Support items

CaptinKeen·Sep 26, 2015·1 votes·1,807 views

Frankly, I find it insulting that - with the complexity of jungle items, and the plethora of items for everyone else, as a support, I get to chose:

An item that gives me gold passivly An item that gives me gold for poke Or An item that gives me gold when I last-hits minions - for someone else! Provided they even let me. Which, by the time the item is completed, they never do!

And these wonderful items then build into: A shield for someone else A speed-boost for everyone else Or a slow

I mean ... is that all they have the imagination for? In which way would the game be broken, if supports were allowed to have fun?

(And it's not that I don't have fun - it's just that I have fun despite itemization, not as a result of it)

28 Comments

EnvironmentalistSep 26, 20151 votes

As a support main, I really don't mind. I don't even usually complete the support items, unless it's talisman on blitz or thresh. item 3222 item 3023 item 3504 item 3050 item 3060 are all wonderful support items!

CaptinKeenSep 26, 20151 votes

Yes - all wonderful for someone else. You forgot Sightstone - another item that benefits everyone but you. And Locket, yet another. Hooray.

TheLittlestLuluSep 26, 20154 votes

{quoted}

Yes - all wonderful for someone else. You forgot Sightstone - another item that benefits everyone but you. And Locket, yet another. Hooray.

What do you want? If Riot made an non-trash tier item that the support themselves primarily benefited from it would be abused by other roles.

EnvironmentalistSep 26, 20152 votes

Wait what? Aha. First of all Locket is a good item for a couple of roles... and the point of support to help your teammates. Hence why all the items benefit others. Though, in turn, they benefit you, because if you're a good support, your team will be victorious. If you want to be a selfish carry support go Annie and build pure AP. Sheesh

EnvironmentalistSep 26, 20153 votes

and sorry, but "Sightstone - another item that benefits everyone but you." How the hell does warding not benefit the support? O.o

MarthianSep 26, 20151 votes

THAT'S THE POINT OF PLAYING SUPPORT. Sacrificing damage (most of the time) to help your team mates get kills, so they can get more kills (and you more assists), so they can carry/snowball to victory.

Go play another role if you want more damage for yourself.

Guyy FieriSep 27, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Yes - all wonderful for someone else. You forgot Sightstone - another item that benefits everyone but you. And Locket, yet another. Hooray.

Isn't that the idea of support? To find ways to enable your teammates to succeed?

LadyRenlyOct 2, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Yes - all wonderful for someone else. You forgot Sightstone - another item that benefits everyone but you. And Locket, yet another. Hooray.

Twin Shadows, Banner, Mikaels and Sightstone all can save your life too, man.

Mia HanokaOct 4, 20151 votes

Laughs

no comment to the OP in the post before this cause yeah I know what your going to say.

"Its not about damage I just want to be 'proactive'"

will still ask by what you mean by that cause your definition of proactive is clearly in question.

{quoted}

Twin Shadows, Banner, Mikaels and Sightstone all can save your life too, man.

To Lady Renly,

Dont even start with this guy he does not acknowledge ANYTHING that has to deal with his twisted concept of items. in other words if its not an item that gives a full stat bonus like Dorans ring, Dorans sword, or Dorans shield with a method of gathering gold he will not read your post.

He says he does not want damage, but despite his posts going on about how he wants stats passives and so that give him more means to be "proactive" he wont accept that supports are not just defined by starting items. he thinks the current starting items force you to be passive. he cant see that he is likely the only one being passive in this case as when I was a main support player I would sit between the minion wave and the enemy ADC/support combo with just item 3303 item 2044 and 2 item 2003 .

I mean look at his post before this one and you can see whats up with his method of thinking. Not saying what he wants, but being VERY clear about what he is implying there.

CaptinKeenSep 27, 20151 votes

I want Riot to make my role fun.

I want the ability to make (support) plays. I want items that enable me, as support. I don't want damage, as such - tho for the life of me I cannot see how it would be a bad thing. If I can have an item that lets me share the gold for minion kills .... then why the screaming **** can I not have an item that lets me share kills for champion kills - giving me the assist gold and a team mate the kill gold?

Instead I get a choice of items that are highly dubious - items that, frankly, have a very high chance of NOT DOING ANYTHING AT ALL. Talisman of Ascension - in a solo queue game - very often achives absolutely nothing, because no one agrees what way to run. So in essence, rather than engage or run away - everyone just runs around like headless chickens slightly faster.

And again: With the amount of effort invested in making interesting jungle items, it is incomprehensible to me while support needs to make to with a selection of three utter junk items. There are more than three, but the three designed specifically for support are pretty much the worst items the game has to offer.

Targons Brace is, hands down, the least well designed item of anything in the game.

KrashinoSep 27, 20151 votes

Pssh, I enjoy my Support games. Its a different experience, sometimes it a bit more relaxing. Sometimes its almost as hectic as another lane. SOMETIMES you take a Troll Support and just crush. SOMETIMES you end up being a Support that ends up dealing even more damage than your entire team. SOMETIMES you go Malzahar Support and slaughter your opponents...

Mia HanokaSep 27, 20151 votes

When I was maining supports I made support plays all the time. if your not making plays as a support its cause you dont have the no guts no glory type of attitude. As a support I think hard fast an on my feet cause any thing I see that the team misses can be the chance for me to set up the game changing plays no matter the type of support I play. healer, sona, or tank you can make them sexy plays.

seems you lost your way my child let me guide you on the path to support god plays.

you dont need to have items like rab cap and echo's all you need is the items that you can use an abuse to break the will of your foes.

the gold gathering item pend the one you pick determines the types of plays you will be making for now we will use talisman cause it in my book is the most powerful support item I have ever seen. this Item as you know gives your team MASSIVE boost in speed it can be used before a fight to close the gap and take your enemies by surprise cause they did not expect the speed boost you have made 1 massive play by shocking your enemy with your teams amazing speed increase suddenly YAYA SUPPORT!

another way it can be used your team is caught off guard but the initial contact was softer then it could have been use the speed buff to save your friends and make another type of golden play! Every one in your team has can rearrange them selves allowing the tank to get in the middle of the enemy team while your carries change round to the back and your fighter take up the middle stance. YAYA SUPPORT FOR GOLDEN SAVES WE LIVED IN A SITUATION OF HOLY FRELL AND WON THE TEAM FIGHT!

