Boards›Gameplay

Solo/duo system seems so broken and lost.

mye PP··4 votes·1,401 views

item 3067 Why is League, this great team sport with its well-planned and functional MMR system, trying to make players be responsible for other players they don't know from Adam?

In 5x5 and 3x3 matches, League of Legends comes into it's own with teams, strategies & synergy. Your team's victories and losses are all about what you and your team accomplished in your scheming and designs. This is positive reinforcement.

In solo/duo queue, you are rewarded and penalized based on your team's victories/losses. Except that these aren't your buddies. You have almost no rapport with them nor level of relationship where you have an idea of what they're doing. You don't have any idea of their capabilities and weak areas beyond what you might have gleaned from one of the stat sites while loading up the match. This forces players into the many infamous situations that we always see complaints about: "Le Blanc open!", "First time Mundo!", "Jungle or feed", "Stop feeding Draven, Soraka!", "I'm not a good Top laner", the list goes on and on. I'm not sure what the goal of this is, because unless you're really good and can carry all your teams comps all the time, you're not going to get much pleasure out of the matches.

IMHO, solo/duo queues should either be real solo/duo matches (1x1 or 2x2) or the reward system needs to be altered. I'll give props for endeavoring to get random people to play together as a cohesive unit, but that is not feasible in reality without a few warm up laps at least.

One thing that might help is implementing the team builder for ranked.

Hope to see some constructive information here.

18 Comments

GaleWinUnleashed3 votes

Team Builder for Ranked is already in production. We'll pick our role, get a strategy all settled, then get dropped into a perfectly normal Draft Pick, just without any arguing over roles.

Edit with quote from Lyte and source:

"It'll be role selection only, with a "Fill" role as well."

http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/2smys1/riot_does_reporting_for_intentional_feeding/cnrfva2 (also look 2 comments up for a bit of context; Ranked Team Builder is apparently prioritized for the "immediate short-term")

H0riz0n2341 votes

REALLY!!!!!!! God I hope so.

GaleWinUnleashed2 votes

Added source.

Ada Wong1 votes

{quoted}

Team Builder for Ranked is already in production. We'll pick our role, get a strategy all settled, then get dropped into a perfectly normal Draft Pick, just without any arguing over roles.

Edit with quote from Lyte and source:

http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/2smys1/riot_does_reporting_for_intentional_feeding/cnrfva2 (also look 2 comments up for a bit of context; Ranked Team Builder is apparently prioritized for the "immediate short-term")

Please put it in already it would really help lower the amount of times I get reported for toxicity when Meta gets broken because of non communication, and it sure would allow me to simply play the roles I feel like making me be able to not only do good myself but be able to do what I can to help others in the game in other words less toxicity, less reports, less rage from other players because they are like go bot, and you get an instant lock zero communication player (I personally) Cant stand or play with these players because ( I feed) I get reported (Meta gets broken) I get reported (Chat Restrictions) Rarely rank restriction even because of getting so many bad match-ups with issues like zero communication.

Kitten of Evil1 votes

How do you propose the system be improved, OP? I think everyone agrees there are some problems, but I'm not sure there are any obvious solutions.

mye PP1 votes

If Riot likes the current system of grab random players together and see if they can play nice, then there few solutions beyond a Band-Aid or two.

  1. As it currently stands, where you must play with random players, your LP should not be based on the team's victory/loss.

This is something that I believe Riot and probably even other games have avoided because it can break the concept of "Five players united as one team". It just rarely comes into fruition IRL. There is no magical instant teamwork solution.

If this is the choice, then they would have to conceive a new system for the ladder.

  1. Make a real duo (2x2) map with its own ladder. Remove the current "normal draft game...only that it's ranked" method. Random player encounters only happen outside the ranked system.

  2. Teambuilder. This will be a fairly nice Band-Aid. It will work well with their current ladder. It will not filter trolls, allow people to protect themselves from problematic players, nor will it take into account your "blocked" list.

Kitten of Evil1 votes

How do you determine appropriate LP otherwise? KDA might work for carries, but for supports or tanks, KDA isn't a good measure of how well you did.

But also ranked is meant to weigh your skills at SR. If you wanted to play TT, you would. 3v3 or 2v2 maps are not going to be the same, nor will they be as popular.

Teambuilder for ranked might work, but I'd imagine it will have the same problem regular Teambuilder has -- namely, nobody wants to support.

mye PP1 votes

I don't know. It's complicated at the least. Generating LP through an individual player's KDA can create problems where players won't care about their team at all and only focus on whatever gives them LP. That's why players are awarded LP based on match outcome, not KDA.

I believe that Riot would have to step back and really think this one over if that is what they opted to do.

Through Teambuilder, each person defines their role and the game registers that information. If your LP was based off of win/loss offset, player role offset, KDA, & objective takedown assist, it could work. Both positively and negatively.

I personally don't really intend to lay out the future of the ranked solo/duo queue here. I have no idea of the inner workings of League, nor of Riot's methods. I do have a player's perspective, though.

Pvt Yong Tai1 votes

I can't think of a better system.

Duo queue exists because some players simply don't have 4 other friends to play with, and playing solo can get lonely at times.

Just be glad 3-queue and especially 4-queue is not allowed.

