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Aurelion Sol's Future... ~~Please Read~~

TheMojoKiller··36 votes·14,427 views

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/6/65/Aurelion_Sol_OriginalCentered.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/1215?cb=20180414201914

My name is TheMojoKiller & I would like to talk about my favorite champion when it comes to everything (story, design, game-play, etc.), and that champion is Aurelion Sol. He's a sassy (sassy is an understatement) cosmic dragon who's a literal god who can make stars. He has the best voice-line in the game, (Seriously, what's better than a star god saying "Boop" when he's hitting anything).

https://imgur.com/XmFpVn1

And because of all that and a lot more, I've main since a little after release. Being one of the few champions to have good consistent damage and being a battle mage himself, his kit favors preferred play-style a lot! Even though he didn't peak a lot of people's interests when it's compared to other champs (Yasuo, Jhin, etc.), the people that play him love the champion and are dedicated to him.

While I could go on about Aurelion Sol, there's just one thing I want to mention before I talk about how the PBE changes feel. When it comes to Aurelion Sol, with enough practice, playing him can get you far. And my point is that even if you have an Aurelion Sol on your team or enemy team, there isn't going to be that stench where Aurelion Sol "has no counter-play" or "Aurelion Sol's broken." The favor of his battles depends on how well you play, and then you get rewarded from that. It feels good to be able to call him a healthy champion.

Aurelion Sol on the PBE... Aurelion Sol has received a mini rework on the PBE a couple days ago. If you are interested in the details and numbers, visit this link to get more info: https://twitter.com/RiotAzuBK https://imgur.com/C9A6NdZ (Here's a clip of how the mini-rework looks like provided by RiotKingCobra)

This itself may be a "mini"-rework, but it just changes the champion's playstyle and kit entirely. His combos, build, runes, and strengths and weakness are different now. Here is what you can expect out of Aurelion Sol now...

-Due to not being able to hold W up for more than three seconds, but having a faster rotation of speed as an adjustment, he's build more of a burst-mage.

-Your roaming is hit hard. You can only get good roams off whenever your e is off cool-down (which is every 1 min, 20), as you lost your e passive movement speed. This also nerfs gap-closing when it comes to long chases. So it's best to engage with Q+E or find a way to catch them off-guard. (Consistently activating your W over and over helps for chasing or running away, since it procs your w movement speed.

-Instead of zoning with W and landing the stun (Q), you have to engage with your q to get your damage off. Your weak match-ups aren't as oppressive, as crowd control does not cancel your stars, and positioning when landing the combo isn't strained. When laning, you either choose to wave-clear when you activate your w, or go for the poke, as you can only use your w so often early game.

-Instead of going phase rush + inspiration tree, going electrocute + precision/sorcery/inspiration is more optimal (whatever helps you burst more). Getting the Hextech-GLP item and getting squishy ability power items with cdr is required to bring out your kit to enhance burst.

-Aurelion Sol is more of a laner than a roamer, and his combos are usually Q+W for trades or Q+R+W for burst.

-Early/Mid game strong if average or ahead; Late game weak

Thoughts on Aurelion Sol PBE Changes _Positives: _ Introducing a feature like gaining a decaying movement speed on W when retracted is interesting. The Q buff feels very impactful and really gives more confidence when deciding if you can land the stun, and how big you need it.

Negatives: -Most of these changes not only take away his identity, but also his healthy play-style of being a battle-mage. This just makes him too similar to champions like Lux, Ahri, or Zoe to where you just need to land one ability to set-up your burst. Compared to his live-current state, it's a lot boring. If I wanted to do that, I could play Lux instead to do that job. Having the ability to help your teammates was satisfying. If you managed your wave-clear and managed to find an opening to roam, you were heavily rewarded for that, as it also fits in with a space dragon champion. One other thing is that you don't have that good damage when it comes to dealing with tanks & non-tanks (keep in mind you were only rewarded that damage if your position was on point). Now it turns into most-likely having to snowball to have that pressure, and that alone also takes away to how unique Aurelion Sol is.

Suggestions:

  • Make the fifth rank of leveling W change the ability to a toggle (which could call for a consideration of the speed of the stars). -Have the (E) still give the passive movement speed still, but only if it's off cool-down. -Consider tuning/adjusting Aurelion Sol's main damage to have an opportunity to buff his ult. His ult feels meh. (extra effect?, damage?) -Keep most of the buffs to (Q) (or adjust it to a slightly lower version from the PBE version) -Or if there is no compromise, please don't release it how it is now.

