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Yasuo windwall change to no longer block ultimates

Nochebr··9 votes·3,586 views

Hey call me a hater, but is it not dumb that yasuo's windwall blocks like 30+ champ's ultimate abilities? I can kinda feel the aa blocking as ok... but does it really make sense that some wind will block a giant tidal wave, and like every skill shot in the game???

If we could change wind wall to just block aa, then ok maybe yasuo is then a balanced champion.

I could even live with malphite and zac just giving him faceroll ultimates on all 5 of ur team if u were foolish enough to clump up, as long as ashe could hit him with an arrow, or he couldn't block the entire reason miss fortune is a viable adc in solo q with a basic ability... he could at knock her up to end the channel anyway, that would be fair. Her ultimate is difficult enough to setup against a non-brain dead team comp, ya know?

So like let yasuo build tanky with lifesteal, let him have 100% crit with 2 items, let him block basic range aa with windwall, but change windwall so it doesn't block ultimate abilities like nami's wave and then he is close to a balanced champ imo.

41 Comments

CrimsonDawn775 votes

Agreed. It's ridiculous that Yasuo has what should basically be a support ultimate for a basic ability. If riot ever reworked Janna, or created a similar new support, I would expect something like a slightly better windwall as an ult.

Nochebr1 votes

Janna is pretty good/fair/balanced as is :) But yeah I agree with you that it is a god tier support ability only someone like braum should have.

PermabannedGaren2 votes

{quoted}

Janna is pretty good/fair/balanced as is :) But yeah I agree with you that it is a god tier support ability only someone like braum should have.

Janna is considerably stronger as a champion than Yasuo is, and is completely unfair to play against as a melee champion who relies on diving at all.

Jorencice1 votes

Which is balanved because she does almost 0 damage by herself.

CrimsonDawn771 votes

That's not true I don't think. Janna counters divers, but that makes her a counter, not necessarily op. If you're playing Vayne, Zyra's immensely oppressive poke, zoning and damage seems totally unfair. The problem with Yasuo is he's immensely overloaded and does double crit broken damage. That makes him so dominant at lower elo. Look at what Apdo said about Yasuo. He said that Yasuo doesn't seem as good at higher elo because higher elo players are very good at punishing small mistakes which hurts as Yasuo is squishy, and also high elo Yas players still don't have enough self-control and judgement so they end up going too ham and getting shut down. But some pro players and one tricks can actually fully utilize his op damage and overloaded abilities to make him truly overpowered. He was an intrinsically broken champ; idk if he still is that bad or not, as Apdo said that in S6.

CrimsonDawn771 votes

Yep. and I'm not saying that Janna needs a rework, that was just an example.

sit kid2 votes

or just wait till its gone?

Its litterally the only defence he has to not get blown up

Nochebr3 votes

well he does have a shield, a viable tanky build, dashes to easily dodge projectiles, tons of damage to one-two shot carries... you know Riot is planning on nerfing him in some way anyways(they have said posted this publicly they want to focus on him and other unbalanced champs in 7.2), so I say change his windwall to not block ultimate projectiles(it can still block other skill shots like lux q) and see if that balances him.

Zielmann2 votes

I can think of two possible changes that would be acceptable:

  1. On the back-end, split Nami's ult into several separate segments (5-7?), so instead of one really wide segment, you have several narrow ones running in parallel. This way, the wind wall (or Braum's wall) could block part of her ult, while the rest of it continues past.

  2. Shorten the duration of wind wall. 3.75 seconds is a long time to have to hold your ult simply because wind wall exists in the general area you want to cast the ult. What's worse is that wind wall feels like it lasts slightly longer, because it still blocks stuff while it fades away. If any little bit of it still exists, it'll stop her entire ult. If wind wall only lasted 2 seconds, or even less, it'd feel more like the Yasuo has to choose what specific incoming spell he wants to prioritize blocking, rather than being able to just put it up during the fight and having a safe space to stand where he can't get hit by much. Like, Fiora's Riposte is a much better implementation of a blocking sort of spell in this regard.

Nochebr1 votes

i definitely agree with #2. That could be a smart and fair nerf.

As for #1, I think it would be cool to see nami's wave actually behave like water and split apart over terrain and a wind wall or braums shield, but maybe that would be kinda broken and I don't think Riot would do it just for the sake of nami, especially since shes already a pretty good champ anyway.