Finally the last way it can be used and this one is only in the case of a sudden burst out of a team mate. activate the time and run from the hard engage that is impending do to the sudden loss of one of your forces! YAYA WE HAVE A SUPPORT THINKING ON THE FEET AND SAVING TOWERS BY GETTING US TO THEM!

Wow one item three uses this is shocking I wonder what the other 4 can do for you.

Well lets talk about those useless ward stones OR ARE THEY? Hey did you know that wards save lives? warding bushes and commonly used camp spots can save your allies from a sudden burst attack while walking the jungle to stopping ganking in their tracks since you can back off to a safe area. also it allows you to set up on those camping re re's cause you can see them sitting in those bushes while your team tightens the noose on them. OMG THAT PLAY IS AMAZING THE SUPPORT ONLY HAD TO WARD THERE AND WE COULD GET A PICK ON A DANGEROUS CHAMPION! WAY TO GO SUPPORT YOUR WINNING THIS MATCH FOR US WITH OUT EVEN TRYING! "aw shucks guys it was only a ward"
Twin shadows this Item I love cause it hunts down the nearest enemy champions. this is great for mid-late game when your teams inventories fill up and they cant help as much with warding aside from yellow blue and red trinkets. plus its amazing in a fight if used correctly but that is later on. for now you and your ADC are roaming the map and you have a feeling enemies might be near by SUDDENLY YOU UNLEASH YOUR GHOSTS! they split off in two direction one behind you and one ahead of you and both hit champions with in the range 1 is the enemy tank waiting in your path to hold you down to its anvil with CC and the other is the enemy burst champ or ADC to act as the hammer that will shape you death! good thing you had twin shadows and used it it saved you from getting blown up by allowing you to turn on the softer enemy and kill it then either turn on the tank or get the hell out. YAYA THE SUPPORT PLAYS ARE REAL MAN LOOK AT THAT ADC GET FED LIKE A BOSS!

BUT WAIT THERE IS MORE THIS ITEM CAN DO! "GASP!" a team fight has just broke out and you team is winning HOWEVER those sneaky bad guys still had flash and had been hovering near a wall just in case they needed to beat feet and run. OH WAIT YOU HAVE THE GHOSTS! FLY MY PRETTIES FLY! they hunt down the sneaky goons preventing those super fly jukes! EVEN BETTER if they make contact those sneaky fools cant possibly escape as they are revealed and slowed to your team allowing your team to pick up them missed kills then push the base! OMG NO WAY THE SUPPORT MAKES THE PLAYS AGAIN I CANT BELIEVE MY EYES! "guys your embarrassing me!"

Banner of command I love this item for when I need to either boost the push power of a lane or help set it to an auto push lane. now aside from the Meh passive aura that helps your team withstand magic combat yeah rather blah I say. HOWEVER THAT ACTIVE! ok we cant win these straight up fights what do we have on hand that can make it so the enemy had to break off a member so we can do a 5v4? "Um I have Banner of command?" O.O REALLY GO POWER UP A CANNON MINNION IN ANOTHER LANE! you go do that putting it on a fresh cannon wave and clear some of the minion ahead in the lane while your at it you place a few wards from your trusty sight stone in the path that would be used to set up either a free kill or let you know that the enemy that left is coming back. By the by did you know that the banner of command active is permanent now? OH and that the boosted minion can not be hurt by spells or abilities even on hit one! yeah you can have up to 4 cannon minions blasting the enemy tower if they pushed the lane far enough up and your team does not hard push that lane and that buff makes them cannons HURT! DID THE SUPPORT JUST MAKE ANOTHER PLAY? NO WAY LOOK AT THAT WAVE PUSH HOLY I HAD NO IDEA THAT BANNER OF COMMAND COULD DO SO MUCH DAMAGE! "I know right thats why I always get it if I am going support."
Last item cause you have to get boots and those dont really make plays happen as much. ardent censer we are assuming your a support sona for this one. now by its self it is a rather um how you say sad item as you need friends to make it work and the more friends you have the better it works! now sona has a nifty thing since her big change and the cuddle zones appeared. SONA CAN MAKE EVERYONE FEEL HER SHIELDING GOODNESS! I know right its amazing your team does not have to be all together in one big knot but she can move the green sona aura around and give every one the shielding goodness OH WAIT THIS ITEM GIVE AN ATTACK SPEED BUFF TO THOSE WHO FEEL THAT GREEN AURA OF SONA'S! OMG NO WAY HOLD THE FRELLING PHONE DUDE! now its not a rock of solid thing BUT that extra AS even on an APC can make all the difference with them auto attacks from taking towers faster to getting that one last auto attack on a champion. OMG NO WAY THAT SUPPORT IS MAKING ALL THE PLAYS WE CANT STOP THE MADNESS LOOK AT THAT PUSH SPEED AND POWER! "awe shucks"

5 items you deem as worthless I have made plays with in countless matches! you cant possibly even begin to think about how those simple "worthless" items can turn a fight around. That is just the items that I felt like explaining that I use more often then others. I bet your imagination cant even formulate what I could do with them other items if given the chance. so when you say that an item is not note worthy or cant possibly be handy or cant help in any fashion that would benefit the team as a whole. slow your brain down and think about how that item might give and edge in a fight if you time it right. if you cant do that just play sona and use the items I have listed here you will win 9 out of 10 games as long as you keep your head and use your kit and your tool to their fullest!

