Why hasn't Zac jungle come back into the competitive meta?

Worst Mid Ever·Apr 12, 2015·2 votes·1,997 views

He fits the tank meta and cinderhulk perfectly, and has by far the best initiation and ganks vs coordinated players in the game due to his E.

19 Comments

lightdragoon88Apr 12, 20155 votes

If I recall, he has been picked a few times in the LCS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f20HXzuMA8U

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOK25DA545I

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5lsu-ag-jDo

SIaytonApr 12, 20154 votes

His damage is weak, his CC is pretty soft, his ganks aren't particularly threatening pre 6, all in all he's just not as good at his job as the other tank initiators.

stuartk11Apr 12, 20152 votes

I'm sure the main is reason is just Sejuani. There is little reason to pick Zac over Sejuani since he will have a weaker early game, and his E engage doesn't really compare to Sejuani's Dash and Ultimate combo, which is not only less risky, but also hits a larger area aswell. It's a shame though that instead of actually nerfing her where she would need it, they'll probably straight nerf Cinderhulk instead. (Note: For the record, I'm OK if they nerf both. But I doubt it.)

Trash MammaIApr 12, 20152 votes

I don't think sej is the issue considering she's banned so much and nobody picks zac still lol

VenowolfApr 12, 20153 votes

Sejuani is not the problem, I'm main Sejuani and in every game she is banned, and nobody pick Zac like vice-Sejuani, I personally prefer Skarner and Amummu in the Vice-Sejuani role, Zac its not a bad champ but need more buffs to stay more revelant in the meta, his Q is a very awful skill, IMO usseles, its some kind of Skarner E but with less range and more width, his Q nneds to be reworked into some new, maybe add some kind of Nautilus Q and allow Zac to make gap closer with the structures and walls.

stuartk11Apr 12, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Sejuani is not the problem, I'm main Sejuani and in every game she is banned, and nobody pick Zac like vice-Sejuani, I personally prefer Skarner and Amummu in the Vice-Sejuani role, Zac its not a bad champ but need more buffs to stay more revelant in the meta, his Q is a very awful skill, IMO usseles, its some kind of Skarner E but with less range and more width, his Q nneds to be reworked into some new, maybe add some kind of Nautilus Q and allow Zac to make gap closer with the structures and walls.

When one is banned, it doesn't exactly mean the other should be picked. You can punish Zac a hell of a lot easier than Sejuani, for instance, and he doesn't have stellar clear times either. People don't pick Sejuani for the niche that she fills, they pick her for the all-round consistent jungler that she is. It just so happens that the niche that she was originally designed for is the same role that Zac would normally fill.

VenowolfApr 12, 20151 votes

With the new Black Cleaver both (Sejuani and Zac) felt down a lot, both are a very bad fighters and the new Black Cleaver give that chance to destroy tanks, so its about time and wait for the tank-meta junglers down a little bit, I'll hope that Zac received some love on tehse days to be more revelant

Support EvelynnApr 12, 20152 votes

He has.

GarurumonApr 12, 20151 votes

You can see exactly where Zac is gonna land during his E.

Pros will dodge ever Zac jump unless they are cc'ed before.

Worst Mid EverApr 12, 20152 votes

that didn't stop him from being the top jungle pick during season 3, he fell off because the tank meta died and everyone started playing high damage AD fighters

GarurumonApr 12, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Worst Mid Ever,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kjHzds45,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2015-04-12T10:50:07.107+0000)

that didn't stop him from being the top jungle pick during season 3, he fell off because the tank meta died and everyone started playing high damage AD fighters

Well it stopped him from being a successful in high elo. Concidering that low elo can't dodge for shit, how are they suppose to know that there is a huge clear black shadow where Zac is going to land (walks right into it). GG THEY DESERV CHALLENJOUR.

Worst Mid EverApr 12, 20153 votes

im talking about Season 3 of the LCS, when Cloud 9 went 25/3 and Meteos had a 39 KDA with Zac as his most played

Hypochondria9Apr 12, 20151 votes

I think he had way more tenacity on his ult then so it was damn near impossible to stop him from just sitting on the ADC.

AkeydelApr 12, 20151 votes

He's too squishy. And too jiggley. He'd make a great flex pick though.

VenowolfApr 12, 20151 votes

For me some of the problems on Zac is this:

W - Unstabble Matter

(max. 200 aginst minions and monsters).

That limit need to be applied only for minions, Zac have a some problems in the clear jungle, so he need some "help" with this.

Worst Mid EverApr 12, 20151 votes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECun7mX9QCU

in what way does he have trouble clearing?

VenowolfMay 2, 20151 votes

Because need more in his kit to be on the same level of Amummu, Sejuani, Gragas or Skarner.

BeatzBoyFTWMay 2, 20151 votes

A suicidal tank in teamfights, where he literally peels himself whenever he casts an ability.
Jungle champs who has more oppresive ganks & destructive ults than he has like pretty much overpowers him. A tank who only slows after one knock-up is not what everyone mostly needs in teamfights.

Acheron16Feb 28, 20161 votes

Because he has ridiculously bad stats for a tank which on top of his "identity" (killing himself to use skills) makes him pure garbage as a straight up tank.

And his laning phse was made non-existant by making his blobs pretty much always fall near the enemy, which relegates him to the jungle where are better options to do the same job.