Ashe with the new IE changes

Lissoul·May 2, 2018·1 votes·2,220 views

With the new AD itemization changes coming out all adc's who get two zeal items will end up with 120% crit changes, game caps at 100 however, not a big deal no one benefits from having over 100%. WRONG. Ashe does and currently on the pbe she does not get any extra damage on her passive for being over 100%. Since she is now having to choose between CDR or a Crit build it will really push Ashe into being able to build into a hyper carry or a utility adc with a lower ult CD. Near endgame you could have an extra 180% crit dmg with 3 zeal items and an IE if they uncap the current critical strike chance.

10 Comments

TransferToKoreaMay 6, 20181 votes

wont new IE be trash on Ashe?

Automated RivenMay 6, 20181 votes

It will be good. She will still go IE into double zeal for 100% crit.

AzadetheMay 6, 20181 votes

The biggest scary thing about the new itemization is that you now only need 2 Crit items, instead of 3. Now, adcs are going to have 3 AD pumping items and average around 350 AD, where they used to get 3 Zeal items and 2 AD items.

In other words, a lot of adcs will just get item 3094 item 3087 , and build item 3072 item 3036 item 3031 , where they used to either choose OR , and pick up item 3046

It wouldn't surprise me if Twitch begins building both item 3072 item 3153 , instead of just , and result in an almost unkillable rat.

Then ofc there's Overheal, and champs like Yasuo Kaisa who have onboard shields which act in conjunction with item 3072 , allowing 3 shields to rotate precedence so the champ never really takes much damage, because while a subject is taking their BT's Shield, they are charging their own shield and Overheal shield, and by the time those shields are gone, BT's creating a new layer of shield on top of them.....

Not including other shields, ofc.

Automated RivenMay 6, 20181 votes

The upside is that true damage does not recieved lifesteal. So lifesteal gains are effectively cut by 20%

VoraciousXMay 6, 20181 votes

{quoted}

The biggest scary thing about the new itemization is that you now only need 2 Crit items, instead of 3. Now, adcs are going to have 3 AD pumping items and average around 350 AD, where they used to get 3 Zeal items and 2 AD items.

In other words, a lot of adcs will just get , and build , where they used to either choose OR , and pick up

It wouldn't surprise me if begins building both , instead of just , and result in an almost unkillable rat.

Then ofc there's Overheal, and champs like who have onboard shields which act in conjunction with , allowing 3 shields to rotate precedence so the champ never really takes much damage, because while a subject is taking their BT's Shield, they are charging their own shield and Overheal shield, and by the time those shields are gone, BT's creating a new layer of shield on top of them.....

Not including other shields, ofc.

As far as I can remember most ADCs only build 80% crit. That'd be shiv/rfc/pd, one of whichever they didn't choose, and IE. They wouldn't build all 3 usually because they want bloodthirster, lord dominiks/mortal reminder, and GA. Of course now they get 100% crit out of 2 items, as opposed to 3, but they pretty much always crit with 80% anyways and like Automated Riven said, they're gonna get less lifesteal, and lose out on the +50% increase in damage(although they'll still gain some of that back with it being true damage).

AzadetheMay 7, 20181 votes

That depended on the champ, matchup.

P.S. It's not like we don't have an excess of Life steal as it is..... considering access to:

-Legend: Bloodline -Fleet Footwork (which still has the same heal ratios, just more restrictions on how it procs..... diminished to Minions..... they're changing nothing to that..... only the move speed. - item 3812 calculates from all damage types. -Domination Taste of Blood/Ravenous Hunter on skill based adcs

POSSIBLY Grasp of the Undying/Second Wind/Revitalize (Can secondary Resolve and take Second Wind and Revitalize; I use Grasp vs Mage lanes)

Life steal after all, was and is the most serious problem with some ADCS.

Draven Jinx Twitch all became situationally unstoppable with life steal.