CaptinKeenSep 27, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mia Hanoka,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ytOav7mE,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2015-09-27T08:54:18.923+0000)

When I was maining supports I made support plays all the time. if your not making plays as a support its cause you dont have the no guts no glory type of attitude. As a support I think hard fast an on my feet cause any thing I see that the team misses can be the chance for me to set up the game changing plays no matter the type of support I play. healer, sona, or tank you can make them sexy plays.

seems you lost your way my child let me guide you on the path to support god plays.

you dont need to have items like rab cap and echo's all you need is the items that you can use an abuse to break the will of your foes.

the gold gathering item pend the one you pick determines the types of plays you will be making for now we will use talisman cause it in my book is the most powerful support item I have ever seen. this Item as you know gives your team MASSIVE boost in speed it can be used before a fight to close the gap and take your enemies by surprise cause they did not expect the speed boost you have made 1 massive play by shocking your enemy with your teams amazing speed increase suddenly YAYA SUPPORT!

another way it can be used your team is caught off guard but the initial contact was softer then it could have been use the speed buff to save your friends and make another type of golden play! Every one in your team has can rearrange them selves allowing the tank to get in the middle of the enemy team while your carries change round to the back and your fighter take up the middle stance. YAYA SUPPORT FOR GOLDEN SAVES WE LIVED IN A SITUATION OF HOLY FRELL AND WON THE TEAM FIGHT!

Finally the last way it can be used and this one is only in the case of a sudden burst out of a team mate. activate the time and run from the hard engage that is impending do to the sudden loss of one of your forces! YAYA WE HAVE A SUPPORT THINKING ON THE FEET AND SAVING TOWERS BY GETTING US TO THEM!

Wow one item three uses this is shocking I wonder what the other 4 can do for you.

Well lets talk about those useless ward stones OR ARE THEY? Hey did you know that wards save lives? warding bushes and commonly used camp spots can save your allies from a sudden burst attack while walking the jungle to stopping ganking in their tracks since you can back off to a safe area. also it allows you to set up on those camping re re's cause you can see them sitting in those bushes while your team tightens the noose on them. OMG THAT PLAY IS AMAZING THE SUPPORT ONLY HAD TO WARD THERE AND WE COULD GET A PICK ON A DANGEROUS CHAMPION! WAY TO GO SUPPORT YOUR WINNING THIS MATCH FOR US WITH OUT EVEN TRYING! "aw shucks guys it was only a ward"

Twin shadows this Item I love cause it hunts down the nearest enemy champions. this is great for mid-late game when your teams inventories fill up and they cant help as much with warding aside from yellow blue and red trinkets. plus its amazing in a fight if used correctly but that is later on. for now you and your ADC are roaming the map and you have a feeling enemies might be near by SUDDENLY YOU UNLEASH YOUR GHOSTS! they split off in two direction one behind you and one ahead of you and both hit champions with in the range 1 is the enemy tank waiting in your path to hold you down to its anvil with CC and the other is the enemy burst champ or ADC to act as the hammer that will shape you death! good thing you had twin shadows and used it it saved you from getting blown up by allowing you to turn on the softer enemy and kill it then either turn on the tank or get the hell out. YAYA THE SUPPORT PLAYS ARE REAL MAN LOOK AT THAT ADC GET FED LIKE A BOSS!

BUT WAIT THERE IS MORE THIS ITEM CAN DO! "GASP!" a team fight has just broke out and you team is winning HOWEVER those sneaky bad guys still had flash and had been hovering near a wall just in case they needed to beat feet and run. OH WAIT YOU HAVE THE GHOSTS! FLY MY PRETTIES FLY! they hunt down the sneaky goons preventing those super fly jukes! EVEN BETTER if they make contact those sneaky fools cant possibly escape as they are revealed and slowed to your team allowing your team to pick up them missed kills then push the base! OMG NO WAY THE SUPPORT MAKES THE PLAYS AGAIN I CANT BELIEVE MY EYES! "guys your embarrassing me!"

Banner of command I love this item for when I need to either boost the push power of a lane or help set it to an auto push lane. now aside from the Meh passive aura that helps your team withstand magic combat yeah rather blah I say. HOWEVER THAT ACTIVE! ok we cant win these straight up fights what do we have on hand that can make it so the enemy had to break off a member so we can do a 5v4? "Um I have Banner of command?" O.O REALLY GO POWER UP A CANNON MINNION IN ANOTHER LANE! you go do that putting it on a fresh cannon wave and clear some of the minion ahead in the lane while your at it you place a few wards from your trusty sight stone in the path that would be used to set up either a free kill or let you know that the enemy that left is coming back. By the by did you know that the banner of command active is permanent now? OH and that the boosted minion can not be hurt by spells or abilities even on hit one! yeah you can have up to 4 cannon minions blasting the enemy tower if they pushed the lane far enough up and your team does not hard push that lane and that buff makes them cannons HURT! DID THE SUPPORT JUST MAKE ANOTHER PLAY? NO WAY LOOK AT THAT WAVE PUSH HOLY I HAD NO IDEA THAT BANNER OF COMMAND COULD DO SO MUCH DAMAGE! "I know right thats why I always get it if I am going support."

Last item cause you have to get boots and those dont really make plays happen as much. ardent censer we are assuming your a support sona for this one. now by its self it is a rather um how you say sad item as you need friends to make it work and the more friends you have the better it works! now sona has a nifty thing since her big change and the cuddle zones appeared. SONA CAN MAKE EVERYONE FEEL HER SHIELDING GOODNESS! I know right its amazing your team does not have to be all together in one big knot but she can move the green sona aura around and give every one the shielding goodness OH WAIT THIS ITEM GIVE AN ATTACK SPEED BUFF TO THOSE WHO FEEL THAT GREEN AURA OF SONA'S! OMG NO WAY HOLD THE FRELLING PHONE DUDE! now its not a rock of solid thing BUT that extra AS even on an APC can make all the difference with them auto attacks from taking towers faster to getting that one last auto attack on a champion. OMG NO WAY THAT SUPPORT IS MAKING ALL THE PLAYS WE CANT STOP THE MADNESS LOOK AT THAT PUSH SPEED AND POWER! "awe shucks"

5 items you deem as worthless I have made plays with in countless matches! you cant possibly even begin to think about how those simple "worthless" items can turn a fight around. That is just the items that I felt like explaining that I use more often then others. I bet your imagination cant even formulate what I could do with them other items if given the chance. so when you say that an item is not note worthy or cant possibly be handy or cant help in any fashion that would benefit the team as a whole. slow your brain down and think about how that item might give and edge in a fight if you time it right. if you cant do that just play sona and use the items I have listed here you will win 9 out of 10 games as long as you keep your head and use your kit and your tool to their fullest!

