Fail Tank Runes

Saggitairre·11/9/2017, 4:36:04 PM·88 votes·3,901 views

Currently all damage roles gain access to their damage from runes at the start of the game. Tanks that take the conditioning rune though have to wait 10 minutes to gain their armor and mr. This has been a game changer for me. I usually play Leona and being that she did not get any armor and mr added to her kit (likely becasues of her w), I am just getting blown up. I started taking coin instead of relic, as I get punished way too hard trying to proc charges.

Having that armor and mr would help a lot early game. I do not see why we, or perhaps a tank jungler should have to wait 10 minutes into a game (basically half the game now) to have access to this, while the damage runes do not have that kind of delay.

57 Comments

ToBeSomebody11/9/2017, 6:24:38 PM26 votes

Of all of the trees the Resolve tree definitely does feel the most underwhelming.

Keystone: Tanks were given a slightly better Grasp, a slightly reworked Courage, and a support/peel assist option for keystones.

First minor rune: While I'll admit that the tower buster rune is a cool mechanic, it's not often too useful for tanks themselves. We see the return of Stoneborn Pact without the added life and a very niche third option that makes us feel a little better for taking Flash/Teleport, two 5-minute CD summoners.

Second minor rune: This is the real kicker. This section right here is why I don't like to pick the Resolve tree at all. You can either choose to take a measly (and boy do I mean measly) early game bonus to armor or MR with the added bonus of a small % boost anytime you're shielded, healed or pop a potion, for the next three seconds; or you can choose to get no early game benefit whatsoever and gain yet another measly bonus to armor and MR with a permanent small % boost to both. Every one of these options is pitiful.

Third minor rune: Here we see the return of Windspeaker's, a mini Doran's Shield passive, and a stackable % health bonus that provides more benefit from time spent in lane (could still be good for tank junglers but not as much)

Edit: The Windspeaker's rework doesn't include the defenses like it did before, just a buff to heal/shields.

ModCaptainMårvelous11/9/2017, 11:45:18 PM14 votes

Ok, parts of this aren't even remotely true.

Currently all damage roles gain access to their damage from runes at the start of the game. Tanks that take the conditioning rune though have to wait 10 minutes to gain their armor and mr.

Yeah, that's your trade-off for conditioning. You wait ten minutes then get your (fairly big) bonus. See:

Magical Footwear
Celestial Body (Albeit that's 100 HP for -10% damage early on)
Gathering Storm
The Legend tree (Which requires farming)

That's your trade-off. You're weaker early for a bigger bonus later.

I usually play Leona and being that she did not get any armor and mr added to her kit (likely becasues of her w), I am just getting blown up. I started taking coin instead of relic, as I get punished way too hard trying to proc charges.

https://puu.sh/yiwMD/45b6bf35ca.jpg

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Having that armor and mr would help a lot early game. I do not see why we, or perhaps a tank jungler should have to wait 10 minutes into a game (basically half the game now) to have access to this, while the damage runes do not have that kind of delay.

Good news, you don't have to!

Iron Skin IT'S FREE Gain +5 Armor LIQUID COURAGE Heal effects from consumables, heals for 20+ health, and shields increase your Armor by 5% for 3 seconds

Look, I get it, the defensive tree needs work...but please don't go around spreading misinformation when there is obvious counterpoints to what you're saying.

FCJAAAAGOOOO11/9/2017, 9:53:13 PM9 votes

Armor is now exclusively either built into tanky supports or tank items, and mages have zero armor. Really it makes tank items more relevant alongside the fact that there's no free %arpen anymore which is nice. The downside to that is in most cases you -have- to build tank items to be not squishy in general. Every champion in the game is susceptible to getting blown up right now.

Tolinar11/10/2017, 1:48:26 AM8 votes

Grasp of the Undying doesn't scale well, and Overgrowth doesn't give you hardly enough even if you spend all game pushing. Hell I can TP back and forth between lanes catching minion waves, and I won't get anything worthwhile from Overgrowth.

What's good is Demolish. And Second Wind. Second Wind is REALLY good early but it falls off. But early is what you want it for.

There's not enough good defensive options.

Shuyin17811/9/2017, 4:52:53 PM6 votes

Leona did get the armor added in. it just wasn't documented until later in the PBE cycle.

