Why Elo Hell Exists (The Problem With Bronze)

Hrd2H1t·Aug 18, 2016·2 votes·814 views

The thing is that you don't get out of Bronze by being good. You get out of Bronze at being a complete carry. The difference between a good Bronze player and a good Platinum player is that a good Plat player knows how to work as a team, while a good Bronze player is the team. I'm so sick of being in Bronze that I would gladly pay real money to redo my placements for a chance to redeem myself in Silver. So many people like me are stuck in Bronze, because even though we are decent if not good players, we can't be the team itself.

Seriously though. If it costed $1,000 dollars to redo my placement games I would probably still do it.

47 Comments

Swiftstrike4Aug 18, 20165 votes

I looked at your stats. You are appropriately placed. Even if you were placed in silver you probably wouldn't last unless you improved as a player. You die a lot in almost all your games. Redoing your placements would not matter. If you cut you deaths per game by 1/3rd you could easily get into Silver.

Edit: I was placed in Bronze I or 2 this past season after obtaining Gold V last season. I was able to get to Gold probably after a couple months of playing ranked. I hit a bit of a wall in upper silver, but was able to move past that after struggling for a couple weeks.

Hrd2H1tAug 18, 20163 votes

"You die a lot in almost all your games"

I get 3 kills top and 1 death Enemy ADC gets 8 kills in bot lane and is never killed Enemy ADC goes top kills me Enemy ADC repeats to kill us for the rest of the game and we lose

Deaths aren't always indicative of performance

Swiftstrike4Aug 18, 20162 votes

{quoted}

"You die a lot in almost all your games"

I get 3 kills top and 1 death Enemy ADC gets 8 kills in bot lane and is never killed Enemy ADC goes top kills me Enemy ADC repeats to kill us for the rest of the game and we lose

Deaths aren't always indicative of performance

I am not going to get into a debate about your deaths. I am simply giving you advice that you die a lot per game. But the stats on NAOPGG don't lie. Lets take a look at your last 10 games in ranked:

3-11
11-6
10-22
6-8
5-3
4-7
1-8
2-5
5-11
3-10

A total of 50 kills to 91. Even if we just took out the outlier which is the 22 death game you still would have had 69 deaths. This is bad play that reflects your skill at the game. I am not including assists because even if you had 20 assists per game (which you don't even come close) the amount of deaths per game is very very high.

Then I thought "oh he hasn't play ranked very much, what are his/her normal stats. Maybe he/she has improved."

3-11
9-3
3-6
1-17
10-4
4-11
14-8
5-2
4-6
0-9

A total of 53 kills to 77. This is still really poor and normals are less competitive, so it would not surprise me if you fared a bit better in normals than in ranked games.

What does this tell me? It tells me that you die way too much and while most silver players also die A LOT as well, they do not die this much. If anything they often focus too much on preserving their KDA, despite such a play strategy not equating to wins.

Here is what you need to do to improve:

Just CS, don't even try to trade in lane
Avoid dying no matter what - even if it means you give up a tower
Learn to farm under tower
Don't chase kills
Use your teleport (i see you are top a lot) to get back to lane if you are low. At this point you need to work on fundamentals such as CSing and wave management

Your complaints are relatively unfounded. Hell, if you just gifted me RP I would happily play 10 games on your account and get you into Silver. But as soon as you started playing ranked on it again, you would probably fall out of the division.

Hrd2H1tAug 18, 20161 votes

I will admit that I have to work on my wave management, but my trading usually isn't too bad. Also, a lot of those normal games are just fun, off meta picks like jungle Ryze and stupid stuff like that. My main complaint about Bronze is that group of people that decides to take jungle Ryze in Ranked.

colesyAug 19, 20161 votes

man imagine if you'd just used your tp and stopped the enemy adc getting fed

oh wait

better blame team instead

LordGeovanniAug 19, 20161 votes

that for second piece of shit in an elo where allies dont follow up. i want what you smoking

colesyAug 19, 20161 votes

what

when i was ranking my smurf i literally just dumped on my laner and tp'd bot and fucked them too. why would you not want to get two lanes ahead?

