Matchmaking is trash

Andrei3173·Jul 23, 2018·4 votes·1,399 views

Hello Riot Games, i recently won my promotionals games 8/2 and i got gold 3, i ranked up to gold 1 easy, i had 80% win rate ... Since then the players from my TEAM WERE GARBAGE, TOTALLY SUCKING ASS PLAYERS... 2350 MATCHES IN RANKED WITH 50% WR FOR GOLD 2, ON OPGG IT SAYS "WELCOME TO ELO HELL" AND ALL OF MY TEAM MATES ARE THROWING, I GET ONLY YASUOS WITH 3/17 AND SHIT CAN YOU FIX YOU R MATCHMAKING, IF SOMEONE HAVE BIG WINRATE, LET THEM GROW UNTIL THEY CANT ANYMORE, 80% WR IS SOMETHING FOR GOLD. This game is slowly dying... i get in my matchups players with 500 matches for gold 5... dude give me some good players... i cant carry alone. 36 matches i got carried once, once mate onceeeeeeeeeeee and now i get all the time a bot that doesnt want to swap when im 5/0 and they are 0/10 .... dude teach your players... they want their teammates to do all by their own, and after they get boosted and get some free lp from their hard trying team mates... How about a 1v1 ranked system, atleast me and players that faces players like this to get what they deserve, im done with this sucking ass game and your community, they give the first blood a few seconds later i see in chat "ff15 report my jungler" at minute 2:30 . Well done riot games, give me bad players and let me die in gold 1. AND BTW THANKS FOR THE DMG ON ILLAOI'S Q 110 DMG AT LVL 1. AT LETS NOT TALK ABOUT AATROX...

14 Comments

AyattoJul 23, 20183 votes

Finally a man rose up and said the bloody fucking truth, screw your balancement team, all they do is fuck the game even more rename it to the demolishing team because in reality that's all they do tbh, also let's not forget our faithful idiot who once said "Thank god they nerfed Shaco's Q that was getting annoying" ~ Freak 2018.

Ghosł Jul 23, 20183 votes

How to fix ranked and matchmaking balancing problems:

Reward LP based on performance. The guy who goes 12/2 deserves more LP then the guy who went 2/12
Same thing for losing. If you lose and go 12/2 you deserve to lose less LP then the guy who was afk/trolling/feeding. COMMON SENSE PEOPLE. Otherwise what is the real purpose of the class rating at the end of the game?
Make use of the honor system. Start matching players with HIGH honor with only players of HIGH honor. And match LOW honor ragers with other ragers. COMMON SENSE AGAIN. Other wise what was the real purpose of the honor system?
Stop placing new accounts in GOLD or higher. Everyone should start out in bronze. Otherwise you have people who just make new accounts and play with high elo friends to skip to gold.
Add in new elos under bronze and above silver/gold.
Reward players who play alot over those who only play 20 matches a season
Lose forgiveness when a player goes AFK or ints for those who do good in the game. (1-2 time per week to reduce abuse)

JamareeJul 23, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ghosł ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jG7IXlnt,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-07-23T19:48:35.162+0000)

How to fix ranked and matchmaking balancing problems:

Reward LP based on performance. The guy who goes 12/2 deserves more LP then the guy who went 2/12

Supports now even less played, stat padding, assassins best solo queue class.

Same thing for losing. If you lose and go 12/2 you deserve to lose less LP then the guy who was afk/trolling/feeding. COMMON SENSE PEOPLE. Otherwise what is the real purpose of the class rating at the end of the game?

Team game, you win or lose as a team.

Make use of the honor system. Start matching players with HIGH honor with only players of HIGH honor. And match LOW honor ragers with other ragers. COMMON SENSE AGAIN. Other wise what was the real purpose of the honor system?

People then complain that once in elo hell, impossible to leave because Riot puts people in elo hell.

Stop placing new accounts in GOLD or higher. Everyone should start out in bronze. Otherwise you have people who just make new accounts and play with high elo friends to skip to gold.