Draven 's per hit damage is so large 1 hit often replenishes 1/3 of his HP bar, and catching axes charges up his Fleet footwork.

Jinx with any more than 1-2 early game kills = when she gets excited, she both dominates chases, and heals up so fast she can 1v5 a team.

Twitch Heals enough through a good ult to get beyond the Penta, because every attack hits every single champ in range.

Other situationally OP heals:

Caitlyn Kalista

VoraciousXMay 7, 20181 votes

{quoted}

That depended on the champ, matchup.

P.S. It's not like we don't have an excess of Life steal as it is..... considering access to:

-Legend: Bloodline -Fleet Footwork (which still has the same heal ratios, just more restrictions on how it procs..... diminished to Minions..... they're changing nothing to that..... only the move speed. - calculates from all damage types. -Domination Taste of Blood/Ravenous Hunter on skill based adcs

POSSIBLY Grasp of the Undying/Second Wind/Revitalize (Can secondary Resolve and take Second Wind and Revitalize; I use Grasp vs Mage lanes)

Life steal after all, was and is the most serious problem with some ADCS.

all became situationally unstoppable with life steal.

's per hit damage is so large 1 hit often replenishes 1/3 of his HP bar, and catching axes charges up his Fleet footwork.

with any more than 1-2 early game kills = when she gets excited, she both dominates chases, and heals up so fast she can 1v5 a team.

Heals enough through a good ult to get beyond the Penta, because every attack hits every single champ in range.

Other situationally OP heals:

I don't know any ADC that takes Bloodline honestly. Alacrity is better. Even Jhin picks up Alacrity over Bloodline on most occasions(more attack speed = more damage for him).

Death's Dance only counts from physical damage, dunno where you got that. Gunblade counts from all damage sources, and it's not a common item for most champions.

Lucian's taking PTA with Sorcery, Ezreal's taking Klepto with Sorcery, MF is taking Conqueror with Sorcery(Interesting on the Conqueror thing). No ADC is taking Ravenous Hunter/Taste of Blood. Fleet Footwork is powerful from it's movement speed over it's healing honestly.

Out of all your talks of lifesteal, Death's Dance is probably the worst offender, and I don't think ADCs should be able to use it anyways. IMO it's literally a better Bloodthirster.

AzadetheMay 7, 20181 votes

Bloodline I do take. Alacrity's not always needed Sometimes sustain wins the exchange, not more auto attacks. Really depends on the adc.

I didn't discuss other adcs, and the ones you mentioned show obvious signs that the majority of players are playing them wrong.

For example, there's nothing wrong with Lucian's kit, yet his "Favorite" runes are pulling a 49% win rate. Ezreal's also sub 50% win with his vastly favorite runes. Perhaps there's a better tree than Inspiration (Klepto has been substantially nerfed, and in many cases, Triumph probably will earn him more gold.)

Why is a champ with a plus 30%+ pick rate pulling a 49% or less win rate with his favorite runes?

MF is taking Comet, not Conquerer. Conquerer is the #2 pick, and:

Fleet Footwork, Dark Harvest, and Press the Attack are all pulling higher win rates than BOTH of them. Bloodline is actually MF's highest win rate secondary Precision rune, pushing 53.4% win rate vs Alacrity's 51.23% win rate. (Domination is actually MF's highest win rate Primary Tree).

And no. FF is strong because the heal is about 350-400. The attack speed was never changed. It was the heal change that got people taking it. FF is why people don't build life steal.

Death's Dance heals SKILLS btw, where Life steal does not. That's why it's taken on Kaisa . There are a ton of adcs who would self heal more if they took it, than if they went pure Life steal: Caitlyn Ashe Graves Ezreal Jhin Jayce Lucian Sivir Xayah

All do a ton of non crit damage with skill based abilities, outside of crits.

That's why i mentioned it, and what I meant by all damage.

