Latest Veigar Win Rates

EnzoDaBaker·Mar 1, 2015·92 votes·10,877 views

Apparently the latest win rates for Veigar are in, looks like he is by far the lowest winning champ, coming in at a whopping 32.79%. I guess that "compensation buff" for removing DFG is working as planned.. If you guys think this wasn't a planned nerf to protect their LCS reel then you must not know riot. Even newbies can understand when you nerf his ult, remove his poke, increase his late game CD for Q, and nerf his stun. These are obviously nerfs, not compensation. Yes he did get mana upgrades that he needed and he will have much fun farming for 30 mins using it. Because he can't do anything else anymore. 32%... Are you kidding me? He was WELL below the top tiers in win % before this nerf. LCS protection, protect that reel! Next up, LB/Kat/Zed buff, cuz.. Reel!

102 Comments

TapDattMar 1, 201524 votes

"Don't worry, people just need time to adjust" they said "Give it time, his win rates will even out" they said "Veigar will receive just compensation for Dfg removal" they said

Veigar item 3070

Volt CruelerzMar 1, 201510 votes

Is this a record for league?

Just think of it as Veigar now causes his players to lose a third of the games they'd ordinarily win.

AudiomancyMar 1, 201510 votes

The record for Lowest Win Rate belongs to Release Syndra I believe, at 25%. Veigar's on his way there though, so who knows?

Judge ArcadiaMar 1, 20159 votes

http://www.lolking.net/champions/veigar&region=all&map=sr&queue=normal&league=ranked#statistics

He's back in the 40% bracket. You can stop bitching now.

SolaxoMar 1, 201557 votes

[{quoted}](name=Judge Arcadia,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yevA8EcL,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2015-03-01T16:32:48.550+0000)

http://www.lolking.net/champions/veigar&region=all&map=sr&queue=normal&league=ranked#statistics

He's back in the 40% bracket. You can stop bitching now.

Wow whole 40%! Amazing.

EedatMar 1, 201515 votes

I think the point he was trying to make is that the numbers from some of these sites are far from accurate. Using inaccurate information to make your point is dishonest and misleading

AuryielMar 1, 201515 votes

We use what we have, since we can't have access to Riot's database.

How is that dishonest exactly?

Having the wrong information is not the player's fault. In fact we don't even know if it IS the wrong information.

EedatMar 1, 201516 votes

No, but shopping around every single site to find the lowest possible win rate to post is dishonest. I'm not argueing that Veigar isnt underpowered, but purposely giving misleading information to prove a point is wrong

Whats even more confusing is that even in the link that is given his win rate is listed as 44.27%.....thats a difference of 12% from what was listed in the post

EnzoDaBakerMar 1, 20159 votes

How is it misleading to show exactly the information presented? The information is there for you to do what you will with it, crying that I offered facts because the facts aren't what you want to believe sounds like a personal issue, not a dishonesty issue. There are 3 other websites that offer game win stats, all 3 of them have veigar in the bottom 5. Out of 116, the bottom 5.

EedatMar 1, 20159 votes

It's misleading because in your post you said 32.79% when even the link you provided says 44.27%. I mean its a bold faced lie at this point

Also, it's funny that I'm the one "crying" about the lies you provided when your entire thread is a QQ thread. We know Veigar is underpowered. Riot has acknowledged thats he's underpowered and will be making changes to help him. There is no point blatantly lying to tell everyone something that we already know other than "whelp, time to make another circlejerk thread for upvotes"

RrettMar 1, 20159 votes

The information is misleading because you lied about veigars winrate. You said 32% and on op.gg it's 44%.

As for actual relevant information, in diamond he has a 40% winrate. It's still really terrible.

Even if they gutted a champion twice as hard as veigar they still wouldn't reach 32%, there are going to be a large amount of people who just carry the veigar no matter how bad he does.

EedatMar 2, 20157 votes

When the biggest nerf in league history hit Evelynn in season 1, her win rate dropped to 33.5%. Her entire kit was absolutely gutted and destroyed. Way worse than what happened to Veigar. So even the biggest nerf in League history failed to drop the champion to 32%

HetchyMar 1, 20158 votes

No "adjustment" needed.

You just accept that he's horribly weak right now and hope to God Rito's whims swing the other direction.

Fucking LCS-centric ~~balance~~ nerfing is really annoying.

