If you think that Zed, Rengar, Draven, or any other champ is over power, let’s look at Zoe. Zoe’s E is completely broken. When the skill shot does not land, there’s a hug circle that will hit you. Also, her Q is overpowered. Can completely one shot you without any effort. Her W is completely broken. Give it a longer cool down. Please comment your opinions and make the league community better. Thanks you.
Ragnaveil5 votesThe Q can only one shot if she lands that E on you. Its a difficult skillshot to land without it.
Hibeki18 votesNo its not, high projectile speed and if you miss one, boo hoo shoot another in 3 seconds.
Ragnaveil2 votesIm just saying she cant use one q to one shot without the E, I wasn't talking about the cd, although her cds are the big issue.
Daedric Etwahl9 votesIf youre squishy and get hit by Zoe Q she eats up a gigantic part of your health bar. Thats without her E. With the E youre just straight up gone.
It's not that easy to see the Q projectile.coming either. I can see Zoe's animation sending it back, but the.projectile is not very noticeable for how brutal it hurts.
Ragnaveil2 votesYeah, and honestly all I can say is wait for riot to address it.
ImPhinite1 votesRiot won't realize it until everybody is whining about it.
Noblewind1 votesIt's more difficult to learn playing against her than other champs I feel. For facing her it's less about dodging the actual skill shot and more about dodging her positioning because it's clear to see the first cast of Q and second cast has to be made close to her location. Meanwhile the Zoe player has a lot of agency as to what she can do at any one time, so it's a long learning curve for the opponent, and it's going to feel like crap playing against her (like Yasuo or Lee Sin)
Dope Solo5 votesIf Zoe needs nerfed, you'll have to tell Riot she needs buffs because it seems like they end up doing the exact opposite of what the playerbase wants.
quasistellar1 votesUnfortunately you’re wrong there. They’re listening to the slobbering masses and nerfing Ezreal q damage scaling while not touching the Klepto interaction. He’ll still be broken, and when they finally fix Klepto, he’ll be back to unplayable—even in the jungle, since the q buff is what allowed even that.
Brain Errör 4044 votesFunny you should mention any of them... it's fine for them to one shot, but not fine for Zoe to one shot? High class hypocrisy right here.
Dope Solo5 votesIts not hypocritical to say Zed needs nerfs.
Troll for Trump3 votesShe's a glass cannon. Oneshot or nothing. Get rid of that, and she's useless. She needs E to land her oneshot ability or have some form of reliable self-peel.
It's probably an inherent flaw with the champ, but still too early to make decisions.
She has a really low winrate, but that could be because she's new, and because she has high playrate
lookbehind691 votesya, buuut. who wants to lose to rng or get "out-skilled" by a e that comes from over a wall in the fog of war with tons of buffs. her e should be her ult on a 10 second cool down because it is so over powered. plus getting stuneed from something you could not hope to see and then getting one shot by a max ranged q makes me want to throw my computer out a fucking window. on top of that her w is pure rng, hello let me just randomly get teleport and teleport bot and one shot you from base or let me just double flash and e you for a easy kill. simply put she is on my insta ban list, her main counter is an assassin like zed but good assassins are rare and for all of us that jungle adc support or top lnae, zoe is a cancerous rng nightmare
Troll for Trump1 votesRNG is bullshit.
E can be countered by wards pretty easily. Zoe as a whole is countered by wards.
Her Q does basically all the dmg. It's not exactly pleasant to have so much damage jammed into one ability rather than spreading it out, though.
Good assassins being rare is a player skill issue. Jg has the easiest time with Zoe due to how many divers and assassins are among them right now.
She's supposed to kill ADCs, supps, and squishies easily, that's her niche.
She hurts immobile top laners hella hard, but won't kill you unless you have no MR and are being extremely cocky. The problem with top lane isn't really with Zoe, as much as how useless it is as a lane overall
soccerdogboy1 votesBut shes also doing half a tanks health with one combo. Unless the tank goes full mr, she melts everyone on a 3 second cd
Troll for Trump1 votesEvery mage can melt tanks with a combo. Zoe gets more of her "comboes" but it's not really that much more than a mages full combo. Just more frequent.
Her E does not have a 3 s cd.
The way she's designed though makes her combo too spammy for how much it does
TitanAnteus3 votesI just want you to know that at level 6 if lux catches you in her Q, she will kill you.
Lux q hits two targets too.
Her ult cooldown can be as low as 30 seconds.
Lux... the most basic ass mid laner in the game.
If we're talking strictly pre6, then Xerath and Talon would like a word.