VoraciousXMay 7, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Bloodline I do take. Alacrity's not always needed Sometimes sustain wins the exchange, not more auto attacks. Really depends on the adc.

I didn't discuss other adcs, and the ones you mentioned show obvious signs that the majority of players are playing them wrong.

For example, there's nothing wrong with Lucian's kit, yet his "Favorite" runes are pulling a 49% win rate. Ezreal's also sub 50% win with his vastly favorite runes. Perhaps there's a better tree than Inspiration (Klepto has been substantially nerfed, and in many cases, Triumph probably will earn him more gold.)

Why is a champ with a plus 30%+ pick rate pulling a 49% or less win rate with his favorite runes?

MF is taking Comet, not Conquerer. Conquerer is the #2 pick, and:

Fleet Footwork, Dark Harvest, and Press the Attack are all pulling higher win rates than BOTH of them. Bloodline is actually MF's highest win rate secondary Precision rune, pushing 53.4% win rate vs Alacrity's 51.23% win rate. (Domination is actually MF's highest win rate Primary Tree).

I used OP.GG to find out the information of ADCs using bloodline/alacrity. No one I saw used it, and I went through Caitlyn(standard ADC), Ezreal(caster based adc because you wouldn't think he'd use alacrity), MF(another caster based ADC), Jhin(who could use both to good effect, and Draven(who would benefit from more lifesteal being there are builds where he runs bloodthirster first item). He also is running Conqueror recently, which is interesting. All of these champions might have a higher win rate rune, but the thing is, these runes have been tested far less due to a lower pick rate. Also Comet only has an 11% pick rate on MF compared to a 33% pick rate of Conqueror, with a 22% win rate difference of Comet being more, but Comet has been tested 22 less games out of 100 than Conqueror. So if Comet had been played 22 games more out of 100, it's possible it'd be lower. You have to take pick rates into account, because something might be done once, and be good, but then in different circumstances it could be garbage(I've tested Dark Harvest on MF and while I think it could be a good rune on her, it only works on the first bounce of her Q, even if the first bounce is on minions, which means Dark Harvest provides no synergy with her. It would have been interesting if it did have synergy, but unfortunately it doesn't really. She can use it, but there's no actual synergy with her kit).

And no. FF is strong because the heal is about 350-400. The attack speed was never changed. It was the heal change that got people taking it. FF is why people don't build life steal.

I wasn't talking about attack speed, that was a mis-type. I meant the movement speed. ADCs are given extreme kiting skills with fleet footwork. It's hard to reach someone who can move so much faster after one auto, whether they hit a champion or a minion. It makes them so much more difficult to get to, and that is why Fleet Footwork is better than the other precision runes. The healing is good, but it's not the reason Fleet Footwork outclasses the others.

Death's Dance heals SKILLS btw, where Life steal does not. That's why it's taken on . There are a ton of adcs who would self heal more if they took it, than if they went pure Life steal:

All do a ton of non crit damage with skill based abilities, outside of crits.

That's why i mentioned it, and what I meant by all damage.

I understand, but it doesn't work on ALL damage, which is what you said. I know it heals off skills, if they are PHYSICAL DAMAGE. This means Kai'Sa's W will not heal her. Nor will her passive, only her Q. This is why they made her Q changed into AOE damage, because each individual hit was counting as a single ability, which made Death's Dance broken on her. Now it won't be near as effective. And I agree, Death's Dance is a problem on ADCs, and I don't think they should be able to use it, as it's a better bloodthirster(imo) whether it works off their skills or not due to the bleed damage passive keeping them from being able to be bursted down while they're healing up, even with just autos. But almost all the other options are situational at best on ADCs.

DW DianaMay 6, 20181 votes

Wouldn't ashe just build a zeal item, stormrazor and IE. I dont play her much (auto filled adc only) but it seems to me it would give her 100% crit, extra attack speed, and allow her to finish her build with essence reaver and bloodthirster and boots.