AzaelMar 1, 20158 votes

Riot's balance team is looking at Veigar/Kassadin right now like

TalamareMar 1, 20156 votes

http://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/stats/by-winrate

League of Graphs still has him above Azir and Kassadin

TheKingDodoMar 1, 201513 votes

but still below Urgot ... we can't have that! Here's how community balancing works: UP ≤ Urgot ≤ balanced ≤ fotm ≤ OP

NeroYamatoXMar 1, 20155 votes

I say give it time. People need the adjust to his nerfs. If his win-rate is still 32% after a month then we can complain. Champions bounce back all the time.

SolaxoMar 1, 201513 votes

{quoted}

I say give it time. People need the adjust to his nerfs. If his win-rate is still 32% after a month then we can complain. Champions bounce back all the time.

I don't know how people are supposed to adjust to obvious nerfs to both numbers and mechanics.. It's not the power shift Ahri had.

SecretAgentHulkMar 1, 20152 votes

Q - Potentially buffed, both for farming and poke. Range buffed. Level 4/5 CD nerfed, but IIRC people started building Morello's after DFG was removed so not as bad as it sounds. (I could be way off base there; I don't play mages much.)

W - Straight buff. Numeric.

E - Decent in theory, bad in execution. I expect this to be buffed in the next two patches.

R - Mana costs and CD buffed. Honest question: how much was that extra 20% AP worth? He still does that extra 80% of target's AP as well.

WarlockLawMar 1, 20158 votes

20% ap on a champ that can easily hut 1000 ap in a 40 minute game is 200 damage he won't see again. Also you fail to realize how dependant veigar was on landing his stun, it is easier to hit cho gath's rupture than it is to hit veigar's dark matter and his cc now has a stupidly London delay. It's fine that they want him to have counter play and all but the killed what he can do to counter play his opponents. I say give him his old ratio back and decrease the delay to 0.5 and go from there

EnzoDaBakerMar 1, 20155 votes

Q has not been potentially buffed, it has been a mana plus and a team play minus. You can no longer poke an enemy with it because he's smart enough to just sit behind the line which reduces his Q to a farming tool only. What other poke does he have after this is removed? His W? It doesn't land unless the player is stunned and you can no longer stun a player because they can simply walk away after the telegraphed location is given.

W's straight numeric buff is worthless if your stun has been greatly nerfed.

R - 20% extra AP is a huge bonus when facing NON ap chars in game, which is usually about 60-80% of the characters in game.

BudupopsMar 1, 20158 votes

how do you adjust to nerfs

LyraSonaMar 1, 20155 votes

It's called having an open mind + patience + skill. It does not include whining on a forum :).

Ark Angel HFBMar 1, 20155 votes

{quoted}

It's called having an open mind + patience + skill. It does not include whining on a forum :).

And yet the guy who made challenger playing only him... is calling him unplayable and has announced he is dropping the champ.

When the absolute best player for a certain champs says he is in a state not worth playing... think how bad it must be.

LyraSonaMar 1, 20151 votes

And I literally just got done watching a LCS match where some guy named Bunny Foo Foo mopped the floor with Veigar. The announcers were like astonished at how well Veigar did. Maybe your Veigar gold medalist just lacks some imagination.

DirewolfiezMar 1, 20154 votes

LCS matches play on previous patches up to two weeks ago, not the current ones. Your ignorance is astounding.

"In the past, the delay between the live patch and LCS play was two weeks, while new champions and reworks were disabled for one month. After consulting with teams and in an effort to make competitive play align more consistently with what’s available to all players, we are shortening our new champion/rework activation cadence to two weeks. LCS officials still reserve the right to disable a champion or item if there are game-changing bugs." http://na.lolesports.com/articles/changes-2015-lcs-official-rules

soulbanana8Mar 1, 20155 votes

If they remove the cast time on his E(not the 0.75 sec delay, the 0.5 sec cast time), then he'd be better.

ThryaleMar 1, 20153 votes

meddler confirmed that his cast time is .25 secs, not .5 secs.

chumblerMar 1, 201510 votes

{quoted}

meddler confirmed that his cast time is .25 secs, not .5 secs.

Meddler also implemented these changes, so you'll have to forgive me for not trusting that dumb piece of shit.

ThryaleMar 1, 201512 votes

sigh, lack of foresight has no bearing on a person's ability to read the code staring him in the face.

Rinky DinkyMar 1, 20152 votes

LoLKiruMar 1, 20156 votes

Gonna be honest, while your anger is a warranted to an extent. Meddler has access to the code of the game, and we do not, I trust what he says based on that alone.

Insulting him isn't doing any good either.