I love this champion a lot, and I can also say the same for the Aurelion Sol Community. We are also very grateful to have our time to speak out about our champion. So Riot, communicate with us more so we can end up with Aurelion Sol not losing his identity has a healthy battle-mage, able to roam and put great damage out if positioned correctly. Thank you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxt-k9VCpBs **Edit: W comparison, courtesy of @Mjolnirunleashed **

Feel free to leave some feedback down below, all helps!

43 Comments

WoonStruck9 votes

Instead of fixing the shit meta, they try to make everyone fit the shit meta. [sg-lux-2]

Riot games at its finest.

TheMojoKiller5 votes

{quoted}

Instead of fixing the shit meta, they try to make everyone fit the shit meta. [sg-lux-2]

Riot games at its finest.

I agree, this kind of way of doing things is unhealthy and boring. I feel for the players who have had their fair share of champion changes even though most protested otherwise. Hopefully, this could shed some light on how much some champion communities, no matter the meta or appeal factor to all, can be just as dedicated as anyone else. Hopefully Riot can start doing the right thing.

FlameHalbrdOkido1 votes

Yeah I'm worried about that, I really don't like how everything is about burst, its not healthy for the game. Especially when the class is supposed to be the example of non burst sustained dmg: Marksmen were the 1st to set this whole thing in motion a long time ago.

I really hope they pull back, but u might have a point, and now champions and classes are suffering for it, non burst class champs are getting burst dmg, tanks aren't getting the ability adjustment, runes or items they need 2 take the dmg and are instead getting more dmg. This might be because that they want faster games....

Riot if u want faster games tell people to play TT instead of deleting it!

Dynikus8 votes

-Your roaming is hit hard. You can only get good roams off whenever your e is off cool-down (which is every 1 min, 20), as you lost your e passive movement speed. This also nerfs gap-closing when it comes to long chases. So it's best to engage with Q+E or find a way to catch them off-guard. (Consistently activating your W over and over helps for chasing or running away, since it procs your w movement speed.

I'm not sure about this one. His e getting a substantial distance increase rank 1 (enough to go from mid to either side lane) plus the addition of his w move speed I think makes his roams stronger and saves you from needing to put any additional points into e before maxing other abilities. I've noticed from the few games I played on pbe with him that you can waveclear even faster with w, then use the short movespeed burst for a roam.

Overall though the changes do hurt his late game, and completely change how the champion is played, which I don't really know if I like yet with how few games I've played.

TheMojoKiller5 votes

{quoted}

I'm not sure about this one. His e getting a substantial distance increase rank 1 (enough to go from mid to either side lane) plus the addition of his w move speed I think makes his roams stronger and saves you from needing to put any additional points into e before maxing other abilities. I've noticed from the few games I played on pbe with him that you can waveclear even faster with w, then use the short movespeed burst for a roam.

Overall though the changes do hurt his late game, and completely change how the champion is played, which I don't really know if I like yet with how few games I've played.

As everything is up for debate, its just one idea I decided to mention to maybe bring a spotlight to other ideas, but it can make you think twice in either using your e to fly to lane or to another lane to consider losing that movement speed buff. The w movement speed could be tuned down a bit to compensate keeping the e passive on as well.

Tobykachu7 votes

A Sol is not technically a God. Riot confirmed this. This new playstyle gives you several notable advantages that you don't quite realise. Firstly, CC does not cancel the W anymore, giving you a LOT more opportunities to succeed. The damage you deal from landing every star when you activate your W is far higher than the current damage and only has a 2 second cooldown, meaning late game, your damage is WAY up. The bonus movement speed on W after it retracts now means you can afford to go other rune choices instead of phase rush every game.

TheMojoKiller4 votes

{quoted}

A Sol is not technically a God. Riot confirmed this. This new playstyle gives you several notable advantages that you don't quite realise. Firstly, CC does not cancel the W anymore, giving you a LOT more opportunities to succeed. The damage you deal from landing every star when you activate your W is far higher than the current damage and only has a 2 second cooldown, meaning late game, your damage is WAY up. The bonus movement speed on W after it retracts now means you can afford to go other rune choices instead of phase rush every game.

As previously mentioned, because of the changes, his early and mid-game is strong. And because his passive damage was increased early, as well as his W speed, he's going to do a lot more damage, I acknowledge that. When it comes to late game against a decent comp, it's not going to be that "easy" to pick someone out when they know all they have to do is avoid your set-up, your q. And if the enemy-team is not fed, but scaled enough, it's not going to be easy to one-shot someone without comitting and risking your life. Keep in mind, your passive ap scaling is weaker late game. If you can't finish them with one combo, you have to either leave or commit, hence the life of a burst-mage, which we have plenty of.

