Ashe support

WeiseAzir·Feb 27, 2016·37 votes·3,667 views

http://i.imgur.com/0vKSsq6.png[/img]

its says here Ashe can secondary support.

please stop dodging :(

46 Comments

48983507DEL1Feb 27, 201637 votes

Hey, if she's strong enough to survive -20 degree temperatures with that much skin showing, I'd let the woman do what she wants.

JakraFeb 27, 201610 votes

Well she's not the only one who can do that Braum Tryndamere Janna

I know Janna is a strange one to put here, but in her splash, she's in the sky. The sky is cold AF.

NsEternalFeb 28, 20161 votes

hell id let my nutz sit in -20 degree weather for a woman like that ;)

RezandraFeb 27, 20169 votes

Dude, if you come into my ranked game and try to lock in Ashe support, I'm going to call you an idiot and dodge immediately. Those character pages haven't been updated in years. Have you seen the character page for Annie and what it shows for her difficulty level?

48983507DEL1Feb 27, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Those character pages haven't been updated in years.

I'm pretty sure that's the point of the post, bub.

RezandraFeb 27, 20165 votes

"please stop dodging" insinuates that he has tried locking in Ashe support and people have dodged because of it. If he wants to try it in his Bronze 4 promos, nobody cares. But people that are serious pick real supports in the elos that matter.

48983507DEL1Feb 27, 20169 votes

Or, and hear me out because I know this is a GIANT stretch...

he might JUST POSSIBLY

be joking.

Because there's so many people that legit believe Ashe support is viable.

WeiseAzirFeb 27, 20169 votes

but what if I just want to have fun? league can still be for fun right? also ranked is not in this equation

48983507DEL1Feb 27, 20162 votes

That too, but either way, some people just take this too seriously.

Supreme Senpai69Feb 27, 20162 votes

Having fun is legit, but not at the expense of others' fun. Winning lane and losing game because of a horrible support is unfun and very frustrating. I love going off meta but I definitely try it out with premades instead of doing it in solo Q, regardless of if its ranked or normals tbh.

DrehirthFeb 27, 20162 votes

meh a bad support is what costs you your lane because it's almost always decided by supports. If I actually won lane despite weird support but lost game I would look more to myself than the support...

Supreme Senpai69Feb 28, 20161 votes

I think we said the same thing?

DrehirthFeb 28, 20161 votes

no? you said winning lane but losing game. I said if you won lane but lost game chances are that it wasn't the supports fault.

Supreme Senpai69Feb 28, 20161 votes

Oh wow brainfart. You're right, winning lane but losing game wouldn't usually be the support's fault.

I still stand by what I said though, about an individual's fun shouldn't be at the cost of the entire group, but thanks for catchin that.

Jungle Lux GodFeb 27, 20163 votes

Your overarching goal in League of Legends is to have fun regardless of which game mode you play. It's just that the mode dictates what you should be playing to have that fun.

With normals (including ARAM), that fun comes from playing your favorite champions in a low-stress environment, practicing champions you want to get better on, learning new champions to add to your champion pool, and trying experimental off-builds or off-roles that can either expand the metagame or flop miserably. While it's easy to mark the fun up to being a "casual mode", there's also a thrill of learning that comes from normal games if you use them as so.

With ranked, that fun comes from the thrill of competition. There's no greater thrill than engaging in battle against an equally skilled opponent and coming out as the victor, and having that competition is what ranked is for. You play your best champions against your opponents in this mode because that offers the greatest competition.

TwinTon3Feb 27, 20162 votes

You sir, I tip my hat to. Never have I seen such a brilliant and well said explanation of what fun is in both Normals and Ranked. The truth of this post is beyond exquisite and deserves far more upvotes. It's just sad that half of the players (at least in my case during Normals) rage and flame because someone tries something new. Even if they're learning a champion, they expect such high levels of expertise. I wish more players shared this mindset as it would help make League far more enjoyable.

[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

WeiseAzirFeb 27, 20164 votes

ranked =/= me

A Miss FortuneFeb 27, 20163 votes

Ashe support is pretty strong though. She's a mix of a utility and poke support, because of her high auto range she can zone off the enemy ADC away from CS, especially if they're someone like Sivir who already have low range. Ashe has two global abilities so she always has global presence throughout the game. She's strong in lane and transitions well into a really strong teamfighter because of her global engaging potential.