Zielmann1 votes

I've felt like they should hit his wind wall's duration for a long time now. Also reduces the time he can stand inside of it and be basically invulnerable to most spell and ranged autos during laning. I'm fine with the wind wall blocking ults in general, just would rather it be more of a point of skill and timing to select what to block than simply sticking a wall up and being safe for nearly 4 seconds.

But #1 doesn't actually feel too far-fetched to me, even if Nami is already in a decent spot. I wouldn't go so far as having it interact with the terrain, though that'd be awesome. But all you have to do is experience the very edge of Nami's ult clipping wind wall and suddenly disappearing to see that there's an inherent problem with this interaction as it is. It may not be a huge problem now, but I'd almost say it's a must-change if they decide to put a similar blocking ability on even just one more new champion.

Truly Prideful2 votes

I would have less of an issue with it if the hitbox wasn't so wonky. That thing grabs some projectiles that don't even touch it. Also, it shouldn't block projectiles fired from the back of the windwall. If anything projectiles fired from the back should go through and be sped up.

I do think it shouldn't block ultimates, but I think they might need to drop the cooldown some if it only blocked basic abilities and attacks.

Nochebr1 votes

Sure man, just brainstorming a way to balance a controversial champ. :)

Rinart732 votes

2 years passed and Riot did nothing about it. I don't mind that Yasuo windwall blocks projectile abilities, but it **shouldn't **block ults. This makes no sense from a balancing point of view. I can understand when Xayah ult allows her to dodge stuff. It's balanced, because it's ult too.

khorney1 votes

somehow it doesnt block lux ult

Nochebr1 votes

yes, it definitely makes sense that wind can't block something as potent as a laser :)

IronwallJackson3 votes

Like Blumpkin mentioneed, Lux's ult isn't a projectile. It's actually a linear aoe nuke, like Brand's Pillar.

Blumpkin Nation3 votes

It's not a projectile...

Reval1 votes

It's a lazer, so abilites that aren't projectiles don't get blocked, so lucian Q, nasus E, xerath's w and q, rumbles Q, maybe even kayn's w or illaois q.

Trap or a Trick1 votes

20 champs ults? Ahri Ashe Brand Braum Caitlyn Corki Draven Ezreal Fizz Gragas Graves Jhin Jinx Katarina Lucian MissFortune Nami Nautilus Poppy Riven Rumble Sejuani Sona Swain Syndra Taliyah Talon Tristana Twitch Varus Vayne Veigar only 30+

Nochebr1 votes

woah i did not know it blocked rumble, poppy, taliyah, and talon ult. I was just throwing up a guess estimate with 20.

IronwallJackson1 votes

Nautilus's ult has some weird coding to it that makes it bypass windwall, Rumble's ult is only kind of sort of blocked by it in certain cases, and Vayne's ult is an AD steroid, what do you mean it gets blocked?

Edit: Windwall only blocks the projectile portion of Ahri's ult, not the dashes.

Generally speaking, if an ability has a travel time, it counts as a projectile and thus gets blocked. Exceptions occur, but that's the rule of thumb. Furthermore, many abilities that involved objects coded as minons will stop at the wall but not be destroyed because the wall only axes the ability that causes the "minon" to move, hency why Taliyah's ult get stopped and why Azir's Q stops but his soldiers remain.

Trap or a Trick1 votes

enchants her autos, autos are projectiles boom

IronwallJackson1 votes

That's a very inane way of looking at it.

BlueBilberry1 votes

{quoted}

Nautilus's ult has some weird coding to it that makes it bypass windwall, Rumble's ult is only kind of sort of blocked by it in certain cases, and Vayne's ult is an AD steroid, what do you mean it gets blocked?

Maybe because Naut's ult is a AoE ground based attack? I think AoE ults can work their way past the wall as long they don't target the wall as such. For example, if Brand's ult hits a minion to the side of the wall, then it can spread behind the wall.

Just noting here, Rammus's ult also works too. (It's lots of fun to fight Yas as Rammus - after constantly bullying and pushing in the little ground-dweller into his turret, he fires up the windwall and pokes the heck out of Rammus, only to be surprised to see that his health is steadily dropping as that ult just wears him down.) Come to think of it, I still have to check and see if Amumu's tears get past the wall.

