Why cant riot just treat support champions as special cases?

Boatwhistle · 2018-10-07T05:34:42.707Z

Playing support is effectively playing from behind as league has pretty much 4 resources to choose from so one role has to share exp with another and gets a gold generation item that simply does not compensate for the lack of cs just so it doesn't get abused by other roles. This is enough reason to dislike playing supports on its own but you put on top of this the fact that a support has to go out of their way to avoid last hitting enemy champions as getting a kill is shameful for the same resource allocation practices that put the role in this position to begin with. So even if you are god mode support for a game you are still probably no better off in personal power in terms of dmg, utility, or survivability then the enemy team members you are stomping if not worse. Then what, you get good KP and a win? Big whoop! Alot of people clearly hate: -Being filled support. -Playing with a filled support. -Getting little reward or clear recognition doing well as support. -Having the lowest carry potential by default cause one happens to be playing support. This is why, despite the history of league, support champions need to be a special case when it comes to the availability of options. Support champions should have access to a summoner spell that is to them what smite is to a jungler. It should allow them to have access to items suited to them that allows them to be equals in terms of power to the other roles in which will simply not be available for abuse by champions that do have effective access to better amounts gold and exp. So doing well is not automatic for a support the utilization of such a summoner spell could be directly connected to their preformance and what they get as a result. Imagine a version of ignite for supports where if an ignited champion gets killed during the support ingite then the support gets kill gold as well or if the ignite kills them then their ally gets it as well like pyke ult. OR maybe they can mark them with the spell to increase the amount of dmg the marked champion recieves from allies and lasts as long as you the support stays in combat with the target... resulting in shared kill gold. JUST some way that allows a support to effectively get ahead without it being a bad thing. Soaking exp is passively done anyway so why the hell should somthing being forced to leach be punished for having to do so exactly??? Why should it punish another role for having to do so with them??? Just have it so that a support with the support exclusive summoner spell not only gets more exp from minions just to make up the difference of having to share but also gives the allies they are sharing with additional exp to make up for the difference of sharing with them. ITS STILL JUST STANDING IN LANES GETTING LEVELS. Getting forced out of or leaving lane would still result in being behind in levels as well... so its still no more free then what each other role gets by existing amongst dying units. Yes, getting less exp for sharing a lane has a good reason, but the support champions dont have viable alternatives and we are talking one role that happens to be doing their job. Supports maybe definded by their effective utility while playing without good resources, but this same thing is what makes them unfun and unrewarding so just suppliment it. Making this unique to supports is the only way as other champions would just end up abusing whatver this would be otherwise... but this doesnt justify having a role that exists to be disliked for the reasons I said even by the people that main it. With the amount of discontent surrounding this role from many directions surely people can agree somthing along these lines should be in order, honestly.

BloodnachtOct 7, 20182 votes

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I didn't dislike but how about the fact that supports are pretty close to equal in gold income now? They removed the 800g cost of wards, supports can now build pretty much whatever they want after tier 2 support item, and all support items cost less, give them 40% CDR easily, mana regen out the ass, and they also get a heal and shield power stat now so enchanters don't have to build squishy to do what they normally do. Supports also do carry as they're usually the most annoying thing to deal with in the game. Pyke gets a kill gold sharing ult because he himself is a catcher/assassin hybrid that is meant for players who hate the role to be able to pick a carry champion who also has high gold requirements due to building like an assassin, whereas any other support can build a 2400G item and be just as effective(if not moreso). As for EXP, it's split evenly between the ADC and the support. You have two people in lane so you should be lower leveled than the rest of your team because of this.

you can't read or what? He's talking about REAL SUPPORTS not Zyra Velkoz Veigar Zed Syndra Teemo Ryze Olaf Malphite Maokai Malzahar Kennen Karthus Katarina Anivia Annie , and explain it to me, which support does more HEAL than DAMAGE? and let's not forget, Janna has her Ultimate, at least 60 sec cd at 40%, Sona has her W, cost more mana than Janna 's Ultimate and shitty heal + a little shield, Soraka Must pay with 5-10% of her life to use her W and her Ultimate has at least 60 - 70 sec full CDR and used only once, when Janna 's its like a TICK inside the area. and the last one Kayle 's has 9 sec CD at full CDR and its not even so strong, so don't spew BS pls.