5000000000000000Feb 27, 20161 votes

Ashe support used to work, but the rework nerfed her utility for her sustained damage/teamfight potential. When she had her slow on her Q instead of passive, you could get 40% slow on your autos at level 9. Her poke with the guaranteed crit passive was pretty oppressive, especially with Statikk Shiv. To be fair her E didn't have a charge mechanic, but since you max it second the CD wasn't too bad.

QueenAquaFeb 28, 20161 votes

I actually found Ashe support harder pre-rework. I recently played Ashe support with a duo in normals and we owned them. The ult gives good initiation and the q and w give good dmg and slow to secure the kill. The ranged agro definitely helps with her and she's an overall fun support to play. Don't know if I would take it into ranked, but i can say it was a fun game and she definitely has a lot of pluses to playing her as support. Plus, you can go dmg after you get ss almost right away, so it's like having 2 adcs in teamfights busting out dmg.

SukishooFeb 27, 20162 votes

Actually a lot of them have been updated. Teemo's used to list him as a support and they removed that.

Itadaki SeiekiFeb 27, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Dude, if you come into my ranked game and try to lock in Ashe support, I'm going to call you an idiot and dodge immediately. Those character pages haven't been updated in years. Have you seen the character page for Annie and what it shows for her difficulty level?

Her difficulty lies in predicted gameplay.

Everyone expects the flash tibbers. It's nothing new. Annie players have to work around that. She's extremely predictable, that's why she's so difficult. If the player can predict the playstyle of Annie, well there goes her all in. If you can play unpredictable, then well you're fucked. If you don't know how to play against her and she punishes you, it's not because she's easy. It's because it's a well known fact she'll ALWAYS all in you with Tibbers + stun.

If you see an Annie mid, just pick Xerath and you counter her. If you pick an equal range middle champion, then you're asking for a fight based on predictability of you and her.

Crystal RushFeb 27, 20166 votes

[(http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1900626574/216648224?tab=overview)] It works but if your ADC is not Tryndamere you are doing it wrong ;3

GenghisEmoFeb 27, 20165 votes

and there were pplthat dodge when she was adc XD

IcyPepperFeb 27, 20164 votes

Support secondary, although for some champions it's a little dated, but it tends to be for utility champions that either can support in the support role or have utility that aids their team even if they are a carry. Like Ashe's perma-slow and her ultimate is a great engage, especially for a champion in the ADC class.

Orianna, Lux, and Syndra are all secondary supports last time I checked, but that's more due to them being carries with some manner of utility rather than actual supports to be played. Although, you can support with them if you really wanted to, but they're not really optimal for it.

However, do whatever you want man. Find that Ashe support is the thing that tickles your fun bone in all the right ways for the game? Then by all means, play it. Discover new builds, new possibilities, new everything. And if, by some miracle, you discover that it outshines all meta supports or you have like a 80% win rate with it over 100 games, take it to ranked, get to Diamond or Master, and shame all the meta sheep in low elos.

And for the love of god, have fun!

NaharaFeb 28, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Orianna, Lux, and Syndra are all secondary supports last time I checked, but that's more due to them being carries with some manner of utility rather than actual supports to be played.

Karma is another good example of this.

IcyPepperFeb 28, 20161 votes

As with Vel'Koz and a few others. A good tank example would be Nautilus, since support secondary isn't exclusive to mages (but has a slight tendency, if I'm seeing it right. Rarely do you see a true assassin/support, after all).

Unstoppable MonkFeb 28, 20161 votes

Karma is more of an anti-carry utility mage. Her kit tends to stop champions from carrying the game.

Only Play DariusFeb 27, 20163 votes

By that logic Aatrox is a tank. And Malzahar is an assassin. And Kennel is an ADC. And Syndra is a support.

Duke AnaxFeb 27, 20161 votes

Well Tank Aatrox is simply impossible because his tankiness is tied to his damage, so no matter how you build him it will always end up a Brusier.

The others work though.

SukishooFeb 27, 20163 votes

Kennel

Never seen this champ

Syndra is a support

She can support really well actually.

JayrettFeb 28, 20161 votes

AD Jg Malzahar. Just saying.

SmithneyFeb 28, 20162 votes

[{quoted}](name=Jelly Mac,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=eeEUkOio,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2016-02-27T10:05:32.877+0000)

And Kennel is an ADC.

https://40.media.tumblr.com/9f41312b35567796fbf8b79b59099771/tumblr_mtwfv0oPA61sj9gaco1_500.jpg

OksanaandjoyFeb 27, 20163 votes

Agreed. I'm all about the oddish supports. If people can play them. Let them play!

JayrettFeb 28, 20161 votes

I've seen two troll pick Lee Sin supports, once when I was adc and again when I was mid. Both times they kicked ass.