That said, Veigar's confirmed to be getting a buff before the 5.5 PBE cycle ends, so im eager to see how much that helps him (hopefully it'll do some good for him in the reliability department)

HeadHonchkrowMar 2, 20152 votes

You spelled the word "nerf" wrong

Xion MoonrayMar 2, 20155 votes

Oh God...Veigar, Kassadin, and Azir all below Urgot now. Riot, what the fuck are you doing...

Especially Azir, though. Nobody deserves that, that's just horrible.

Nyaruko ChanMar 1, 20154 votes

If you were intelligent you would know that Veigar has never had high win rates. Because Veigar has never been a good champion outside of Bronze and Silver. He was always extremely easy to counter pick and deal with. Thats no different now. The only difference is his really silly E that even the pro players and Analysts knew was op has been nerfed to make it no longer a mass aoe insta 3 second stun that also zones off an entire area as well. It now takes 0.75 seconds to stun and zone off the entire enemy team. Wow.

BerserkInfernoMar 1, 20158 votes

It takes 1.25 seconds genius. The warm up particle lasts for .75 seconds AFTER a .5 second cast time. You have to be psychic and your opponent has to be absolutely idiotic for that stun to land.

Volt CruelerzMar 1, 20154 votes

1.0 seconds, according to Meddler. He stepped in at one point to indicate that the cast time was 0.25, not 0.5.

BerserkInfernoMar 1, 20154 votes

Oh, ok, thanks for the correction.

BolwinkelMar 1, 20154 votes

[{quoted}](name=Kirito x Silica,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yevA8EcL,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-03-01T16:13:23.716+0000)

If you were intelligent you would know that Veigar has never had high win rates. Because Veigar has never been a good champion outside of Bronze and Silver. He was always extremely easy to counter pick and deal with. Thats no different now. The only difference is his really silly E that even the pro players and Analysts knew was op has been nerfed to make it no longer a mass aoe insta 3 second stun that also zones off an entire area as well. It now takes 0.75 seconds to stun and zone off the entire enemy team. Wow.

At level 1 it is a 1 second stun and at max level it is a 2.5 second stun. Never has it been 3 seconds. Also have you actually played the old veigar? It takes a bit to get used to landing his stun RIGHT on top of his prey. Now it's impossible to do. His stun was the only thing that made him good. If his w had a shorter delay (mayber .75 seconds), His win rate might rise up. No champion should be under 45% win rate. However no champion should be above 60% win rate.

Nyaruko ChanMar 1, 20155 votes

Its not that hard to land his stun at all. It was instant. Meaning you can instantly place down a large massive aoe stun that not only insta stuns anybody caught in the edge but also instantly zones off an entire team or traps them or cuts the team apart. It was far too powerful to be able to be instant casted like that. It literally offered no reaction or counter play.

BolwinkelMar 1, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Kirito x Silica,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yevA8EcL,comment-id=000000010000,timestamp=2015-03-01T18:24:12.021+0000)

Its not that hard to land his stun at all. It was instant. Meaning you can instantly place down a large massive aoe stun that not only insta stuns anybody caught in the edge but also instantly zones off an entire team or traps them or cuts the team apart. It was far too powerful to be able to be instant casted like that. It literally offered no reaction or counter play.

Of course it's not hard to land a stun if someone walks into it. But now people won't walk into it because they have time to react since they can see where it is going to be. Before it was quite difficult to land your stun right on top of people due to the champions having a fuck ton of mobility. What about Taric's stun? How does that have counter play? Point and click stun that lasts for 1.2---1.6 seconds. Also what about with Katarina. She might not have a stun but she can completely burst an entire team in 3 seconds. How does that have any counter play?

Nyaruko ChanMar 2, 20151 votes

Easy. Taric is garbage and is completely useless. Anything he does every other meta support pick does better. Also Taric has a pathetic mana pool on top of his abilities costing far too much mana to even use them. You wont ever have any mana in lane to use his stun because you will constantly be healing your ADC instead which costs even more mana. On top of that his stun doesnt have very good range and Taric has such shitty base movement speed that he will be lucky if he ever reaches their adc to stun him. Even then Taric has surprisingly shitty base health stats and armor outside of his passive on W meaning he gets bullied out of lane extremely easy. Anything he offers other supports offer better. Annie has a much easier to use stun that can mass aoe stun an entire team. Soraka heals people for a lot more and has a global heal.