Having the ability to zone, do good consistent damage rewarded with positioning, and being able to roam effectively with enough practice feels very rewarding. Having that thrown away to just turn him into another burst-mage (by which some could argue other burst-champs could do better) doesn't feel fun or great or healthy.

Tobykachu5 votes

Aurelion's late game at the moment is nothing special. He lacks any sort of innate tankiness or sustain compared to other battle mages, Cass and Vlad have their healing, Rumble and (old) Ryze had constant shields and Karthus doesn't mind dying at all. His damage is also considerably lower than all of them late game, so acting like he's always been some kind of late game hyper carry really isn't true.

His W late game will only be on a 2 second cooldown and given the massively increased speed of the stars, his overall damage will be WAY up, even late game. As mentioned previously, the ability to no longer have your W interupted is absolutely huge, given the large presence of CC and interupts in the current meta. He also gains a lower cooldown on his Q mid-late game, as well as it giving him more movement speed when he travels behind it, increasing the chance for a stronger stun.

There'll definitely be a new learning curve that you'll have to commit yourself to if you want to become a god at this champion again, but I firmly believe that these, overall, are a net positive.

TheMojoKiller2 votes

{quoted}

Aurelion's late game at the moment is nothing special. He lacks any sort of innate tankiness or sustain compared to other battle mages, Cass and Vlad have their healing, Rumble and (old) Ryze had constant shields and Karthus doesn't mind dying at all. His damage is also considerably lower than all of them late game, so acting like he's always been some kind of late game hyper carry really isn't true.

His W late game will only be on a 2 second cooldown and given the massively increased speed of the stars, his overall damage will be WAY up, even late game. As mentioned previously, the ability to no longer have your W interupted is absolutely huge, given the large presence of CC and interupts in the current meta. He also gains a lower cooldown on his Q mid-late game, as well as it giving him more movement speed when he travels behind it, increasing the chance for a stronger stun.

There'll definitely be a new learning curve that you'll have to commit yourself to if you want to become a god at this champion again, but I firmly believe that these, overall, are a net positive.

I never said anything about him being a late hyper carry at all, but he does well when played correctly when it comes to fighting with your team late game in a 5v5. Something that Aurelion Sol can do quite exceptionally well when comparing those champions to him is the ability to manipulate the battle-field when it comes to zoning people with your stars, and do enough damage to kill or pressure the enemies. Going the AP Bruiser route gave you the damage to kill squishes or tanks because the hp shred to tanks, and magic pen w/ cc for squishes. Of course making it so that stars aren't disabled is pretty damn good, but it's the reason why committed Aurelion Sol players can pull it off regardless. The positioning to dodge the cc, kite around their cc, and damage them and zone at the same time, (especially when you have rylais) is under-appreciated. And it's also worth mentioning that if those changes go through, Aurelion Sol won't have that strong roaming potential that has live. That's also one thing he's good at that not most champs are.

This isn't a buff to Aurelion Sol, it's a change of playstyle to make him easier for other players, but also nerfing the capabilities of how you can impact a game. With the time I've been playing Aurelion Sol, and few days I've been consistenly testing out the Aurelion Sol changes, I strongly believe that it isn't a net positive with most of these changes.

Tobykachu1 votes

A trait of all battle mages is their good zoning ability, of which most have better control of due to their much later higher game damage. Cassiopeia has her ult and W to zone people, Anivia has her wall and her ult, Karthus has his E and W and Vlad has the ability to just run at you and instagib your squishies if you get too close. Aurelion has one of the absolute lowest damage outputs late game out of all the mages in the game and by the time you reach late game, if the enemies are in range of your stars, then you are also in range of their abilities and in most cases they will out DPS you. His W not being interuptable also means you are able to ban champions that aren't Kassadin.

I don't see how his roaming power is worse? He can use his W from much further away, in exchange for it being a slightly longer cooldown. His ability to side lane has been massively improved as he can now reach a fight much more quickly mid-late game due to the overall range increase and massive MS increase he'll be getting 600 at all ranks to 800 by rank 5.

In the long run, this change is supposed smooth out some of his power, so they can meaningfully buff him without making him completely overbearing when played by a proficient Aurelion Sol player, like he has been previously. If these changes end up nerfing him overall, then I have no doubt that they'll buff him in future patches.

TheMojoKiller5 votes

{quoted}

A trait of all battle mages is their good zoning ability, of which most have better control of due to their much later higher game damage. Cassiopeia has her ult and W to zone people, Anivia has her wall and her ult, Karthus has his E and W and Vlad has the ability to just run at you and instagib your squishies if you get too close. Aurelion has one of the absolute lowest damage outputs late game out of all the mages in the game and by the time you reach late game, if the enemies are in range of your stars, then you are also in range of their abilities and in most cases they will out DPS you. His W not being interuptable also means you are able to ban champions that aren't Kassadin.

