ARAM: let's talk TANK META - the TRUE major issue with ARAM

OnlyLosersVoteNo··5 votes·2,025 views

Definition: Tank Meta is where after 18-20 mins tank (and to a certain extent bruiser) based champions defenses outscale damage. There are only a couple items in game designed to try to help counter this for both AP and AD characters through preventing healing to a certain degree however it isn't effective enough and for the majority of cases if one team has 2 or 3 more tanks/bruisers and the game is past 18-20 mins: the vast overwhelming majority of the time you are looking at a loss.

The reason that tank meta isn't a thing in SR/pro circuit is because the ramp up to 18-20 mins includes about 3 to 4 finished items, and by the time SR/pros complete 3-4 finished items the game is all but over. (In most cases: it is over.) So this has never been a focus for Riot to even admit or open this for a topic of discussion in other game modes - like ARAM. In their minds: this isn't even an issue.

The reason this is now an ACTUAL issue in ARAM is the new banning system. What is happening, and predictably will continue to happen is that 10 damage based champions will be removed from the champion pool... meaning even more tanks (and bruisers) will end up being picked.

Welcoming our continued tanking overlords? You bet.

If you guys actually believe that banning champions like Ziggs, or Fiddle, or Teemo, or whatever you classify as top Tier1 damage is going to fix ARAM you are completely and totally wrong... if you don't think that this week will see pairings of 2-3-4 queuing buds start brand new accounts removing those top tier damagers... and going with more bruiser/tank based comps... you are totally out to lunch!

This banning change only further enhances tank meta!

There's a reason that champs like darius or garren or scion literally rip you apart with you on a skill shot/skill based character..... I can tell you for sure these champs are players rolling their faces across their keyboards while you desperately try your heart out to gain distance, and skill shotting... using full skill versus a 5 year old literally smashing at their keyboard: it's not because they are skilled at the game obviously.... it's because the game is fully designed mathmatically to reach a stage where that scion or garren just need to do 1 thing: close the gap and win. Literally tank and bruiser meta is a MAJOR flaw in this game... and very rarely spoken about.

Go back and check your losses, people. Before you want to argue with me here about it... check yourselves. How many losses past 18-20mins in ARAM do you have where the other team has just 1 more bruiser/tank to your team?

It's a thing. Like actually.

And guess what? There's way more of this coming.

So either this:

  1. You embrace tank meta fully understanding that this is how ARAM is from now on.
  2. You DON'T BAN A SINGLE CHAMP in ARAM.
  3. You ONLY BAN tanks instead of damage/skill based characters

ALSO - what you need to understand is another thing you are looking at is queue dodges... the alternative is to queue with buddies who will just dodge - we all have 5+ ARAM accounts and it's possible to do this too. So there is that too - more queue dodging and games just not starting. So much fun!

20 Comments

Kalikain6 votes

item 3165 item 3135 item 3020 item 3153 item 3124 item 3036 item 3033 Just itemize correctly. Tanks are not an issue. If they are, its not them, it's you. How to counter; Kite How to kill; Build the above items shove wave and wave clear so they don't break towers.

OnlyLosersVoteNo2 votes

You say this like I don't know how to try my best to counter that meta. I do. In all of my own gear set ups I 100% have "versus tank" item lay outs and I use them.

That doesn't prevent the meta though.

Tanks still just roll straight on through damage teams after the 20th minute.

If you have 3 tanks + 2 damage on 1 team, and 3 AP + 2 AD on the other team. If you do not finish that ARAM game in under 20 mins: you absolutely are looking at a very likely loss. This has been my own experience for the last 4 years in this meta - and it doesn't matter what you build, no item set in existence can counter this. At some point after the 20th minute: those 3 tanks will and are rolling over you.

If you are legitimately trying to argue this: then I don't believe you are playing ARAM very often and as much as I do.

Kalikain2 votes

Yeah, I'm 3000 games of aram in since 2013. So... I think I know.

OnlyLosersVoteNo1 votes

Then you know:

The fact is this (as much as you argue that human's need air to breath... in my mind: there's legitly zero basis to even counter what I'm saying): tank meta is a major MAJOR issue in ARAM. After the 20th minute even just 1 tank more per side is a MAJOR, NEARLY GAME BREAKING advantage.

If you want to argue this fact with me through saying it's me as a player (2013 also over like 9000 ARAM specific games over like 10 accounts) or that I just need to build items sets as if I'm a complete noob.... instead of agreeing with me about the very obvious tank/bruiser meta.... then honestly speaking I don't believe we need to even say anything at all to each other because clearly if we can't be honest with each other here and coming to this very obvious statement of fact: you are just a troll and here specifically to argue with anyone and everyone.

