Riot Please Make An ASSASSIN META

TSA unityinstall·Apr 16, 2016·2 votes·1,492 views

Hey Everyone, I just wanted to say that we need an assassin meta. For the current and last season we had a top lane meta, bot lane meta, jungle meta, but we never had a true mid lane meta. When I mean mid lane, I mean like fizz vs zed or like LeBlanc vs Talon matcups in lcs. Right now tanks are overpowered, as all assassins build sunfires cape or iceborn gauntlet. The adc's had a huge time right now, the tanks get buffed, and right now we should transition to the meta of a solo carry one. A assassin should be rewarded for snowballing and not treated like a sitting duck in the 30 minute mark because of the massive tank and defensive options people now have. We need DFG or some assassin related item to make assassins great again. I want more outplays, more reward for pure mechanical skill.

Regards, Unitydownload

31 Comments

TheThundersRoarApr 16, 20165 votes

I was going to say something, but actually...

I'm just gonna sit here and watch everyone in Gameplay & Balance come eat you alive.

ModWulf HelhammerApr 16, 20161 votes

Dammit now I can't say that!

TSA unityinstallApr 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I was going to say something, but actually...

I'm just gonna sit here and watch everyone in Gameplay & Balance come eat you alive.

Can you explain why?

RalanrApr 16, 20161 votes

Most people fucking hate fighting assassins.

AnnoxisApr 16, 20163 votes

From memory, in season 4, there was an assassin meta. From memory, it was by a great margin one of the worst meta I have experienced.

Furthermore, if you want to show « Pure mechanical skill », the fact that DFG isn't here shouldn't bother you that much, right ?

TSA unityinstallApr 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

From memory, in season 4, there was an assassin meta. From memory, it was by a great margin one of the worst meta I have experienced.

Furthermore, if you want to show « Pure mechanical skill », the fact that DFG isn't here shouldn't bother you that much, right ?

Worlds was much better from a spectators perspective. I just feel UN-rewarded as an assassin. Season 4 was not necessarily a better meta but it was much more fun. People actually valued mechanical skill and just not farm, lane-swap and wait till teamfights happen. In solo-q a assassins role is greatly diminshed because there are much better options such as building bruiser or simply tank. I am not proposing to make asssassins kings, I am saying that assassins should be good at what they are doing. That is killing champions that are supposed to be squishy.

Utilizing items is part of the mechanical skill process. It is called using items in time for the right purposes. The itemization right now is really bad for assassins as they do not have the same correlated reward to mechanical skill.

AnnoxisApr 16, 20163 votes

There is a little something you seem to forget : Assassins are defined by their very nature high-risk, high-reward champion. But, the meta design what is the most likely to make you win and is thus played accordingly. You see where the problem is lying, I guess.

You want mechanical outplay ? Okay, it is fine. But if assassins become a great part of the meta, it just mean that they are strong. Winning with Kha'Zix at the start of the S4, was it a great display of mechanical outplay, when, you towerdived the ADC with your evolved ult ? No, because he was utterly overpowered. The stronger assassins are, the less you can outplay your opponent since the quality of an outplay is measured by the risk taken by the player, risk that is dimished by the overall strength of your champ.

TSA unityinstallApr 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

There is a little something you seem to forget : Assassins are by their very nature high-risk, high-reward champion. But, the meta design what is the most likely to make you win and is thus played accordingly. You see where the problem is lying, I guess.

You want mechanical outplay ? Okay, it is fine. But if assassins become a great part of the meta, it just mean that they are strong. Winning with Kha'Zix at the start of the S4, was it a great display of mechanical outplay. No, because he was utterly overpowered. The stronger assassins are, the less you can outplay your opponent since the quality of an outplay is measured by the risk taken by the player, risk that is dimished by the overall strength of your champ.

According to your theory then why should assassins even bother to exist. If a tanky bruiser can do the same thing as an assassin with less effort, where does the high rewards really come in. You can argue that the complexity of a play is what makes it an outplay, but that is about the same parallel you can make of a zed outplay being much more insignificant to like a annie one.

If assassins have high risk but equal reward, then that is when they need buffs. I am proposing it based on this conjecture.

ModWulf HelhammerApr 16, 20162 votes

It was called season 4. Like, all of season 4. You think people complain about Zed a lot now? This is nothing compared to then, on top of the complaints about Akali, Katarina, and LeBlanc. Tanks were nearly non-existent during that time. Everyone just built damage and teamfights were really more of just burn everything at the enemy and hope everyone on the enemy dies.

MokkunApr 16, 20162 votes

Of the various role-based metas you can have, assassin metas are by far the most cancerous. It comes down to ping, super-snowballing, and who can do more unavoidable damage faster.

Assassin metas exist when the defensive side of the arms race is very very far behind. Tank metas may be boring and grindy, but there's more of a sense that you can react to what's going on.

Personally, from a competitive standpoint, I think support metas are best, because those are teamwork metas. For non-organized play, generalist mage metas probably end up being the most fun in the aggregate.