PS: Also SUPPORTS hit lvl 6 after the A D C

VoraciousXOct 7, 20181 votes

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you can't read or what? He's talking about REAL SUPPORTS not , and explain it to me, which support does more HEAL than DAMAGE? and let's not forget, has her Ultimate, at least 60 sec cd at 40%, has her W, cost more mana than 's Ultimate and shitty heal + a little shield, Must pay with 5-10% of her life to use her W and her Ultimate has at least 60 - 70 sec full CDR and used only once, when 's its like a TICK inside the area. and the last one's has 9 sec CD at full CDR and its not even so strong, so don't spew BS pls.

PS: Also SUPPORTS hit lvl 6 after the A D C

I have no idea why you're mentioning non supports(btw Brand IS a support now though), as for what you're mentioning about supports getting level 6 AFTER the ADC, that could be because they're not killing champions. but again, unless you want to share the kill exp with the ADC, then it would be unfair because otherwise you're doubling down on something solo laners get. As for what you're saying about the cooldowns on ultimates, you must be joking if you think Janna's, Soraka's, and Kayle's ultimates are not that great. As for Soraka's W, yeah, it costs her health, but guess what? With the total BS heal and shield power stat, she can use that infinitely because now warmogs is pretty much core on her. She just Ws until she's near death, and waits for her health to fill back up out of combat.

Back to all the non-supports you mentioned. If you're talking about me saying supports carry, I'm not saying they carry by kills. You're crazy if you think that kills are all that carrying involves. Supports carry by being purely annoying. They prevent you from being able to touch the one person who can nuke your entire team. They peel you off them again and again while they're throwing mini atomic bombs at you and there's nothing you can do about it because their peel is on a 5 second cooldown. while you have to use an entire set of abilities to kill them, which brings your cooldowns to around 8 seconds with 10-20% CDR.

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No, in a typical game it is not equal or building 2.8k+ gold tank items on thresh(as an example) would be just as efficient for him as it is to do so on ramus. You build the cheap support tank items to get the passive values sooner then you would the higher price tank items. Into late game its worse as you could be far from full build doing this with each item. Two players should equal two players... When you gank bot you are ganking two players, you should be prepared to deal with at least two enemy players then. This should be fine as under ideal conditions playing intelligently it will be a 3v2... meaning you have the advantage still. The support has to leach exp the entire game. Putting them 1000s of gold in stat value behind until late game with no effective measure otherwise, the effect that protects from 2v1 lanes is nothing but a punishment to a role that has no choice otherwise for no advantage. I don't suggest kill gold for every kill, only when the suggested summoner is up and the kill is gotten within its effects, then it goes on cool down. Serving no other functions then for the kill pressure(like ignite) and a gold reward for the support playing will to facilitate/get the kill without punishing them passively for denying the adc gold.

Again, what you're asking for is 2 kills for one. Also, again, Pyke builds OFFENSE which costs upwards of 3k in each item. Defensive items are also cheaper than offensive ones, and a Thresh build consists of locket, redemption, and Zeke's. The LOWEST price of those is 2100 and the HIGHEST is 2250, while ALL OF THEM protect the ADC or grant buffs to the ADC, making THEM stronger, while also giving much EARLIER power spikes. Pyke's items only serve to make HIM stronger, and cost MUCH MORE. This is why his ultimate grants both kill gold. He doesn't build for his ADC, he builds for him, to be an assassin, and he's made for players who prefer assassins or don't like to play traditional supports. He's somewhat of a selfish pick intended to be a secondary carry.