LordGeovanniAug 19, 20161 votes

you cant your bot almost never wards and if they do they ward as close to lane as they can instead of at the edge of the bush by jungle the teleport takes 4 seconds and is visable through the fog of war the enemy just backs off and makes you waste a teleport. it could work where your allies bait the enemy into a fight when you start teleporting but like i said low elo no follow up they will either not bait the enemy and let them run away or they wait till you full down there and they too far to help do anything

colesyAug 19, 20161 votes

you cant? but ... i did. you know when you get accounts to 30 they all have the same mmr right? i was literally playing against low elos and was able to tp bot and destroy enemy bot lanes over and over.

colesyAug 18, 20164 votes

if you're in bronze you're not decent and you're not a good player either.

Hrd2H1tAug 18, 20162 votes

I'm only in Bronze because I played tons of ranked games when I just got level 30. It was a stupid mistake, but it has essentially ruined my account

colesyAug 18, 20162 votes

i completely tanked the mmr on my account too and was still able to push it through from d5 0lp to d3 86lp.

so the fault is on your end, not your account.

Hrd2H1tAug 18, 20161 votes

Did you mean to say B5? because Diamond 5 is actually really good, whether people acknowledge it or not. High plat and above make up a small portion of the league community.

colesyAug 18, 20162 votes

no. d5. i got to d5 0lp and lost 10 games in a row but didn't demote. so my lp gains have been like +16/-22 and I was almost able to climb to d2 with absolutely atrocious mmr.

bad mmr isn't an excuse for not being able to climb, it's honestly just on you to play better.

Hrd2H1tAug 18, 20161 votes

Clearly if you're in Diamond, even in Diamond 5, you're pretty good. I just want to be in a high Silver or low Gold.

colesyAug 18, 20162 votes

d5s arent good, i can tell you that.

and it's beside the point, you're making excuses so as to why you can't climb when the fact of the matter is that you're just not good at the game, it's nothing to do with "i played straight after hitting 30 and now my mmr sucks" because i completely destroyed my mmr too and climbed up almost three divisions.

DREADN0UGHTAug 18, 20161 votes

You would be surprised to hear what people in high elo say about ''low diamond'' haha.

colesyAug 18, 20161 votes

low diamond is pretty much a dumpster lol.

i need to get off my ass and climb back in to d3 but muh ranked anxiety

DREADN0UGHTAug 18, 20161 votes

Yeah I know. Turns out Challenger players consider Diamond 2 to be ''garbage''.

Which makes me laugh anxiously as I sit in low plat.

colesyAug 18, 20161 votes

i mean all you have to do is watch pretty much any streamer that smurfs in mid/high diamond and you'll see enough mistakes they make that'll help you distinguish between high diamonds and master/challenger.

DREADN0UGHTAug 18, 20161 votes

If it can make you feel any better, I was Bronze 5, 4 years ago. And I climbed my way out Solo to plat now.

Remember its an individual rank given to you in a team game. Learn to play like a Silver player.

Great MutaAug 19, 20162 votes

I stayed in Bronze 4/5 for thousands of games. I said the same things you said and I was told I was awful and never would get out. Then I went on a massive win streak and got out. Have I changed anything? No. But somehow, despite being rock solid in B5, I'm now beating Gold's and Silvers.

BeoridasAug 19, 20162 votes

plat players arent team players lool.

every season i had my smurf in bronze i climbed it easily. Its about personal skillz.

Im The Jayce GodAug 19, 20162 votes

The problem with elo hell, is nobody knows how to communicate/work together. Thats the problem.

3 enemies are bot attacking your tower while your top laner is the only there defending it? Better farm < Bronze/Silver response.

I have 1 ward available, the jungler is no where to be found, better go all in. < Bronze/Silver response.

I already gave the ADC 4 kills while im behind on farm and I have no kills, I can still 1v1 her tho < Bronze/Silver response.

Thats why theyre in elo hell. The only way to get out of elo hell is to help your team. If youre top lane, gank mid, save your teleport to help bot get kill. If youre mid, you better roam beens its your 2nd biggest role. Jungler, Gank bro, just because its laning phase doesnt mean youre farming 24/7 until laning phase is done. Support, roam mid. ADC, no clue, I refuse to adc unless im Quinn. In that case, roam.