I have never seen that happen. Links to this happening?

Add in new elos under bronze and above silver/gold.

Again, why.

Reward players who play alot over those who only play 20 matches a season

Why?

Lose forgiveness when a player goes AFK or ints for those who do good in the game. (1-2 time per week to reduce abuse)

"Dude, you are feeding, leave so that we don't get punished."

Ghosł Jul 23, 20182 votes

Supports now even less played, stat padding, assassins best solo queue class.

Yea but each lane gets a rating differently based on the position. You can still get S class as sup without going 12/2 by playing well. I used the score as an example but it should be based on your class rating at the end of the game. Theres no reason for people not to play support less with what I am suggesting. Blaming the issue of no one wanting to play support on my suggestion just dodges what I am saying all together for some hypothetical result. But you can't really say for sure that people would play support less. In fact your argument is the definition an invalid one based off of a hypothetical and render completely illogical.

Team game, you win or lose as a team.

This is absolutely true. Everyone should contribute as it is a team game. You have proven my point on accident. And people should be rewarded fairly based on their contribution. This is what I am suggesting. Unless you want to suggest that people who are detrimental to the team should be rewarded for their behavior?

People then complain that once in elo hell, impossible to leave because Riot puts people in elo hell.

Sometimes in life you have to bear the consequences of your behavior. They raged at teammates, fed, went afk, or did something to get their honor that low. Behavior adjustment requires either positive re enforcement when someone does something correct, or negative re enforcement when someone does something wrong.

I have never seen that happen. Links to this happening?

My gamer tag is my name. Add me, lets play we can watch this happen as well as people raging, feeding, ect as many times as you want. Im actually a pretty nice and fun to play with fellow. Never been chat banned, never had low honor, ect. I'll gladly play with you or anyone else of any skill level and I am willing to put my money where my mouth is. Add me if you really wanna be about proving your point. Lets play some. I need good partners anyway.

Add in new elos under bronze and above silver/gold. Why?

This one is an idea i got from Riots ranked update post. I happen to like the idea because the distribution of players and skill level differences in silver elo is out of hand. This is from riots info not mine. As for the reasons consult their post on the upcoming ranked changes.

Reward players who play alot over those who only play 20 matches a season why?

Because as it stands and how it has been for the last 6 years. You can make a new account and play with your plat/diamond friends and place that new account in gold easily. The FACTUAL result of this is a bunch of people who are not ready to be in gold, getting placed way above their elo. This result is FACTUAL and not some possible hypothetical like your answer to question 1. This is not disputable it is a reality. So sense you seem to want everything to be so far with the this is a team game talk. Why are you ok with people skipping ahead 2 elos over the others? Continueing from this point why should people who play 10-20 games a season recieve the same amount of reward as those who play 200 games. The amount of time and effort for the reward does not match. Again as someone who wants things to be fair why are you ok with this?

"Dude, you are feeding, leave so that we don't get punished."

Naturally there would have to be some restraints and safe guards to prevent misuse, such as extreme punishments for those who attempt what you are suggesting. Although this wouldn't be enough to deter it entirely I admit that, as I am a reasonable man who knows when a solution is not perfect

JamareeJul 23, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ghosł ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jG7IXlnt,comment-id=000300000000,timestamp=2018-07-23T23:23:38.760+0000)

Yea but each lane gets a rating differently based on the position. You can still get S class as sup without going 12/2 by playing well. I used the score as an example but it should be based on your class rating at the end of the game. Theres no reason for people not to play support less with what I am suggesting. Blaming the issue of no one wanting to play support on my suggestion just dodges what I am saying all together for some hypothetical result. But you can't really say for sure that people would play support less. In fact your argument is the definition an invalid one based off of a hypothetical and render completely illogical.

Ok, and what of stat padding?

This is absolutely true. Everyone should contribute as it is a team game. You have proven my point on accident. And people should be rewarded fairly based on their contribution. This is what I am suggesting. Unless you want to suggest that people who are detrimental to the team should be rewarded for their behavior?