Also, during ganks you aren't accounting for the other jungle. In an ideal situation for both parties it will be 3v3. If you're going in 1v2 and the enemy bot lane is a higher level than you, it won't matter even if their health is far below the normal threshold, because they will be able to 2v1 you regardless. If you want full exp and gold, get a duo and have them play Mordekaiser bot. He shares the same EXP with his partner, and you can go double relic for even more gold. It's not fair for bot lane, a lane DESIGNED TO HAVE A WEAK LANING PHASE to be on equal terms with the rest of the cast, because they have two people in one lane. It's twice as hard to deal with them than it is for another laner. If you want equal gold and equal exp, you should be asking for a lane of your own instead of something that will overpower you more than supports already are.

Oh and also, again, Riot has already stated that supports get similar gold incomes to other laners now already. They have buffed support gold income beyond belief to achieve this.

BloodnachtOct 7, 20181 votes

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I have no idea why you're mentioning non supports(btw Brand IS a support now though), as for what you're mentioning about supports getting level 6 AFTER the ADC, that could be because they're not killing champions. but again, unless you want to share the kill exp with the ADC, then it would be unfair because otherwise you're doubling down on something solo laners get. As for what you're saying about the cooldowns on ultimates, you must be joking if you think Janna's, Soraka's, and Kayle's ultimates are not that great. As for Soraka's W, yeah, it costs her health, but guess what? With the total BS heal and shield power stat, she can use that infinitely because now warmogs is pretty much core on her. She just Ws until she's near death, and waits for her health to fill back up out of combat.

Back to all the non-supports you mentioned. If you're talking about me saying supports carry, I'm not saying they carry by kills. You're crazy if you think that kills are all that carrying involves. Supports carry by being purely annoying. They prevent you from being able to touch the one person who can nuke your entire team. They peel you off them again and again while they're throwing mini atomic bombs at you and there's nothing you can do about it because their peel is on a 5 second cooldown. while you have to use an entire set of abilities to kill them, which brings your cooldowns to around 8 seconds with 10-20% CDR.

Again, what you're asking for is 2 kills for one. Also, again, Pyke builds OFFENSE which costs upwards of 3k in each item. Defensive items are also cheaper than offensive ones, and a Thresh build consists of locket, redemption, and Zeke's. The LOWEST price of those is 2100 and the HIGHEST is 2250, while ALL OF THEM protect the ADC or grant buffs to the ADC, making THEM stronger, while also giving much EARLIER power spikes. Pyke's items only serve to make HIM stronger, and cost MUCH MORE. This is why his ultimate grants both kill gold. He doesn't build for his ADC, he builds for him, to be an assassin, and he's made for players who prefer assassins or don't like to play traditional supports. He's somewhat of a selfish pick intended to be a secondary carry.

Also, during ganks you aren't accounting for the other jungle. In an ideal situation for both parties it will be 3v3. If you're going in 1v2 and the enemy bot lane is a higher level than you, it won't matter even if their health is far below the normal threshold, because they will be able to 2v1 you regardless. If you want full exp and gold, get a duo and have them play Mordekaiser bot. He shares the same EXP with his partner, and you can go double relic for even more gold. It's not fair for bot lane, a lane DESIGNED TO HAVE A WEAK LANING PHASE to be on equal terms with the rest of the cast, because they have two people in one lane. It's twice as hard to deal with them than it is for another laner. If you want equal gold and equal exp, you should be asking for a lane of your own instead of something that will overpower you more than supports already are.

Oh and also, again, Riot has already stated that supports get similar gold incomes to other laners now already. They have buffed support gold income beyond belief to achieve this.

Dude, you come with 0 fucking arguments at me while i'm maining support, and u think u know better than me what DOES WHAT and what DOES NOT? dude, you're like any other PLAYER who knows shit how Support really works, just by stating that BRAND is now SUPPORT, you already lost the arguments against me, and let's not FORGET, check a mid to late game, Supp as max 15k gold altogether while others has at least 18k+ which there's a lot of difference, and don't spew me another BS that RIOT stated, they cant say a single shit to us when they can't even fix Bugs animation nor one of them PLAYS this fucking game.

