Hey, Riot, how about you ACTUALLY do something to reward mastery of single champions?

Busty Demoness·Aug 29, 2017·5 votes·941 views

Such as allowing players to score multiple Hextech Chests from a single champion. Now, I don't think it should be a simple "every S rank", that would be too easy. Simply make it require more S rank games on a single champion to earn the next chest.

First Chest: 1 S rank game. Second Chest: 2 S rank games. Third Chest: 4 S rank games. Each Chest After: 8 S rank games.

This count will reset each season, but it will greatly encourage players to truly master champions so they can consistently score S ranks for rewards.

28 Comments

420 gramsAug 29, 20172 votes

An S isn't hard to get, so just play a normal game with a new champion to get a chest if you want one so bad.

Busty DemonessAug 30, 20171 votes

Oh, okay.

I'll just first time this champion and expect an S rank.

Nothing wrong with that expectation, right?

420 gramsAug 30, 20171 votes

If you're good at the game then it's not unreasonable. But yeah, usually it'll take about 3 games to get an S

warpenguin555Aug 30, 20172 votes

You mean like how the ranked system rewards 1 tricks more than people with bigger champions pools?

Critmaster GarenAug 30, 20171 votes

{quoted}

You mean like how the ranked system rewards 1 tricks more than people with bigger champions pools?

its not the "system" that rewards 1 tricks.

its practise and mastery with their champions that rewards them. if you 1 trick a champion or keep your champion pool small, you master his mechanics, his power spikes, all of his matchups, his build pathes to a point where youre better at playing him than people who jump from champion to champion with each meta change who havent mastered their picks.

1 tricking a champion is also the best you can do to become better strategic player. when you really have mastered a champion, your muscle memory does most of the work for you playing him, and you can focus better on your surroundings and macro play than you have to focus on playing the champion himself.

its like learning to drive a bicycle vs. already knowing how to drive it. instead of focusing all your effords on keeping balance, you can concentrate on the traffic around you.

this is what champion mastery should be all about imo, and why the champion mastery system should support 1 tricks as well as people who switch between a huge number of champions.

Darkdemon653Aug 30, 20172 votes

Why do you want chests if you play only one champion?

Busty DemonessAug 30, 20171 votes

Because I already get shafted when said chests give me a champion shard.

Mysticman89Aug 30, 20172 votes

I can pretty consistently get janna S ranks as someone with 1 mil+ mastery on her, but I've also gotten every available mastery chest within 48 hours of one becoming available. You can pretty much spam anything for a day or two, and you'll get an S rank eventually, be it from actually getting decent on the champ or simply having a stompy match.

As a result, more chests from my janna mastery would do absolutely nothing for me except be frustrating, since I'd never be able to open them due to lack of keys.

Or if you mean they still draw from the same 1 chest a week pool of chests (instead of them being bonus chests), then that somewhat defeats the purpose of the system to encourage people to try new champs.

Besides, people are rewarded for their exceptional mastery of single champions by virtue of them being able to apply that mastery to climbing ranks and getting a shiny border at the end of the season. (Since those who tend to put all their time into mastering one champ almost always end up being able to climb higher than someone who played the same amount but divided between multiple other champs.)

Busty DemonessAug 30, 20171 votes

Not everyone is willing to play Ranked 24/7.

And trying new champs is not the same as MASTERING them. S ranks promote MASTERY. Trying out a champion and expecting an S rank is unrealistic.

You're arguing that it's better to rely on luck for chests rather than skill when chests are already luck-based rewards.

Mysticman89Aug 30, 20172 votes

You don't need to play ranked 24/7 or even come close to that, at least until master and by that point you're probably long past the point of caring about chests. It took me 300ish games to get to D5, and now I can play ~1 ranked game a month if I so wish just to avoid decay. With ranked seasons being nearly a year long, thats around 1 game a day on average to reach diamond, which itself is likely higher than many players even care to strive for.

Besides S ranks and actual mastery are only loosely linked. Again, I've reliably been able to get an S rank on champions I don't play within 48 hours, and realistically probably only playing for a 10th of that, so earning chests is easy. I have by no means mastered those champions, or even come remotely close. I was just willing to put in a handful of hours of effort to earn the chest.

So basically, people who wants chests can already earn them without needing any particular mastery of the champion, and people who want to display skill can do so through ranked. Those who only have time for a couple games a week wouldn't benefit from your system (not enough keys even if they got an S rank every match [sure, some one tricks may have a backlog of keys currently, but they'd run out eventually]), but would still reach plat at least if they'd actually mastered their champion, even if they didn't have time to actually make it all the way to diamond.

Busty DemonessAug 30, 20171 votes

My point is that you've lucked out on getting games you can earn S ranks on without mastering the champion. I understand that S ranks are loosely linked with mastery but they still relate more closely to mastery than luck. Anyone can luck out and earn an S rank. A master of the champion can regularly earn S ranks even on bad games.

Mysticman89Aug 30, 20171 votes

Yes, and my point is a master of the champion will reliably be able to win games at least below diamond, so people are incentivized to master a champion for the sake of ranked rewards already, and shouldn't need further incentive.

It sounds like this is more a system that rewards players who haven't actually mastered a champion (and hence would get actually get stuck at a sub diamond elo instead of only being there due to lack of time to play), but just spam it a lot for those random luck S ranks.

Busty DemonessAug 30, 20171 votes

Except this balances out earning S ranks on one champion versus multiple champions, if you looked closely.

Earning 8 S ranks per chest means you're spending at least 8 games on a champion to get one chest. You (generally) will be much more efficient at earning S rank chests over multiple champions than simply spamming one.

Keep in mind, this still keeps the chest limit of 48 per season and you are still limited to the chests available to you based on weekly +1. All it does is give an option for players to have a more convenient (if less efficient) means of obtaining chests.