Do NBA players win even when their team loses because they scored the best in the game, or football, or any other team sport? No, you win or lose as a team, you might get more recognition in the end, but you don’t win on your own.

Sometimes in life you have to bear the consequences of your behavior. They raged at teammates, fed, went afk, or did something to get their honor that low. Behavior adjustment requires either positive re enforcement when someone does something correct, or negative re enforcement when someone does something wrong.

That’s fine, what of all the bitching that will happen though? What of all the claims of of how bad the system of matchmaking is now with no proof only to actually have a system that strings you through hell as well as longer queue times as games find players while also bein at the right honor? And what of the newer players going through it for the first time while leveling up honor?

My gamer tag is my name. Add me, lets play we can watch this happen as well as people raging, feeding, ect as many times as you want. Im actually a pretty nice and fun to play with fellow. Never been chat banned, never had low honor, ect. I'll gladly play with you or anyone else of any skill level and I am willing to put my money where my mouth is. Add me if you really wanna be about proving your point. Lets play some. I need good partners anyway.

I’m not talking about players with bronze skill eventually bullshitting their way to gold, I’m talking about actual new players starting gold because I haven’t seen any new players starting higher then silver 1. Sure will add after work though.

This one is an idea i got from Riots ranked update post. I happen to like the idea because the distribution of players and skill level differences in silver elo is out of hand. This is from riots info not mine. As for the reasons consult their post on the upcoming ranked changes.

Riot or not, I want to know what this will solve?

Because as it stands and how it has been for the last 6 years. You can make a new account and play with your plat/diamond friends and place that new account in gold easily. The FACTUAL result of this is a bunch of people who are not ready to be in gold, getting placed way above their elo. This result is FACTUAL and not some possible hypothetical like your answer to question 1. This is not disputable it is a reality. So sense you seem to want everything to be so far with the this is a team game talk. Why are you ok with people skipping ahead 2 elos over the others? Continueing from this point why should people who play 10-20 games a season recieve the same amount of reward as those who play 200 games. The amount of time and effort for the reward does not match. Again as someone who wants things to be fair why are you ok with this?

Well first off, you can’t rank with people two ranks higher then you. Bronze can’t rank with gold, silver can’t rank with Plat, gold can’t rank diamond.

Why exactly is it unfair, they set rewards at gold, if someone can make it in 20, why should they not be allowed to get it simply because they didn’t play enough even if they got to said level?

Naturally there would have to be some restraints and safe guards to prevent misuse, such as extreme punishments for those who attempt what you are suggesting. Although this wouldn't be enough to deter it entirely I admit that, as I am a reasonable man who knows when a solution is not perfect

Nor am I so unreasonable to want things to be better, I would love for me to do well no matter what and still get LP, but then people won’t play as a team as they should. It is the downside of team games, you are only as strong as your weakest link.

Ghosł Jul 24, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Ok, and what of stat padding?

What is more important some self centered person who wants an extra few kills before he wins, or a fairness for the teammates who carried you. As you said it is a team game, reward the mvps accordingly like the NBA does. Beside, this stat padding issue already exists. Also, you are using a hypothetical problem again they may or may not come to pass if my suggestion was implemented. If it already exists now I would lean to agree with you that it would exist after my suggestion, however how to resolve that issue is a different topic.

Do NBA players win even when their team loses because they scored the best in the game, or football, or any other team sport? No, you win or lose as a team, you might get more recognition in the end, but you don’t win on your own.

Exactly my point again. Im not saying reward good players with positive LP when they lose. If your team loses you lose. I agree with you. But in the NBA as you just said the players who carry their team get more recognition because it is obvious they contributed more and so they are rewarded rightfully so for their contribution. And i have been the 2/12 player just as much as the 12/2 player if not more. I still don't think I deserved as much LP as the players who carried me for that specific game.