That's such an incredibly long post, just to show you have no idea what I'm talking about.

Mia HanokaSep 27, 20151 votes

{quoted}

That's such an incredibly long post, just to show you have no idea what I'm talking about.

I know what your talking about you feel that support items should pack more punch. guess what if support items had a punch to pack mid top jungle and maybe even ADC pending on the stats it gave would use the item. the fact you made this entire thread proves you cant grasp this base concept.

reason items that supports get have little power is cause of how little gold is needed to make those items. however if you use those items well they can make the same plays of any other champion. sadly you cant think beyond the "no power no glory" mentality. I will admit sure I would like more variety to the items I COULD pick then yeah I can under stand that but you have to under stand there is only so many things they can do.

Also if this is just simply your pissed about your gold gathering items options I suggest that you you stop crying now I dont see riot coming up with anything new for that. I will continue on in a second post cause your a child that cane sit still and read. the next one covers why there is hardly a way to help the situation.

CaptinKeenSep 27, 20151 votes

That's NOT what I'm talking about. Which is why I say that you have no idea what I'm talking about. I never - not ONCE - mentioned 'more punch' or 'damage' or anything of the sort.

I have said, quite specifically, that I want Riot to make my class fun. That we should be able to make plays (plays is not the same as getting kills), and that we have hideously retarded items designed specifically for our role: Items that force passivity, rather than encourage action.

I'm sure you love that. There's always one. But I'd like to play the same game as everyone else on my team - rather than the 'wait for everyone else to win the game' game.

Mia HanokaSep 28, 20151 votes

{quoted}

That's NOT what I'm talking about. Which is why I say that you have no idea what I'm talking about. I never - not ONCE - mentioned 'more punch' or 'damage' or anything of the sort.

I have said, quite specifically, that I want Riot to make my class fun. That we should be able to make plays (plays is not the same as getting kills), and that we have hideously retarded items designed specifically for our role: Items that force passivity, rather than encourage action.

I'm sure you love that. There's always one. But I'd like to play the same game as everyone else on my team - rather than the 'wait for everyone else to win the game' game.

So that is what this is about? you want to be more proactive? more on the offence? more in the face with a mace? GUESS WHAT THAT IS NOT SUPPORTING. you want items that allow you to be on the offence while still being support items? guess what here is a list of items that you can use to be offensive!

First off any thing that builds out of this item item 1001

item 3069 item 3023 item 3504 item 3060 item 3222 item 3092 item 3401 item 3174 item 2045 item 3364 item 3363 item 3050 item 3190

Take those items if your a ranged champion or seeking to help set up or make plays.

item 3512 item 3069 item 3800 item 2045 item 3364 item 3190 item 3363 item 3401 item 3742 item 3053 item 3060 item 3102 item 3143 item 3068 item 3065 item 3110

Take those if your a tank support.

I dont see ANY of these encouraging passive play as I am a very offence oriented style player. in fact the only passiveness I see in lanes most of the time is the enemy after me and my ADC blow up both the enemies in lane a few times in 2v2 and later 2v3 and further on 2v4. at one point me and an adc that I was perfectly in sync with did a 2 v 5 and killed all five attackers due to a combination of the champions kits we had and my use of items I bought as a support. if your not making plays with the items provided or cant get out of a passive rut that is on you sooner you realize that sooner you break out of your rut. till then no amount of whining pissing and moaning in the forums is going to fix things for you.

CaptinKeenSep 28, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mia Hanoka,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ytOav7mE,comment-id=00030000000000000000,timestamp=2015-09-28T00:04:01.044+0000)

So that is what this is about? you want to be more proactive? more on the offence? more in the face with a mace? GUESS WHAT THAT IS NOT SUPPORTING. you want items that allow you to be on the offence while still being support items? guess what here is a list of items that you can use to be offensive!

First off any thing that builds out of this item

Take those items if your a ranged champion or seeking to help set up or make plays.

Take those if your a tank support.

I dont see ANY of these encouraging passive play as I am a very offence oriented style player. in fact the only passiveness I see in lanes most of the time is the enemy after me and my ADC blow up both the enemies in lane a few times in 2v2 and later 2v3 and further on 2v4. at one point me and an adc that I was perfectly in sync with did a 2 v 5 and killed all five attackers due to a combination of the champions kits we had and my use of items I bought as a support. if your not making plays with the items provided or cant get out of a passive rut that is on you sooner you realize that sooner you break out of your rut. till then no amount of whining pissing and moaning in the forums is going to fix things for you.

Go read what I'm saying. I'm not going to respond to what you decided I'm saying. I'm not being unclear - so either read it, or stop responding.

Mia HanokaSep 28, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Go read what I'm saying. I'm not going to respond to what you decided I'm saying. I'm not being unclear - so either read it, or stop responding.

Bro no matter how I read your opening post all it is is bitching about how there are not enough support items. as you can see in that list and any list shared by other is that your the one not making sense. all your griping about is lack of imagination on riots part and posting later in the thread about not being able to make plays and whining to every one about not enough items some more.

so here I will break down your crappy opener and show you that I have read it all:

Frankly, I find it insulting that - with the complexity of jungle items, and the plethora of items for everyone else, as a support, I get to chose:

ok you want more items for the role of support but comparing it to jungle is hardly even a final say. jungle items complex? lets see item 1039 as a starting item then in to one of these item 3707 item 3714 item 3719 item 3723 fine items one of which junglers dont even use unless they know they are not coming out till 6. then in to one of these enchantments item 3708 item 3930 item 3709 sure the enchantment makes each pick of one of the 4 jungle items ecentually 4 each but in the long run not really an award wining line up as the item is still jsuta three step upgrade.

if this comment was directed at just starting items then ADC has options of item 1042 item 1051 item 1055 item 1036 item 1001 item 2041 taking the first two is not recommended leaving the last three as solid picks not a very big variety of options and flask is only taken by certain ADC's if they go top. APC options are item 1056 item 1052 I am sure there are more but double faerie charm I rarely see again not a lot of options. Tanks have item 3244 item 1054 item 1029 item 1033 I am sure there are other options but again double rejuv beads are again rarely seen out side of high level ranked. you know support items cause your griping about them so I wont list them any more cause it only seem to piss your child like mind off more.

now that we have broken down this line on to the next block

An item that gives me gold passivly An item that gives me gold for poke Or An item that gives me gold when I last-hits minions - for someone else! Provided they even let me. Which, by the time the item is completed, they never do!

