Boards›Gameplay

Why does everyone assume that someone who would prefer to surrender is toxic?

CharQueen··2 votes·1,808 views

Seriously. Why?

I am an unranked Lv.21. I recently just played a match [ data: http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1492301382/218789089 ] that I wanted to surrender 23 minutes in. Our kill ratio compared to the other team was something like 1:8. At this time, I was in bot with another ADC ( Quinn ) against a very well built Leona and a Twitch who was able to easily poke both of us out. None of the lanes were doing well and Hecarim had this passive 'better than you' attitude. Anyway, I ask the team about surrendering and I get a positive response from one team member who was either Hecarim or Fiddlesticks. Probably Fiddlesticks. The vote is cancelled 3/2 and I am somewhat annoyed by it. I decide to just let it pass by and simply try my best. Not worth causing an argument about, right? As the game ends and we are at the stats screen, everyone on my team targets me. Specifically Fiddlesticks and Hecarim. They claim that I threw the game because I suggested that we surrender. While I realize that I did terrible that match, there is absolutely no way that our loss was only contributable to me. So there I was. Being marked as toxic and most likely falsely reported for a negative attitude or something all because I wanted to surrender.

There were a lot of really bad plays going on in this match, and the enemy team were far more skilled than we were. However, instead of our team choosing to reflect on what went wrong, I get marked as the scapegoat so no one has to take responsibility and that gets forced on me. I have never once threw a game. I try and attempt new things or strategies and hopefully try to involve my team, but in one way or another, things don't work out. I'm really irritated at this mindset that so many players have on League. Just because someone wants to surrender a match 23 minutes in so that they can move on to a hopefully more fun match, that doesn't mean that they are throwing the game. I get it if you don't want to surrender because you think your team has a chance. However, if you don't surrender and you don't help your team with chat and teamwork and positivity, it is not my fault. I'm tired of taking the blame for something I didn't do. I'm tired of getting stepped on by players who are more skilled than me.

Thanks for reading. I doubt I'll see much out of this post except some venting and possibly some negative feedback but...I'll be Ahrit regardless of the MissFortune to come.

36 Comments

Hoi Im Temmo3 votes

Your team was just mad and looking for a scapegoat - sorry man. Keep trying.

Sunfield2 votes

As there are always two sides of the story Im not going to judge anyone here. I just want to say that evfrerything depends on you attitude and expression. Wanting to surrender early is perfectly fine (although most of the time those games are fully winnable and you cant judge your teams performance based on kills alone), but what really matters is how you approach it.

Honestly, starting a vote suffices. You dont need to comment on how this game is over or how pointless it is to keep trying - life might prove you wrong many times. Just vote yes in silence and wait for the result. When people are frustrated, they get defensive. Same applies for many different situations. Just in general, when you lose, dont let your frustration out on your keyboard.

Not calling you a rager, not judging, just food for thought.

CharQueen1 votes

It's good food for thought, but I have only played one match where not surrendering proved fruitful. As I get closer to Lv.30, I will try much harder to improve my end-game and become more of a team leader. Right now? I'm still learning playstyles and the like as well as strategies and juggling team management.

My writing must be rather strong here. I'm not that upset. I meant to simply post an issue that I'm finding all too frequent in this community.

Anarchomagus2 votes

trying to discourage or demotivate your team to push a surrender is a perfectly legitimate tactic, i mean, as long as you're not totally awful about it. in situations where victory is looking more or less impossible i like to remind my team about tower differences, kill disparity, buff losses, etc. because lets be honest tryharding is great but sometimes plowing on into a certain loss is masochistic and teammates need to be mindfucked into giving up.

that being said, and you might learn this as you climb levels and eventually hit up ranked: say it with me. "every team needs a scapegoat." you see at the end of the match everybody who contributed to the loss in various ways is looking for absolutely anything to make themselves feel like they are not responsible. so if someone else points the finger at someone (you in this case), its super duper easy for everyone to jump on the bandwagon and just blame that guy for everything. this is par for the course when you lose badly and/or are paired with a bunch of ragers.

don't let it get you down, but keep in mind that sometimes, juuuust sometimes, it really is your fault the team lost (maybe not this time). take it gracefully and try to learn from it.

edit: another good trick for subtly making your team surrender is to wait until as many people are dead as possible, because thats when everyone is going to feel most like quitting. no negativity required

CharQueen1 votes

Thank you for providing a comment that wasn't pointed and actually had the simple message that the world is wicked. Pure truth and honest will always be admired.