IronwallJackson1 votes

It's not strictly speaking like Rammus's ult, it's closer to Braum's if I recall. It's just that some "projectiles" can go over/under the windwall, with Zigg's ult being an example of the former and Naut's ult an example of the latter.

Nochebr1 votes

Amumu tears get past the wall. Amumu is also listed as a yasuo counter on many counter sites because of his aoe cc and tankiness, bandage toss is blocked by windwall though.

Supreme Senpai691 votes

Nocturne and Sivir can negate ultimates too. That isn't a big deal. Personally I don't see why a hypermobile champion capable of dodging any skillshot in the game needs a windwall that can block them, but that's another thread I guess.

Nochebr1 votes

well they just have a personal spellshield rather than an aoe skillshot blocker for their entire team...

Supreme Senpai691 votes

Yes but I'm not jumping on the hate Yasuo train right now. Should Yasuo have that? I don't want him to. That's a totally separate entity from "Should windwall block ults?" though. Windwall should most definitely block ults, as we've seen other basic abilities also be able to.

Nochebr1 votes

I'm not hating either bro. I'm trying to find an appropriate nerf to make a champ feel more balanced so there aren't really only 5 bans cuz yasuo is on insta-ban. This way people could actually play, what i feel is a very fun and versatile champ in yasuo, much more often.

Supreme Senpai691 votes

Nono, maybe I misunderstood. I didn't know this was a nerf Yasuo thread. I thought it was a "Why does windwall do this" thread. Nevermind

Nochebr1 votes

Guess I was unclear in my post. Not such a good writer. I really meant to brainstorm ways to balance him.

BlueBilberry1 votes

I find that you have to step to the side (somehow) and get around that wall. It is interesting that other wallmakers (e.g., Anivia) seem to have problems blocking ults though.

Stars Shaper1 votes

Hey call me a yasuomain, but is it not dumb that ppl shoot like 30+ ultimate abilities against a thing that they know it will block them all?

CrimsonDawn771 votes

Just because some people do that doesn't mean its not a broken ability on Yas. People who throw everything they have at Fizz the second before he does his low cooldown zhonyas on demand arn't playing too smart. That doesn't mean that Fizz's e (get out for free and negate all damage) isn't broken on a snowballing, insane burst, diving assassin. Windwall has no counterplay mostly. Also part of the problem is how reactive you can be with the windwall as it happens so quickly. That means you can pannic press it and it will save you. It also makes outplaying people with it very easy as you only have to predict incoming skillshots a tiny time before they happen. It doesn't require tons of prior thought. Plus there's the whole factor of a basic ability totally stopping an ultimate being kind of broken. Maybe it wouldn't be broken on a support, but on Yas.

Nochebr1 votes

Guess this isn't a fizz thread really but i would say that he is probably one of Riot's biggest balancing successes in the assassin rework since they made him actually need to stay in the fray(as a very squishy champion) long enough to hit his w with max efficiency, and his e cd long enough that if you don't have max cdr and an hourglass on him then you are probably going to die very quickly if you used e to gap close on your target. Like Fizz went from played and banned often, to never banned and played maybe every 5 games or so since his mini-rework.

CrimsonDawn771 votes

I can't disagree more. Fizz is still Fizz. His ultimate is now more op then before, and have you seen it miss but latch onto a target regardless? Then he can easily burst someone with just two basic abilities. He can still kill people and get out for free. He is still a champ that becomes out of control if one or two mistakes are made in lane, which is cancer to lane against, and also bad if you're team feeds him. What riot has done is made his mid to late damage not enough if he doesn't snowball. He also is countered a bit with the tank meta, but that doesn't make him a healthy champ, it just means his brokenness can be managed more ofte.

Nochebr1 votes

Thats fine man if you disagree, you disagree. Good luck in your games and thanks for your contribution to the discussion.

CrimsonDawn771 votes

Same to you XD

Nochebr1 votes

well he actually can wait for you to cast so it is a zoning tool your entire team would have to wait for to be on cd before they could do much if they have projectile ultimates. I'm not a yasuo player hater or anything. I'd like him balanced to where people don't feel he needs to be banned almost every game though. I think Yasuo players would like it also if he wasn't banned every game too.

Not asking for him to be nerfed into the ground, but to instead feel like a fair champion that can't just go 1/12 to start the game and still have immense dps and utility despite this.

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