BoatwhistleOct 7, 20181 votes

I am glad to you on my side by kindness is key man...

VoraciousXOct 7, 20181 votes

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Dude, you come with 0 fucking arguments at me while i'm maining support, and u think u know better than me what DOES WHAT and what DOES NOT? dude, you're like any other PLAYER who knows shit how Support really works, just by stating that BRAND is now SUPPORT, you already lost the arguments against me, and let's not FORGET, check a mid to late game, Supp as max 15k gold altogether while others has at least 18k+ which there's a lot of difference, and don't spew me another BS that RIOT stated, they cant say a single shit to us when they can't even fix Bugs animation nor one of them PLAYS this fucking game.

Brand is a support. Look at OP.GG, look at anything. His support pick rate is more than his mid lane pick rate. Also if you're saying Brand isn't a support then neither is Morgana, as both were designed for mid lane. Nautilus iirc was supposed to be a top laner so he isn't one either, and I believe originally Blitzcrank was as well. The hard truth is Brand is a support, it's not off meta, it IS meta. People may not like that fact, but until Brand gets actual scaling and probably lower base damage, he'll always be better as a support.

As for supports having max 15k while others have 18k gold. How about you look at the cost of a traditional support build. It's much cheaper than anyone else's. Let's look at a full build Soraka for example: item 3092 item 3107 item 3504 item 3190 item 3222 item 3158 . I just built these items out of Soraka's most built items. from top to bottom that made somewhat sense. Let's look at the gold value of this:

item 3092 1800 gold item 3107 2100 gold item 3504 2300 gold item 3190 2200 gold item 3222 2100 gold item 3158 900 gold Total cost: 11,400 gold

Now let's look at Caitlyn's gold value of her items:

item 3095 2800 gold item 3094 2800 gold item 3031 3400 gold item 3087 2800 gold item 3026 2800 gold item 3006 1100 gold Total cost: 15,700

Are you really going to say a support isn't getting more than equal value now? If 2k gold is their only gold difference, then they're actually getting far more than ADCs are for their money. Hell by the time an ADC has 2 full items a support would have almost 3(ADC 2 items = 5600, support 3 items = 6200) if they were making the same gold.

BloodnachtOct 7, 20181 votes

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Brand is a support. Look at OP.GG, look at anything. His support pick rate is more than his mid lane pick rate. Also if you're saying Brand isn't a support then neither is Morgana, as both were designed for mid lane.

So, you're saying that OP.GG plays your games????? no??? then wtf are you spewing nonsense to me?Like i said, you're like the Majority of players which i Met in World of Warcraft who COPYPASTED their Talents FROM EACH OTHERS 'cause they saw it on the best GUILD in the game AT THAT TIME ... and now you're the same kind in League of Legends, so i guess you're watching Games on YT and you gain LP after every fucking REPLAY you're using? dude, grow some balls and see the facts on your own, BRAND IS NO SUPP, more supp than is Amumu or Lux

VoraciousXOct 7, 20181 votes

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So, you're saying that OP.GG plays your games????? no??? then wtf are you spewing nonsense to me?Like i said, you're like the Majority of players which i Met in World of Warcraft who COPYPASTED their Talents FROM EACH OTHERS 'cause they saw it on the best GUILD in the game AT THAT TIME ... and now you're the same kind in League of Legends, so i guess you're watching Games on YT and you gain LP after every fucking REPLAY you're using? dude, grow some balls and see the facts on your own, BRAND IS NO SUPP, more supp than is or

If Brand isn't, neither is Morgana, Nautilus, Blitzcrank, Sion, Shen, Trundle, or Zilean. It has nothing to do with me "copying other people". I don't play Brand, or support generally, but there are reasons he is a support. He's not as good in the mid lane because of many things which keep him from performing as well there. Just because you claim he isn't support, doesn't change the facts that he is played as a support 85% of the time.