NaeniaAug 18, 20161 votes

Silver isn't that much better. People still fail to realize when to group, when to engage, when to disengage, and when to push.

NiamhNyxAug 18, 20161 votes

I climbed out of Bronze, B5 to S5, in less than 100 games as a support. I'm 100% sure I did not carry lol, all I did was babysit.

SlythionAug 18, 20161 votes

...I went from Bronze 4 -> Silver in 50 games

Hrd2H1tAug 18, 20161 votes

Another thing that I forgot to mention is that I hate how steep the MMR system is too steep. I understand the belief that Bronze-level Gold players should be punished more, but its just so steep that you can easily loose 2-3 wins worth of LP from one loss.

venomous frostAug 18, 20163 votes

LP gains and losses depend on your MMR in relation to your current league. More wins than losses = more lp gained than lost

more losses than wins= more lp lost than won.

LP gains don't depend on the level of your MMR at all

Hrd2H1tAug 18, 20161 votes

My bad, but that still makes things really hard. If you are on a hard losing streak, you lose LP at an extreme rate, you can't gain it back nearly at all, and you will end up dropping to worse divisions, making it harder to carry.

FioraWillCarryAug 18, 20161 votes

{quoted}

My bad, but that still makes things really hard. If you are on a hard losing streak, you lose LP at an extreme rate, you can't gain it back nearly at all, and you will end up dropping to worse divisions, making it harder to carry.

Before I made Silver, I dropped multiple times to B5 from B2 and B3. Even had a long stint where I was at B5 0LP while still losing multiple games. I think at B4 i was getting something like 11 LP for a win. I still made it out of Bronze practically Solo.

Basically, I got better and started winning a fuck tonne of games until I made it to B1 for the first time. Struggled a bit but made it out.

Point is, your account isn't fucked. Keep winning and everything would work out.

venomous frostAug 18, 20162 votes

Do you really deserve to climb if you lose that much? that's the question you should be asking.

It's not about lp gains or MMR in your ELO, it's about improving yourself as a player and getting better. You might get some unlucky games or some lucky games causing you to fall or climb, but that's only a couple of division, it doesn't matter in the long run. You need to learn from every game, from every mistake you do. Yes somebody might be feeding, but could you have carried that game if you made a play in situation X, and got fed yourself? Always question your decision making.

Also feeders and ragers are off all ELO's, you won't get nicer people the higher you climb, you will still have a 0/5 botlane by minute 8 in some games.

CommbustionAug 18, 20161 votes

SIlver is not better. trust me, I usually get a 5-7kda with 55% or higher k/p and I can't carry shit kids that are basically trolling

FioraWillCarryAug 18, 20161 votes

{quoted}

SIlver is not better. trust me, I usually get a 5-7kda with 55% or higher k/p and I can't carry shit kids that are basically trolling

Silver is way different than Bronze. When I got to Silver one of the most outstanding differences I noticed is how fast people take towers in Silver in comparision to Bronze. You could lose your tower if you fuck up even once in lane. Silver players group much earlier and much more frequently than Bronze players too. It's very common to see 8 man fuckfests in bot lane as early as 5 minutes into the game. Silver players make plays for Baron a lot earlier and a lot more too. In general, their CSing is much better.

The only thing Silver has in common with Bronze is the thirst. The thirst to chase kills, to pad their KDAs. As such they get baited and feed a lot here too. Silvers for all their improvements from Bronze still feed like Bronze players. Unlike Bronze players though, feeding Silvers are a lot harder to carry than feeding Bronze players.

cinomenapplebaeAug 18, 20161 votes

but new players that just got level 30 usually get placed in silver 5 which makes it horrible

FioraWillCarryAug 18, 20161 votes

{quoted}

but new players that just got level 30 usually get placed in silver 5 which makes it horrible

Yea, I got a couple of those as well. Thanfully, they have been rare in my games.