Tank meta is a thing. It's been a thing for years. 20th min in ARAM means one thing: those with more tanks will very likely win the game... 80-90% of the time.

Boltonator2 votes

{quoted}

Then you know:

The fact is this (as much as you argue that human's need air to breath... in my mind: there's legitly zero basis to even counter what I'm saying): tank meta is a major MAJOR issue in ARAM. After the 20th minute even just 1 tank more per side is a MAJOR, NEARLY GAME BREAKING advantage.

If you want to argue this fact with me through saying it's me as a player (2013 also over like 9000 ARAM specific games over like 10 accounts) or that I just need to build items sets as if I'm a complete noob.... instead of agreeing with me about the very obvious tank/bruiser meta.... then honestly speaking I don't believe we need to even say anything at all to each other because clearly if we can't be honest with each other here and coming to this very obvious statement of fact: you are just a troll and here specifically to argue with anyone and everyone.

Tank meta is a thing. It's been a thing for years. 20th min in ARAM means one thing: those with more tanks will very likely win the game... 80-90% of the time.

I honestly can’t take you seriously when your lone counter-argument to someone who provides sufficient proof that your logic is full of holes is “If you don’t agree with me then you’re clearly just a troll”

If you are trying to convince anybody, let alone ARAM veterans, that your logic makes sense then you need to be willing to have constructive discussions and not say that anyone who disagrees with you is an idiot.

OnlyLosersVoteNo1 votes

I don't believe you or anyone who tries to dispute the basic truth "after 20th minute, if a team has 2 or 3 tanks more than you, it is highly likely you are losing that game" plays ARAM very often. For me: if you can't even talk about tank meta even being "a thing" in this game means that we shouldn't be talking. It's equivalent to me as an anti-vaxxer or flat-earther. Like really. It's that obvious you are either so out there in your logic or just trolling.

If we first want to start this discussion on equal platform where we can come to a consensus that, after the 20th min in a game, that tank meta is an INTEGRAL part of ARAM? Then great! We can move on to the next part of this discussion surrounding why banning in ARAM is a legitimate concern due to tank meta.

Boltonator1 votes

{quoted}

I don't believe you or anyone who tries to dispute the basic truth "after 20th minute, if a team has 2 or 3 tanks more than you, it is highly likely you are losing that game" plays ARAM very often. For me: if you can't even talk about tank meta even being "a thing" in this game means that we shouldn't be talking. It's equivalent to me as an anti-vaxxer or flat-earther. Like really. It's that obvious you are either so out there in your logic or just trolling.

If we first want to start this discussion on equal platform where we can come to a consensus that, after the 20th min in a game, that tank meta is an INTEGRAL part of ARAM? Then great! We can move on to the next part of this discussion surrounding why banning in ARAM is a legitimate concern due to tank meta.

Alright then...I’ll bite...

Say that bans create a tank-meta in the future and Riot decides to remove the bans from the game mode. Guess what ARAM becomes again?

ARAM-only accounts with only mages.

You are claiming that bans will create a meta that doesn’t even exist yet completely ignoring the fact that mages have long been the bane of ARAM games, particularly Ziggs, Lux, Zyra, Veigar, Zoe, Heimerdinger and the like. Bans are there to keep ARAM-only accounts from stockpiling easy wins by cheesing through the random aspect of the game mode. I guess you haven’t had the misfortune of playing against a full team of mages and basically losing in less than ten minutes because you’re team consists of all melee and tanks, who never even get to hit the enemy turret a single time. Yes, tanks may get more exposure as a result but they are lightyears easier to deal with and do damage to then a majority of the mages in ARAM.

620 ARAM games to my name, while not as impressive as the 3,000 someone else has, means I have seen my fair share of matchups and know when a game will be one-sided.

By the way, I don’t care if you downvote my posts OP, you’ve said enough to convince me you’ll stick by your stance come hell or high water. I’m not too keen on downvoting gameplay posts, just Player Behavior.

OnlyLosersVoteNo1 votes

So right now the issue is that the game is now all trash all mid - or all tank all mid.

The champs you listed are... FUN to play! And if both sides have equal opportunity to have them, then the game is really fun...

I have accounts that I've unlocked specifically 15 champs (3 tanks, 3 bruisers, 3 AP, 3 AD, 3 supports) so that I could slightly cheese the "all random" aspects of it. My current account I have unlocked a ton more than just 15 champs - I only unlock champs now that 1) I'm strong with 2) that I find highly fun to play

Lately though with all the banning I am consistently getting really unfun champs or tanks. Essentially the tailings in a drained out pond.

For me personally: this week in ARAM has been completely not fun - chaulk full of players dodging (holy smokes it's SO BAD lately, hey everyone?) - getting champs that are highly trash - even using my rerolls to get even more trash... it's SO FRUSTRATING to use 2 rerolls and get stuck with Vi or whatever trash, no fun to play, champ.