Oh wow you list the support items you grip about with out naming names about items ok dont need to look at that to deeply. nice break down of the mechanics behind them though.

And these wonderful items then build into: A shield for someone else A speed-boost for everyone else Or a slow

First of all more breaking down of how items work still not stating what you dont like other then the first sentence which indicate displeasure with the lacking amount of support items. also some corrections here item 3401 Sheilds one player even yourself not just for allies, item 3069 is a speed buff for all your team not everyone else. hit the nail on the head of that last one though forget to mention is was an AoE slow though and some damage.

I mean ... is that all they have the imagination for? In which way would the game be broken, if supports were allowed to have fun?

Griping about imagination? really? How are they lacking in imagination? share this please cause I am lost other then starting items there are a lot of fun support items that are fun as hell to make use of. do you even know what an active is? do you use them? if so how often and to what effect? please fill me in this will help me understand what your getting at.

(And it's not that I don't have fun - it's just that I have fun despite itemization, not as a result of it)

This indicates that it is not just the starting support items you dislike but all of them. Tell me which items you dont like hm? what is so bad about the items they have in place? what items ideas do you have that might make them better? what items would you change to make them better?

there I read and broke down the opening post now lets look at your gold nugget posts after this in my next post.

Mia HanokaSep 28, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Go read what I'm saying. I'm not going to respond to what you decided I'm saying. I'm not being unclear - so either read it, or stop responding.

last post continued as I dont want to make it one massive post again only for you to not read it.

Yes - all wonderful for someone else. You forgot Sightstone - another item that benefits everyone but you. And Locket, yet another. Hooray.

This shiny nugget of information was shared in response to the first post in the thread where some one points out support item options. now its funny how you share this fun insight into your actual knowledge of how things dont benefit you. sightstone you brought it up and said it gives you no advantages what so ever. excuse me here for a second I have to point out when you drop a ward does it not give you expanded vision into that area you placed it? if that is the case I can see how it does not help you cause its not doing anything for you. please let me know if it does not give you more sight in to the fog of war on your mini map and free floating screen (unless you play only locked then also explains some things.)

I want Riot to make my role fun.

ok I can understand wanting things to be more fun mind you this is just a segment of that post so I am not going to blast on this to hard.

I want the ability to make (support) plays. I want items that enable me, as support. I don't want damage, as such - tho for the life of me I cannot see how it would be a bad thing. If I can have an item that lets me share the gold for minion kills .... then why the screaming ** can I not have an item that lets me share kills for champion kills - giving me the assist gold and a team mate the kill gold?

Ok I see your actually starting to post some inner thoughts here. wanting to make support plays I shared a list of things that can make that happen with out even killing any thing and allowing your team to get kills. next "items that enable you as a support." enable you to do what sing and dance? blow up enemies on one shot? vaporize all minions in a lane? it seems like you had a thought there but lost it half way through moving on. "I dont want damage...." not typing it all you can see it in the quote. you dont want damage, but cant see how more damage would not be a bad thing. I am sorry are how much extra damage are we talking and what way is it given a passive, in the form of raw stats, maybe more active item options? the last sentence in this quote above I can understand to some extent its actually giving me and idea of what sort of things your looking for. However can you not see how such an item might also be abused by supports? if not here is an idea of how this would be abused. the other older support item options can be replaced completely with things like this item and rab cap, echo, and hourglass for AP support. it can also open up the fun thoughts of assassin supports just take this item then build pure damage like normal blow up the enemy for your ADC. this one is still done but currently its not as problematic as the gold goes to the killer and often the killer is the early to mid game burst assassin support.

Instead I get a choice of items that are highly dubious - items that, frankly, have a very high chance of NOT DOING ANYTHING AT ALL. Talisman of Ascension - in a solo queue game - very often achives absolutely nothing, because no one agrees what way to run. So in essence, rather than engage or run away - everyone just runs around like headless chickens slightly faster.

excuse me Highly dubious items? you must not support much or dabble there in each of the support items I have used are strong picks over all and I use them to extremely great effect. you think that items wont do any thing at all? well sure that is a possible I wont lie some times you use it at the wrong time, accidentally or flat out not at all cause you died to soon. Talisman of Ascension is not useless in a solo queue game. I have used it to great effect many times I even shared examples of this in another post go read it might be fun for you. reading further on this item shout out I see you use it before an engage in this example ever think of using it during a fight or in the event of being chased? if not your not you might not be using this item to full effects.

And again: With the amount of effort invested in making interesting jungle items, it is incomprehensible to me while support needs to make to with a selection of three utter junk items. There are more than three, but the three designed specifically for support are pretty much the worst items the game has to offer.

Comparing another role to your support role ok yeah your not winning favor that way mate. neither is going on about wait what is this you clearly state that the three support role starting items are junk? you must not use them to their full power then as clearly stated by your Ascension statement in the same post kinda funny.

"but the three designed specifically for support are pretty much the worst items the game has to offer." where are you getting your vomit of the brain here. do you even try to make proper use of these items or did you just give up trying at some point?

Targons Brace is, hands down, the least well designed item of anything in the game.

you think this item is bad? I used to use this item for my tank support to great effect. my current support friend he plays nothing but tank supports and wait a minute whats this take this item and uses it to great effect. hold on going to stop there you cant see how handy it is by my explaining it so I am not going to try to explain this one its literally something you have to find out on your own.

well that is for that one post on to your responses to me basically.

That's such an incredibly long post, just to show you have no idea what I'm talking about.

Long yes but your massively wrong about one thing I have read every post of yours my guess you skimmed through all mine ignoring things. and while yes I dont break down all three support Items its not my place to hold your hand like a child and detail how each item in league is a solid other then possible tweaks that are needed as things change in league. I did however in that post you just laughed off explain how an item you directly said was garbage could be used in three different ways talisman of ascension any one? actually go back and guess what read it you might be surprised at how hand they tool is in a fight.