I don't see how his roaming power is worse? He can use his W from much further away, in exchange for it being a slightly longer cooldown. His ability to side lane has been massively improved as he can now reach a fight much more quickly mid-late game due to the overall range increase and massive MS increase he'll be getting 600 at all ranks to 800 by rank 5.

In the long run, this change is supposed smooth out some of his power, so they can meaningfully buff him without making him completely overbearing when played by a proficient Aurelion Sol player, like he has been previously. If these changes end up nerfing him overall, then I have no doubt that they'll buff him in future patches.

Though saying "Aurelion Sol having the absolute lowest damage output in the game" is a bit of an exaggeration, that's fine. The reason he's still good because of how efficient he is when it comes to constantly being able to damage multiple enemies at once, especially when you pull off good positioning. No other battle mage can pull off consistent aoe teamfighting against up to five people AT ONCE like Aurelion Sol can. Why should he be able to do heavy impact damage when such a champion is able to manipulate a teamfight so well, with a BASE ability. High-reaching numbers don't solely measure the worth of the champion, it's what they provide. That's why I'm stressing so much that these changes will remove that kind of power, power that's rewarded for practicing a lot. Even when knowing that, there is counterplay if you can get the best of him by gap-closing him or ccing him, it's a healthy factor of Aurelion.

As with roaming, it is nerfed heavily. You honestly can't wave-clear as fast due to your w having a big cooldown with limited uptime. With the old (E), it also factors in the ability to get to your lane fast and then clearing the wave, then moving on to another lane, with you using your e or not. The movement speed boost you get is the key to roaming, and with that gone, it's a severe unnecessary impact.

Tobykachu2 votes

I said he has one of the lowest damage outputs, late game, out of all mages. Not in general. You are severely underestimating the presence of other battle mages in the game. Karthus, Swain, Anivia etc. can all pull off constant AoE damage late game, with Anivia and Karthus doing a LOT more damage than Aurelion can ever wish to dish out late game. Vlad, Cass and Ryze have the ability to 1v5 late game a LOT easier than Aurelion Sol, as A Sol is prone to getting instantly turned on and killed if he's seen to be alone.

From the videos I've seen so far, his early pushing power is still very strong and doesn't burn through your mana in the same wasy as current Aurelion Sol. He doesn't necessarily need this movement speed now, if he has the ability to use his E from much further away? It just means he is punished more for a bad roam, which is seems only fair in the long run, as this has been a problem with balancing Aurelion for a while now.

As mentioned previously, these changes are not supposed to be a nerf, but an adjustment to his kit to allow him to fit more comfortably in the game, meaning they don't have to keep nerfing him, because his win rate reaches absurd levels when put behind someone who knows what they're doing. (A winrate that stems almost entirely from his roaming potential).

TheMojoKiller2 votes

{quoted}

I said he has one of the lowest damage outputs, late game, out of all mages. Not in general. You are severely underestimating the presence of other battle mages in the game. Karthus, Swain, Anivia etc. can all pull off constant AoE damage late game, with Anivia and Karthus doing a LOT more damage than Aurelion can ever wish to dish out late game. Vlad, Cass and Ryze have the ability to 1v5 late game a LOT easier than Aurelion Sol, as A Sol is prone to getting instantly turned on and killed if he's seen to be alone.

From the videos I've seen so far, his early pushing power is still very strong and doesn't burn through your mana in the same wasy as current Aurelion Sol. He doesn't necessarily need this movement speed now, if he has the ability to use his E from much further away? It just means he is punished more for a bad roam, which is seems only fair in the long run, as this has been a problem with balancing Aurelion for a while now.

As mentioned previously, these changes are not supposed to be a nerf, but an adjustment to his kit to allow him to fit more comfortably in the game, meaning they don't have to keep nerfing him, because his win rate reaches absurd levels when put behind someone who knows what they're doing. (A win rate that stems almost entirely from his roaming potential).

?? Why are we comparing Aurelion Sol to Anvia, Karthus, Cass, and etc. a solid point to saying how weak he is. Again, damage alone isn't the solo determining factor in what makes strong in the late-game. Is he super crazy strong when it comes to damage? No, but that isn't the thing here. Even though they are all battle-mages, they bring something different to the table, and that's what I'm saying about Aurelion. You shouldn't be saying he's weak because he isn't killing people instantly with his stars, because that isn't him. What no other battle-mage brings that Aurelion Sol does is the base ability to potentially damage up to 5 people at once, zone people out of fights, grant cc to the team (assuming you get rylais), at a consistent rate, as long as his W is up. What I'm saying is that it's the damage and utility Aurelion Sol brings to the team that no one complains when a team gets an Aurelion Sol because of the absolute potential to be a carry in teamfights.