Mysticman89Aug 30, 20171 votes

Players using multiple champions is a desirable outcome though, so allowing players to bypass that is counter productive to one of riots goals.

On top of that, your stated goal wasn't for making mastery chests easier, it was to reward champion mastery.

8 games per chest*48 potential chests is 384 games to get all possible chests (slightly less due to the first 3), which is more than enough to reach diamond. What's more, ranked, unlike the weekly mastery chests, has no limitations on how much you can gain in a given period, so theres no 'wasted' games, while someone could be earning S ranks without chests available. As such, the time requirement to earn diamond through single champion mastery is strictly less than the time requirement to earn all mastery chests through your system of single champion mastery, so your initial rebuttal about willingness to put in the time seems ill founded.

It's possible that they should do more to reward single champion mastery (1), and it's possible that the hextech loot system should be made easier/more convenient (2), but those are separate discussions. If one established that both were things that should happen, then using one to solve the other could be a possibility, but it's far from a given, and there may be better individual solutions for each.

(1) = I wouldn't be adverse to a riot sourced mastery 'high score' list for each champion (and total across all champs), so players could climb through the ranks for their specific champion for example. Consistent S rank scorers earn more points than low mastery grade earners, so playing a lot and doing well would result in climbing faster than those just spamming the champion. There in turn could be some rewards for players standing on each of those leader boards.

(2) = I'd prefer if there was simply a 48 chest/season and 48*3 key fragment/season limit, rather than 4/month and 12/month respectively. It feels quite bad if I'm super busy one month (or on vacation or something) and don't cap out on my monthly fragments, and suddenly I'm forever going to be behind on fragments. Similarly, if I earn an S rank on a champion, it feels bad to not be rewarded just because I'd already earned one that week.

XylinthAug 29, 20171 votes

Yeah, I OTP Varus so I legit never get chests. It sucks.

CochoAug 30, 20171 votes

If you want a chest, just play another champion lol.

Getting a S isnt that hard

Around999PeopleAug 30, 20171 votes

This will just give people excuses to try even less when auto filled.

Busty DemonessAug 30, 20171 votes

Explain.

Around999PeopleAug 30, 20171 votes

Say someone's a one trick Riven. They get autofilled supp. They just refuse to do the role right knowing what's the issue if they'll get to play riven next game and get something like a legendary chest.

Busty DemonessAug 30, 20171 votes

You're assuming several things.

Riven Player has asked for a trade and didn't get one.
Riven Player is already tilted to the point where he refuses to play support properly.
Riven Player wouldn't just go ham and play Riven Kill Lane Support (non-tilted).
Riven Player won't simply dodge so he can get preferred role.
Riven Player won't play it anyway knowing he can get 1 S rank on the support for another chest.

Around999PeopleAug 30, 20171 votes

And you're assuming the above best possible scenerios happen while we both know people who get autofilled often troll. Not everyone. I get autofilled too (Which is weird since I'm a supp main lol) and I do my best. But I'm sure you've had people who got autofilled supp and just went with whatever they wanted and fed. Now they have less of a reason to try the roll to see if they can get a chest and they'd simply do whatever tknowing they'll get their daily chest anyway.

Both scenerios, yours and mine, can happen. I'd like to think most of the community would work like you suggest, but we both know there are those who'd just not give a heck and do whatever. While a chest isn't incentive to try a new role and do good, it won't force them to play the role they get, but trying a new role right now gives another option for a chest while with your idea there is no reason try anything new.

Busty DemonessAug 30, 20171 votes

Okay, your situation implies that none of those alternative scenarios happened. Possible, but by all means worst case. Mine offers multiple alternatives for one player to go through. Yours is the result of all of those alternatives failing. Yes, people who get autofilled might troll. Won't deny that they can and will do that.

The chest, as I see it, is a reward for doing well.

Why be forced to roll the dice on doing well in one game with every champion a large variety?

Lord DusteonAug 30, 20171 votes

Why is this even needed? 1 tricks shouldn't care about chests to begin with, as anything that isn't for their main is useless and you are extremely, extremely unlikely to get anything for 1 single champion.

This gives more chests to the 1 group who has no use for chests.

Busty DemonessAug 30, 20171 votes

It helps them fill out a smurf account named after their one trick.

Also helps newer players because they won't have that many champions owned to begin with.

Lord DusteonAug 30, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Busty Demoness,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MrkgGjNO,comment-id=00070000,timestamp=2017-08-30T01:57:49.044+0000)

It helps them fill out a smurf account named after their one trick.

Which presumably will still only play a single champion, thus invalidating the need for chests.

Also helps newer players because they won't have that many champions owned to begin with.

The literal only time this 'helps' new players is if they are trying to one trick something (in which case they don't need chests), or they are playing extremely infrequently (in which case due to both being new and playing little this doesn't help). In neither case does this actually provide a meaningful improvement for new players.

Automated RivenAug 30, 20171 votes

I am a one trick and I love getting chests. :(.

QuephaAug 30, 20171 votes

They do, it's called "winning."

Almost every time a player submits their match history to a high tier streamer to ask for advice, the streamer immediately answers with "cut down on the number of champions you 'main', ideally down to 1" because the game already heavily rewards people who play a small champion pool well.

Automated RivenAug 30, 20171 votes

I would far rather have higher mastery levels that are actually difficult to achieve. FFS 2 of my three mastery seven champs I barely even play. I would rather be able to have a mastery 10 on riven and have it actually mean something. Mastery seven just means I got lucky a few games after I played that champion like 40 times. But if they had something that required you to maintain a certain level of consistentcy in your game play that was losable it would feel 1000x better to have.