Whiskoo6 votesYes if lux catches you with a q you will take a lot of damage.
The difference between lux and zoe is that fact that lux has to actually make a decision if she wants to use her e for waveclear, save it for poke or for the one shot. Lux has to debate her decisions based on cooldown.
Zoe on the other hand has little to no cooldowns, and we will very soon see the same exact problem that taliyah had when she was released. Spammable, low mana cost, low cooldown, aoe abilities that clear waves starting from level 1 breaks the game because of how much stupid pressure it creates. Taliyah could q the level 1 wave and shove in, get vision in the enemy jg, and control the game from there. There is little difference from this problem as there is with zoe right now.
It's not because the damage, the damage is absurd but its not why she needs fixing immediately before it goes ANYWHERE near the competitive scene. The fact that zoe, compared to lux, has to make little to no decision making based on her cooldowns is ridiculous. She takes little skill compared to other mages because she can spam q, spam e, pick up ws, spam rs whenever she wants and theres no way to punish her because she'll q you again in 1.5 seconds. She'll shoot another e in 3 seconds. She'll r again in 4 seconds. Oh look she picked up glp or protobelt, welp I guess she just shoves me in and harrasses my jungler and theres nothing I can do about it.
Her waveclear needs to be addressed, and her cooldowns need to be addressed.
TitanAnteus1 votesI do agree that Zoe's cooldown on E is much much too low.
xDogMeatx1 votesincrease mana costs and cooldowns and it will be k maybe tweak the ap ratios to base damage more to balance it out
Midlane Vibes1 voteslow cooldown stun that oneshots you if it hits every 4 second and comes from screens away
Warlord Rhinark1 votes[{quoted}](name=Rito Thot Slayer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qx9vFoOA,comment-id=00080001,timestamp=2018-07-15T14:51:41.157+0000)
low cooldown stun that oneshots you if it hits every 4 second and comes from screens away
Oi mate.
Don't necro 8 month old threads.
That's against the (Updated) Boards Universal Rules under "Spamming & Trolling".
Nausicäa 2 votesMeanwhile an adc Right clicks me for my entire health bar in 1-2 seconds. But Zoe requires no effort right?
soccerdogboy2 votesadc cant one shot you from 2 screens away in fog
Kitten of Evil2 votesHer Q is fine, IMO. It's comparable to a Nid Q in damage, which I guess is fair if you don't dodge the skillshot. Her W is way too RNG-reliant (which is a balance fail but doesn't break her since it can easily give her something useless). But her E is absolutely overloaded to hell.
It's got:
Baltharaaz1 votesActually, that second bit of damage is conditional: the true damage portion doubles the damage of the next attack, post mitigation, up to the cap of the bubble's damage itself. The reason this is true damage is to prevent MR double dipping; if this was plain magic damage instead, MR would reduce the damage of the trigger spell, lowering the damage that could be doubled, and then further reduce the capped doubled wake up damage. Anyone can trigger this damage, and stats/credit for that damage is given to the triggerer.
So the only way Zoe is going to completely trigger the true damage is with her passive and a 
, or a Paddle Star. Mind you, I don't believe there's any difficulty to land spells on the Slept target, but her Q can only travel, what, 800 units away from her upon recast? (By this I mean that you can throw it wherever and recast, but when it gets 800 units away from Zoe in any direction, it fizzles out). Against another burst mage or even assassin (I'm looking at you, 
), 1 second is actually enough to kill her (I had a particularly amusing instance of such a punishment with Q R on 
recently). Her mobility is basically artificial, unless Spell Thief picks up some juicy stuff and is maxed for the 70% movement speed, but it's nearly always maxed last. Maybe gating minion spell pickups behind levels of Spell Thief will change that, but we won't see many changes for now.
I do agree her E is overloaded. You can keep the spell mostly the same I feel, just heavily amp up the base CD, making her rely on the partial CD refund to maintain a remotely decent uptime on the spell.
UpDownLeftRightAB1 votesQ only lasts 1 second. It doesn't fizzle out after 800 units, only 1 second at max range from initial cast location, else it wouldn't have scaling damage till 2500 units.
Kitten of Evil1 votesWell yes, the second bit of E damage is conditional, but that condition is very often going to be met, since her Q has a short cooldown and in a teamfight or siege, any ally can proc it (and they have 2 seconds to decide how to maximize that output). And even though it gives the true damage credit to the triggering ally, that damage boost comes from Zoe's E itself so I would consider it to be part of E's damage.
You can keep the spell mostly the same I feel, just heavily amp up the base CD, making her rely on the partial CD refund to maintain a remotely decent uptime on the spell.