As for Katarina shes really easy to counter. In fact shes so easy its laughable. Literally the moment Katarina jumps into your team cc her and watch her melt. Literally any form of CC will cancel her ult which is her main damage output in team fights. On top of that her cooldowns are really fucking long and she literally has to get kills in order to really get going in a team fight. Meaning if you stop her ult and her follow up with literally any form of CC shes useless.

Now about Veigar's old mass aoe stun. It had extremely surprising range on it for one. Making it very hard to accurately judge where it was going to appear. Plus most times Veigar would just wait in a bush and as soon as somebody walks by mass aoe stun stuns 4 people and he does his full combo and the entire enemy team's carries are dead. If you want a good reason why Veigar's stun was so broken just got watch some of the recent LCK games in Korea. Hell actually just go watch the NA LCS game yesterday where Gravity picked Veigar support and shut down the enemy team from ever being able to do anything.

BolwinkelMar 4, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Kirito x Silica,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yevA8EcL,comment-id=00000001000000000000,timestamp=2015-03-02T13:12:49.693+0000)

Easy. Taric is garbage and is completely useless. Anything he does every other meta support pick does better. Also Taric has a pathetic mana pool on top of his abilities costing far too much mana to even use them. You wont ever have any mana in lane to use his stun because you will constantly be healing your ADC instead which costs even more mana. On top of that his stun doesnt have very good range and Taric has such shitty base movement speed that he will be lucky if he ever reaches their adc to stun him. Even then Taric has surprisingly shitty base health stats and armor outside of his passive on W meaning he gets bullied out of lane extremely easy. Anything he offers other supports offer better. Annie has a much easier to use stun that can mass aoe stun an entire team. Soraka heals people for a lot more and has a global heal.

As for Katarina shes really easy to counter. In fact shes so easy its laughable. Literally the moment Katarina jumps into your team cc her and watch her melt. Literally any form of CC will cancel her ult which is her main damage output in team fights. On top of that her cooldowns are really fucking long and she literally has to get kills in order to really get going in a team fight. Meaning if you stop her ult and her follow up with literally any form of CC shes useless.

Now about Veigar's old mass aoe stun. It had extremely surprising range on it for one. Making it very hard to accurately judge where it was going to appear. Plus most times Veigar would just wait in a bush and as soon as somebody walks by mass aoe stun stuns 4 people and he does his full combo and the entire enemy team's carries are dead. If you want a good reason why Veigar's stun was so broken just got watch some of the recent LCK games in Korea. Hell actually just go watch the NA LCS game yesterday where Gravity picked Veigar support and shut down the enemy team from ever being able to do anything.

explain this then https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NoMnNUtxL5g&t=305

BiffoloMar 1, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Kirito x Silica,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yevA8EcL,comment-id=000000010000,timestamp=2015-03-01T18:24:12.021+0000)

Its not that hard to land his stun at all. It was instant. Meaning you can instantly place down a large massive aoe stun that not only insta stuns anybody caught in the edge but also instantly zones off an entire team or traps them or cuts the team apart. It was far too powerful to be able to be instant casted like that. It literally offered no reaction or counter play.

Just want to say, it had a small cast time you could react to. Because Im perfectly capable of doing it, and im an east coast baddie. It just took recognition as to when it was gonna go off.

ThryaleMar 1, 20157 votes

tell that to DaBox (a challenger ranked veigar main)

Rinky DinkyMar 1, 20155 votes

And Sadistic Veigar... and anyone who has a brain.

Veigar has always been very strong, just off meta, same as Anivia, but for different reason's obviously.

Veigar was actually being played alot right before riot announced the changes, coming up to an 8% pickrate and a 50% winrate on average.

HIs passive is actually very strong right now considering the mana nerfs. To bad that riot decided that extra regen was worth gutting his bread and butter spell E, gimping his R, and giving a buff to his Q that would only work if you could actually use W and E.

Chevalier ChawaMar 2, 20153 votes

I guess 32.79% for veigar now is SUPER HIGH lol Veigar

FoggyPawsMar 2, 20151 votes

TFW Everyone who belives giving the new kit a chance and waiting a while for everyone to get used to it gets voted down into oblivion.

Waiting for this to be downvoted too.

chumblerMar 2, 20157 votes

{quoted}

TFW Everyone who belives giving the new kit a chance and waiting a while for everyone to get used to it gets voted down into oblivion.

Waiting for this to be downvoted too.

There is no "new kit" here. It's just Veigar, but worse in every way. There's nothing to get used to, other than that they just turned him into shit.