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Pyke builds Black clever because of the high AD it gives him along with the added benefit of armor shred which helps his adc kill them faster. I don't play pyke cause I agree he is mostly selfish and I don't like playing assassins anyway. Thresh starts to build his first defense item after support item then tier two boots. By then everyone else has their first damage item and probably tier 1 or 2 boots depending or are even confident enough to start more dmg/tankiness. The 2100-2250 items are not worth as much in stats as other tank items understandably. He also doesn't build them any faster cause gold income is lower for supports which is why these items exist... which is why you don't see the support getting full build first, they get it last. All together putting the support behind most of the game on top of 1000s of Gs in level stats so even if you do really well you are behind. Just 5 support items give the adc more power. Only two are good enough to get early one only giving survival (knights vow, which happens to be bad for thresh cause ranged so he gets the shitty locket they gutted) and the other gives on hit and attack speed to make up for the fact enchanters cant tank for them as effectively or contribute as much damage past lane(ardent). Ultimately however this detracts from the main point which is the role is the most unrewarding in the most literal sense. You do well and get little making the role less fun being perpetually behind if played well. I am sorry but if you think the support gets as much gold as others then I refuse to believe you play much support or watch high elo supports play that further prove this. Lastly I am baffled you think a support should be worth a fraction of a player with the unwarranted unavoidable level penalty the role must suffer under the current state of the game. We are talking about a guaranteed set back for no advantage, justify that from those players perspective, they are the ones being punished with that... on both teams.

I don't play support, but it is highly one of the most effective roles in the game. Enchanters more so than tanks, but saying the items don't give as much as other items is a flat out lie. Almost all support items have some sort of active, and all of them are an extremely powerful one. They also all can get any support to 40% CDR easily, and most have over 300 mana regen by full build. Anyways if you want me to use Thresh as an example for Caitlyn I can also do that.

item 3069 1500 gold item 3190 2200 gold item 3107 2100 gold item 3109 2200 gold item 3050 2250 gold item 3117 900 gold Total: 11,150

Even cheaper than Soraka. The reason these items don't have as much defenses as other defensive items is because they're cheaper, yes, but if you look at actual tank items they do nothing for anyone else, and don't really have super powerful actives or passives. All support items are used to basically make ADCs overpowered. As for not getting rewarded, support role isn't really something you go in thinking about being rewarded for. Your reward is your ADC being unkillable. That's why you play support. That's why you build all these items, for them, not for you. Aside from the CDR and the mana regen which basically means you spam nonstop, you don't really get anything out of those items. The only way it could be fair for a support to get kill gold for assisting is if the support gets half of the kill gold and the ADC gets the other half. Otherwise it wouldn't be fair. If you want full kill gold, then your item costs need to be raised, and (possibly)support needs to be moved to it's own solo lane so that it doesn't warp ADCs making them even stronger. Another thought is you take one kill and your ADC takes another. It is a duo lane after all. You're sacrificing your kills to give them to your ADC. So yes, you should lose out on gold. Your ADC is getting double the gold of anyone else in their lanes if they're doing well.

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you also did not include the price of a warmogs in that soraka build, its pretty much core as I have been informed.

Yeah, she apparently doesn't build it anymore for whatever reason. I don't understand it myself as it makes sense for her and she doesn't have much HP without it for locket. If it were to be replaced I suppose she'd replace it with locket. Just add 650 to the original total cost and that would be a build with warmogs in it.

BloodnachtOct 7, 20181 votes

1500 gold 2200 gold 2100 gold 2200 gold 2250 gold 900 gold Total: 11,150.

