fleeing enemy that's out of the carry's range, as I'm sure you know.) I think carries need to chill and think about the team. :P Including the Vayne s that arbitrarily take blue buff from a mana-hungry jungler so they can Q-spam in-lane...cough but that's another story.

I HAMPSTERMay 26, 20152 votes

from my experience the players who talk about ks are always bad.

Only Play DariusMay 26, 20152 votes

Once got a Quadra with MasterYi in ARAM. Jumped to Anivia for the penta and got her into egg form. Then while i'm chopping away at her egg, ally Corki slays her for the ace. I tell enemy team in /all "i'm done with my team, please come collect your free win". And sat in the back the rest of the game and let my team lose.

There are certain situations where KS is inexcusable. There was absolutely no reason for corki to do what he did. She was in egg form so there was zero chance of her escaping or killing me.

Jekk ToranakaMay 26, 20156 votes

What's even more inexcusable is the fact that you admittedly sat in base and let your team lose.

Far worse than blatant steal, even if it is the penta.

Only Play DariusMay 26, 20151 votes

I needed to show corki that toxic behavior does not go rewarded. I'm not going to continue carrying after someone intentionally ruins my penta without reason.

I felt bad too because Azir bought us a skin boost that game, but he had to pay for corki's toxicity.

Black Star 1299May 26, 20154 votes

Pentas are earned, not given.

In addition, take a look at this: Nick, Ellen, and Bob are in an elevator. Nick starts screaming loudly in the elevator. Since Nick won't shut up, Bob starts screaming loudly in the elevator too. Now poor Ellen has to hear both people screaming in an elevator.

Sure, toxic behavior does not go rewarded, but that does not mean that YOU can also be toxic too. You were no more different than that corki who stole the kill, and probably deserved it anyways.

Jekk ToranakaMay 26, 20155 votes

LOL

Taking the last kill out of a penta is a far cry from toxic behaviour. It may be dick move, but it's not toxic in anyway.

You going afk and helping the enemy team win the game? That's another story...

BlancmarkMay 26, 20155 votes

It sucks to have your penta ruined, but it is no valid reason or excuse to basically AFK/rage quit. You were ahead. Say whatever, win the match, try again later.

Your behaviour there is toxic, far worse than a penta deny. Your team didn't lose because of Corki ksing. Your team lost because you tilted and gave up entirely. You can't choose what another person does. You can choose how you react to it. You chose to react badly and your team paid the price. Always easier to blame someone else for triggering your bad behaviour, instead of handling things better yourself. Sorry, but this is at least 80% your responsibility, if not more.

Also, do you really think Corki learned anything from that? Do you seriously think that acting this way will make someone realize "Omg he quit cuz of me. I'll never do that again T.T"? Far bigger chance that he will blame you, as you blame him, and all he learned is that you tilt easily. Just as you refuse to own your part in this, he will likely refuse to own his. Especially since you were toxic. In the end, you helped nobody. You only made the community a little bit worse.

AbiwonKenabiMay 26, 20153 votes

http://media.giphy.com/media/SqTB3NuVy0hEc/giphy.gif

KaeendeathwalkerMay 26, 20152 votes

great post. I get this all the time playing Supp.. Its really easy to loose hp bars in team fights, if I do get a kill I will say Im sorry, but at the same time, Im really not, due tot he fact, they are dead, we got the gold, level, and ground. It happens, most of the time it can not be helped. Kills are only part of the match anyways, if I can get the kill in the middle of a fight and we take a turret or drag, whats the problem? My main complaint about league is the "I have to have the top score every game" Ego. Its a team game not "make me look good so I can say you suck all match" type of game.

DivineRageMay 26, 20152 votes

I agree fully, though I as someone who plays mostly support roles, have become rather adept at telling when I should hold off so I don't get the kill.

Kill stealing in a game such as League is something I've never really understood, sure it is applicable at times if the kill was secured and someone dives in to get it but it's a team game and the goal is to kill your enemies and reach their nexus. If something furthers your path to victory then isn't that a good thing?

In an MMO where getting the kill is usually -only- beneficial to the one who gets the last hit on the enemy kill stealing is relevant. In a team game where you are trying to make sure you succeed as a whole, not as much.

