Runaan's with Ashe is now disappointingly bugged

Potatobird··37 votes·5,311 views
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Runaan's Ashe used to be fucking awesome. When she used her Q, she would send out her flurry of 5 bolts to her main target, but she would also send out 10!! less powerful Runaan's bolts, each applying stacks of Black Cleaver, on hit effects, etc, and the cool thing was that they were not limited to just 3 targets. The 10 side bolts would spread randomly to any viable targets.

This shit was just as cool as it sounds. I don't have any videos of it for those of you who haven't seen it, but it was actually kind of viable, yet nobody used it of course because meta sheeple conformism. You could slow and shred entire teams simultaneously like a true support adc, and then Rito fucked it up somehow.

Now if you get Runaans and use your Q, your Runaan's bolts will actually lose most of their damage - she only shoots out 2 extra bolts instead of 10, and they only do 1/5 of the damage of her Runaan's bolts when she isn't using Q.

Now that people might actually build Runaan's because it has 30% crit, it's a shame that they destroyed something so unique and awesome. They have to fix it

31 Comments

rampaging poet11 votes

Agreed. The extra bolts also aren't giving her Q stacks anymore which is more important than ever with the Q changes. I filed a bug report about it here: http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/bug-report/oVEFlWUL-gameplay-ashe-rangers-focus-q-and-hurricane-bugs

They've also let her use Q to melt turrets again without putting it in the patch notes, so that's probably a bug too.

Potatobird1 votes

Right, I'm surprised I forgot to mention that. Thanks!

Omninaut1 votes

It's definitely intentional for it to no longer stack. Since Q has no cooldown anymore, you could reactivate after 2 attacks! LOL

Potatobird1 votes

Oh damn, didn't think of that. It does make sense that they removed that I guess... As awesome and unique (and probably op) as a permanent blizzard of arrows would be, it would be a little much for Ashe to be the queen of global control AND the queen of multi target cc and damage.

rampaging poet3 votes

That's how it worked before (except the cooldown) which is why I'd like to see it in the patch notes if they deliberately changed that interaction. Changing it makes sense because otherwise Hurricane is the item to get on Ashe, but it should have been listed with the other Q changes.

Traxinator5 votes

{quoted} I don't have any videos of it for those of you who haven't seen it

I got you https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbKbTlFcciA

Autrah Fang4 votes

{quoted}

I got you https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbKbTlFcciA

regardless of how strong that actually is (reason for this phrasing is because i have no idea how strong this actually is), it looks badass as hell >_> kinda sucks that they got rid of it

Potatobird3 votes

I built Runaan's and black cleaver every game, because each one of those arrows applies a stack of black cleaver - and they used to be unable to crit so I wouldn't build any crit chance, although stattik shiv looks pretty cool. The benefit is that you can apply the Q slow and the armor shred to the entire enemy team at once, because the arrows would go all over the place, and just one mini bolt would apply the full slow.

It's like full support-carry, it gives all other physical damage on your team a nice boost. I won like 60-70% of my games with this build, but maybe it was just due to winning lane a lot.

Now that the bolts can crit and Ashe relies on that crit to slow (they removed the slow from her Q), this is clearly not the way to go, sadly. Runaan's will still be hella useful though once they fix it.

RIP Red build ashe

Vellich0r1 votes

Do ruunans, bork, cleaver, IE, Deaths dance. It's not even funny.

Hyrum Graff1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Marik Winters,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=NKYehFgp,comment-id=0003000000000000,timestamp=2015-11-12T05:23:23.885+0000)

Do ruunans, bork, cleaver, IE, Deaths dance. It's not even funny.

I feel like shiv, bt, or mercurial would be better than bork in this build. Thoughts?

Vellich0r1 votes

The Bork gives you % health damage on your bolts, and attack speed to bump your overall damage output. It also helps you escape more effectively. This means your Q is up more often, you are more likely to get a critical slow, and even secondary targets can't ignore your runaans bolts, so the Bork is really important.

Hyrum Graff1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Marik Winters,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=NKYehFgp,comment-id=000300000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-11-12T23:19:11.115+0000)

The Bork gives you % health damage on your bolts

I don't think you were implying this, but just to be clear, it doesn't proc 5 times, so it's just as effective as any other Runaan's adc, not super effective or anything. In addition, Ashe's Q gives your AA's a better-than-1.0 AD ratio, so I feel like raw AD is more effective than %hp. It'd be good if the enemy were stacking hp, but not as a core item, imo.

and attack speed to bump your overall damage output.

True, but AD bumps your damage output too, as does crit, armor pen, AS from any source, etc.

It also helps you escape more effectively.

This is true, and is probably the strongest argument I see for BoRK. I still think for escaping, mercurial would be as good or better, most of the time.