That's NOT what I'm talking about. Which is why I say that you have no idea what I'm talking about. I never - not ONCE - mentioned 'more punch' or 'damage' or anything of the sort.

Sorry I would have stopped you right there I think there is an example of you saying this some where oh yeah

I don't want damage, as such - tho for the life of me I cannot see how it would be a bad thing.

That right there looks like a cry for more damage masked as a "I dont care about it." post so shut your hole about not wanting more punch or damage cause guess what child you asked for it in a back handed way.

I have said, quite specifically, that I want Riot to make my class fun. That we should be able to make plays (plays is not the same as getting kills), and that we have hideously retarded items designed specifically for our role: Items that force passivity, rather than encourage action.

Hold on wait just a second I think there is a post I can reference for that one as well let me look.

then why the screaming ** can I not have an item that lets me share kills for champion kills - giving me the assist gold and a team mate the kill gold?

Oh my that looks like you want kills but want to pass it off as assists for you and kills to some one else. sorry not buying that your cry baby tears for the ability to make plays but not get kills falls on blind eyes now. Also note further on you go on to say how the current support items force you to be passive. my reply to this child is that your only as passive as you make your self be no matter my item pick for starting gear as a support I am in the face with a mace harassing my enemies I dont play passive unless I REALLY have to and I make the plays happen and kill or assist or draw I am happy with my actions. your items dont make you passive your items permit you to make your choice on being passive or not. get that in your head.

I'm sure you love that. There's always one. But I'd like to play the same game as everyone else on my team - rather than the 'wait for everyone else to win the game' game.

You think I just sit around letting my team win for me? you feel that your actions dont influence a team fight or the match? you think that every thing you dont do does not count for something? ok then how about this uninstall see how much your actions effect the matches then promise you that your maybe helping players every where enjoy this game by about 25% more. however I would hate to loss a player of this community just cause his eyes are wide shut. I tell you again your only as effective as you permit yourself to be. use the tool they have to offer and you will impact a match in a big way.

on to the next post I think this is the last one about you wanting me to read stuff right?

Go read what I'm saying. I'm not going to respond to what you decided I'm saying. I'm not being unclear - so either read it, or stop responding.

ah yes it is funny seems your not the one being A) honest with yourself and B) not reading what your posting to well to be sure your point is getting across. kinda sad really but hey I will give you another fair shake and if you actually read this maybe you will finally come out with what ever it is point your trying to make cause honestly your not being clear your post look like a 5 year old throwing a tantrum about not having "equal amount of options." your only looking at the starting items right? support have roughly the same amount of options as every one else.

Wow I hit the limits on post length.

CaptinKeenSep 29, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mia Hanoka,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ytOav7mE,comment-id=0003000000000000000000000001,timestamp=2015-09-28T12:05:51.556+0000)

last post continued as I dont want to make it one massive post again only for you to not read it.

This shiny nugget of information was shared in response to the first post in the thread where some one points out support item options. now its funny how you share this fun insight into your actual knowledge of how things dont benefit you. sightstone you brought it up and said it gives you no advantages what so ever. excuse me here for a second I have to point out when you drop a ward does it not give you expanded vision into that area you placed it? if that is the case I can see how it does not help you cause its not doing anything for you. please let me know if it does not give you more sight in to the fog of war on your mini map and free floating screen (unless you play only locked then also explains some things.)

ok I can understand wanting things to be more fun mind you this is just a segment of that post so I am not going to blast on this to hard.

Ok I see your actually starting to post some inner thoughts here. wanting to make support plays I shared a list of things that can make that happen with out even killing any thing and allowing your team to get kills. next "items that enable you as a support." enable you to do what sing and dance? blow up enemies on one shot? vaporize all minions in a lane? it seems like you had a thought there but lost it half way through moving on. "I dont want damage...." not typing it all you can see it in the quote. you dont want damage, but cant see how more damage would not be a bad thing. I am sorry are how much extra damage are we talking and what way is it given a passive, in the form of raw stats, maybe more active item options? the last sentence in this quote above I can understand to some extent its actually giving me and idea of what sort of things your looking for. However can you not see how such an item might also be abused by supports? if not here is an idea of how this would be abused. the other older support item options can be replaced completely with things like this item and rab cap, echo, and hourglass for AP support. it can also open up the fun thoughts of assassin supports just take this item then build pure damage like normal blow up the enemy for your ADC. this one is still done but currently its not as problematic as the gold goes to the killer and often the killer is the early to mid game burst assassin support.

excuse me Highly dubious items? you must not support much or dabble there in each of the support items I have used are strong picks over all and I use them to extremely great effect. you think that items wont do any thing at all? well sure that is a possible I wont lie some times you use it at the wrong time, accidentally or flat out not at all cause you died to soon. Talisman of Ascension is not useless in a solo queue game. I have used it to great effect many times I even shared examples of this in another post go read it might be fun for you. reading further on this item shout out I see you use it before an engage in this example ever think of using it during a fight or in the event of being chased? if not your not you might not be using this item to full effects.

Comparing another role to your support role ok yeah your not winning favor that way mate. neither is going on about wait what is this you clearly state that the three support role starting items are junk? you must not use them to their full power then as clearly stated by your Ascension statement in the same post kinda funny.

"but the three designed specifically for support are pretty much the worst items the game has to offer." where are you getting your vomit of the brain here. do you even try to make proper use of these items or did you just give up trying at some point?

you think this item is bad? I used to use this item for my tank support to great effect. my current support friend he plays nothing but tank supports and wait a minute whats this take this item and uses it to great effect. hold on going to stop there you cant see how handy it is by my explaining it so I am not going to try to explain this one its literally something you have to find out on your own.

well that is for that one post on to your responses to me basically.

Long yes but your massively wrong about one thing I have read every post of yours my guess you skimmed through all mine ignoring things. and while yes I dont break down all three support Items its not my place to hold your hand like a child and detail how each item in league is a solid other then possible tweaks that are needed as things change in league. I did however in that post you just laughed off explain how an item you directly said was garbage could be used in three different ways talisman of ascension any one? actually go back and guess what read it you might be surprised at how hand they tool is in a fight.