BisaknospFeb 27, 20163 votes

i played it several times (in draft) and it is not thaaaaaat bad i build something like that

item 3092 item 2045 item 3512 item 3071 item 3009 item 3060

WeiseAzirFeb 27, 20162 votes

gonna try to make this more wide-stream. crit gives 10-50% slow so crit = utility. item 3069 or item 3092 . item 3046 item 3117 item 3143 item 2045 , situational item 3094 item 3190 item 3022 item 3100 item 3124 item 3085

YuGiHoFeb 27, 20162 votes

item 3085 item 3071 item 1308 item 3512 item 3190 item 2045 summoner 6 summoner 4 I start item 3303 and buy the first upgrade but sell it later.

BRBGTGBOWFLEXFeb 28, 20162 votes

Ashe support is really rough against the current meta so I wouldn't say it's viable. I'd play it with friends who are okay with it, rather than force it on random strangers who are going to be rightfully unhappy with the pick.

Swifties negate much of Ashe's utility. Her primary utility is a slow and swifties are great against slows. Add other sources of slow negation, and you begin the game at a disadvantage.
Her early game is inferior to way too many other supports. If you're ganked, Nami/Lulu can heal/shield you, speed you up, and CC enemies. Ashe can only use a slow. Further if you are receiving a gank, Ashe has little she can do pre-6 to enable it, and minions can interfere with what she could do.
Poke with no sustain. Most other poke champions have some form of sustain or damage negation contribution. Sona/Soraka/Nami can heal, Lulu/Janna/Karma can shield, Ashe can't really do anything outside of poke, and hers starts to become inferior to the others pretty rapidly.
Lack of Survival. Ashe does not add much to help you survive, particularly compared to other options. She's also not tanky, so she cannot help be a front-line. Alistar, Thresh, Leona, Braum, can all outperform her.

She has no niche in botlane where she is the best, and the others that are better than her in one dimension are better than her in multiple others as well. If you enjoy it, play it, but it's a bit unfair to expect everyone in the world to go along with your ideas.

WeiseAzirFeb 28, 20162 votes

+1 for tip. I did not know swifties counter slow but now that I think about it yeah they do. the meta does cater to strong early supports like Leona who can spend forever tanking tower or eliminating an adc's hp bar to keep pressure high.

my primary fascination with ashe is her E, map vision is a idea I really wish riot would heavily invest in. i know it possible though other champs like bard and lux. map vision is still having issues and I place a very high standard on map vision.

BRBGTGBOWFLEXFeb 28, 20161 votes

True, but that's also a way that the meta disfavors Ashe support.

Ashe's unique vision ability, Hawkshot, used to be very difficult to replicate. You could count on only one blue trinket per game, which sort of does what Hawkshot does, but usually only the ADC had it last season. This season, usually three members of the team will be running the blue trinket. Because of that, the relative value of Hawkshot as a vision tool has declined.

I think of Ashe as a utility ADC, one you pick up when you need a mix of ADC and support features for your comp. For example, in comps where you already have a lot of damage on other champions, Ashe's abilities are very helpful.

One of the issues with Ashe support is that she takes up one potential slot of tankiness without increasing the overall resilience of the composition.

Top, Jg, and Support are the three roles where you can place a tank champion. Usually you want damage on Top or Jg, because they have the budget to do it. Supports that improve resilience (Janna/Soraka) or supports that are resilient (all tanks) tend to fill this needed role. Ashe really can't.

ADC items are also very expensive so putting it on a gold starved role tends to be a bad strategy.

I am unsure if I would like to see Ashe become a viable support, mostly because ADCs are already going to three positions in the current meta and having them crowd over a fourth would be an unwelcome development. But eventually it would be cool for it to be more viable.

I think if you got very good with it, you could take it to high silver, one issue would be the sheer amount of tilt you would cause on teams. I do not think it has higher elo potential, since the influence of support Ashe isn't really strong enough to move the game that much.

Good luck and have fun with it, but try to make sure you sell it to people, it is part of your duty if you're going to play something off meta to minimize the impact on others.

junglerboy16Feb 27, 20161 votes

item 3092 / item 2301 + item 3071 item 3085 and whatever utility your team needs is actually a pretty legit build.

FCQ gives you strong lane trading and harass (woohoo, 600 AA range!), BC and Runaan's cover your damage and give you a ton of anti-tank utility (AoE instant armor shred from Q) and then you can build whatever the hell you want/need and function as a utility based semi-carry.