Uh, so this sona and taric duo in bot lane, what makes it so effective?
I see people doing it in my matches, what's so special about it?
I see people doing it in my matches, what's so special about it?
Insane levels of sustain (both champs can shield+heal each other), great poke&punish (Taric does his stun thing and it comes from two directions, he gets to smack you, full AP Sona gets to Q you for massive damage), and transitions into a normal lane mid to late.
Somethig something

[{quoted}](name=Sir Saltarin,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nLyONwdG,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-04-28T19:20:48.627+0000)
Somethig something
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the first correct answer this thread.
they double up on gold generation items + gain the additional gold stream off minions. support items now have the requirement that you need a partner near you, but there is no specification who those champions are. so you can just run two supports in the same lane who utilize the items well.
one of those two champions ends up with twice the gold of a solo laner.
A big thing imo is that Sona also runs Klepto.
A big thing imo is that Sona also runs Klepto.
yea, thats another huge chunk of income.
Hot take: Supp items were incredible bad designed looking at how many times they have been abused on gamestyles that were not intended
This is just another case
And honestly, the fact that I think that my comment it's the only one that brings up to the thread the supp items kinda shows that the ones talking here dont know exactly what they are saying
It's not the items, it's klepto that's being abused.
Remove Klepto or make it so Klepto can't proc if you have a sup item and this duo falls off bigtime.
It's not the items, it's klepto that's being abused.
It's both.
The strat wouldn't work either without Clepto or without the Supp items.
[{quoted}](name=Sir Saltarin,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nLyONwdG,comment-id=0000000000000001,timestamp=2019-04-29T01:06:04.273+0000)
Hot take: Supp items were incredible bad designed looking at how many times they have been abused on gamestyles that were not intended
This is just another case
And honestly, the fact that I think that my comment it's the only one that brings up to the thread the supp items kinda shows that the ones talking here dont know exactly what they are saying
Riot needs to dedicate the resources necessary to either make SR a 4 player map, or make support's gold needs/acquisitions equal to everyone else's in a way that breaks nothing.
And either of those is a lot of work.
It only takes one player discovering some abuse of the system to turn a working design into a "bad" one, and players are constantly TRYING to break the game. Most of the support item design iterations have historically held up pretty well, until some Korean finds a loophole and it spreads like wildfire across the playerbase.
The reason is more being that sona at lvl 16 autowins teamfights, but has a garbage laning phase AND waveclear
and Taric is the only support that makes her having a very reliable laning phase and waveclear with targon + E + his passive
COWARDS!
Not like Taric with his ult can pretty much autowin a head on teamfight too :P
Well it helps him to have sona to keep enemies from escaping.
Insane levels of sustain (both champs can shield+heal each other), great poke&punish (Taric does his stun thing and it comes from two directions, he gets to smack you, full AP Sona gets to Q you for massive damage), and transitions into a normal lane mid to late.
Q for massive damage.... hahahahaha, good one. She needs the amped AA to do any real damage, which means she's open to retaliation. Plus nobody ever buys GW early even when they should because "MUH BUILD". I'll give you they have good sustain, but that's really all.
I see you've never lost half your health bar to a single empowered AA early game.
I see you've never lost half your health bar to a single empowered AA early game.
There is absolutely no way Sona can actually half-health anyone before backing. Her most damaging combo is AA-Q-Powerchord+Electrocute, and even that doesn't drop someone to half without a Sheen. And, i hear she runs Klepto.
Beating Sona in lane is easy. She comes in to trade, hit her back, hard. Her heals are ridiculously inefficient and will wipe her mana bar and cripple her ability to poke.
Alternatively, facing two AP champs in lane, you could adapt your build for early MR, but nooooooo, you gotta get that crit, amirite? A single Hexdrinker almost nullifies her ability to do damage. Exec's Calling cripples their healing. But no, gotta get that glass cannon build.
The fact that sona is a glasscannon and taric can make her invincible for a few seconds come to mind..
I already posted this in another thread so i'll simply copy my own conclusion (TL;DR - damage creep):
It literally comes down to the question "why should i pick a "true" damage dealer if everyone explodes anyway?". In current state of game Sona's damage is simply just enough to get the job done and thats because there is to much damage both direct and indirect flying around. What do i mean by indirect damage? All those runes like comet, items like luden's echo, random aoe spells that just happens to hit you and so on. It may seem like its not that much but in those few seconds of teamfight they can really stack up. On top of that Sona/Taric combo is great at dealing with this indirect damage. Both of them are aoe healers, this allows them to simply ignore big chunk of damage on the battlefield. Another point is CC. With so much damage even singe stun can be a death sentence and Sona/Taric combo brings 2 aoe stuns that can be used to lock down big part of enemy team. Last point is Taric's ultimate. In a world where everyone explodes in 3s a potential teamwide 2.5s of immortality is like additional life and Sona's speed aura makes it even harder to disengage from this.
All this is quite ironic. Extreme high damage metas don't favour damage dealers. If everything deals tones of damage anyway why not pick someone who does other thing on top of that.