BlancmarkMay 26, 20152 votes

Ksing... I don't care about it. I admit it feels better to get a few kills, rather than have a 0/2/8 score (except as a support or other non - damage focused build). But ultimately, I don't give a Twitch 's ass who gets what kill. Doesn't mean I go out of my way to get kills. If it happens in the heat of a team fight, it happens. If someone else gets it, no problem. If the ADC has low health and mana, and can't reach the low enemy, but I can kill them with a flash combo, I will probably try if it's safe enough to do so. Should I just let them recall because my ADC is busy farming behind me, showing no desire to jump into the fight and likely die? No. I'll take that kill.

I'm pretty good at setting up for kills anyway, having played support and cc heavy champs so much. The example of a Taric flashing to auto the enemy to death... Most I'd do is stun them, aside from healing the ADC. Easiest kill setup ever.

As far as intentional kill steals go, I don't do that. I don't care enough about it to go out of my way to kill a champ that clearly has no chance of survival anyway, being mauled by Udyr or something.

NinjaToad99May 26, 20152 votes

Even that one time a Taric flash + ulted to kill the last person on the team as the fetal basic attack was two inches away, thus preventing the penta? I laughed, but I don't think the Cait thought it was too funny. But in those kind of situations I'd say kill steal is an ok term.

air tigerMay 26, 20151 votes

TBH I think kill securing and kill stealing are two different things.

Kill stealing in the real sense is annoying AF. Happens mostly in bot lane.
Imagine for a sec that you are jinx with a blitz support. You guys win a fight in bot lane, getting 2 kills. Both go to blitz. He decides to go AP, takes more kills but does a terrible job of supporting/peeling. So he ends up 7/1/6 while poor supportless jinx is 1/6/8. I know this is a specific and hypothetical example, but I've witnessed plenty of matches in which blitz/sona go AP and take every kill they can get - effectively starving the carry.

Clown ApocalypseMay 26, 20152 votes

I think a lot of people underestimate the value of a fed support. It could be that jinx was doing a horrible job of positioning and kept getting dove, It could be she missed all her abilities. If I'm playing sona I'm pretty much gonna faceroll my keyboard till everyones dead. Also if theres any chance in my mind they might flash away or possibly kill you ....sorry not sorry. A fed annie, Leona, sona,zyra and my favorite lately maokai are pretty scary when the person using then knows wtf they are doing. Never think that gold is a waste in the hands of a skilled support. Someone forced to fill....probably, but people who main support have been known to carry....often. My kda with morg is 5:1.

ReinouMay 26, 20151 votes

Explain to me how someone taking a kill that was already secured from me is "helping" when I REALLY needed the 300 gold to come back into the game, but instead got 150 because of some baddie.

Yes, securing kills is great.

Kill stealing is not.

I've literally lost games were supports would get most of the kills, just because I wouldn't get enough gold out of it, and since they're supports they don't really do too well with many items compared to me.

I'm not saying I rage when someone takes my kill a few times, but when I'm 1/3/20 as an ADC then there's a fucking problem, and it's NOT me.

If I get a kill or two in-between KSes I won't care much, unless they're doing it on purpose.

Clown ApocalypseMay 26, 20153 votes

I've stolen so many kills as support I ended up carrying. lol. Honestly I have games where I end up getting kills as support, which I play a lot...but to be honest I play supports that do damage and have cc....and half the time I did 75% of the damage while still shielding and peeling for the adc anyways. Worst case scenario I get you fed off assists and farm. I think people need to forget the term ADC and use marksman instead. ADC invokes an overwhelming sense of importance and entitlement. The win is all that matters, not who carried.

When my adcs are bad to mediocre...I tend to outperform them. When my adcs are good they usually end up getting all of the kills they should. Just remember your support isn't farming. That gold item.....isn't making us rich. You miss kills, let people escape as adc....I don't get no money. Its in my best interest they never escape. If you have given me reason to believe you might not secure the kill I might take it. I've had games where I was 1/3/20 as adc. I was ashe and pretty much just sat back and blasted people with arrows. When you got a yi or kat or somebody like that on your team you can almost count on that. but honestly I'd rather win than carry. Id rather win than be fed. Someone steals my kill now I just be like "intercepted" lol.