Thanks, you didn't disappoint me. Once again you Copypasted the same Example over and over again as your ARGUMENT. Your build should be crafter on how BAD/GOOD your game goes/is. The fact that you only post me the same Itemized 11.150 or 13.350 or w.e the numbers are, are ridiculous. Like seriously, who builds item 3190 on a AP supp? its = to 0, you don't believe me? your choice, either way item 3117 isn't a viable usage to any of my game style ... why? First, i don't copy paste what i see on internet Second, i always make the CHAMPION which i play, FITTING to my own STYLE/GAMEPLAY Third, your lack of knowledge to come with own self arguments makes me think i'm retarded to prove you wrong Fourth, here i go being retarded and telling you once again, come with better Arguments, which are from your own PERSONAL EXPERIENCE rather than * I WAS WATCHING ON YOUTUBE or ON GG.OP * like seriously, wtf?

VoraciousXOct 7, 20181 votes

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Thanks, you didn't disappoint me. Once again you Copypasted the same Example over and over again as your ARGUMENT. Your build should be crafter on how BAD/GOOD your game goes/is. The fact that you only post me the same Itemized 11.150 or 13.350 or w.e the numbers are, are ridiculous. Like seriously, who builds on a AP supp? its = to 0, you don't believe me? your choice, either way isn't a viable usage to any of my game style ... why? First, i don't copy paste what i see on internet Second, i always make the CHAMPION which i play, FITTING to my own STYLE/GAMEPLAY Third, your lack of knowledge to come with own self arguments makes me think i'm retarded to prove you wrong Fourth, here i go being retarded and telling you once again, come with better Arguments, which are from your own PERSONAL EXPERIENCE rather than * I WAS WATCHING ON YOUTUBE or ON GG.OP * like seriously, wtf?

That build was for Thresh, not Soraka, the Soraka one, which I listed, was for Soraka. That post also wasn't talking to you, it was talking to the OP, who said that he couldn't talk about Soraka, so I gave him a Thresh list. As for Soraka, people don't build as much AP on her for one simple reason. They don't need to. AP makes her weaker because she's squishier. When you have heal and shield power which give you heals that are almost equal to the heals you would get if you ran a full AP item build, you can just build tank after you build your heal and shield power items. This is the last time I'm replying to you because one, you're entirely too emotional and aggressive, and 2, I'm the only one coming up with anything. All you're doing is claiming things with no actual basis for your claims. The Soraka's I see aren't building AP. They're building one, 2 at most AP items and the rest is heal/shield power/tanky. You can't speak from experience because experience isn't actual data you can see. OP.GG shows the data of what most players are using and gives a clearer picture into things. If I wanted to even make up an AP page, it'd still be cheaper than a mid laner's.

Just for randomosity's sake, this page wouldn't be GOOD for Soraka, but here is what an AP Soraka page would look like:

item 3092 1800 gold item 3504 2300 gold item 3174 2100 gold item 3905 2400 gold item 2065 2250 gold item 3020 1100 gold Total: 11,950 gold.

This is the last time I'll reply to you as you don't make sense and go off pure rage.

BloodnachtOct 7, 20181 votes

This is the last time I'm replying to you because one, you're entirely too emotional and aggressive, and 2, I'm the only one coming up with anything.

Just for randomosity's sake, this page wouldn't be GOOD for Soraka, but here is what an AP Soraka page would look like:

1800 gold 2300 gold 2100 gold 2400 gold 2250 gold 1100 gold Total: 11,950 gold.

This is the last time I'll reply to you as you don't make sense and go off pure rage.

Again, you came at me with something which you found on the INTERNET, congratz. You seems like you're underage since you think this is RAGE. You never came up with anything from your own PERSPECTIVE, only VIA Google, Internet, Others GG.OP or w.e you may find. The Simple fact that you can't comprehend the logic of an arguments its beyond me ... but hey, at least you tried.

VoraciousXOct 7, 20181 votes

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This is the last time I'm replying to you because one, you're entirely too emotional and aggressive, and 2, I'm the only one coming up with anything.

Again, you came at me with something which you found on the INTERNET, congratz. You seems like you're underage since you think this is RAGE. You never came up with anything from your own PERSPECTIVE, only VIA Google, Internet, Others GG.OP or w.e you may find. The Simple fact that you can't comprehend the logic of an arguments its beyond me ... but hey, at least you tried.