That’s fine, what of all the bitching that will happen though? What of all the claims of of how bad the system of matchmaking is now with no proof only to actually have a system that strings you through hell as well as longer queue times as games find players while also bein at the right honor? And what of the newer players going through it for the first time while leveling up honor?

-People will bitch about anything. This is about fairness and proper rewards. -The proof is in every game where you have people raging, trolling or feeding due to improper ranking system. -You can solve the longer wait cues by exercising an optional check box to only play with people of your honor. You could then choose longer wait times or risk a toxic team. Easy to implement as well. -luckily new players start at mid level honor so they'd be placed with others of similar honor instead of ragers, feeders and afkers. This would actually prob help new players (i think).

I’m not talking about players with bronze skill eventually bullshitting their way to gold, I’m talking about actual new players starting gold because I haven’t seen any new players starting higher then silver 1. Sure will add after work though.

I have seen friends of mine countless times place high silver low gold on brand new accounts by playing with higher elo friends and winning alot of the matches. I can't present proof of my claim but anyone can test it out a few times easily and see for themselves.

Riot or not, I want to know what this will solve?

It will solve the issue of 80% of all ranked players being in the silver elo by creating new elos to help disperse the majority gap and properly place players with players of similar skill levels. (or at least attempt to solve this. Who knows what will really happen, hypothetical and thus not a sound argument on my part here)

Well first off, you can’t rank with people two ranks higher then you. Bronze can’t rank with gold, silver can’t rank with Plat, gold can’t rank diamond.

This is true but when you where never ranked before (new account) this doesn't take effect yet.

Why exactly is it unfair, they set rewards at gold, if someone can make it in 20, why should they not be allowed to get it simply because they didn’t play enough even if they got to said level?

Because majority of the time they only got their rank that quickly due to smurf friends helping them get there. If there are great solo players who get gold completely on their own that quickly then they deserve rewards, but majority of the time this is not the case. This one is a fact and riot has been attempting to prevent this issue with anti cheat implementations. We will see how it goes.

Nor am I so unreasonable to want things to be better, I would love for me to do well no matter what and still get LP, but then people won’t play as a team as they should. It is the downside of team games, you are only as strong as your weakest link.

I get it believe me, but if a teammate is purposely making you lose the game (and this happens more often then not) then your down to a 4v6 really. Point is, there is an undeniable issue that has been brought up time and time again for years. It may not be as vocal on the forums now but that is only because people have given up hope.

great discussion. I like that your not making invalid and random personal insults. Maybe others will join in and riot will take notice and do something!

JamareeJul 24, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ghosł ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jG7IXlnt,comment-id=00030000000000000000,timestamp=2018-07-24T01:19:42.901+0000)

What is more important some self centered person who wants an extra few kills before he wins, or a fairness for the teammates who carried you. As you said it is a team game, reward the mvps accordingly like the NBA does.

Those MVPs will move up anyway, because they are good. The reward for the MVPs here is that they will eventually go up because they are good.

Beside, this stat padding issue already exists. Also, you are using a hypothetical problem again they may or may not come to pass if my suggestion was implemented. If it already exists now I would lean to agree with you that it would exist after my suggestion, however how to resolve that issue is a different topic.

All of this is hypothetical, so of course I'm going to bring up every thing that could go wrong.

Exactly my point again. Im not saying reward good players with positive LP when they lose. If your team loses you lose. I agree with you. But in the NBA as you just said the players who carry their team get more recognition because it is obvious they contributed more and so they are rewarded rightfully so for their contribution. And i have been the 2/12 player just as much as the 12/2 player if not more. I still don't think I deserved as much LP as the players who carried me for that specific game.

Yes, they get more RECOGNITION, but nothing else. Yes, that recognition leads to things outside the game like sponsors, offers, deals and such, but in the game, not so much.

-People will bitch about anything. This is about fairness and proper rewards. -The proof is in every game where you have people raging, trolling or feeding due to improper ranking system.

People would do that even with the proper perfect system.

-You can solve the longer wait cues by exercising an optional check box to only play with people of your honor. You could then choose longer wait times or risk a toxic team. Easy to implement as well.