AdeBugAug 18, 20161 votes

I had 4 afk'ers in 4 of my placement games, each rendered a loss and in the end I was B2. After that, a lot of trolls, afks and feeders came my way and I went to B5 then B4. I often think of making a new account but I'm just against smurfin' atm so much, that I'm just telling myself I only need to get better, at a lot of things, so I can climb out myself one day.

moonbornAug 18, 20161 votes

my friend started winning a lot of bronze games when i just told her what items to build against what champions and just general strategy tips. i can't imagine being stuck in bronze. if you play mid/top and you are platinum+, and you were in bronze, then you would probably have 95% win rate. i dont think there are champions that can't carry bronze. probably even soraka mid could do it. because nobody would focus her and she would just heal all day and night. i saw my friend playing in bronze and it was a one big clown fiesta where nobody cares about objectives, where a team gets aced and the enemy team doesnt do anything and goes back to farming without taking any tower or any objective. i can't imagine bronze games being impossible to carry.

Hrd2H1tAug 18, 20162 votes

Bronze is like the lottery, only whoever gets the least 4 IQ teammates wins.

DREADN0UGHTAug 18, 20161 votes

People in Brone have nooooo idea what they are doing. Even the ones that are remotely decent at a champ's specific mechanics have no clue how half the champ roster works.

To win in bronze is easy as:

Picking a carry like WuKong, Tryndamere or even Teemo.
Farm
let the others fight and have a clown fiesta
meanwhile, you splitpush
repeat step 3 and 4 until you have a couple towers and a huge gold lead.

FioraWillCarryAug 18, 20162 votes

{quoted}

People in Brone have nooooo idea what they are doing. Even the ones that are remotely decent at a champ's specific mechanics have no clue how half the champ roster works.

To win in bronze is easy as:

Picking a carry like WuKong, Tryndamere or even Teemo.

Farm

let the others fight and have a clown fiesta

meanwhile, you splitpush

repeat step 3 and 4 until you have a couple towers and a huge gold lead.

Yea this works. I did something similar to get out. Only difference, is that instead of splitpushing, I'd team fight and use my farm advantage to kill everything, and it helps get my allies fed when they pick up kills after I chunk them with my massive damage.

At B1 this kinda stops working as effectively though because there is likely gonna be someone on the enemy team farming just as good as you and your team is gonna be feeding then on top of that.

ChotenAug 19, 20161 votes

True you're gonna have like 3 of the enemies team trying to stop your split push and when you die or barely make it away, you'll see your team killing random mobs in the jungle and your support tank blitz/thresh trying to 1v1 a carry.

FioraWillCarryAug 19, 20161 votes

{quoted}

True you're gonna have like 3 of the enemies team trying to stop your split push and when you die or barely make it away, you'll see your team killing random mobs in the jungle and your support tank blitz/thresh trying to 1v1 a carry.

EXACTLY THIS!. This is sooo spot on. It fuckin tilts the fuck out of me when I get 3 people to follow me in the Top lane trying their darnest to ks each other wasting a whole lot of time only to see after they catch me or I get away, my team hasn't done a single fuckin thing to apply pressure elsewhere by getting towers or even pushing lanes. They're always fuckin around in the jungle or chasing low HP supports half way across the map. Even worse is when they decide to come and "help" me....God I hate when they come try to help when they could 4v2 instead and barrel down mid or bot and get and inhib. So yea, I prefer to come fight and only split push after we win a skirmish where we trade 3 for one or some shit.

ChotenAug 19, 20161 votes

Play split pushers and learn to run from losing teamfights. if you can break into their base while your team is feeding and draw attention to yourself, you could make it a 3v4 or better for your team.

LordGeovanniAug 19, 20161 votes

while true silver isnt any better silver is where the luckier bronze players end up and the quit throw and dont focus objectives jsut as much as bronze

five oh tree Aug 19, 20161 votes

Bronze is not elo hell, not in any way. I personally don't believe in elo hell, but if I had to choose one place that was, it would be silver V. This is because that is where most of the new ranked players are put, so there are massive differences in skill level between players in this division. In bronze solo carrying is a lot easier up until about b1, and then you face the huge stream of new level 30s. Struggling to climb here? I can sympathize with that. Struggling to climb out of anything lower? ehhhh. need some self improvement.