People like you really get my blood boiling. You just barge in and make assumptions out of nowhere with no actual proof at all for anything you say. Sorry to disappont, but that build was entirely made up by me because those are support AP items. You're clearly prejudiced about anything I say on this topic because I didn't look anything up on the internet, I simply looked at the costs of the items and combined them together for an "AP Soraka" build, which Soraka should not be building pure AP because she will die in seconds and she has better options which allow her to survive longer and still function as a support. You asked for AP Soraka, I gave you AP Soraka. The prices are still similar. This is REALLY the last time I reply, because I can't have people accuse me of things I didn't do. It really pisses me off.

BoatwhistleOct 7, 20181 votes

I cant speak much for soraka cause I don't play enchanters.

BoatwhistleOct 7, 20181 votes

you also did not include the price of a warmogs in that soraka build, its pretty much core as I have been informed.

BoatwhistleOct 7, 20181 votes

Pyke builds Black clever because of the high AD it gives him along with the added benefit of armor shred which helps his adc kill them faster. I don't play pyke cause I agree he is mostly selfish and I don't like playing assassins anyway. Thresh starts to build his first defense item after support item then tier two boots. By then everyone else has their first damage item and probably tier 1 or 2 boots depending or are even confident enough to start more dmg/tankiness. The 2100-2250 items are not worth as much in stats as other tank items understandably. He also doesn't build them any faster cause gold income is lower for supports which is why these items exist... which is why you don't see the support getting full build first, they get it last. All together putting the support behind most of the game on top of 1000s of Gs in level stats so even if you do really well you are behind. Just 5 support items give the adc more power. Only two are good enough to get early one only giving survival (knights vow, which happens to be bad for thresh cause ranged so he gets the shitty locket they gutted) and the other gives on hit and attack speed to make up for the fact enchanters cant tank for them as effectively or contribute as much damage past lane(ardent). Ultimately however this detracts from the main point which is the role is the most unrewarding in the most literal sense. You do well and get little making the role less fun being perpetually behind if played well. I am sorry but if you think the support gets as much gold as others then I refuse to believe you play much support or watch high elo supports play that further prove this. Lastly I am baffled you think a support should be worth a fraction of a player with the unwarranted unavoidable level penalty the role must suffer under the current state of the game. We are talking about a guaranteed set back for no advantage, justify that from those players perspective, they are the ones being punished with that... on both teams.

BoatwhistleOct 7, 20181 votes

No, in a typical game it is not equal or building 2.8k+ gold tank items on thresh(as an example) would be just as efficient for him as it is to do so on ramus. You build the cheap support tank items to get the passive values sooner then you would the higher price tank items. Into late game its worse as you could be far from full build doing this with each item. Two players should equal two players... When you gank bot you are ganking two players, you should be prepared to deal with at least two enemy players then. This should be fine as under ideal conditions playing intelligently it will be a 3v2... meaning you have the advantage still. The support has to leach exp the entire game. Putting them 1000s of gold in stat value behind until late game with no effective measure otherwise, the effect that protects from 2v1 lanes is nothing but a punishment to a role that has no choice otherwise for no advantage. I don't suggest kill gold for every kill, only when the suggested summoner is up and the kill is gotten within its effects, then it goes on cool down. Serving no other functions then for the kill pressure(like ignite) and a gold reward for the support playing will to facilitate/get the kill without punishing them passively for denying the adc gold.

ZT XperimentorOct 22, 20181 votes

Except the fact supports are still often behind the rest of the team significantly in gold and levels, unless someone on their team is purposely feeding all game. And it's one of the main reasons people don't like playing support, they're often an easy target because; the support usually can't waveclear, tends to roam more for warding in a meta where most people don't provide coverfire for fear of dying too, the support can't take objectives unless hilariously ignored or being opportunistic. they can't duel anyone without an immense advantage, their items are cheaper sure but also weaker stats to go with them with the sole exception of mana regeneration.

Why cant riot just treat support champions as special cases?

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