Which then splits the playerbase which in turn would also lead to longer queue times.

-luckily new players start at mid level honor so they'd be placed with others of similar honor instead of ragers, feeders and afkers. This would actually prob help new players (i think).

Everyone starts at level 2, meaning that is where most people would be.

I have seen friends of mine countless times place high silver low gold on brand new accounts by playing with higher elo friends and winning alot of the matches. I can't present proof of my claim but anyone can test it out a few times easily and see for themselves.

That is a problem with smurfing, which will never go away period.

Because majority of the time they only got their rank that quickly due to smurf friends helping them get there. If there are great solo players who get gold completely on their own that quickly then they deserve rewards, but majority of the time this is not the case. This one is a fact and riot has been attempting to prevent this issue with anti cheat implementations. We will see how it goes.

And what of legit duos who are of the same skill and do well, should they be punished for duoing then?

I get it believe me, but if a teammate is purposely making you lose the game (and this happens more often then not) then your down to a 4v6 really. Point is, there is an undeniable issue that has been brought up time and time again for years. It may not be as vocal on the forums now but that is only because people have given up hope.

I don't think it happens anywhere near as much as people make it out to, what I think happens is they start off poorly and it snowballs into shit, the flaming starts so they feed into the feeding even more.

great discussion. I like that your not making invalid and random personal insults. Maybe others will join in and riot will take notice and do something!

They won't.

Ghosł Jul 25, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Those MVPs will move up anyway, because they are good. The reward for the MVPs here is that they will eventually go up because they are good.

Nah that won't at least from what I've seen. In lower elos some teamates are so bad it literally does not matter how good you are. Shit there is a post on the main page with a diamond player talking about how hard silver is. IMO its proven that individual skill less then not can win you the game. However, I actually agree that it should be that way. As it is a team game and I advocate to keep it that way. I'm just saying it is unfair to reward LP the same without considering team contribuions.

All of this is hypothetical, so of course I'm going to bring up every thing that could go wrong.

This isn't worst case senerio tho. Most of what you brought up are already existing problems. And I already agreed that these problems would most likely continue to exist even with the change I am arguing for. However, those issues are separate concerns to be adressed. It isn't valid to use potential and already existing problems as counter arguments to stop progress. This is a foundation of logical reasoning in collage courses.

Yes, they get more RECOGNITION, but nothing else. Yes, that recognition leads to things outside the game like sponsors, offers, deals and such, but in the game, not so much.

They get alot more then recgonition? The get PAID more. Which in this case is the logical equivalent to LP. If what I am suggesting is so unfair. Why then do all professional sports pay the better athletes more? Common sense answers are because they should, they deserve it, its more fair and that system has been proven to work in all pro sports up to this point.

People would do that even with the proper perfect system.

Agreed. But then again without adversity progress is alot slower. Emotions tend to render progress often in general in life. The problem here is the gaming community is prehaps the most ungrateful and toxic community on earth so Riot is stuck in a position where no matter what they do someone will get upset. Which is why it makes more sense to do stuff that is fair and has been proven to work in the past.

Which then splits the playerbase which in turn would also lead to longer queue times. This is a fair argument, however it makes me wonder what the point of the honor system was then. I guess to just appease people and make then "feel" like they can punish the toxic players.

Everyone starts at level 2, meaning that is where most people would be.

Agreed. Most very toxic players who cause problems would be lower then that most likely. Also theres always the option of expanding the amount of levels in the honor system to create a larger gap between new players and toxic ones.

That is a problem with smurfing, which will never go away period.

Agreed.

And what of legit duos who are of the same skill and do well, should they be punished for duoing then? No, but again gotta focus on the big picture IMO not less common situations.

I don't think it happens anywhere near as much as people make it out to, what I think happens is they start off poorly and it snowballs into shit, the flaming starts so they feed into the feeding even more. As someone who spent 7 years moving from bronze to gold and in and out of silver. On average it happens at least 50% of the time if not more.