TSA unityinstallApr 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Of the various role-based metas you can have, assassin metas are by far the most cancerous. It comes down to ping, super-snowballing, and who can do more unavoidable damage faster.

Assassin metas exist when the defensive side of the arms race is very very far behind. Tank metas may be boring and grindy, but there's more of a sense that you can react to what's going on.

Personally, from a competitive standpoint, I think support metas are best, because those are teamwork metas. For non-organized play, generalist mage metas probably end up being the most fun in the aggregate.

I agree. I just wanted some input on assassins needing a bit more attention now. I just hope riot gives a shoving hand to assassins.

1 800 MID LANEApr 16, 20161 votes

We've had an assassin meta this season already IMO. Not a really strong one where assassins were required, cough ADCs cough but an assassin meta nonetheless due to ADCs being the way they were/are. Either way, I think most people would rather have tanks and tank items simply deal less damage and give other things lower base damage or ratios.

TSA unityinstallApr 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

We've had an assassin meta this season already IMO. Not a really strong one where assassins were required, cough ADCs cough but an assassin meta nonetheless due to ADCs being the way they were/are. Either way, I think most people would rather have tanks and tank items simply deal less damage and give other things lower base damage or ratios.

ADC's may be assassins but remember a lot of adc's became much stronger due to items such as maw and steraks. Graves is a prime example of this. When I mean assassin I generally mean the champions with the Assassin classification provided by riot.

1 800 MID LANEApr 16, 20161 votes

No. As in ADCs are required and assassins haven't been entirely required this season. However, due to ADCs being as strong as they were and are, assassins became much more usable and popular. Pop the ADC and your tanks are free to do whatever they want.

TSA unityinstallApr 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

No. As in ADCs are required and assassins haven't been entirely required this season. However, due to ADCs being as strong as they were and are, assassins became much more usable and popular. Pop the ADC and your tanks are free to do whatever they want.

Hypothetically you are correct. The issue is that adc fundamentally screws over assassins. Look at graves, Lucian and Jhin. With streaks, maw and with much better hybrid damage items, an assassins job to assassinate is much more difficult.

1 800 MID LANEApr 16, 20162 votes

Steraks and maw fuck everyone over. Anyone who can utilize them, will. Assassins included. An assassin's job shouldn't be as easy as you seem to think. They're supposed to be high risk, high reward. As of late, they're mediocre risk, high reward. Most assassins have a pretty safe lane phase if you play it right, and in teamfights, even if they don't kill the carries, getting them low enough to be out of a fight is just as good for the rest of that fight. ADCs can't do a whole lot alone unless they're really fed, so while their team has no damage behind them, the rest of your team is just going to destroy them. After that, the ADC that you took out of the fight now has no one to peel and may as well be dead with the rest of them at that point. All they can really do is clear waves unless, again, they're really fed.

TSA unityinstallApr 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Steraks and maw fuck everyone over. Anyone who can utilize them, will. Assassins included. An assassin's job shouldn't be as easy as you seem to think. They're supposed to be high risk, high reward. As of late, they're mediocre risk, high reward. Most assassins have a pretty safe lane phase if you play it right, and in teamfights, even if they don't kill the carries, getting them low enough to be out of a fight is just as good for the rest of that fight. ADCs can't do a whole lot alone unless they're really fed, so while their team has no damage behind them, the rest of your team is just going to destroy them. After that, the ADC that you took out of the fight now has no one to peel and may as well be dead with the rest of them at that point. All they can really do is clear waves unless, again, they're really fed.

how do assassins have a high reward if they cant kill the carries. Your example just exemplifies a mediocre risk and a mediocre reward. They go in, they do some damage, enemy carry lives and assassin doesn't do much after major spells are burnt. Assassins are supposed to have a good laning phase so they can spike in mid game. The issue in the meta right now is that the spike is not as noticable as adc's can stack up defensive items and tanks do so much damage. As a result assassins also stack up defensive items like maw, which invalidates their original purpose of high damage high burst.

1 800 MID LANEApr 16, 20161 votes

They have a high reward because most carries wouldn't build maw or sterak's as their first item and if they do, they're already getting dominated. Assassins roam to get ahead and when they're ahead, sterak's and maw won't make a huge difference in a 1v1. There is literally no reason to buff assassins.

CoolMike127Apr 16, 20161 votes

Riot are currently testing for a massive Mage update right now that will be live in the near future. That will change up the meta greatly for mid lane, if you wanted a change for mid laners.

Assassins already had received item 3147 to help them assassinate their targets, and that is already a great quality of life item for them.

Riot are also trying to provide more emphasis on team-play, than individual performance (as the result of Dynamic Queue), so they aren't going to start a heavy emphasis on a solo carry meta (Mages are getting an over-haul because they haven't been in meta for a lot longer than any other group of champions).