Sorry I would have stopped you right there I think there is an example of you saying this some where oh yeah

That right there looks like a cry for more damage masked as a "I dont care about it." post so shut your hole about not wanting more punch or damage cause guess what child you asked for it in a back handed way.

Hold on wait just a second I think there is a post I can reference for that one as well let me look.

Oh my that looks like you want kills but want to pass it off as assists for you and kills to some one else. sorry not buying that your cry baby tears for the ability to make plays but not get kills falls on blind eyes now. Also note further on you go on to say how the current support items force you to be passive. my reply to this child is that your only as passive as you make your self be no matter my item pick for starting gear as a support I am in the face with a mace harassing my enemies I dont play passive unless I REALLY have to and I make the plays happen and kill or assist or draw I am happy with my actions. your items dont make you passive your items permit you to make your choice on being passive or not. get that in your head.

You think I just sit around letting my team win for me? you feel that your actions dont influence a team fight or the match? you think that every thing you dont do does not count for something? ok then how about this uninstall see how much your actions effect the matches then promise you that your maybe helping players every where enjoy this game by about 25% more. however I would hate to loss a player of this community just cause his eyes are wide shut. I tell you again your only as effective as you permit yourself to be. use the tool they have to offer and you will impact a match in a big way.

on to the next post I think this is the last one about you wanting me to read stuff right?

ah yes it is funny seems your not the one being A) honest with yourself and B) not reading what your posting to well to be sure your point is getting across. kinda sad really but hey I will give you another fair shake and if you actually read this maybe you will finally come out with what ever it is point your trying to make cause honestly your not being clear your post look like a 5 year old throwing a tantrum about not having "equal amount of options." your only looking at the starting items right? support have roughly the same amount of options as every one else.

Wow I hit the limits on post length.

Why do you do this?

No, seriously? What are you trying to achieve with these giant posts - that DO NOT relate to what I'm saying?

I simply have no idea how to explain this to you if it isn't clear already. Riot are going out of their way to design items for one out of four roles that are uninspired, boring, passive - items that aren't interactive, that rely on others and not yourself, that are reactive rather than proactive.

And also, items that make sure that while we do nothing else that's fun ........

.........

......... we also don't do damage. But oh boy - we get to ward, and shield. Fuck off, Riot.

Mia HanokaSep 30, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Why do you do this?

No, seriously? What are you trying to achieve with these giant posts - that DO NOT relate to what I'm saying?

I simply have no idea how to explain this to you if it isn't clear already. Riot are going out of their way to design items for one out of four roles that are uninspired, boring, passive - items that aren't interactive, that rely on others and not yourself, that are reactive rather than proactive.

And also, items that make sure that while we do nothing else that's fun ........

.........

......... we also don't do damage. But oh boy - we get to ward, and shield. Fuck off, Riot.

What I am trying to acheive with these posts?

A) that your last post stated I dont read your vomit of the brain. guess what if you read even a portion of my posts you see that I am breaking down what you said in your posts thus far.

B) get you to state what it is your really looking for cause honestly you had not till just now.

so you want the ability to do damage and be able to contribute directly to a fight. Rab cap, echo, hour glass, rylia's, an so on. there its not support stuff but you build it that damage will be there. if your looking for better options on your starting stuff then I recommend you do a different role cause each item that supports get as a starting option is inline with the stats other roles get.

if you want more starting damage get item 3303 and play a ranged support like sona, soraka, Janna, or lulu when you proc your gold gain it gives you a small increase in damage to the hit as well.

But simply put yet again your a support they cant give you more damage cause then other roles will abuse the items and there is no way to lock out the items like junglers items can be with smite cause even if they did try what summoner spell would it be? summoner 3 ? thats a good pick SS for other roles as well. {{summoner:2}} ? what if the support wants ? with out away to ensure it locks into a support champion there is no way they can give the support role and item that has a gold gain feature and has stronger stats. If you can figure out how to consistently bind it to the support then every thing will be gravy and they might read about it then green light it.

Sorry this was long as well, but I feel its justified to explain all that. I also want to state complaining about something does not help find a solution. if this was meant to be a brain storming thread for that you opening post does not convey this at all only comes of as a "wha wha I want god items for support."

CaptinKeenOct 1, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mia Hanoka,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ytOav7mE,comment-id=000300000000000000000000000100000000,timestamp=2015-09-30T00:11:31.807+0000)

What I am trying to acheive with these posts?

A) that your last post stated I dont read your vomit of the brain. guess what if you read even a portion of my posts you see that I am breaking down what you said in your posts thus far.

B) get you to state what it is your really looking for cause honestly you had not till just now.

so you want the ability to do damage and be able to contribute directly to a fight. Rab cap, echo, hour glass, rylia's, an so on. there its not support stuff but you build it that damage will be there. if your looking for better options on your starting stuff then I recommend you do a different role cause each item that supports get as a starting option is inline with the stats other roles get.

if you want more starting damage get and play a ranged support like sona, soraka, Janna, or lulu when you proc your gold gain it gives you a small increase in damage to the hit as well.

But simply put yet again your a support they cant give you more damage cause then other roles will abuse the items and there is no way to lock out the items like junglers items can be with smite cause even if they did try what summoner spell would it be? ? thats a good pick SS for other roles as well. {{summoner:2}} ? what if the support wants ? with out away to ensure it locks into a support champion there is no way they can give the support role and item that has a gold gain feature and has stronger stats. If you can figure out how to consistently bind it to the support then every thing will be gravy and they might read about it then green light it.

Sorry this was long as well, but I feel its justified to explain all that. I also want to state complaining about something does not help find a solution. if this was meant to be a brain storming thread for that you opening post does not convey this at all only comes of as a "wha wha I want god items for support."

You're not reading a word I say, are you?

I've stated, repeatedly, that it is NOT about damage. Over and over again, and still it's what you jump RIGHT back to. Because you're not responding to me - you're responding to your own expectation of what I want is.

And this is why I don't respond to you.

We are not having a conversation.

You are having a conversation with yourself - with me as an astonished spectator.