Shuriman Curator11/10/2017, 3:53:35 AM5 votes

In all honesty, Riot needs to take the damage down a good notch.

nGio11/9/2017, 11:38:31 PM4 votes

The tank runes are pretty bad in general. Tank runes should actually be the strongest, because of horrible tank itemization. Instead, AD get their Dusk Blades and Zeal items for every occasion with insane fucking runes, and tanks are left with shit. Halfway through the day yesterday, the 'tanks' in my games just started building damage, because they were getting insta-stomped with full tank anyway, so I guess they wanted to at least land a big hit on their way out.

AirKingNeo11/10/2017, 5:00:03 AM3 votes

Nerf damage runes. Don't buff tank ones.

Less powercreep, the better.

RocketRelm11/9/2017, 11:51:10 PM3 votes

I feel awkward because I was thinking about Darius top, and Aftershock seems tailor made for him (you pull, and if the enemy tries to trade back on you, they're hitting you with a buttload extra resists). But the rest of the Resolve tree is so bad that I'm wondering if it's worth going for another tree's capstone just so I can avoid the resolve tree and the +130 HP in favor of damage boosts.

Commissariat11/10/2017, 1:22:04 AM2 votes

Jungle tanks seem to have gotten the worst end of the runes. Literally no real diversity if you're someone like Zac, Nunu, or Sej.

Chumpzi11a11/9/2017, 6:48:14 PM2 votes

Shouldn't Leona take precision anyway? She's like the poster child for press the attack. Resolve looks fine for a secondary path.

Curean11/9/2017, 7:24:36 PM2 votes

I dunno, I've been rolling with my Ornn jungle and loving the resolve tree.

Aftershock is a nice chunk of damage especially since it's based off your max hp and aoe. For the few times I've laned with him grasp of the undying is strong as fuck, and lets you minorly scale hp as you go.

While I'm not a fan of unflinching personally, demolish really promotes tank junglers pressuring lanes as it's a massive hit to the tower, and font is very strong for helping squishies heal since that too is based off your max hp

I do agree the armor/mr talents are a bit weak. As a jungler I take the 10 minute one and the flat+% bonuses feel nice, but a laner might feel a little jipped on it.

The third row is just good all around. Overgrowth syncs well with your other talents and helps any champs with % hp abilities scale harder, revitalize is a bit weird as I dont see any heal/shield champs going into the resolve tree. Second wind is pretty nice for lane sustainability to me.

I think it just needs a few tweaks and maybe looking at the middle row a bit harder then it'll be in a good spot

NekoniClaws11/9/2017, 9:49:52 PM2 votes

I'm on the same page of you. 300K mastery, gold onetricked her, 5.5KDA- in norms- and today I fed.

2 hours; dedicated to learning and setting up the runes, only aftershock immediately grabbed me as 'for leona', the scaling tank ones are a wide miss for support tanks. I wasn't happy to see some of aftershock's powerbudget put into damage -that means it's not in tank stats. 'Leona is a tank, I'm sure the other runes are just as bad for other classes' I say to myself, trying to rationalize the failure......... .... I witness firsthand how out of control damage is- facing Jhin (a poke adc, usually no problem for Leona) I lose lane slightly- I try to play macro when my adc is safe so we can get ahead, only to realize my EXP isn't going up (too late! Now I'm behind!). Pointlessly try and save my carries from burst with locket + gargoyle before realizing there's just too much burst, and then my team flat out tells me- with that build, I'm just not a tank, because I had little over 1500 HP- Yes I had some armor, but that's pitiful. I blamed the runes, 'I picked the wrong ones... that's all, right?' and tried a variation much closer to, but not yet, optimal- More failure, my biggest problem being even playing safer, I just can't save people. Then I tried Thresh, and watched my adc disappear before I could throw a hook... Tanking nerfed, Macro nerfed, Peel nerfed. I've been pretty furious all day.

Now people are crowing about how damage is great on Leona, because fervor was played at Worlds. Yeah, I saw it. I'd already been there, done that, happy to see it in Worlds, and I understood why it worked, and when it won't work. You can't just copy ONE LCS strat and throw a fervor style Leona at everything. But y'know, most people never saw the value of a tank in the first place, they just think we shove CC down people's throats and then yell 'stop getting Blitz hooked!' at us after we've bodyblocked it 6 times in a row. They don't realise, if you're poked out of the frontline, they're dead. Perhaps right now, it's true and doesn't make any difference. But I find this game, in its more well balanced states, isn't just 5 v 5 burst assassins (even if one of those assassins is Leona.)