Discussing it with my ARAM duo partner: we ultimately may just leave this mode if this goes live... OR... we've counter argued actually setting up new accounts and unlock specific champs (Mundo, Garren, Thrash, Scion... etc) taking ONLY bruiser/tanks and just winning every single game via tank meta. (Both he and myself agree that we really DON'T want to play the game this way - it's actually not fun... ARAM was fun for both of us last week... minus tank meta which was felt frequently enough in our games.)

The last ditch alternative for both he and I would be to just queue hop with our 10 accounts until we get champs we actually want to play.

BE AWARE: that banning will absolutely lead to 1) way more queue hops - so games taking 5+ mins to even start - and when those games start? You better believe that if YOU have a crap line up: that other team gonna be GOOD 2) way more tank meta and trash line ups

Kalikain3 votes

So I really will never believe you when you say, over 10 accounts you've played 9000. Virtually impossible to prove which is why anyone who is a real veteran knows better. If you do have 9000 games in ARAM, and really believe IN A DAMAGE META, that tanks are a problem. Why are there only 3 tanks in the top 30 champions in aram? https://lolalytics.com/aram/worldwide/platinum/plus/champions/ Here is my proof We have Maokai, sion and Mundo. thats 10% of the top 30 champs in aram are tanks. How is this tank meta when tanks have the lowest representation in win rate in ARAM?

I simply stated it before, and I will again. If you have an issue with tanks, its not the tanks, its you as a player.

4/45 of the top are tanks 11/60 of the top are tanks 15/75 of the top are tanks

It's not like I picked a poor sample size, its consistent

8/30 of the bottom 30 champions are tanks. Thats 26%, thats a differential of 16%

LETS DO MAGES

Out of the top 20, 10 are mages 50% out of the bottom 20, 2 are mages 10%

OnlyLosersVoteNo1 votes

All I've been saying is this: check your losses - specifically out of those loses how many of those are games lasting longer than 20 mins? Of those games specifically how many more tanks/bruisers does the other team have vs yours?

HP Crookshanks3 votes

item 3165 and item 3020 don't counter tanks. Flat magic penetration counters squishy champions not tanks. item 3135 is the only AP item that counters magic resist. That's why AP champions deal no damage when enemy starts to build magic resist and full AP team means auto loss.

OnlyLosersVoteNo3 votes

Thank you.

You can legit stack every single piece of MR penetration in this game and that scion or garren will continue forward and crush you.

Boltonator4 votes

Tanks get their shit pushed in in almost every ARAM game unless the game gets dragged out and they start to scale. Even when they do the hard counter to tanks is as easy as tying your shoelaces: kite them, slow them, displace them, get armor pen, get magic pen, get %hp damage items.

It isn’t rocket science.

I just noticed your username and it makes sense why you would want to claim tanks are OP and just surrendering when you face them instead of, I don’t know, trying to build what they are weak to?

OnlyLosersVoteNo1 votes

{quoted}

Tanks get their shit pushed in in almost every ARAM game unless the game gets dragged out and they start to scale. Even when they do the hard counter to tanks is as easy as tying your shoelaces: kite them, slow them, displace them, get armor pen, get magic pen, get %hp damage items.

It isn’t rocket science.

It shouldn't be rocket science - but the problem right now is you can stack every single counter tank item in this game and you WILL likely lose after 20th mins to tank/bruiser based teams. If the opposition has 2 or 3 bruisers/tanks who take a couple MR/AR items: you are highly likely losing after 20 mins.

Your only recourse is to rush tower killing and win the game before the 20th min.

This is an issue BECAUSE now you are forcing more of this meta through allowing players to ban out damage characters.... leaving players to get more bruisers/tanks.

wolvius2 votes

{quoted}

Tanks get their shit pushed in in almost every ARAM game unless the game gets dragged out and they start to scale. Even when they do the hard counter to tanks is as easy as tying your shoelaces: kite them, slow them, displace them, get armor pen, get magic pen, get %hp damage items.

It isn’t rocket science.

Don't forget one that's often ignored, change your full ap team to have the TF or lulu go AD, you legit shoulnt complain about the enemy finally taking time to kill if your ranged full Ap damage or full squishy AD team and dont end before the midgame where defense matter before its ignored lategame.

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Also OP there are some changes implemented that actually lessen the advantage melee gained this patch.

Triumph healing was nerfed from 12 to 6% missing health, this affects tankier champs more than squishies as they don't get as much a restore from a takedown which often made the difference between surviving or respawning.

Also damage to turrets was increased as well, so the early game before the 'tanky' team has had a chance to adapt by buying items should net you towers quicklier if yer actually trying to win.