But it's certainly entertaining, so please don't stop. Be sure to include more personal attacks - that's really the MOST funny: How you're flaming - essentially - yourself, cause I'm not a part of this little monologue you're having. Good luck with the Tourettes =D

Mia HanokaOct 1, 20151 votes

{quoted}

You're not reading a word I say, are you?

I've stated, repeatedly, that it is NOT about damage. Over and over again, and still it's what you jump RIGHT back to. Because you're not responding to me - you're responding to your own expectation of what I want is.

And this is why I don't respond to you.

We are not having a conversation.

You are having a conversation with yourself - with me as an astonished spectator.

But it's certainly entertaining, so please don't stop. Be sure to include more personal attacks - that's really the MOST funny: How you're flaming - essentially - yourself, cause I'm not a part of this little monologue you're having. Good luck with the Tourettes =D

Reading loud and clear and only one here looking like a fool is the person who felt it was cool to flame riot then flame a person and people who seek to help him miss understand is misguided ways. Also since you seem to not be stating your case clearly no one can help you beyond reading your crappy posts and assume your cry baby stance.

{quoted}

I simply have no idea how to explain this to you if it isn't clear already. Riot are going out of their way to design items for one out of four roles that are uninspired, boring, passive - items that aren't interactive, that rely on others and not yourself, that are reactive rather than proactive.

And also, items that make sure that while we do nothing else that's fun ........

This indicates a lack of understanding of your role that is fundamentally your own fault at this point. I used to main support hard and WAS a proactive force in bot lane and WAS able to do things on my own with one of the 3 items provided. Also you again must not be a support or any thing of the sort cause you would have seen how some supports can put themselves way out ahead of the minion waves and keep 2 enemies at bay with out their ally close by. Which can often be done with just the base starting items given to us supports by riot.

......... we also don't do damage. But oh boy - we get to ward, and shield. Fuck off, Riot.

you sir are a dumbass an ^^^^^^^ there is your proof of your dumbassery!

I've stated, repeatedly, that it is NOT about damage. Over and over again, and still it's what you jump RIGHT back to. Because you're not responding to me - you're responding to your own expectation of what I want is.

I am sorry lets get that in repeat again to make it clearer for you

......... we also don't do damage.

Wait maybe again just to be 100% sure yeah?

{quoted}

......... we also don't do damage.

I think I am seeing it clearly now. HOWEVER I want to be absolutely sure that we have an understanding here. YOU ARE NOT AFTER DAMAGE BUT YOUR CLOSING ARGUMENT 90% of your frelling posts is about how Supports dont have damage. You pass it off as "passive" request for damage and you think your being cleaver about it but you not you really are not.

I don't want damage, as such - tho for the life of me I cannot see how it would be a bad thing.

Lets note the "I cannot see how it would be a bad thing" you passive aggressive piece of trash you cant even grasp that this screams you want it but want to pass it off as not wanting thinking that people will ignore it. I sir am not blind and I sir am not a frelling child it takes more then subpar word play to fool me.

At this point all your doing is trolling and no amount of people informing you will help you. even if riot staff came in here and started explaining it great detail about how your tantrum is not going any where. explain to you the intricate workings of each role and how support is meant to play out. you would simply flame them screaming and whining and crying and screaming some more about how "its not fair we should have more starting item options and even though it I say I dont want it I would like damage to come with those items so I can make plays and get kills for my allies by myself." sorry if you even went back and read half your crap with an objective eye you would see how much the child you are acting.

Shall I just start saying "yeah your right supports should have the option of an instant kill item from get go that gives that kill to our ally in lane." that is right up there with this person post about how they want a champion that can bring a team back from a loss refer to Argenta, the Noxian banker.

I am sure your one of those stains who would look at that champion upvote it just cause it has an insane gold generation kit and demand riot make it a champion cause it would allow you to get all those mid lane items to ramp up your damage and healing abilities as well as have a permanent siphon of gold from level 6 on wards. then make even more suggestions about how it can increase the gold generation of your team some how so that it can bring a team back from the brink of a loss or force your team in to a hyper snowball mode with excess gold generation and well played lanes in the early phase.

CaptinKeenOct 2, 20151 votes

And ... reported.

Damage is not the issue at hand. I have mentioned damage only because you and others brought it up, and taking it out of context in an attempt to support your opinion is a new low.

I have, at no point, claimed that I do not play proactively - this entire post is about ITEMS. The ITEMS do not support proactive play. I want Riot to make ITEMS that do.

This discussion is now officially over. You will get no more responses to your rants. Have a nice day =)

Mia HanokaSep 27, 20151 votes

Sad fact is sad if this is about you first pick gold gather items there is not much for it.

Enchantment system: this cant work to apply a gold gathering type to an item as it is put on FINISHED items making it tough to do as a start of game thing unless rito can rework the system for upgrading with the same enchantment in place.

more variation in gold gathering items: basically this is taking the route that floods the entire item shop with 3 versions each of the gold items so that you can get the passive gold on that armband or active on hit gold from the spelltheifs on coin. this cant work cause again your flooding three different build paths into the store for a minor problem.

these would be the two simplest ways to make it flexible but they are still complex and would be a thing that riot would do as a preseason reformation rather then a simple mid season patch.

Truly PridefulSep 27, 20151 votes

I don't think support means what you think it does. You choose support to sacrifice for the team and bring the extra utility and vision items. If that's not something you like, support probably isn't for you.

Also, there is nothing preventing you from buying the big stat sticks that everyone else does if you have the money.

QueenAquaOct 2, 20151 votes

I actually really like the item 3092 . And I'm simply just happy that they're gonna be giving us alternate sightstone builds besides ruby. That's really the only item i have a problem with, lol. I am not a fan of getting ruby, only reason i get it is for the extra wards, i hate the obligated health.

CaptinKeenOct 2, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I actually really like the . And I'm simply just happy that they're gonna be giving us alternate sightstone builds besides ruby. That's really the only item i have a problem with, lol. I am not a fan of getting ruby, only reason i get it is for the extra wards, i hate the obligated health.

That is the support I most often go with. But honestly? It's only ever so slightly less crap than the others.

At least it gives me gold for landing harass, which is close to what I want - but why does it have to be a shit item in every other way? 2200 gold for a slow with the tiniest sprinkle of stats on top? What, exactly, are they afraid of?