To help I'll share my updated runes- I've not tested them out, maybe they can be improved, so goodluck. Resolve > aftershock, font of life, iron skin, second wind, Domination > taste of blood, zombieward. Taste of blood procs Iron Skin (or the MR alternative) - Second Wind protects a little from the poke but that's all she wrote. I'm waiting on an I0ki stream to see what he's doing. Until then,

Maligaro Spike11/10/2017, 8:56:27 PM2 votes

I hate that you need to heal 20 points to even use the 2 runes that grants immediate armor or mres at their maximum, also conditioning is seriously too strong to pass and toplane matters less in this meta anyway so you better just play safe

SweedishGunner11/10/2017, 1:56:04 AM1 votes

Leona got the 20 armour though? Or at least a Rioter said she did.

Sun Wu Ryuumoku11/10/2017, 12:24:48 AM1 votes

Grasp is op

while the damage runes do not have that kind of delay.

i don't agree :

to begin eyeball need conditionnal to work
and lethality is still lethality... so u need time gain the full arpen

kasfas11/9/2017, 11:09:34 PM1 votes

I don't think that he defensive tree is bad. I think some of the other trees are just significantly better. That's not to say that some things could be made more accessible in the defensive tree like the armour and mr stuff, but it's pretty decent overall.

Now when you see tgings like press the attack, lethal tempo, and dark harvest, then you see why some think the defensive tree is too weak. No it's not weak, those trees are just too good.

It's not just the keystones either. Things like sudden impact, ravenous hunter, overheal, etc tend to be a bit better than the defensive tree.

But above all, the biggest issue is still individual balance and item tuning. Ad items scale rediculously well off of each other whereas defensive stats don't do so as well. In addition offensive items have ways to ignore defensive itemization and defences, making the resolve tree more underwhelming than it should be.

That's not to say that some other things on other trees aren't good either, like kleptomancy may be too good, and summon aery might do too much damage, but those are less problematic than the two trees designed for excessive damage.

Alimentateur11/10/2017, 5:59:40 AM1 votes

then you probably got it all wrong.

just played support blitz and i had 150 armor @ lv 7 with not even my first item complete hence assists count towards bounty hunter the lifesteal is insane <3

junglerboy1611/10/2017, 6:35:01 AM1 votes

Leona did get the armor MR buff though, they said it was an error on the PBE notes, but she got them in game.

If she still doesn't have it that's a bug.

Faceroll Tactics11/10/2017, 1:38:05 PM1 votes

Leona got 20 more armor at level 1

avilus11/10/2017, 5:12:18 PM1 votes

tank runes are fine, you’re just not accustom to the power shift

you’ve got access to demolish for tower power and iron skin for +5 armor — not even including aftershock for +30% resistances, along with scaling or sustain from overgrowth/second wind, respectively

leona can even pair this with sorcery for ultimate hat for more solar flares — she’s in a great spot

Squey11/10/2017, 8:11:41 PM1 votes

ok resolve tree is underwhelming however... Leona is one of the strongest supports with the new runes. Your doing something wrong for sure. I played 5 games of leona last night and completely wrecked the entire enemy team every single game. Not once did we lose lane. Even when we where camped by all 5 including a 14-3 irelia we didnt lose lane. I as leona had plenty of tools to get kills for my adc and peel the irelia off long enough for her to die. We didnt just win every single game i played leona. Me and my adc carried those game super hard. It isnt just proper runes either. First game it fucked up my rune page and gave me half preset and half what i wanted. 3rd game it gave me full preset page for no reason. Despite this the out come was the same. ( my personal rune page was the best though). Also we had a differant adc every game. Jinx, kalista, vayne, didnt matter. Leona is a blast and rediculously strong right now. Yes u have less starting stats but that support lux/nami has alot lesss.

Lord of Math11/16/2017, 2:48:32 AM1 votes

Make a keystone for resolve that gives you Tenacity, Slow Resist, Movespeed, and other bonuses when you hard Crowd control someone on the enemy team. Give tanks a rune that basically gives them Garen W passive, so that they can keep stacking armor for killing stuff, or give Grasp of the Undying 1 armor and magic resist.

LOSINGISMYPRIDE11/10/2017, 1:04:43 AM1 votes

but but its to shorthen game .... Teemo