Now, no matter how you or Riot say it, this a nerf to his damage. It also makes him more predictable in fights. For starters, once you right past mid-game, that AP scaling on his passive will be weaker than his live. His w not being able to have full up-time at the point takes him away from having full dps WILL make a difference, because while positioning yourself right made you do more damage live, but the pbe w restricts you from constatly dps the team, because you'll just be squishy burst-mage not being able to have that power like you used to. B

But wait, stars move faster! But wait, you can have it up every 2 seconds! Again and again, his scaling was nerfed late game, and removing the complete uptime of his W does remove his battle-mage like kit, and those 2 seconds are crucial. The stars "being faster" isn't going to be stronger at this point or make up for it.

Tobykachu2 votes

Because we are talking about battle mages, control mages and high dps mages. These are the champions he's directly competing with. Aurelion Sol's late game is not strong by any margin. There are control mages out there with higher damage AND higher zone control, look at Anivia, Azir and Orianna.

The only time Aurelion is hitting 5 people at once, is if they're clumped together, and there are many champions that can damage 5 champions, CC them at a consistent rate. Again, look at Azir, Anivia and Karthus, all of which do a LOT more damage.

So let's forget about his late game, because Aurelion is absolutely not a late game champion, he is an early to mid game champion, who focuses on getting his teams ahead with his roams and stacks HP items and mows through teams, taking little damage in return, before they're able to build the items to bring him down.

Now you're somewhat contradicting yourself when you say damage is not the only factor when it comes to a late game champion, which is true, as you're ignoring some of the buffs to his main utility spell - his Q. With these Aurelion Sol changes, his late game damage is the only thing that's going down. His Q is getting buffed to be a lot stronger late game, with a lower cooldown and higher travel speed.

Aurelion Sol is already very predictable. He's going to try and hit you with his stars whenever possible. Which is still going to be the same now?

TheMojoKiller1 votes

{quoted}

Because we are talking about battle mages, control mages and high dps mages. These are the champions he's directly competing with. Aurelion Sol's late game is not strong by any margin. There are control mages out there with higher damage AND higher zone control, look at Anivia, Azir and Orianna.

The only time Aurelion is hitting 5 people at once, is if they're clumped together, and there are many champions that can damage 5 champions, CC them at a consistent rate. Again, look at Azir, Anivia and Karthus, all of which do a LOT more damage.

So let's forget about his late game, because Aurelion is absolutely not a late game champion, he is an early to mid game champion, who focuses on getting his teams ahead with his roams and stacks HP items and mows through teams, taking little damage in return, before they're able to build the items to bring him down.

Now you're somewhat contradicting yourself when you say damage is not the only factor when it comes to a late game champion, which is true, as you're ignoring some of the buffs to his main utility spell - his Q. With these Aurelion Sol changes, his late game damage is the only thing that's going down. His Q is getting buffed to be a lot stronger late game, with a lower cooldown and higher travel speed.

Aurelion Sol is already very predictable. He's going to try and hit you with his stars whenever possible. Which is still going to be the same now?

At this point, we are getting nowhere. We keep having different views on this topic, and it seems like it's not going to change. I respect your opinion, and hopefully you can respect mine. Thank you for your valued input on this post.

Tobykachu1 votes

{quoted}

At this point, we are getting nowhere. We keep having different views on this topic, and it seems like it's not going to change. I respect your opinion, and hopefully you can respect mine. Thank you for your valued input on this post.

Of course I respect your opinion. I hope that the changes, whether good or bad, don't stop you from enjoying the champion ^_^

MjölnirUnleashed5 votes

you get one extra hit with new w then a 2 sec cd with lower base dmg and scaling, and you trying to say the dmg goes up?

Tobykachu1 votes

{quoted}

you get one extra hit with new w then a 2 sec cd with lower base dmg and scaling, and you trying to say the dmg goes up?

From the videos I've seen of it, it appears to be a lot more than one extra hit.

MjölnirUnleashed2 votes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxt-k9VCpBs

MagicFlyingLlama6 votes

I only play ASol in ARAM, but what the hell is this meant to be? I get it, riot wants new players to not spin in confusion while trying to play him, but this is ryze-level unneeded.

Qiynaa5 votes

Agree, I am a main Sol my main account diamond 2. I love the way he is. His W is the most strongest ability. I was sad when I saw his W and E changed. Please don’t change or rework champion like that riot.