They won't.

JamareeJul 25, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ghosł ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jG7IXlnt,comment-id=0003000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-07-25T05:42:42.445+0000)

Nah that won't at least from what I've seen. In lower elos some teamates are so bad it literally does not matter how good you are. Shit there is a post on the main page with a diamond player talking about how hard silver is. IMO its proven that individual skill less then not can win you the game. However, I actually agree that it should be that way. As it is a team game and I advocate to keep it that way. I'm just saying it is unfair to reward LP the same without considering team contribuions.

Yeah, there is one or two games where they simply can't, where the team is too heavy, and what of all the rest where their skill and knowledge trumps the people around them and they go 10/0 by 10 minutes in and carry consistently?

This isn't worst case senerio tho. Most of what you brought up are already existing problems. And I already agreed that these problems would most likely continue to exist even with the change I am arguing for. However, those issues are separate concerns to be adressed. It isn't valid to use potential and already existing problems as counter arguments to stop progress. This is a foundation of logical reasoning in collage courses.

And I'm saying what is the point of changing something if it isn't going to fix the problem anyway?

They get alot more then recgonition? The get PAID more. Which in this case is the logical equivalent to LP. If what I am suggesting is so unfair. Why then do all professional sports pay the better athletes more? Common sense answers are because they should, they deserve it, its more fair and that system has been proven to work in all pro sports up to this point.

Those are outside factors though, they get paid more because they bring more to the team, their representation IN game however doesn't mean that just because they alone scored 50 points alone compared to three players scoring 20 points each doesn't mean that said MVP gets the win.

Agreed. But then again without adversity progress is alot slower. Emotions tend to render progress often in general in life. The problem here is the gaming community is prehaps the most ungrateful and toxic community on earth so Riot is stuck in a position where no matter what they do someone will get upset. Which is why it makes more sense to do stuff that is fair and has been proven to work in the past.

But your system isn't fully fair, no one duo queue period which is an incentive to play for some people, they would be getting actively punished for playing with their friends.

This is a fair argument, however it makes me wonder what the point of the honor system was then. I guess to just appease people and make then "feel" like they can punish the toxic players.

To reward players who follow the rules.

Agreed. Most very toxic players who cause problems would be lower then that most likely. Also theres always the option of expanding the amount of levels in the honor system to create a larger gap between new players and toxic ones.

I suppose but at that point I have to ask, what would that accomplish?

No, but again gotta focus on the big picture IMO not less common situations.

But then it isn't fair, you can't use the concept of being fair and NOT consider everyone.

Andrei3173Jul 24, 20181 votes

Im not a new player, so a new account isn't a problem for me, especially playing in gold 1, plat and so.
I have better wr against high elo players, when i play with gold 5 teammates i cant do anything even if the enemy are at the same skill with my team mates, mine fed so it doesnt matter the skill anymore since i play tanks and bruisers.
Check this one, whenever i get 4-5 wins in a row i get teammates with 35% wr in ranked and 2k games+ https://imgur.com/a/pBHeCaD + im not a one tricker with champions i can play any champion you want and still win as long as you give me atleast mediocre teammates

NotADariusPlayerJul 23, 20182 votes

I feel you man and I think you are right, but we can't do anything about it, so it's not our fault that the matchmaking is how it is.[zombie-brand-clap]

EedatJul 23, 20181 votes

Weird how this 0/10 Wukong game never happened and you actually feed hard as fuck when you play Yasuo

Andrei3173Jul 24, 20182 votes

Mate i've never said i had wukong in my team, but i had yasuos and bot feeding wukong representing that they are monkeys... you should have a photo with wukong everytime with you, so i dont have to explain this again.

Andrei3173Jul 24, 20182 votes

https://imgur.com/a/pBHeCaD yeah, i was feeding, not like my teammates were throwing so until the end of the match the enemy team knew that they had to focus me since i was the biggest trouble as a support man lmao. with malphite top full ap