That would be fine with me, but I'm also not sure why she is rewarded for landing a hard CC on an enemy champion in the first place. Usually disabling an enemy champion is reward enough.
UpDownLeftRightAB1 votesHer passive is also applied to the bubbles initial damage, which it will if she used R or Q before it.
Striga1 votes[{quoted}](name=Kitten of Evil,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qx9vFoOA,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2017-11-30T05:10:29.287+0000)
- It rewards Zoe for landing a hard CC ability on an enemy champion by giving her a CD refund on that same hard CC ability. WHY? WHO KNOWS! Usually landing hard CC on your opponent is reward enough! But not for Zoe! (and the second half isn't guaranteed)!
Thresh hook has that too...same champion designer though, so I guess it's not totally unexpected.
MCpatato2 votesNerf the B**ch pls i hate her she is so op like if you play against a zoe who just have a little bit of skill you lost. she is so anoying
I Love C0CK2 votesi completely agree with you . Riot please nerf zoe she is way too powerful and please reduce the duration of her STUNNN \
wildfox991 votesher iusses: her Q can OS or almost but it is AoE and have 3 sec CD,it's a bit too much her W sumoners spells/items drop rate from minions is too high especially at early rank,i saw some zoe getting 2 gunblade/glp800 per minion wawe (in early game),don't forget her W does damage on its own,it's not only the item itself then the orbs for collecting items/summ last too much,at last if she already have something up let the new ones overwrite the actual (or make them disappear if zoe walks on them with a summoner/item her W) her E will be a reward in any case,long CC,long range (especially with walls),enought fast skillshoot,houge damage (half is true),and even if you miss it dw you just created an half-lane zone where enemy will get CC'ed anyway
Malix Farwin1 votesher iusses: her Q can OS or almost but it is AoE and have 3 sec CD,it's a bit too much her W sumoners spells/items drop rate from minions is too high especially at early rank,i saw some zoe getting 2 gunblade/glp800 per minion wawe (in early game),don't forget her W does damage on its own,it's not only the item itself then the orbs for collecting items/summ last too much,at last if she already have something up let the new ones overwrite the actual (or make them disappear if zoe walks on them with a summoner/item her W) her E will be a reward in any case,long CC,long range (especially with walls),enought fast skillshoot,houge damage (half is true),and even if you miss it dw you just created an half-lane zone where enemy will get CC'ed anyway
Syndra's Q is also AoE, Zoe's Q is the only thing that keeps her from being under her turret the whole game.
Her W is RNG, sometimes you get nothing till lvl 5-6 even when it was the second thing you selected and what you get can be useless(back to back cleanses when you don't need it).
Her E is a part of her combo, if i land my QE combo on syndra at 6+ the target is likely dead and that combo goes through minions with a wider hitbox.
Every thing you are saying is a problem is what makes her kit work. You are not actually saying why they are a problem you are just saying x does this or x is too much. Sounds like you just dont want her to function at all.
UpDownLeftRightAB1 votesDoesn't seem to be weak enough that you won't spam her in queue and think about your choice of character. Zoe > Every other mid. Damage, CC, and enough range to mobility.
SamBunzly1 votesHonestly, I see where you're coming from. Playing against Zoe is kind of a nightmare right now. Not to mention she can completely destroy turrets if left alone to split push... (LichBane, q aa q aa e aa q aa.... I've taken all 3 unguarded inhibs in a row doing that before... took me almost 45 seconds)
But her downsides are as follows.
procosevoglio1 votesSo, after playing against her, I’d say she is somewhat unfair. I picked Ekko so they picked Zoe, went for the hard push lvl 2 thing, so I got my level 2 way before and forced her to play safe. But, as she got her E I couldn’t trade, you try to punish her if she uses Q but since you jump on her it’s a free E hit and the sleep lasts so long that Q comes up, and it’s enough to outtrade me even if I get my W shield, plus, getting random Ignites and Gunblade actives was free damage. I probably was doing something wrong, but i won the game by roaming, that was the only thing I could really do. So.. main Issue are cooldowns and E duration, if you get caught by that and you have no frontline you’ll get a grey screen.