Shawkeekee5 votes

I've never played him in ranked, but I think that a lot of champions core identities are being butchered. Aatrox losing his revive passive and Asol's ability to fast push a wave and roam. Are either being removed entirely or are being shifted over to other champions (twisted fate) in this case. I'm sorry that this happened to your favorite champion <3

TheMojoKiller2 votes

{quoted}

I've never played him in ranked, but I think that a lot of champions core identities are being butchered. Aatrox losing his revive passive and Asol's ability to fast push a wave and roam. Are either being removed entirely or are being shifted over to other champions (twisted fate) in this case. I'm sorry that this happened to your favorite champion <3

Glad you're not on the change Asol hype train :), not giving up until Riot hears our plea. Not the plea from those people who think they are right even though they don't play him enough, but from the ones who's dedicated a shit ton of time into him.

Tobykachu4 votes

{quoted}

Glad not you're not on the change Asol hype train :), not giving up until Riot hears our plea. Not the plea from those people who think they are right even though they don't play him enough, but from the ones who's dedicated a shit ton of time into him.

Might I ask what constitutes 'not enough' because I've dedicated over 1,000 ranked games to Aurelion Sol. Is that not enough?

TheMojoKiller2 votes

{quoted}

Might I ask what constitutes 'not enough' because I've dedicated over 1,000 ranked games to Aurelion Sol. Is that not enough?

Side note, I'm not pointing fingers at you, I'm simply pointing fingers at people who are getting the say in what happens to Asol, even though they don't play him. Everyone has a view, but I'm trying to reach a compromise.

Tobykachu3 votes

Have you ever considered that maybe these abilities are toxic and should be removed to free up space within the champions pool for more meaningful buffs? Aurelion Sol could literally out push every single champion at level 1 and roam from level 3. You could not play aggressively in a side lane, nor could you invade the enemy jungler because Aurelion Sol would always arrive before anyone else. He's had significant power removed from the rest of his kit for a while now, such as a weaker slow on his ultimate, lower damage and weaker base stats.

Do you really believe a champion should be completely terrible in every metric so long as they're able to cling onto their one toxic niche that forces them to be this way? By all means you can keep Aatrox's revive, but say goodbye to a lot of his damage, sustain and durability.

TheMojoKiller2 votes

{quoted}

Have you ever considered that maybe these abilities are toxic and should be removed to free up space within the champions pool for more meaningful buffs? Aurelion Sol could literally out push every single champion at level 1 and roam from level 3. You could not play aggressively in a side lane, nor could you invade the enemy jungler because Aurelion Sol would always arrive before anyone else. He's had significant power removed from the rest of his kit for a while now, such as a weaker slow on his ultimate, lower damage and weaker base stats.

Do you really believe a champion should be completely terrible in every metric so long as they're able to cling onto their one toxic niche that forces them to be this way? By all means you can keep Aatrox's revive, but say goodbye to a lot of his damage, sustain and durability.

Since when was being good at something was considered toxic, especially in the case of Aurelion Sol? His wave-clear and roaming early game is fucking strong when you pull it off, yes, but that's IF you pull it off. Aurelion Sol doesn't have that free reign when him and his laner reach level 3. You would know as if you were versing a Fizz, he would go all in on you if you were pushing and wave-clearing, because he can gap-close and burst hard. Something a lot of champions have, which who they can punish Asol if they play the matchup right. The enemy jungler could play around engaging on Asol when he tries to roam, because it can be predictable. This is also considering the fact that he could fail his roams due to lanes being attentive to his MIA.

Long story short, he is strong at what he does, but he has CLEAR weaknesses and windows of opportunity of punishment. Like tell me, how is being good at something, yet being able to be completely punishable, toxic? Also, "one toxic niche" is an exaggeration, while they are completely changing the way he's played, he's not hanging on to one toxic niche, he's hanging on to everything the champion is SUPPOSED to be. And that is in no way toxic.

Tobykachu1 votes

When the thing that he is doing is toxic? Is Tahm Kench being able to devour allies iconic to his kit and identity? Yes. Is it also so toxic that his had to be nerfed insanely hard for competitive, leaving him in a completely useless state as a support for the rest of us for so long? Also yes. Aurelion Sol is sat in a similar boat. His ability to constantly shove the wave and instantly look to roam is completely unmatched, inflating his win rate by a huge margin by players who are able to properly identify the optimal times to roam. With these tweaks they're able to adjust it accordingly so he no longer instantly clears a wave, roams to a side lane and then uses the increased mobility to get back to lane without losing a significant amount of gold. By removing the passive speed and increasing its cooldown, a bad roam is now properly punishable. This means that later on, if this turns out to be a huge nerf, they are able to actually increase his damage and buff him in more meaningful ways.