This means your Q is up more often

Shiv does this too.

you are more likely to get a critical slow

Shiv does this, too. And better, because crit chance.

and even secondary targets can't ignore your runaans bolts

It does increase effectiveness vs secondary targets. I'm not sure how the unique interaction with Runaan's is supposed to work with BoRK. I guess personally I just don't value this as much as more LS, more damage to my primary target, more waveclear, etc.

Vellich0r1 votes

I meant runaans bolts. Each of the 10 bolts applies the % health on hit from bork once and the flurry of arrows proc it once, this is 11 6% current health proc. also, each individual bolt counts as an auto attack for the purposes of her Q, meaning one auto attack is now 3 auto attacks, so where as with shiv you still need to attack 5 times to get your Q, with runaans only have to attack twice. In addition, since reunions bolts can proc, they triple your chance of a critical slow (also you act like runaans doesn't have more crit chance than shiv, which it does) This gives you just as much wave clear as a shiv, the bolts lifestyle off of borks % health damage meaning you also have a pretty equivalent heal, and this still does strong damage to the first target since it actually pierces more armor than a last whisper once you get black cleaver.

Photos of Ghosts3 votes

Actually, the minibolts never applied on-hits. They're a spell effect. THey apply black cleaver because they're physical damage.

Potatobird2 votes

Yeah, you're right, but they did apply the extra slow from her Q I'm pretty sure. If they applied stuff like BotRK that is an effect that procs with every hit, that would be too strong. I think they apply the slow because it just puts a debuff and additional hits simply refresh the debuff.

NeoScout2 votes

bump

Slamurai Jack2 votes

It's definitely a bug. There's no way they would recommend Runaans on Ashe if it does basically no damage whenever Q is active.

UberAffe1 votes

I'm pretty sure runaans start firing once instead of 5 times right after the released the update. It was an intentional change that happened a while ago.

Potatobird16 votes

Well first of all that's a shitty change, and they shouldn't have made it, but even if they did intend that, why does it do less damage? That's clearly unintended

Vellich0r3 votes

No, it has been firing the ten bolts up until yesterday, I play ruunans ashe all the time on my unranked/just for fun account.

Traxinator1 votes

Deleted because accidental repost. [slayer-jinx-wink]

9ZPi1wKbnz1 votes

Bump.

Omninaut1 votes

I too would build Runaan's on Ashe as a fifth item, and would then sell last whisper for black cleaver after 6th item. It was soooo strong... RIP! Shameless plug for my 5.22 Ashe thread: http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/EwER3c5o-522-ashe-discussion

xNoblessex1 votes

It's called ranger's focus not pray'n'spray

Auroramancer1 votes

It needed to be done because the bolts can crit.

Can you imagine how overpowered it would be to receive 5 crits while not being Ashe's primary target??

Potatobird3 votes

Each crit would do only a little more than 1/5 of the damage of a regular crit, so the damage isn't any different than normal Runaan's. It doesn't multiply her damage by 5 just like her Q doesn't multiply her damage by 5 on her main target.

So then the difference would be that they would apply the critical slow and frost shot with the addition of crit to the bolts. It would get bonus damage from the frost shot, but again no more than with any other adc.

Basically the bolt should be split into 5 bolts that do 1/5 damage so the damage balances out but the utility is increased.

Auroramancer1 votes

Each bolt deals 25% of Total AD. 5 bolts fired off with Ashe's Q going = 125% AD dealt to secondary targets. If they crit, those secondary target bolts will deal anywhere from 150% - 250% of her Total AD.

That's why it would be broken.

Potatobird1 votes

...A normal runaan's bolt does 25% attack damage. But what I'm saying is when her Q is active, she should shoot 5 Runaan's bolts for every one usual bolt, but each one should do 5% attack damage (1/5 of the damage of a normal bolt).

Here's an mspaint diagram for you - http://i.imgur.com/RumeZqo.png

Do you see how sending 5 bolts instead of 1 wouldn't do 5x damage if you reduced the damage of each bolt by 80%? If you multiply all the damage by the crit multiplier it doesn't change anything, they would both still be equal just like (100+25+25)x(2)=300 and (20x5+5x5+5x5)x(2)=300 are equal. Although crit works differently on Ashe changing the 2 in those equations to anything else would still make both things equal.

However in the game her Q does give her a little damage bonus for her main non-runaans arrows.

Auroramancer3 votes

Well okay, what needed to be clarified is that you THINK she should fire 5 bolts WITH MODIFICATION, as opposed to 5 bolts with the current interaction.

Potatobird1 votes

Another vid of how cool this was https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nv2zSYZ6ymI

ofart1 votes

Has this been fixed?

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