No masterwork assassin item?

TiltoverEnforcer··20 votes·1,647 views

The way Ornn currently is set up, none of the "standard" assassin items have a masterwork addition. The closest I could think would be for Infinity Edge or Black Cleaver, but I generally don't build either of those when playing stuff like Shadow Assassin Kayn or Kha'Zix. Ornn's masterwork items should compliment a champion's strengths, not force them to change their build path to make use of his passive.

29 Comments

Succubús GF16 votes

Riot hates assassins anyways

Edge of Daybreak3 votes

{quoted}

Riot hates assassins anyways

It's been this way for years. If it is anything introduce for multiple classes assassins will get the short end of the stick no matter how small that stick is.

MysterQ10 votes

I agree.

But at the same time, it isn't like every champion needs to complement every champion. If you pick Ornn into a team with 2 assassins, maybe your team comp just needs work and not Ornn.

LordGeovanni5 votes

Same with hybrid fighters

Final Spark Lux4 votes

You know having an Ornn on your team doesn't mean you HAVE to buy one of his items? Not only that, it's actually a gold drain until late game, and people have been one shotting other people as assassins just fine without an ornn item. If it gets that late in the game and you still haven't ended, you have bigger problems than 20 damage on an IE.

HeresyHorus3 votes

item 3031 is great for Assassins, no joke.

item 3031 item 3046 + ur normal assassin build including item 3812 .

Now u deal BpS with ur autos on top of ur spells damage and u are hard to kill too, whats not to like ?

If Ornn upgraded another AD damage items ADCs will get it too, u sure u want that ?

Búbblegum19 votes

{quoted}

item 3031 is great for Assassins, no joke.

item 3031 item 3046 + ur normal assassin build including item 3812 .

Now u deal BpS with ur autos on top of ur spells damage and u are hard to kill too, whats not to like ?

no

La Bello5 votes

it works for SOME assassins not all

I can you pulling this off on Zed Shaco and possibly Rengar but for other assassins like Khazix Talon Kayn will often be coerced into choosing the Black Cleaver version.

Dont get me wrong I get what your saying. ON Blood Moon mode I LOVE getting PD and IE every now and then but on normal SR usually the full Lethality build or Dusk n Yommu+ Cleaver build is what you will be going.

I think Ornn should have a Master Work item 3142 that gives 80 AD instead of 55. Yommu's because its the item nearly EVERY assassin doesnt mind building unlike Duskblade with which some champions get more mileage out of it than others.

DKM Bismarck1 votes

IE Talon is doable, but situational

Talon needs absolutely zero coercing to go Black Cleaver, that item is core on him, and the masterwork upgrade for it is REALLY good on Talon. Same with Zed, however that doesn't change that other AD assassins get shafted because they decided a masterworked Lethality item would be "unfair"

Succubús GF2 votes

Yes excuse me while I build those on Ahri Katarina Akali

Nut on my Butt1 votes

{quoted}

Yes excuse me while I build those on Ahri Katarina Akali

Ahri can build deathcap every game, but the other two not so much.

Succubús GF1 votes

Deathcap is not an assassin based item imo.

nyakasgoods3 votes

But assassins are meant to snowball and be most useful in the midgame, whereas Ornn's upgrades are a last buy kind of thing for when you're already at full build and wish you had something else to buy with all the gold in your pockets. Assassins should be punished for having long games.

Bârd3 votes

...

Do you really want to see a item 3147 with 30 more AD?

DKM Bismarck1 votes

item 3142 is the item that should get more AD, and imo it should go from 55 AD to 80 AD (as someone else said)

PePsiLemoNN2 votes

Assassins are supposed to fall off late

DuskDaUmbreon2 votes

Three things.

One, as it's been said, not every champion works with every composition. Assassins not working with Ornn is just another way this happens.

Two, Ornn's items are meant for late-game, when assassins are supposed to have fallen off, and their roles taken over by burst mages, who can handle the priority targets from a range.

Three, you have BC, Tri, and IE's upgrades. None are perfect for assassins, but at least one works for every assassin.

Serika Zero2 votes

nor does he have one for AP assassins. Yes, AP assassins won't build rabadons. They would have some of the following: item 3146 item 3152 item 3135 item 3151 item 3157 item 3100 yet, does orn buff them? nop only rabadons, which few of even mage players get in the first place looool

and ad assassins use lethality items, also not buffed by orn. Ornn is a meta slave that only cares about tanks, some mages and adcs.

ChaosThief1 votes

First off, I wouldn't build gunblade and protobelt. You can make use of only one of the actives, so I would stick to one of them.

Second off, AP assassins can build rabbadons. It varies on preference.