Angry Monster1 votes

Do not take the advice for trying to get a vote passed. This will get you in trouble and is the worse advice you can get. Its a short step from this to being considered toxic by the system.

CharQueen1 votes

Unless you have better advice to give, no.

Linna Excel2 votes

Some people who try to surrender are toxic. Some aren't. It's the ones who are toxic who stick out the most and from my experience if someone is being toxic, the team is more likely to give up just to get away from him.

Tanerian2 votes

Have no problem with people who try to surrender. Put up the vote. However, if the vote doesn't pass, continue playing your best, and stop f'ing whining about it.

The problem with a lot of people who try to surrender, is after it fails, they then spam surrender every chance they get, while crying "JUST FF WE CAN'T WIN" non stop throughout the game. They then normally just afk farm, and if they die say stuff like "Doesn't matter it's a loss anyways".

This is when they become toxic. No one is reporting a guy just for typing /ff a few times. But it generally does not stop there.

Omnipherious1 votes

If you got reported for doing nothing wrong, nobody is going to vote to punish you. Seriously, shit doesn't work that way. The team was salty at you? Big deal, some people get salty at the simplest stuff. Don't let it bother you. Wanting to surrender when you are behind isn't uncommon and when it failed you said you tried, so no shame. The team decided to blame you for whatever reason, justified or not, it doesn't matter now.

The best advice I have for you is, if you are frustrated from a previous game do not jump into another. Stop right there and do something else. If you really want to play league, go play a coop, go aram, go watch a featured game. You don't sound like you deal with tilt well so do yourself a favour and keep away from more frustration.

CharQueen1 votes

You've got the wrong impression. I'm not overly upset about this at all. I'm simply bothered by it as this issue has come up multiple times.

Angry Monster1 votes

Welcome to competitive gaming? I mean really what do you expect? I am actually looking forward to answer, this is not a troll.

This game is not for fun. I HATE THAT PEOPLE KEEP SAYING THAT WORD. Fun is a byproduct not a reason to play. Games are by nature comptive.

This is a competitive game where actions matter and is a test of skills that you devlop over time.

So here is the meaning of the word fun

someone or something that is amusing or enjoyable : an enjoyable experience or person

: an enjoyable or amusing time

: the feeling of being amused or entertained

here is game : a physical or mental activity or contest that has rules and that people do for pleasure

: a particular occurrence of a game

: one of the games that are part of a larger contest (such as a tennis match).

Pleasure does not equal fun.

I am not saying you can not have fun. But if you are looking for only fun play a single player game. Your goals is not shared by others.

CharQueen2 votes

I'm playing unranked matches. Take your competitive edge to the ranks and quit ruining the FUN that the casuals have.

I may or may not be casual...I don't care.

Angry Monster1 votes

man you are ignorant.

You are sub 30 everyone you are playing with can not play ranked.

Also people use non ranked games to practice new champs. This is not going to the game for you. Scrub. You should read on riots post about mastery

CharQueen1 votes

And you should read a guide about etiquette :P

Angry Monster1 votes

calling people out on the truth is within guidelines.

CharQueen2 votes

Uh huh. Ahrit then.

XXnIE66Rui2 votes

Section 3 of the Summoner's Code. You should read it.

XXnIE66Rui3 votes

Pleasure does not equal fun? According to your own definition, fun means an enjoyable experience. You don't actually take any enjoyment from pleasure? That's... unusual.

Angry Monster2 votes

Sigh you fail at twisting words.

Fun does not translate in to pleasure. Nor does pleasure translate to the other. They may or may not have anything to do with the same activity. Being with family can bring pleasure but that does not mean it is always fun.