xDogMeatx1 votesthere should be a inherent cool down and maybe a small mana cost for it like a 20 or something for spell thief w so it cant be abused using 1000 flashes/ignites at in one continuous sitting (thats a exaggeration i know but if there are 1000 flashes/ignites in one spot she could do that with 0 cd)
SaturosProx1 votesIf you are hiding behind at least one minion. Zoe isnt going to do basically anything to you
noxus bird1 votesIf you are hiding behind at least one minion. Zoe isnt going to do basically anything to you
but then you can't cs, without taking the risk of being half healthed
2handedporksword1 votesIDC about her Q its the spelsteal nonsense that is absolute BS. The abilities sit around for her to pick up for a super long time and then she gets to hold them for another 20 seconds. how are you supposed to lane against a level 3 Zoe with a gun-blade icon sitting by the minion wave? leave it on the ground for like 3 seconds and make her lose the spell within 3-5 seconds and maybe then she wont just be blatantly op. as an aside there is no reason for her stun to extend through walls, its already a quickcast ability with high projectile speed that leaves can zone if it misses. Either dont extend its range through walls or actually make it a miss when she misses and dont give her a benefit just for casting it.
Crymoricus1 votesIDC about her Q its the spelsteal nonsense that is absolute BS. The abilities sit around for her to pick up for a super long time and then she gets to hold them for another 20 seconds. how are you supposed to lane against a level 3 Zoe with a gun-blade icon sitting by the minion wave? leave it on the ground for like 3 seconds and make her lose the spell within 3-5 seconds and maybe then she wont just be blatantly op. as an aside there is no reason for her stun to extend through walls, its already a quickcast ability with high projectile speed that leaves can zone if it misses. Either dont extend its range through walls or actually make it a miss when she misses and dont give her a benefit just for casting it.
Isn't it sick? Lol, amazing to me that people actually feel a need to defend her "as is." I mean, really now.
FTZ Joker1 voteszoes q should be single target and her es mana cost should be vastly greater make her not so spam happy and not instantly clear waves with 1 q
xDogMeatx1 votesactually i would be happier of it was a aoe not single target kind of like how karthus's q works crit if single if aoe then u lower the damage but zoe has to split the damage between those affected in the aoe in a X percent (X means you fill it in) that would be counterplay in my opinion where teamplay is involved
Malix Farwin1 votesWhat's with these necro posts, she got nerfed twice and is doing so-so overall in just about every category.
woodvsmurph1 votesShe is hit-or-miss; when she gets ahead, she's one of the most oppressive champions - along the lines of kha'zix or, in low elo, master yi, yasuo, etc. But if she has a calm farming laning phase or falls behind, she's pretty worthless. Also, her damage to tanks in such a case is less threatening than many other ap mages. Thus, I'd say she is probably close to her proper power level, but just one of those solo queue nightmare champs like kha, yi, 1k stack nasus etc. depending on your elo.
That being said, I would suggest maybe doing one of 2 things to rebalance that power into a less oppressive kit. 1. This option would see zoe's damage distributed more throughout her whole kit rather than have it center almost exclusively around her ult+q combo. 2. This option would see zoe's q damage reduced for landing a SINGLE q on a target within a given amount of time. However, since her primary damage would still be exclusively her q or ult+q, repeated q's landed on a target within a short duration would amplify the damage of the next q by a certain amount - giving her back her current q damage or more if say she landed 3 q's in a row on a target. Missing a q would reset this, but hitting the champ with the splash/aoe of q would continue stacking the damage; capped out at say... 3 stacks. I actually really like the latter idea because it rewards great zoe players with the potential for more damage (even if they're not fed; if they are, the opponent will die before they get to 3 stack amplification anyways) while reducing the burst a fed zoe could do to a carry with a single q landing. Thus it give more damage potential, but also some degree of counterplay. Furthermore, it makes zoe more threatening to tanks even if they have lots of mr compared to feeling like a lux if she's not fed - unable to meaningfully damage tanks while being unable to ignore them and kill the carries behind them. Stacking q damage to amplify the damage of each q would help negate that type of thing for zoe if she were behind or merely even.
That's just my 2 cents though; I don't main mid. I've seen how she can be abused early by champs that can shove her in and get nice chunk damage on her and/or roam and punish other lanes while zoe tries to push back out. This obviously changes once she gets one or two items and can 1-shot half a wave. She can get punished hard for using her ult if you cc her and/or abuse her like leblanc - target the place she will return to when she ults forwards to hit you; you are almost guaranteed to land damage on her then.
Little Bad Boy1 votesDEFINITELY her q and E are so overpowered it kills you almost instantly. if Riot doesn't nerf her more people would become Toxic and start hating Riot. So please do us a favor AND NERF ZOE
Natedog19581 votesshe has been banned or picked in almost every LCS game so far it is a sign that she is broken
Bans: 38 Picks: 6 Presence: 97.8%
karolh20061 votesriot nerf zoe pls
ZzRaptaHzZ1 votesNerf this champ pls