Serika Zero2 votes

on op.gg you can go on "items" tab below the character profile. Everything under 5% is an uncommon pick.

http://champion.gg/champion/Ahri/Middle? https://na.op.gg/champion/ahri/statistics/mid 3% pick rate for rabadons

http://champion.gg/champion/Akali/Middle https://na.op.gg/champion/akali/statistics/mid 1.5% pick rate for rabadons

http://champion.gg/champion/Diana/Middle? https://na.op.gg/champion/diana/statistics/mid/item 4.2% pick rate for rabadons

http://champion.gg/champion/Ekko/Middle? https://na.op.gg/champion/ekko/statistics/mid 2.2% pick rate for rabadons

http://champion.gg/champion/Fizz/Middle? https://na.op.gg/champion/fizz/statistics/mid 2% pick rate for rabadons

http://champion.gg/champion/Kassadin/Middle? https://na.op.gg/champion/kassadin/statistics/mid 1.5% pick rate for rabadons

http://champion.gg/champion/Katarina/Middle? https://na.op.gg/champion/katarina/statistics/mid 1.9% pick rate for rabadons

http://champion.gg/champion/Leblanc/Middle? https://na.op.gg/champion/leblanc/statistics/mid 1.5% pick rate for rabadons.

Please trust me, ap assassins rarely build rabadons. Also, I would like to point out that the items that i listed above are not a build path, or necessary to be build together. But those are items assassins build way more often than rabadons. Like, look at the pick up rates for infinity edge on adcs.

Its about 10% over the auto attack adcs. And the ones that heavily depend on it (like tristana or cait, will have 15% pick rate on it. Which is immense compared to 2-3% pick rate for rabadons for assassins)

ChaosThief1 votes

...I think you ignored the part where I said it was preference. More often than not you rely on knowing the kit you're using rather than raw AP, which is why rabbadons is avoided often.

However it does give the ability to push faster (higher AP on mages = more damage to towers), and more reliable maximum nukes at the cost of having to spend not only 3.8k gold, but having to wait for the full item.

You can build it, and it still works on AP assassins. That doesn't always mean you should build it though.

Serika Zero1 votes

don't know who downvoted you but look. Your preferences could be whatever you like. Lets assume you like green cases with pink circles for your smartphone. But if you are one of the very few people who have this preferences, you will very rarely get to find or buy such a case. And the general ones will be different.

Ornn in particular doesn't 'cater' to preferences. He offers 'general items' for most classes in this game. Yet, both AD and AP assassins are ignored. You can also build a item 3068 on an adc or assassin and upgrade that ;) doesn't mean its always a good choice. Even if that is your preference. I'm sorry but I honestly can't explain better.

your preferance is important at an individual level. And if the champion is supposed to cater those, he would offer many more items to be 'upgraded'. But he doesn't. Nor for adcs either. You don't see a statik shiv or phantom dancer upgrade for example. Nor a blade of the ruined king.

ChaosThief1 votes

I don't think ornn should have an upgrade for every "key" item in the game. If he gave upgrades to assassin items (like, for instance, item 3142 ), then it would just be further reinforced to purchase ghostblade as an assassin. Hell, if he just upgraded boots it would make those more necessary than they already are.

AD and AP assassins are more intended towards mid game, when defensive items haven't been purchased by fragile targets, and while shields and healing aren't going to instantly nullify any chances they have. If the target is alone, then fine, they die, that's what an assassin should do, regardless of build type (assuming a serious build, that is).

Right now Rabbadon is just out of favor; AP champions need more power up front during early/mid game rather than power to late game, which is why it often isn't build. That, and they also need durability, because as fast as they can burst a target, they die just as fast. The same applies to AD assassins. They need survivability as well as more upfront power to assist in the mid game, because late game simply isn't catered to them. Black cleaver may not be an option on every AD assassin, but it still is an option. An item that provides 60 AD is still quite useful, especially considering the durability boost it provides, even if they can't make use of the armor shred as well versus squishies it still helps against bruisers and tanks (who can survive initial cooldowns, but can't take the assassin out instantly.)

Certain items must have their niches retained, and Rabbadon's Deathcap is one of those. It must be for an AP power spike at the cost of time and a higher gold price, not another 100 AP item that costs 3000 gold or something. And although not ideal, the black cleaver upgrade can be used on AD assassins, the Rabbadon upgrade can be used on AP assassins, it still very much depends on the player and not just crunching gold into stats, because if that were the case, why would his upgrades matter? They only truly help when you have nothing else to spend gold on.

Serika Zero1 votes

how is this any different from Infinity edge enforcing on adcs or Rabadons on mages or black cleaver on bruisers?

is the truth so hard to far? assassins are hated. AP ones even more, by the riot developers themselves.

BobaFlautist2 votes

Ap assassins rarely build rabadons because ap assassins rarely get to six items.

If you could (which you can't) filter the item pickrates to only show the rate when the assassin has 5 other fully completed items, you would probably see a much higher number.

And that still wouldn't be fully accurate, because at that point maybe you rush something small for a quick stat-gain. Ornn's items are designed for when you have reached 6 items, accumulated enough gold to reoptinize your build, and are looking for that last edge.

I guarantee you that by that point in the game, most assassins have swapped something for rabadons.

MLDzXnRRR1 votes

You are in trouble, if you hit lategame with Shadow Assassin Kayn... Still, BC is a great item on him, because you can hit W+Q before getting instantly melted and your sacrifice will help your ADC's DPS.

Handy Sandy 1 votes

maybe it's so assassins don't scale well?

yingwhy1 votes

Doesn't Kha'Zix build black cleaver?

Divewing1 votes

It's because Assassin items are designed to give strong spikes early on.

Having something that can supplement that strength runs the risk of overkill.

That said I would not mind if Yomuus got some in combat MS.

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