People that are competitive get pleasure from the rush of stress and applying them selves. While this can be enjoyable does not mean it was fun.

This fun concept is really a modern thing. It is the evolution of people not understanding English and just using simple words to express their feelings. Which is funny most people on these forums are grammar sticklers. Yet when you point out they are not even using words correctly they just say its the modern meaning.

XXnIE66Rui3 votes

I'm not twisting words. It's right there in your definition of fun: an enjoyable experience, an enjoyable time. You're the one saying that, not me. You're also saying the pleasure from the rush of stress can be enjoyable. If fun is an enjoyable experience or an enjoyable time, then that means an enjoyable experience is fun, period. If it can be enjoyable, it can be fun.

And since we're tossing dictionary definitions around, here's one for pleasure:

the state or feeling of being pleased. 2. enjoyment or satisfaction derived from what is to one's liking; gratification; delight. 3. worldly or frivolous enjoyment: the pursuit of pleasure. 4. recreation or amusement; diversion; enjoyment: Are you traveling on business or for pleasure? 5. sensual gratification.

That's 3 out of 5 definitions of pleasure involving enjoyment. Seems to me like pleasure is enjoyable. Therefore, fun. By your own definition of fun.

Also, if this concept of fun you speak of is modern, then why does the current usage of the word 'fun' date back to 1727? Unless you mean 'modern' as in 'modern history' as in 'from the 16th century onwards', in which case, carry on.

If you're going to say people aren't using words correctly, you should check your own usage of words first.

Seriphym3 votes

Their goal is shared by others.

I am not saying the minority or the majority but honestly there are others who play simply for enjoyment, fun and entertainment.

Solitaire is a game that is played for entertainment,

Now I am sure there are some people who play it competitively but it was meant as entertainment for a single person.

Who are you playing against?

You call the OP ignorant yet you lack the enlightenment to see that your playstyle is not the only playstyle in LoL.

Your "opinion", like everyone else in the world, has some basis in fact but is not in and of itself fact.

Almost every game can be played for "fun, pleasure, entertainment, enjoyment, or competitively; or many of those at the same time. You only truly know why YOU play them and not exactly why others play them.

Just like sex, some find it "fun" others find it pleasurable, and even others do it only in competition against someone. Who are you to try and define anyone's reasoning but your own?

No one that is who.

Angry Monster2 votes

go read on what riot said on mastery and league.

They also said they did not make league for the casuals. It was something that you are supposed to work on and master. This why bronze and silver players should never be allowed to comment on balance changes.

You think fun is doing anything you want. Well doing what you want is not what 4 others signed up for. They signed up to achieve victory. That is the goal of the game. This is a lot like basket ball. You play to win or whats the point? If you are just looking to have a good time you stand around take turns throwing the ball and talk.

When games have rules and goals the game is about going for said goals.

So when you did not win you did not have fun? To bad cause fun is not the main part of the game. The OP is crying cause he was not having fun cause he was losing. This shows that if fun was a major part of the game losing would also be fun. But guess what lossing is never meant to be fun. Why? Cause its not the goal of a game. Some game (l4d) actually are played on the idea its ok to lose and still have a good time. League is not one of those games.

Seriphym2 votes

I have lost several games that I had alot of fun in. True the majority of my losses were not fun for me or the other players on my team.

However those losses that I did find fun were the ones where both teams were closely matched and the play was good.

But I digress.

Ranked is meant to be competitive but as you go down in the modes the focus become less and less on competition and more on enjoyment. Of course that is only My opinion on the matter.

I do not see how you can say playing is competitive only though.

You compete to win (correct me if I am wrong in this but from your posting that is what I have determined as obvious) yet wining brings you pleasure and enjoyment from that pleasure am I wrong?

So in a much longer path you also play to receive "enjoyment" from the game.

Or are you playing with the intention of making this a career where you can support your other forms of enjoyment by the cash rewards from being the best at this?

XXnIE66Rui2 votes

That's... not at all what Riot said in their mastery post. What Riot actually said was that they feel the main reason why people play League is to improve at it, whether trying to be the best ever or just learning how to last hit. You know, pursue mastery their own way.

