Poacher's Dirk should just be removed at this point.

The Milky Bae·5/22/2017, 4:12:11 PM·148 votes·4,394 views

item 3252 Poacher's Dirk is quite literally useless. Why would I buy an item for 600 gold, then go risk my life once every 50 seconds to go kill an enemy jungler's camp. Just purely for the "great reward" of saving 700 gold. In total if you killed the enemy's camp perfectly at 50 seconds right as it refreshes, it would take you 2:30 seconds to transform Poacher's Dirk into Serrated Dirk.

Now not only do you have to risk going into the enemy's jungle every 50 seconds, you have to pray that every time, you not only find a camp that isn't already killed, you have to hope that the whole enemy team doesn't collapse on you and kill you instantly. Plus all the time you are gone, the enemy jungler could be stealing your blue!!

Basically, in short, Rito either needs to buff Poacher's Dirk in some form, or they might as well remove it.

116 Comments

SweedishGunner5/22/2017, 5:46:06 PM64 votes

Zephyr was probably bought more and we know where that went.

EndlessSorcerer5/22/2017, 6:20:43 PM40 votes

I'm not going to lie here.

I completely forgot that item existed.

Ralanr5/22/2017, 5:32:56 PM35 votes

Maybe just stop making items or effects that announce, "I AM GOING TO COUNTERJUNGLE YOU NOW!!!" In bright, neon letters?

Sire Hippington5/22/2017, 8:40:53 PM10 votes

Not saying poachers is a good item or even a good concept, but 'saveing 700 gold' IS a fucking huge reward, that's like FB+another kill

Dataless5/22/2017, 6:29:35 PM8 votes

I've never even seen Poacher's Dirk built in any game I have played since it was added.

Sp33d Zer05/22/2017, 5:36:47 PM7 votes

I like to use it. Then again, I like Cull, Refillable potions, and pink wards. Anything that provides a lot more value over time and can possibly accelerate my mid-late has always been a favorite for me.

Gixia5/22/2017, 11:56:12 PM5 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Milky Bae,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=c1VtPbt4,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-05-22T16:12:11.767+0000)

item 3252 Poacher's Dirk is quite literally useless. Why would I buy an item for 600 gold, then go risk my life once every 50 seconds to go kill an enemy jungler's camp. Just purely for the "great reward" of saving 700 gold. In total if you killed the enemy's camp perfectly at 50 seconds right as it refreshes, it would take you 2:30 seconds to transform Poacher's Dirk into Serrated Dirk.

You say that like 700 gold is not a significant amount of gold. Like... seriously? "Why would I buy an item for 600 gold that gives me 700 gold?" That's really a question you have to ask like you can't figure it out? Yes, it takes longer to turn a Poacher's Dirk into a Serrated Dirk than it takes to just buy a Serrated Dirk, but it's faster to turn a Poacher's Dirk into a Youmuu's/Duskblade/Edge of Night than it is to turn a normal Serrated Dirk into one. It's a risk-reward item. You're getting your Serrated Dirk slower so that you can finish it faster by being able to put that 700 gold you saved into the other components.

Now not only do you have to risk going into the enemy's jungle every 50 seconds, you have to pray that every time, you not only find a camp that isn't already killed, you have to hope that the whole enemy team doesn't collapse on you and kill you instantly. Plus all the time you are gone, the enemy jungler could be stealing your blue!!

All this tells me is that you don't understand how to counter jungle properly. That 'the enemy jungler could be stealing your blue' in particular is the worst damn excuse for anything. Yeah, he could be. He could also be taking blue while you're ganking, or he could be taking dragon or rift herald while you're taking your own blue. The enemy jungler isn't going to just sit on his ass twiddling his thumbs while you do things. In fact, as a jungler, part of your job for the team is to try and keep track of whether the other jungler is at any given point in time, either by tracking his jungle route or through wards. And hey, when you're dropping wards to scout for him, maybe you see a camp he hasn't taken yet. Assuming you're not bad, you should be taking that anyways just to deny him it, and if you have a poacher's dirk then that's an extra reward for doing it. Enemy team is starting to collapse on you? Good thing you were watching the minimap and those wards you just dropped so you know to quit what you're doing and get the hell out of there.

alfavhunter5/22/2017, 5:13:40 PM5 votes

how they should change it

getting a kill or assist reduces the remaining CD by 20 seconds

in other words, go take a camp, gank a lane or 2 and then you can go take another camp

edit: this is also a healthy item with this change still because it lowers their power to use gold on this item vs another option giving the enemy a chance to catch up to a lead, but if they fail to do so it pays off better for the person buying it

similar to item 1083

Tobias Brackner5/22/2017, 6:10:07 PM4 votes

Git gud, counterjungling isn't that hard or scary

Subject 55/22/2017, 5:50:05 PM4 votes

Talon Jungle is what I play often recently. I get 3 poachers and earn myself a bunch of gold using them and just ganking all day. I might lack EXP but Riot is like "You're good m8, just gank all day and you'll recover." so that's why I get poachers. He's real safe in the jungle because of his E

TwitchInMyPants5/22/2017, 5:30:01 PM3 votes

I notice they regularly make items for playing on the enemy jungle but they always have shitty stats. My biggest concern invading is getting caught and not escaping. AD won't help me with that, wards might, health might, but its not great outside of on Nunu. Where's an item with movespeed for being on the enemy side? Why isn't there something that actually acknowledges that going across the river from your jungle risks time which if your enemy is farming normally has to spare?

rtbf2256182415/22/2017, 6:06:00 PM3 votes

It should just randomly choose an enemy camp or one of the 2 buffs to transform it and only require one steal. That way it would actually give initiative.

Shinjusuke5/22/2017, 10:08:08 PM3 votes

I love this item in theory.

It's just so goddamn useless right now.

If they dropped the wait time from 50 seconds to 30 seconds, or dropped the amount of steals required from 3 to 2, it'd be worth it.

"But then it'd be too gold efficient!" you might protest. Well then, unknown-and-totally-not-made-up commentor, my counter-argument is that this item takes up an item slot and forces a pretty damn hefty risk on you as the jungler, especially if the enemy team notices you bought it. Seems worth it to me.

Tormentula5/22/2017, 6:06:19 PM3 votes

Its such a useless item.

Especially considering the fact that in the time it takes to transform poacher's into a dirk, you usually can just afford a dirk and that 600g is better spent on two long swords or if you don't have enough, a long sword and a control ward which gives more counter jungle pressure in itself.

Unless poacher's dirk literally becomes a jungle starting item, I see no reason to get it on any junglers besides Khazix Rengar Pantheon but even they don't rush dirk anymore (or build it at all for that matter) with their more recent builds.

Even if it was buffed, there aren't as many junglers as there are mid and top laners who actually build dirk.

YambrinZ5/23/2017, 12:28:29 AM3 votes

What is really needed is other items similar to poachers dirk that offer other buildpaths. Like an item that costs X amount of gold that turns into a giants belt....or an ap item. The fact that there are very few junglers who can even use serrated in their builds means people just forget the item exists usually....which wouldnt be the case if EVERY jungler could build an item that was risk vs reward like that.

Sexy Jack Rabbit5/23/2017, 7:22:18 AM2 votes

Tbh I think an AP Counterpart would work better if they didn't want to get rid of it.

kurthl33t5/23/2017, 4:59:18 AM1 votes

What the hell is Poacher's Dirk?