And before someone answers that "uhhhhh... buuuuut Sona cant one shot an adc early in game". Thats true but we need to remember that Sona has one of the easiest auto targeted poke abilities in game. Simply keeping enemy adc at 50% hp all the time, while at the same time keeping herself at 100% with heals, puts enemy adc in danger. One decent combo, one decent gank, few more hits and he/she risks one way ticket to the fountain. This usualy leads to enemy adc sitting under tower or recalling every 30s, wasting tones of farm. And as we all know farmless adc is the saddest and salties thing one can find on Summoners Rift.
Yep. Sona doesn't even need taric to do this. A good sona destroys the enemy bot lane so easily.
Probably because most marksmen don't buy an executioner's calling or a mercurial scimitar. Then there's the fact meta-maniacs panic when going against something insanely off-meta lol.
Yeah, those Master+ players should really learn how to itemize.
Oh you have me mistaken for someone who cares about pampered elitists :P
It's effective because people won't adapt to it.
or
and other long range poke duos destroy this combo.
Deny Sona her Klepto and spell thief's procs and the y fall apart.
Wrong, wrong, what counters it is hard engage, poke against a Sona Taric who's main strenght is sustain is exactly the worst thing you could do.
Not wrong, you poke Sona out of lane, you make it so she can't gain gold, and you win because a 2 item Sona is trash...
How do you poke Sona/Taric out of lane? They farm and heal back any damage you do. Hard Engage is definitely how you win. If youre against a Sona/Taric, run Lucian/Vayne and Leona/Nautilus and watch them fall apart.
With the sustain they pack its nigh impossible to win a poke war with them early, everything will either get shielded or healed out.
What you want, as always to deal with sona, is a hard heavy engage that kills her before the CC ends.
What I want to know as an aram main is who gets the CS?
Sona
Okay you dont know what you are talking about I see, it's the opposite
Sona actually goes Frostmancy because it was only solved for solo lanes, and the Taric with Targon gets all the farm they can
They switch roles once frost fang's passive kicks in. Sona become the farmer and Taric the sup.
Champions that can and need to heal off minions > stacking champions > carries > tanks
Taric starts the game farming with relic shield while Sona focuses entirely on poking to get her spellthiefs to hit completion, Once that's done it's free range for Sona to farm as much as she can
It's how the whole strat works in the first place
Sona gets assistance on gaining as much gold as she can via spellthief + targon + kleptomancy when she is at her weakest, Sona starts scaling harder and harder
[{quoted}](name=Linna Excel,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nLyONwdG,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2019-04-28T19:23:35.030+0000)
What I want to know as an aram main is who gets the CS?
Taric cs until sona upgrades her supp item then sona cs and taric procs relic shield
spammable healing, a strong cc ult and a strong invuln ult.
well for one thing full ap sona melts adcs because riot nerfed all her utility and gave her nothing back but damage and taric's ult is just really good with teams who are smart enough to use it.Also there is so much damage in this game adcs become redundant.
They did nerf her q damage as well
her kit still does better at dealing damage then actually supporting with Utility
They both excel when they have a partner.
It's the late game sustain tbh. I did it and my team was behind, but in a teamfight my team dropped to near dead and went back to near full HP extremely quickly so many times in a row that the enemy crumbled.
It's just a good duo team that wrecks people, but it is far from the only one.
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That is just a few examples.
All are equally good in my opinion for different reasons.
Edit:
How did I leave out
and
? That duo is sick AF.
So imagine you have a big wall, and when you damage it, it just heals itself, and just gains more Armor, which not only makes demolishing it harder, but somehow let’s it fight back, which let’s it heal more.
Ok now imagine that Voodo wall has a professional builder with a glock protecting it, healing it faster, and shooting at you whenever the manic gets the chance, AND you can’t kill him unless you get through the wall.
And finally, imagine both the wall and the gun guy have the ability to make everyone around them harder to kill and better at killing you.
Just played around 20 games using this duo. Biggest strength comes from abusing
and
. Sona usually can gain ~2000 gold at ~23 min from
, with an additional ~1000 from
. This plus Klep is ~3500 gold at just 23 minutes. Taric is also strong with items like
early since this strategy allows him to CS and buys key items early. Both excel at teamfighting which is usually how I close out games mid/late.
However, I felt laning phase is usually pretty rough if enemy has hard engage and cc like
. Also escaping from ganks is pretty difficult before level 6. This strategy relies on teammates as Sona's damage isn't super high, so if teammates pick low damage champions as well it's difficult to win fights.
I think the strategy is going to need a nerf, but I'd like too see it remain viable.
Enchanters being way too effective to the point they barely need an ADC? I kind of have a feeling of deja-vu...
Dunno, only faces it once and i ate them. Didnt feel strong at all to face.
Income and sustain. Thats it. Has nothing to do with the damage like alot are saying, it has to do with the fact outside of the opening 6 levels its impossible to kill this duo, along with the fact they get insane gold income for just sitting in lane.
Bruisers are broken, pick these 2 bottom lane and win late game.