Also there is plenty of time to react before they get significantly tanky, if you see a lot of resist components start your %armour pen items. Dont forget black cleaver is great item as it helps your ally monkeys that don't understand that executioners is useful against a team with Darius Maokai Vladimir or that last whisper items exist.

OnlyLosersVoteNo1 votes

The thing is man... I have item sets very specifically for when my team is down by 2 or 3 tanks... I buy all the items... I do my ultra best to kite... to move away from their damage... there's only a certain amount of realty in ARAM and all they have to do to win the game is take towers...

What I'm simply stating here is this: banning is only perpetuating tank meta and tank meta is and has always been a cancer to this game.

It's even cancer because people like you and clearly others in this thread simply can't even openly admit that there actually IS an issue.

If BOTH teams have equal number of tanks: NOT A PROBLEM. If one team has ONE tank - most of the time: NOT A PROBLEM. If one team has 2 or 3 tanks - then that team is 80-90% likely to win the game if it makes it to 20th minute.

That's all I'm saying here.

I'll bet if people here who only play ARAM took the time to look through their losses they may be surprised to see that very clearly 20 mins+ is tank winning time... and sadly: that does happen a fair % of the ARAM I play.

wolvius2 votes

{quoted}

The thing is man... I have item sets very specifically for when my team is down by 2 or 3 tanks... I buy all the items... I do my ultra best to kite... to move away from their damage... there's only a certain amount of realty in ARAM and all they have to do to win the game is take towers...

What I'm simply stating here is this: banning is only perpetuating tank meta and tank meta is and has always been a cancer to this game.

It's even cancer because people like you and clearly others in this thread simply can't even openly admit that there actually IS an issue.

If BOTH teams have equal number of tanks: NOT A PROBLEM. If one team has ONE tank - most of the time: NOT A PROBLEM. If one team has 2 or 3 tanks - then that team is 80-90% likely to win the game if it makes it to 20th minute.

That's all I'm saying here.

I'll bet if people here who only play ARAM took the time to look through their losses they may be surprised to see that very clearly 20 mins+ is tank winning time... and sadly: that does happen a fair % of the ARAM I play.

That's the unfortunate problem of ARAM sadly there are games you will never win, that's the nature of gambling RNG. I'm guessing most of those games ye don't even have one form of disengage like janna on a full squishy team and they have hard engage bruisers like irelia, jax who can just on hit murder you that don't sacrifice anything for their mobility/damage combo.

The same can happen for all melee comps you can get a bunch of tanks champs that suck as initiators (poppy, tahm )and can't achieve anytime because when you hit a snowball there is a condemn or janna ult, stun to answer on arrival. And enivitably lose without scratching turret.

Those tank stomps only really occur when they have something like a pyke to murder with extreme mobility as followup. Damn that champ can solo carry, wow have you seen him with new mariners, he don't even have to blow his ult recast before death because he can get a double after death with it.

There will never be a universal best class on ARAM, it'll always be on a champ basis. Something like cassio,veigir, maokai, ( statwise actually get banned fairly often as he is the best tank in the mode) pyke, will always slip through. Champs like reksai will never be good on ARAM as they are.

sliceruser2 votes

The problem with tanks right now in such modes is people are so unused to them being anything that they dont itemize to kill them at all not even a black cleaver or void or anything of the like.

OnlyLosersVoteNo2 votes

{quoted}

The problem with tanks right now in such modes is people are so unused to them being anything that they dont itemize to kill them at all not even a black cleaver or void or anything of the like.

It doesn't help. Even if your entire 5 damage dealers kitted themselves out specifically to counter tanks based on items (MR pen, etc) it's still not enough... 3 tanks will dominate after the 20th minute... and we can all agree that it's fairly easy to stall an ARAM game to the 20th minute... even with random players just typing "we have to stall this one, boys... let's just delay to 20th min" - you don't even need to be in Skype to do this... a bunch of randoms will and can stall games.

wolvius2 votes

Also the reason garen rips mage/adc teams apart is he can go trinity into tanky items, mow down a badly positioned enemy then heal up due to his warmogs passive after running away

Darius shreds because his win condition is getting into range and fully inserting his axe up your rear passage wether you be ranged or melee. There a reason he often goes ghost instead of a damage summoner on the rift.

Well sion is just op on ARAM, people don't respect the bush cheese and the thicc shield he can get. (He probably need a W passive nerf not damage taken nerf for ARAM, he get more health per stack just like nasus right)

The main reason tanks after 20mins can become so dominant is you rarely even see one of a near full adc team build BC to help their teams damage and in general they build no resistances.

Always crit/lethality rarely even see hybrid items such as mercurial until 3 or 4th item against a fully melee team when they need survivability not more damage to win.

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