Ahri is too well-rounded as a champion and her identity can be sharpened up.

Le Tam·Jul 10, 2017·5 votes·584 views

Hear me out, I think Ahri is a champion that is supposed to be assassin like and dance around her foes and currently her Charm is so universally useful that it kind of makes her obnoxious. I think it would seem more fair if maybe she gets a damage increase but a range nerf so that she has to get close to her enemies to charm them. Either that or maybe make her charm duration scale with range like Xerath's E so that players are rewarded for successfully closing the gap with her. Currently her hitbox for the charm is so big that if you are close to ahri its impossible to sidestep even if you are expecting and trying to dodge it. I just think this will give her a fair weakness to her already many strengths (wave clear, cc, mobility, healing, true dmg, so many...)

15 Comments

TehNACHOJul 10, 20174 votes

many strengths (wave clear, cc, mobility, healing, true dmg, so many...)

Many...okays

Her waveclear is okay. Her cc is okay. Her healing is okay. Her true damage is okay. The only thing she really has over most other mages is her mobility, in which she has in spades.

I know Ahri is strong right now (rather she's always strong) and honestly I would favor more specialization in champion kits, but don't oversell it now.

TormentulaJul 10, 20174 votes

Ahri is just a poorly design champion in terms of gameplay.

Idc what happens to her burst/abilities, its just the fact she has all that + safety in lane that makes laning against her dumb and uninteractive unless she's aggressive (which with charm and passive, is a one way street unless you "outplay" it).

You can rework her charm however you want, but if she has that Q movement speed bonus and her low CD 3 dashes, it won't solve her actual issue, safety on an assassin. I see no reason to gut her unique mechanics (the charm and foxfire) when her Q and R just let her have so much comfort.

Master SummonerJul 10, 20174 votes

but that is ahri niche she is a jack of all trades, excels at nothing other then mobility id say

AmetDeCryptJul 11, 20173 votes

u kidden me amazing mana costs, spam your heart out you aren't gonna go oom waveclear from hell low cooldowns amazing scalings aoe and single target burst mobility utility sustain boobs

uhh.... boobs. I'd say she excels at a great many things as well as being very easy to play. which isn't a bad thing, introductory champions are all well and good for learning a role but she just does too much well. honestly all she really needs is to be punished for ulting OUT of fights. the 3 dashes are just too much safety and she can split push towers down and be out before anyone can show up to stop her. it needs to be strictly in combat mobility focused.

Master SummonerJul 11, 20173 votes

her wave clear is not that good idk why people think this is a thing on her cuz its really not lol

low cooldowns i mean yeah thats true but that doesnt make the champ broken her abilitis scale later into the game which is why shes this niche mobile assassin

scaling not that great pretty average honestly

aoe? i mean her q sure but everything else is single target

sustain yeah not the best though

utility ? i mean its a unique from of cc but i wouldn't call it utility ... i mean sure yeah fine lol

all in all she is a jack of all trades master at none other then id say mobility

TheSingularityJul 11, 20172 votes

The issue is, she is the master of something. She is the master of reliable spell damage. Half her damage is aimed by the game, her Q hitbox is extremely forgiving and the spell itself is quick. The true damage on return, procing at max range is a cheap interaction that doesn't encourage ahri to move it herself.

Where is the bonus true damage on these champions? Ekko Gnar Graves Velkoz Viktor . Why doesn't the second part of their respective spells get this bonus? They are all arguably more difficult to land and thus should get greater reward in the form of true damage. Especially if a spell as fat and fast as an ahri Q gets it.

PsyrixJul 11, 20172 votes

Have you looked at the scaling of Ahri's q? (and the base damages) compare that to those other champions, u'll see the tradeoff

TheSingularityJul 11, 20172 votes

Actually it has an effective 70% AP scaling. Two passes with the regular spell and 100 AP=140x2+35x2=350 damage Single pass and double everything, same result. It has a 240 base damage (the same as a vel'koz Q) and 70% scaling. Whether is has 2, 35% scalings or a single 70% scaling it will deal and gain the same amount of damage overall. Only it disguises this as a reward for hitting, an extremely easy to land second proc. If it had a delay like an ekko Q, that would justify the damage.

The effective 70% bonus and true damage is why her base is low. But when true damage involved, that low base doesn't mean shit early game. 9/10 times you will land the true damage dealing enough damage to make up for it. Add in the scaling and that's an obscene amount of true damage.

PsyrixJul 11, 20172 votes

My point still stands tho...... compare it to the others and you'll see the tradeoff (im talking about the projectile abilities that return/have a delayed dmg after the first btw). In total Ekko's q will deal 90% AP, Viktor also has a 90% (on the q) and a 120% (on the e). Gnar has a 115% AD scaling, Graves has a total of 240% (unless i misread that value)

PsyrixJul 11, 20174 votes

Additionally it isnt that often that an ahri will be able to land both passes of the q, it'll usually only happen if cc'd, minion blocked or no attempt to dodge was made

TheSingularityJul 11, 20172 votes

Max to near max range q's will almost always get both hits in. As for you suggestions, yes there're champs with higher ratios. Which of them deal true damage as a reward?

Gnar doesn't double proc. Yes it goes out and comes back. But it will only hit anything once.

I'm talking viktors e only (it rewards for double proc. His q is simply a second part. Like karmas enhanced Q). It doesn't have a set delay (if he's melee it's pretty much 1, 2 within a second). Viktors is higher due to less reliability.

Ekko is higher because he is melee, the spell has less range and a considerable delay between arriving at the destination and returning.

That is a reward.

Having a more reliable (fast, decent range, possible to have zero delay between procs) skillshot that rewards with true damage is unreasonable.

Why true damage? Why not additional magic damage?

If it was easier to avoid (for everyone, incl those without a dash) I'd agree that it'd deserve a reward. But if you're within that range without a dash. She gets a reward for doing the same thing as anyone else with a skillshot.

AmetDeCryptJul 11, 20171 votes

I finally had the time to look this up her heal is 9% ap per champion hit, which means effectively up to 90% ap scaling should she hit both passes of her q (I believe) the reason I mention low cooldowns is it is effective dps and burst at the same time because her scalings are actually really good. let's take orianna for instance, someone considered high scaling. with one 50% and two 70% scalings she can drop around 190% ap on a team every say minute and 120% every 10-15 seconds or so. now ahri has 1 70% (not factoring in true damage) up to a 48% if all three foxfires hit, a 60% and up to 75% on all 3 dashes. that's a total of (not factoring true damage 253% ap whenever her ult is up. and 178% when it's not. surpassing orianna by a margin. that's good ap scaling.

EedatJul 11, 20171 votes

"jack off all trades" really isn't a niche. As a matter of fact it's practically the polar opposite

FrightningJul 11, 20172 votes

Ahri just need to lose the insane amount of free MS on her Q and she will back to being balanced. I knew it was a bad idea for them to add it as soon as I saw how much it gave in game, and that was several years ago. Now it's finally coming to fruition.

Le TamJul 11, 20171 votes

Looks like i triggered a lot of Ahri fans lol