TheMojoKiller1 votes

{quoted}

When the thing that he is doing is toxic? Is Tahm Kench being able to devour allies iconic to his kit and identity? Yes. Is it also so toxic that his had to be nerfed insanely hard for competitive, leaving him in a completely useless state as a support for the rest of us for so long? Also yes. Aurelion Sol is sat in a similar boat. His ability to constantly shove the wave and instantly look to roam is completely unmatched, inflating his win rate by a huge margin by players who are able to properly identify the optimal times to roam. With these tweaks they're able to adjust it accordingly so he no longer instantly clears a wave, roams to a side lane and then uses the increased mobility to get back to lane without losing a significant amount of gold. By removing the passive speed and increasing its cooldown, a bad roam is now properly punishable. This means that later on, if this turns out to be a huge nerf, they are able to actually increase his damage and buff him in more meaningful ways.

But that is the thing though, his early game waveclear is unmatched, and OP, I know. But the beauty of it all is that it has counterplay! You can punish Aurelion Sol from pushing. The fact that Aurelion Sol shoves waves puts him at risk of getting ganked. His pushing can also punished by the laner themselves if they can gap-close him, cc-him, or make him waste mana on them instead of pushing. Tahm's W is his identity and saving allies was strong, and all he had to do was be near them to save them. But that isn't the same case here man, if you let him push, he gets to roam. If you punish him from trying to push, he has to stay and clear waves, or gets killed from being out of positioned or just being ganked. That's why I love this guy so much, it's because he's in no terms of being absolutely broken, or too op to the point where there is no counterplay.

Tobykachu1 votes

Is it really that easy to punish him though? Most of the time, after he pushes the wave, he backs off and looks for a roam, only returning when the enemy mid has pushed it back out. I have played the Fizz matchup a fair bit and I can honestly say it is usually a coin flip as to who wins. If he tries to fight you, he is getting hit by 6 or more minions at once and early game they hurt and if you have exhaust or ignite, usually ends up with me winning. Very few champions can fight anyone in a full minion wave early game and those that can end up being the few champions that he can actually outscale later on into the game.

I agree that Aurelion is far from broken and has a pretty fair and balanced kit and I really do wish they'd hit his E in a meaniingful way so that they can buff his damage because personally I don't really want to play a champion who's main strength is roaming around the map, but I don't think these changes are particularly damning to his identity, but only time will tell as to whether or not these changes are good or bad. The truth is either one of us could be right and we have no real way of knowing until the patch gets shipped.

iiGazeii4 votes

I mean, you can roam like every other mage and just... walk there? You don't need enhanced movement speed to roam effectively. Even the most immobile of mages can roam effectively. Just buy Mobi Boots and/or take Relentless Hunter.

Aurelion Sol suffers from the fact that his plays aren't flashy and satisfying. His gameplay boils down to "creative walking", and while there is a lot of nuance in mana management and positioning and he is absolutely a powerful and skill-intensive champion, he really isn't all that fun or impactful to play unless you've dedicated hours and hours to his unique playstyle.

Changing his kit to be more accessible and familiar to players that aren't one of the four Aurelion Sol mains is healthier for the champion as a whole. Yes, these changes take away some of his sustained damage, but the added burst and in-combat mobility make his plays more dynamic and engaging for everybody involved. His sustained damage isn't gone, it's just in the late game, now. The playstyle of keeping your opponents right in range for your stars is still there, but his sustained damage is geared more for the mid-late game, when his W is at max rank and he can spam it to keep his stars up all the time, and his early game will be more about the burst damage plays you can make.

I understand, there is a lot of pride that goes into mastering such a difficult champion and it hurts to see that difficulty go down to appeal to the masses, but the more people that play ASol, the more attention he gets from the devs, which means more frequent balance passes (and more skins).

TheMojoKiller7 votes

{quoted}

I mean, you can roam like every other mage and just... walk there? You don't need enhanced movement speed to roam effectively. Even the most immobile of mages can roam effectively. Just buy Mobi Boots and/or take Relentless Hunter.

Aurelion Sol suffers from the fact that his plays aren't flashy and satisfying. His gameplay boils down to "creative walking", and while there is a lot of nuance in mana management and positioning and he is absolutely a powerful and skill-intensive champion, he really isn't all that fun or impactful to play unless you've dedicated hours and hours to his unique playstyle.