H0riz0n2341 votes

Except it doesn't test the skill of lower elos. I sticks you with random players supposedly your skill and if you lose because your team feeds thats on you. Great system indeed

Pvt Yong Tai1 votes

that's fine with me. I carried myself straight to plat easily within my first 100 ranked games.

If you truly deserve to rise in the ranks, you will.

If you aren't rising, then you aren't improving.
Maybe try practicing and studying more.
You can't avoid studying. Studying is a part of learning, and to get good at this game, learning must take place.

And if you really want to blame your teammates, then never feed yourself. Do you go 0 deaths every game? If not, then there is room for you to improve. Why should you expect your teammates not to feed when you feed yourself? Remember, a death of a fed member is far more significant than a death of a feeding member. A single death by you, who I assume is "carrying the game", brings down the power level of your surviving team significantly. Until you can handle not dying yourself, then don't blame your teammates for dying, either.

EDIT: oh pfft I saw something in my inbox and came here and realized I replied to you, who made your post 6 days ago. My apologies.

H0riz0n2341 votes

The only thing im studying is how not to feed like my teammates. My first game in B3 after making it there is a feeding jungler and a Lb who throws out her abilities instead of strategically learning the best time to use her combo. I played with B4 players better then my team, quite sad if you ask me. But then again I didn't see this coming as I was first pick. Thinking The players were better I went supp hopefully providing good cc for the team. Now after game I feel I Really should of went adc(adc's cant get countered bad if your a good adc). So as I went in hoping for some strategic gameplay for me to really focus on I got a usual Bronzie team. Now my adc wasn't bad and neither was top but they weren't good either(They were decent plain and simple). Our vayne kept catching jinx's W and karmas skill shots. When I reminded her to dodge them she said "I Know" so I was thinking that late game would her chance. Well there wasn't much of a late game since our mid and jungler were bad but I did learn something. It was my dumbass fault for thinking for that one game in bronze I shouldn't risk getting countered and support instead.

Just say that the famous feeing xin was B3, makes me lose hope in the system. And now that I think about sometimes deaths are necessary. As a supp I have to protect my adc and I will die for my adc sometimes. Now if I have a adc after constant reminder to stop overextending and feeding pretty much I will not help her because that her own fault.(Rather 1 death instead of 2). But if my adc is pretty good I will die to protect her and as a supp if you dont have any deaths either your not supporting or your team Is really good.

mye PP1 votes

3 queue does exist, as does 5 queue, but they have their own stand-alone system: 3x3 & 5x5. How many complaints do we hear from those ladders?

Most of these problems stem from solo/duo queue alone.

Elite4Runner1 votes

I would always encourage Riot to rethink the way they do everything, but I know they always are. The problem with 1 v 1 or 2 v 2 is that each champion is designed to have strengths and weaknesses which are intended to encourage them to work together well with other champions. A 1 v 1 game would completely eliminate some champions from play. 2v2 would come down to 1 carry 1 support. I feel like Riot is actually doing a good job of providing game varieties that allow for diverse teams. I'm only talking about champion select though.

As for player skill and evaluation, .. I believe that is part of where they are going with this champion ranking system. If you are a person who plays a support champion, they will probably be more likely to be able to judge your strength as a support and match you with a carry who plays that roll at a similar level. .. I'm honestly just guessing, but the fact that they are introducing this feature and say there is more to come says that they are thinking about it.

mye PP1 votes

I personally don't think that Riot would go for 1x1 or 2x2, although it isn't entirely impossible.

You said that "they will probably be more likely to be able to judge your strength as a support and match you with a carry who plays that roll at a similar level". The problem is what if said adc decides to go jungle? That person never knew what the MMR system expected of them.

Through Teambuilder it's possible, I suppose.

Cavemantero1 votes

They need to get rid of solo/duo queue and just do team builder. At least this way you're not forced to dodge since you can get booted and join a squad that fits you. The only problem with team builder is even on normals lots of d-bagz are quick to ban you for trying to break meta.

Elite4Runner1 votes

Well again, I'm just speculating, but if you look at what Riot has been doing recently; they have released team builder, giving players the ability to chose the roll and the champion they would like to play, they are about to release a system that measures your "skill" (or at the very least the number of times you have played) with each champion. So if you select that you would like to play bot lane ADC as Ashe and you have played at least 50 games as Ashe. Riot would likely match you with a support who has a similar number of games with the support champion they would like to play. .... Although, this does raise an interesting question. If an ADC has had very little experience, would Riot be more likely to place them with a support who has had little experience also? The only way this works is if both sides have very little experience for balance, which is of course ideal. Alternatively, would they attempt to place someone with higher experience in order to make the lane stronger? Strong support with weaker carry or strong carry with weaker support. Either way, I am sure that Riot is working on a system in order to ATTEMPT to create balance. And, just like everything else they have released, including champions, I am betting they will release something that will be broken at first and over time, continue to adjust it until it does what it was intended to do.

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by mye PP

Malzahar is dead: 2018
Gameplay10 comments
5
votes
Why isn't Teemo's blind like Graves'?
Gameplay4 comments
4
votes
MMR dis?
Gameplay12 comments
4
votes
Pied Piper Singed
Concepts & Creations1 comments
4
votes
Streamline champ-selection bans
Gameplay5 comments
3
votes
How is there there no chroma for Malzahar?
Concepts & Creations2 comments
3
votes