I think his passive would be really cool, and it would probably help him become a higher tier adc, if his passive also gave him additional lifesteal. If it operated on kill like guinsoo's rageblade it would make his passive steroid way more useful. Or even if it had a dangerous game type of idea to it.
JustMyBassCannon2 votesA better idea for Varus' passive would be to swap his W and passive; make his W the Blight mechanic, and then give his W an activated AS steroid effect.
Hayaishi1 votesA better idea for Varus' passive would be to swap his W and passive; make his W the Blight mechanic, and then give his W an activated AS steroid effect.
That's just too generic.
His passive would be fine giving more bonuses, it even fits his lore
JustMyBassCannon1 votesThat's just too generic.
Just curious, do you actually play Varus?
He's one of the two marksmen I can actually enjoy playing (the other being Draven). And Varus' playstyle, as it is, feels fine and enjoyable to me. My only problem with Varus is that his passive feels entirely ineffective. It only activates after you kill an enemy, and it's a pathetically small AS buff.
Compare his passive to Ardent Censer; when Varus kills a non-champion enemy unit, he gains +20% AS for 3 seconds. A base of 0.658 means that he gains about +0.132 AS for 3 seconds (over 3 seconds, he deals 0.395 more attacks). If he kills/assists on killing a champion, he gains +40% AS for 6 seconds, or about +0.263 AS (over 6 seconds, he deals an extra 1.579 attacks).
Ardent Censer, when you shield/heal an ally, grants your target +25% AS for 6 seconds. For Varus, that comes out to 0.1645 (+0.987 attacks over 6 seconds).
Varus' AS gain, again, only happens after he kills a unit. After he has already done what bonus AS would make easier to do.
The reason I suggest something so generic is because Varus doesn't need more. People who think Varus needs more than simply swapping his W and passive are usually obsessed with the fact that he doesn't have the innate mobility that some other marksmen have, or go on about how he hasn't had his popularity skyrocket like other picks. But I'm curious; why is a generic Varus change not good enough, in your opinion?
MattAkhavan1 votesFirst off let me say i agree with what you are saying it would be a valid solution to switch blight with his passive, but that's pretty stale. Just giving varus a steroid like mf's would be very boring unless you add something with it like a dash (which i don't even think makes sense for his play style and would give him too much utility) He needs something more than just a steroid in my opinion.
JustMyBassCannon1 votesOkay, so you like the idea of Blight becoming his passive, but not making his W into an AS steroid. So what specifically would you suggest for a semi-bursty, high-utility Marksman?
MattAkhavan1 votesI ams aying your idea would work, but it's stale change.
JustMyBassCannon1 votesNo, I'm...I'm not trying to be aggressively defensive of my opinion or something.
I'm actually asking you for ideas. I already know my idea would work, but I don't just want an idea that works. I want to refine it. This needs to be much more than "okay," it needs to be something that appeals to both the players and the designers.
So, please, what would you suggest? I want a discussion of good ideas. Hayaishi already slapped me with a damn good idea, and I want some more input. Though, I'm against the idea of putting Guinsoo's effects on Varus, because that kind of ramp-up doesn't seem like his style. Vengeance and Desperation are two separate entities.
Onegarion1 votesAfter having varus as my main adc for season 3 and then him being nearly unplayable competitively (and me not practicing with the lucian popularity) I think his bigger issue is that his E is rather useless. Its a really weak attack overall and mainly used for a quick stack pop. The slow is rather weak and pathetic imo and the grievious wounds doesn't do a whole lot to champs that can delete you.
I'm not going to say make him more mobile becuase I like playing champs that have less mobility. I'm the guy that plays cait, ashe, varus, MF, etc. I don't think varus needs mobility honestly. What i really think he needs is something done to his E to make it more viable of an option. I know riot said they weren't going to make gameplay and story match, but I don't know how desecrated ground even works with his story? Varus' E was always just another blah move that really seemed wasted. Maybe if there were less gap closers and the slow would really help then ok, but with the game being more about gap closers atm I think we could look to change his E.
Overall I do think that swapping his passive and his W is a bad idea. Not because of it making him generic, but I like to control how I scale my W. If it was made into his passive I wouldn't have control over it. That and as I said before I'm not into many champs that have AS steroids so a scaling AS boost doesn't really appeal to me. A change I think could be done that is slight (might make him a bit generic) is making his W stack more than 3 times. With Kalista being able to easy rend out of multiple targets I'm not sure why Varus is stuck with only 3 stacks. I understand that it does % health damage, but you could make it have diminishing returns to a point.
Things that I"m thinking about revolve around making it a more damage based attack or changing the utility on it. I have nothing concrete because I haven't really thought about varus in a while. He just doesn't enter my mind and went from one of my favorite champs to this.