There are no rules in League that say people need to play the way you're implying. There are rules in League about teamwork, about not ruining other people's enjoyment of the game, about being civil.

And no, Riot never said it's not for casuals when 'casual' is 'someone who plays the game for fun with friends'. Now you're just making things up. (And if you're not, source it.)

Your opinion doesn't represent Riot's in any way, shape or form. All it represents is you.

Angry Monster2 votes

Sure theirs not.... keep telling your self that.

XXnIE66Rui1 votes

If that's the best you can think up when people keep rebuffing you with logic and actual things that have been said, then there's really no point to discussing it at all.

Angry Monster1 votes

You have not even come close to logic.

They said league is about mastery not that they think players think that. When you take things out of context their is nothing to talk about. Riot has consistently said league is not for the casual gamer but people who want to/ willing work to be better.

There is a reason the only free skins in the game come from working towards a goal in ranked.

You can play this game just to play with your friends. That is fine. Cause those 4 others know what they are getting into with you. That is not casual that is just not serious.

Casual means to not take great interest or spend alot of time playing. If you are not willing to play a few times a week and actively learn this is not the game for you cause you are casual. You twisted what casual means and this is the reason i am not bothering with you.

you are twisting the game meaning. You are a level 20 account. How can you have any informed bases to actually hold a conversation with? you can not even play ranked. How can you have meaningful interpretations when their is no way a level 22 can grasp everything in this game? unless you are a banned user remaking their account, then i don't want to talk with you anyways. Either way i do not value your input as starter account for league.

XXnIE66Rui1 votes

This account is abandoned. My main account is on another server that doesn't have access to these forums.

Angry Monster1 votes

BS, These boards are global.

XXnIE66Rui1 votes

No, they are not. They're available to NA, EUW, EUNE and OCE. Check under the League of Legends logo on the top left.

DadimPregnant1 votes

Why do people assume that Riot actually cares about "reports"... you can still only report after a game has ended, and we all know that 99% of toxicity and "this is pointless" begins pre-game in champ select.

they still punish you for leaving a game with a toxic player in it, not the other way around. bottom line is they really dont care.. your report wont land you in any trouble.. they really dont do any community cleanup at all. so dont worry about it and try again man

CharQueen1 votes

Did you even read the post? My issue here isn't with reports.

ChaosThief1 votes

It means that they have a negative attitude most of the time, which can be toxic.

"We lose, don't fight this."

"Kill our nexus already."

etc.

It happens here and there but not always. This is a reportable offence by the way.

CharQueen1 votes

I say that we either all buckle up and hull or abandon ship. I'll even ask for the other members to put their own input into the game so that we can communicate and work harder to winning. That doesn't end up happening since most players are completely mute for whatever reason.

Another thing that bothers me: When we are able to make a comeback and the rest of my team decides to target me for suggesting that we surrender. That is the same negativity as 'we lose' 'ff' 'bg' 'scrubs'. However, because we won, no one feels prone to report that guy for bad mouthing me. Which then turns into them jumping on the bandwagon and then reporting me. Shrug.

I've decided to always stay positive and look forward to the next battle to come while giving the current all that I've got.

ChaosThief1 votes

That's a great mindset to have. If you're doing well enough, you can convince your team that there still is a chance. However, don't just surrender out of nowhere, if they are stomping and everyone can see that, then surrender is a good choice as it may end the match.

Sometimes being stomped, though, isn't all bad, as you can have some people who understand that it isn't fun and they in turn make it a little brighter.

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by CharQueen

When I call you over, you come
Gameplay59 comments
72
votes
Best Thresh Skin Design
Concepts & Creations11 comments
20
votes
Share Your BEST League Pun
[ARCHIVED] Miscellaneous27 comments
8
votes
Dear 'Mentors' / 'Tutors'
Tips & Tricks13 comments
4
votes
Stop playing Teemo Support
Gameplay11 comments
3
votes
Chomas sure are popular
Memes & Games11 comments
3
votes