If you are complaining that you can't assassinate a champion because a tank (whose main job is to provide CC and peel for their damage) gets in your way, I'm sorry to say, but that is completely fair and balanced (imagine assassins being able to ignore tanks completely during mid-late game. That would break the entire game, not just the current meta.

TSA unityinstallApr 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Riot are currently testing for a massive Mage update right now that will be live in the near future. That will change up the meta greatly for mid lane, if you wanted a change for mid laners.

Assassins already had received to help them assassinate their targets, and that is already a great quality of life item for them.

Riot are also trying to provide more emphasis on team-play, than individual performance (as the result of Dynamic Queue), so they aren't going to start a heavy emphasis on a solo carry meta (Mages are getting an over-haul because they haven't been in meta for a lot longer than any other group of champions).

If you are complaining that you can't assassinate a champion because a tank (whose main job is to provide CC and peel for their damage) gets in your way, I'm sorry to say, but that is completely fair and balanced (imagine assassins being able to ignore tanks completely during mid-late game. That would break the entire game, not just the current meta.

I am fine with the tank being able to stop me from assassinating, but I do not feel that a kindred sated jg that also builds tank should also be able to stop me as an assassin. Being a bruiser right now offers the best of two worlds which I really hate.

Tanks also do an insane amount of damage right now, in some cases they are able to outdamage in single targets than assassins. In your theory, right now the tanks and bruisers are doing the assassins job.

ReeplayApr 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Riot are currently testing for a massive Mage update right now that will be live in the near future. That will change up the meta greatly for mid lane, if you wanted a change for mid laners.

Assassins already had received to help them assassinate their targets, and that is already a great quality of life item for them.

Riot are also trying to provide more emphasis on team-play, than individual performance (as the result of Dynamic Queue), so they aren't going to start a heavy emphasis on a solo carry meta (Mages are getting an over-haul because they haven't been in meta for a lot longer than any other group of champions).

If you are complaining that you can't assassinate a champion because a tank (whose main job is to provide CC and peel for their damage) gets in your way, I'm sorry to say, but that is completely fair and balanced (imagine assassins being able to ignore tanks completely during mid-late game. That would break the entire game, not just the current meta.

The issue is the tank whose job is to provide CC and peel for their damage are doing as much damage as their carries for the first 25 minutes. That has basically broken the entire game (meta) in my opinion. Dynamic Queue aside, season 6 has been a complete shit show from a balance perspective. From what it's seemed like with reworks, the idea is if everything is overpowered, then nothing is over powered. Obviously each kit has flaws, and the champion is only as good as the player, but so many champions currently have such a distinct advantage just by shit design from the itemization staff.

TSA unityinstallApr 16, 20161 votes

Another thing I would like to mention is the Dunning-Kugger Effect, where simply Assassins seem much more frustrating from a gamer's perspective because they tend to delete people faster. This does not mean that they are more op compared to a tank nautilus, but rather that they just feel a lot more frustrating to deal against. When you see a tank nautilius you dont expect the massive amounts of damage he is applying. When you are against a zed, you just feel helpless against his death mark. The Nautilus may eventually kill more people but the zed simply just causes more rage.

AaravosApr 16, 20161 votes

i wouldn't mind an assasin meta, but without Zed

StaconaApr 16, 20161 votes

Its already the assassin meta, and when does people ever like playing against assassins?

TSA unityinstallApr 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Its already the assassin meta, and when does people ever like playing against assassins?

If maokai is op now, I don't think it is the assassins meta.

TSA unityinstallApr 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Its already the assassin meta, and when does people ever like playing against assassins?

Are you implying that playing against op tanks and bruisers are better?

RalanrApr 16, 20161 votes

But I like having a colorful screen.

DrNovaApr 16, 20161 votes

Mechanical skill?

Jump onto so.eone, smash all 4 buttons and kill them instantly. How is that mechanical skill?

TSA unityinstallApr 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Mechanical skill?

Jump onto so.eone, smash all 4 buttons and kill them instantly. How is that mechanical skill?

it is much better than some tanks that press r to win. Fundamentally all champions just press four buttons and win. That is like saying that basketball is an easy game, because u just throw the ball in the hoop.

DrNovaApr 16, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=TSA unityinstall,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZGNdgijN,comment-id=000a0000,timestamp=2016-04-16T19:00:55.533+0000)

it is much better than some tanks that press r to win. Fundamentally all champions just press four buttons and win. That is like saying that basketball is an easy game, because u just throw the ball in the hoop.

Not really. Not every champ can just smash buttons and win, a lot actually need setup or skillshots to hit, ect.

Assassins, my point is, nearly all blink to you somehow then just blow their entire load at once. Really is the point kinda with the current skillsets of assassins, outside may e lb who needs a little more attention to her combo order.

But they aren't really mechanically Intensive when going in for the kill.

Besides it has always been assassin meta to some degree or another. As long as there is a squishy to kill, assassins have always been around. Granted at various levels of tank meta they have dipped some, but since the release of zed I can't remember him not being a reletivley common pick.

Archen2Apr 16, 20161 votes