JustMyBassCannon1 votesWell, first, comparing Kalista's Rend is a bit unfair. Each stack of Rend after the first increases the total damage by 25-45% depending on its rank. Even if the base+scaling matched with 2%/5% of max HP on the first attack, she'd have to land 8/5 more attacks to start beating 6%/15% max HP. 3 attacks compared to 9/6 attacks is a pretty large gap, even if Kalista's Q applies a stack. Not only that, but Kalista can't repeatedly re-use Rend, while Varus can continually re-proc Blight stacks.
I agree that Varus' E seems a bit soft. The damage/scaling is low to justify the slow+Grievous Wounds (which is actually a hugely effective duel tool, halving your opponent's LS/healing), but almost all of those effects have been nerfed at some point because of the combination. Hell, why not move the Grievous Wounds to his Q, and increase the damage/radius+slow on his E?
Yeah, I'm a fan of simply power-shifting instead of adding entirely new stuff. But, really, Varus' kit does have most of what he needs, and most of it works together very well. The only part that never feels effective at all outside of CSing is his passive.
MattAkhavan1 votesPersonally I don't agree, i think his E provides a ton of utility and makes trading in lane so easy. It's almost impossible to miss with auto e auto knocking off 2 stacks of blight. Hail of arrows actually got nerfed because it was too dominant and the damage from hail of arrows was transferred to piercing arrows.
Hayaishi1 votesThat's just too generic.
Just curious, do you actually play Varus?
He's one of the two marksmen I can actually enjoy playing (the other being Draven). And Varus' playstyle, as it is, feels fine and enjoyable to me. My only problem with Varus is that his passive feels entirely ineffective. It only activates after you kill an enemy, and it's a pathetically small AS buff.
Compare his passive to Ardent Censer; when Varus kills a non-champion enemy unit, he gains +20% AS for 3 seconds. A base of 0.658 means that he gains about +0.132 AS for 3 seconds (over 3 seconds, he deals 0.395 more attacks). If he kills/assists on killing a champion, he gains +40% AS for 6 seconds, or about +0.263 AS (over 6 seconds, he deals an extra 1.579 attacks).
Ardent Censer, when you shield/heal an ally, grants your target +25% AS for 6 seconds. For Varus, that comes out to 0.1645 (+0.987 attacks over 6 seconds).
Varus' AS gain, again, only happens after he kills a unit. After he has already done what bonus AS would make easier to do.
The reason I suggest something so generic is because Varus doesn't need more. People who think Varus needs more than simply swapping his W and passive are usually obsessed with the fact that he doesn't have the innate mobility that some other marksmen have, or go on about how he hasn't had his popularity skyrocket like other picks. But I'm curious; why is a generic Varus change not good enough, in your opinion?
I have more Varus games than anyone you know probably, that much.
His passive could give way more AS, he acually has more problems than just his passive. But Living Vengenace is an horrible passive in today's game its meant to make Varus snowball and it doesnt come close to doing that. Not like Riot cares anyways notice how they ignore every Varus thread ever made
Because it simply feels a rehused mechanic, Tristana, MF Draven all have that it feels horrible.
Proccing blight could easily be turned into an AS steroid it would fit his playstyle better than the generic "press button for steroid"
JustMyBassCannon1 votesI have more Varus games than anyone you know probably, that much.
Like I said, simply curious...although, I did ask it in a way that can be taken pretty negatively. But I will take your word for it, and believe you have more Varus experience (considering that my preferred playstyle is mage, half the time because one of my queuing buddies always takes marksman).
His passive could give way more AS, he actually has more problems than just his passive. But Living Vengenace is an horrible passive in today's game its meant to make Varus snowball and it doesn't come close to doing that. Not like Riot cares anyways notice how they ignore every Varus thread ever made
Well, I wouldn't say they blatantly ignore Varus threads. They have a lot of priorities much higher than his only-slightly-needing-refinement kit. The pre-season changes (and the few champions that break them), the top 10 "next to be reworked" champions, balance overall across...what, 4 maps? Plus new content, bonus game modes...
I'd say they're keeping up a lot better than a lot of game companies whose F2P games I've played.
Because it simply feels a rehused mechanic, Tristana, MF Draven all have that it feels horrible.
Proccing blight could easily be turned into an AS steroid it would fit his playstyle better than the generic "press button for steroid"
That's...actually an awesome idea. Blight stacks granting an AS steroid would ramp up his damage output during a fight instead of afterwards, and it would feel good.
I'm going to remember that one.
Hullabaloo9072 votesThis is a cool idea, but im not sure if i agree with buffing varus beyond giving him a bit more ms and mana regen. If i did think he needed a buff, this would be a good one. Would make that passive a lot more satisfying.
TheFallenShaw1 votesLife steal... Varus..... So if someone blinks on you and kills u in 1 second how does the Life-steal help?
MattAkhavan2 votesSo if someone blinks on you and kills u in 1 second how does any of these help?
I give this suggestion because varus's passive gives you a 40% attack speed steroid when you kill a champion. you want the extra life steal so when you are attacking 40% faster you are also healing 40% faster. It makes you harder to kill if you have life steal , and allows you to snowball a kill into multiple kills which is already what his passive is trying to do.