Turret siedges are the worst part of the game and they are enforced by lack of proper itemization

Sunfield·Jul 20, 2014·2 votes·791 views

Right now, LCS is plagued with 50 minutes long games and countless 5v5 siedges... Its both boring and painful to watch. If teams go even, 90% of the action is Aoe mages cleaning up the minions in seconds and then wait for a new wave, and again, and again until one of the teams makes a mistake.

The problem is, if your team doesnt have a fed duelist that can split push, there is no other way of putting pressure on the lanes. As long as there are no viable tools for pushing, Aoe mages will remain a compulsory pick for majority of the team comps.

Buff the Banner of Command so it becomes useful. Give us a way to reduce aoe damage dealt to minions. Buff tier 3 upgrade Capitain for boots, so you can manipulate the speed of waves more effectively.

LoL has a potential as an esport, but siedges are incredibly boring to watch

15 Comments

Hyrum GraffJul 20, 20142 votes

And boring to play! When ziggs (and others, ziggs is just the worst offender) can just instaclear the wave, it's rather annoying to sit around being bored, waiting for another wave.

12talesJul 21, 20141 votes

Thank god Ziggs is getting nerfed.

SunfieldJul 21, 20141 votes

You are getting Xerath instead. Of Lux.

Problem not solved.

Besides, as long as he has Aoe damage, he's fine

12talesJul 21, 20141 votes

Yeah, or Anivia.

Man, Ziggs is pretty two of those guys at once right now. He's by far the worse offender- you can maybe catch Xerath backing or out of position and take a turret while he can't clear the wave. Not so with Ziggs.

PushoverJul 20, 20142 votes

There are solutions to this, just none that are easy in solo play. It's why you will see some teams in the LCS switch lanes very often, it keeps the other team moving, and may allow a quick pick under the tower. However, with solo queue and the like, it's very hard to get your team to be coordinated enough to switch lanes every other wave and not get picked off themselves. That said, it can still be a little tough to break into the 3rd tower when Baron is down and you end up wasting a few minutes waiting for Baron to respawn.

Buffing Captain would be a good way to allow faster rotations, as long as Captain were out of combat only movespeed. Which now that I think about, makes it kind of awesome and useful compared to how it is now.

Part of the problem also lies with Athene's, since most midlaners lategame can spam their waveclear without blue buff and not run out of mana to actually fight.

SunfieldJul 20, 20142 votes

Teams in LCS switching lanes do nothing good for the sake of an interesting game, as long as its the same worn out scenario - who can clear the wave better. There are not enough tools to play the pushing game in order to allow multiple approaches and tactics to getting inside enemy base. There are no ways of influencing minion waves other than killing opposing creeps.

Little tools, little diversity.

And the problem doesnt lie with Athene's, as long as the game doesnt reward you for trying other tactics than to instaclear the wave and wait patiently for the next one, the gameplay will be the same.

PushoverJul 21, 20143 votes

Switching lanes is a team trying to avoid the waveclear situation, by appearing in a lane that the other team didn't expect, hitting the tower before the other team can move, and then switching again. Captain boots would mean that the team could move into a new lane even faster, although it would also mean the defending team could respond faster too. It's a little like a surprise split push from the entire team.

Generating larger minion waves is another way to influence the wave, although it takes planning, and doesn't appear to the spectators clearly (it's rare to notice someone only killing the ranged creeps, walking away, and that is the reason there's a huge wave toplane when the team switches into top lane).

Without Athenes, the game wouldn't have the infinite waveclear courtesy of the midlaners that leads to half of these situations. Or the midlaner would need to build suboptimally to have enough mana to keep spamming spells.

SunfieldJul 21, 20141 votes

Even if you nerf the entire class with Athene and Tear nerf, you wont enforce diversity, you will just make aoe mages less dominant and mages like Cassio completely unviable, plus you will be replacing Aoe mage meta with assasin meta. It would end painfully long siedges, but it has some issues on its own.

An item that could reduce Aoe damage dealt to minions would be nice. And Capitan, Banner of Command buffs are overdue.

Angry MonsterJul 20, 20141 votes

I think you are mistaken on what the problem is. When you take hyper carries your goal is to take it to the late game. Now every one is taking hyper carries. Also LCS players get more careful as death timers get higher.

This is how season 2 was. These games are all about proper positioning and target focus. In a couple patch the non hyper caries will get a buff to make mid game closing possible again.

BolraguardJul 21, 20141 votes

So, why dont you just request minion buffing as a feature in the game?

Instead of spending gold to buy equipment yourself, spend gold to buff the creeps!

Have like 5 levels of Damage bonus, Armor bonus, Magic Resist, Etc... I think that would be a very interesting addition, and a Gold sink for champs.

Hyrum GraffJul 21, 20141 votes

I like this idea. You could also buy minion buffs for specific lanes, to add another level of strategy - buff botlane, then go baron.

PushoverJul 21, 20141 votes

Battle Tanks in Warcraft 3 was a moba where creep upgrades were actually a thing. In some ways it worked to end the game (sieges in the game could take well over 40 minutes sometimes...), in other ways it was a little lame that you could convert a gold lead into straight pushing without any gameplay, no outplay moments. In League, it would be very difficult to balance it in a way such that having a gold lead didn't just convert into a victory.

Remember when a destroyed inhibitor meant that all minions in all lanes got buffed? Remember how hard it was to come back from losing an inhibitor? That's why I would be against damage or armor buffs to minions. Magic Resist buffs are an interesting idea, but it's better to just put in on an item. Like Banner of Command.

MrSc0ttyJul 21, 20141 votes

Buff BoC to give the wumbocreep a defensive aura vs AOE.

Buff Ohmwrecker to 90AP.

SunfieldJul 22, 20141 votes

Ah yes Ohmwrecker, I forgot about it

Pretty sure everyone did

StaconaJul 22, 20141 votes

This will be fixed if teams actually run engage comps and be able to execute tower dives (there are champions that hard counter this like Zyra, but anyways) when people run Elise and Lee Sin constantly you will see the same results over and over again with non-decisive wins that drag on forever because these kinds of champions may be great early but they suck at making engages and plays, where as you can do things like Galio ult, amumu ult, malph ult, (somewhat) j4 ult, alistar combo (expect to see him in the upcoming LCS with his recent buffs), leona can stat fights with her basically global stun ult, Ashe arrow (ult), zac jumps in and ults, etc etc etc these kinds of champions will make games a lot more exciting and impactful and see more action- unless the other team runs something like Fiddle or Zyra who will turn a tower dive around in their favour