Changing his kit to be more accessible and familiar to players that aren't one of the four Aurelion Sol mains is healthier for the champion as a whole. Yes, these changes take away some of his sustained damage, but the added burst and in-combat mobility make his plays more dynamic and engaging for everybody involved. His sustained damage isn't gone, it's just in the late game, now. The playstyle of keeping your opponents right in range for your stars is still there, but his sustained damage is geared more for the mid-late game, when his W is at max rank and he can spam it to keep his stars up all the time, and his early game will be more about the burst damage plays you can make.

I understand, there is a lot of pride that goes into mastering such a difficult champion and it hurts to see that difficulty go down to appeal to the masses, but the more people that play ASol, the more attention he gets from the devs, which means more frequent balance passes (and more skins).

And this is what personally irritates me to be honest. Why should a champion like Aurelion Sol, who is in a HEALTHY state and in OK place in the meta, be required for changes on what makes Aurelion Sol, Aurelion Sol. There is 140+ champions to pick and learn, but it's simply not ok for Aurelion Sol to be an interesting niche pick when compared to other flashy champions? Usually when a champion gets this type of treatment, they usually have a big source of complaint (No Zac Engage Counter-play, Fiddlesticks E, etc.), but there is nothing infuriating about Aurelion Sol when it comes to versing him.

Why shouldn't it be okay to have a champion that rewards you for practicing him to take the control of the game in your hands? Everyone has the ability to play him and fufill his potential to the fullest, but changing him to become easier to most at the sake for "the rest of the people" instead of listening to the DEDICATED and PASSIONATE Aurelion Sol players, who decided to go on a journey to master Aurelion Sol? Aurelion Sol not being the flashiest champion in the game can be an opinion, because I believe otherwise (but anyone is welcome to decide for themselves), but him not being flashy to some people shouldn't be the determining factor of changing him. That's just a flat-out insult to the dedicated Aurelion Sol players. And as I do thank you for your input, as it does give light on what other people think, the people of voice and opinion who have DEDICATED their time to playing this champion and who have formed a community around him, should be able to influence what should happen to Aurelion Sol.

FlameHalbrdOkido1 votes

Yo TheMojoKiller, show them a giant Q E cross map combo gank. Idk what's flashier than turning urself into a giant star missle blazing across the map and yelling: "It's beyond too late to seek cover!" Most champs only get to do that with thier ults.

FlameHalbrdOkido1 votes

Have you not felt the joy of landing a cross map giant Q E combo? That's where the gameplay of Sol shines W and Passive are just the follow up or what u do in between landing E Q combos

Kiwi Lemonade4 votes

Everyone is a Burster class now. No battle-mages Swain , no tanks Nautilus , no artilleries Ziggs , no sustain DPS classes Kayle , everyone is either changed to Burst class or it doesn't survive (or so riot thinks). Sad days

Mαgie3 votes

Let's be realistic - Riot's gutting their own champions of their originality and making them all similar to play. I don't know what they're trying to achieve with this.

Toxic Teeto3 votes

I used to main this dude. And I still like him, I don't wanna see him ruined :(

IxtaliKing2 votes

I don't play Aurelion Sol much, but I often wonder what he'd be like if his E and R were swapped around and adjusted accordingly.

For example: Voice of Light on E would likely lose some range and damage in exchange for lower cost and CD. And if Comet of Legend was on R, perhaps it could gain some steering capabilities similar to Sion's R or Nunu's snowball.

Do you think something like that could work?

Whatever the case, I agree with you about the direction of his rework (particularly the updated W) changing his identity.

mskoldis2 votes

Recently I’ve also started to play a lot of Aurelion sol and I love his playstyle. I agree with everything that you’ve said. Aurelion still keeps his abilities but his playstyle is like every other champion. That’s what made Aurelion fun. This feels like the ryze change where riot is trying to invite new players to the champion but rams over those who’ve adapted to his current playstyle. I hope this thread gets some attention from riot. Amazing ideas. I hope Aurelion doesn’t gets killed like Ryze.

TheMojoKiller2 votes

{quoted}

Recently I’ve also started to play a lot of Aurelion sol and I love his playstyle. I agree with everything that you’ve said. Aurelion still keeps his abilities but his playstyle is like every other champion. That’s what made Aurelion fun. This feels like the ryze change where riot is trying to invite new players to the champion but rams over those who’ve adapted to his current playstyle. I hope this thread gets some attention from riot. Amazing ideas. I hope Aurelion doesn’t gets killed like Ryze.

Agreed.

Scaleyvore2 votes

He needs reverting lol or people should be refunded. His new build makes him a totally pointless champion

FlameHalbrdOkido1 votes

Wow this should be a model post for anyone wanting to... really just make a boards post, u notice and issue explain it, but u don't stop with complaining u actually offer solution suggestions. Bravo I always tell people this is how boards posts should be written. Peeps need to have discussions to get change done, not rants

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