Warding/invading the enemy jungle

Rux100··2 votes·1,229 views

I'm in bronze and am having difficulty understanding how I'm supposed to know when a good time to invade is or when and where to ward their jg. Is it legitimately harder to learn true jungling in bronze?

I do keep my eyes on the minimap, and take whatever advantage I can out of them when I see the enemy jg in a lane or on the other side of the map and such. But in many game the enemy jg seems to constantly have eyes on me, always shows their face as soon as I pop out, ready to kill me. Part of me thinks its a bronze-league-no-teamwork thing, but I think there's more to it. But I simply cant keep their jg warded all by my self, the uptime on that seems like it would take too much time away from my camps and constantly put me at risk. How am I supposed to do this, cuz I'm tired of feeding the enemy jg and ripping my hair out wondering how the f*ck he always beats me to where ever I wanna go.

Thanks all for responses, jungling is fun but losing isn't T.T please help! If it helps at the moment I enjoy the jg with Vi Sejuani, and Evelynn since shes free this week. Thinking I want to try Rengar and Kindred, but havent played them yet.

TL;DR, the first sentence.

P.S. GO CLG! AurelionSol AurelionSol AurelionSol AurelionSol AurelionSol MOAR!!! YOU'RE NA'S ONLY HOPE NOW!!!

12 Comments

71883083DEL11 votes

{quoted}

I'm in bronze and am having difficulty understanding how I'm supposed to know when a good time to invade is or when and where to ward their jg. Is it legitimately harder to learn true jungling in bronze?

I do keep my eyes on the minimap, and take whatever advantage I can out of them when I see the enemy jg in a lane or on the other side of the map and such. But in many game the enemy jg seems to constantly have eyes on me, always shows their face as soon as I pop out, ready to kill me. Part of me thinks its a bronze-league-no-teamwork thing, but I think there's more to it. But I simply cant keep their jg warded all by my self, the uptime on that seems like it would take too much time away from my camps and constantly put me at risk. How am I supposed to do this, cuz I'm tired of feeding the enemy jg and ripping my hair out wondering how the f*ck he always beats me to where ever I wanna go.

Thanks all for responses, jungling is fun but losing isn't T.T please help! If it helps at the moment I enjoy the jg with Vi Sejuani, and Evelynn since shes free this week. Thinking I want to try Rengar and Kindred, but havent played them yet.

TL;DR, the first sentence.

P.S. GO CLG! AurelionSol AurelionSol AurelionSol AurelionSol AurelionSol MOAR!!! YOU'RE NA'S ONLY HOPE NOW!!!

What do you main?

Rux1001 votes

SupportAlistar

Leopards Ghost1 votes

you can't trust bronze-level adc's. make sure you don't jump in and be prepared to do absolutely nothing if your adc is lazy.

71883083DEL11 votes

you are support alistar, so you buy the ward items. You will ward the bushes.

Simple as that, don't let your ADC get hurt, be good to him. Add me and I will teach you how to play support later on today around 5 PM est.

I am really good at support, don't let my stats get you confused.

I play support karma so yeah.

ign is cogsnter04

Rux1001 votes

I want to be a better jungler. lol Im a good support, I've posted advice forums about sup. I play karma too, normally in mid lane though. But yea I appreciate it, I just want to be a better jungler right now

Leopards Ghost1 votes

It's a guess. Gut feeling.

You can make an educated guess by assessing their jungle & which side of the map he's going to leash on but in the end it's just a guess.

Talkrr1 votes

With the JG champs you play, the only good one I see for Counter jungling/invading is Eve since she has a semi fast clear. Vi is also decent but Sej isnt much of a damage dealer so her clear imo isnt the best.

Either way, I tend to not Counter jungle unless my lanes have pressure,

ex;

Zed has kill pressure on the Ahri and she's backed into turret Darius has kill pressure on the MonkeyKing and he's backed into turret.

Only then will I try and invade the enemies jungle between those to lanes as I know the laners wont help because they dont want to take damage and if they do follow I can only hope that Zed or Darius knows there is a free double kill if he follows since he has kill pressure on the laner that's already low.

Honestly, you just need to play the game and make an assumption on how the jungler will clear, if they're going to do a level 3 gank you know they're doing Gromp - Blue - Red then going top to pressure lane or gank. Alas this is predictable but you can almost always counter gank or counter jungle and wait for the enemy jungler to go back into his jungle then pick him off.

Also, you dont want to counter jungle duelists unless you know you can beat them; Invading is the same thing, LeeSin , Shyvana , Udyr are people you don't want to invade unless you know where they are exactly and have a fast enough clear time because they will beat you depending on you you're playing.

Those are my suggestions.

Rux1002 votes

What about Kindred or Rengar?

I feel like jungling is a friggin' artform. How am I supposed to know if they want to do a level 3 gank or not? And I know I'm never gonna KNOW know, but how can I make an educated assumption they will?

Who might be an easy all-around jungler for me to try invading and counter jungling with? I'm clear on the buffs and how jungling works on my side of the map already, so I just need 1,2, maybe 3 champs who I can practice my invades and stuff with.

Leopards Ghost1 votes

those aren't bronze-level champs. jax is a better jungle pick for lower leagues.

Talkrr1 votes

Not true at all.

Kindred is a good champ to play as she has an incredible early invade. She can easily pick up red buff first and go to the enemies blue and invade and pick off a kill. This itself comes with practice.

In my opinion, Jungle takes a while to get a hold of and I wouldn't say it's an art form per se but it does require finesse and patience depending on how your play style is. If you don't know what champs are going to do a level 3 gank, then just think about their abilities and make an assumption. If they have a gap closer and CC chances are they will do a level 3 gank in top lane.

Some champs that are easy to play and can counter jungle are the ones I mentioned above;

Shyvana, Udyr along with Kindred. There are more but Im too tired to get into what makes a good invader.

If they have a good clear and can get around fast they can invade.

EndlessSorcerer1 votes

If you are looking for suggestions of junglers to play, I would recommend the following in Bronze play: Amumu Volibear Sejuani XinZhao Pantheon Warwick

While they aren't necessarily the strongest or most flexible, they are generally rather strong and reliable champions while being simple to play (letting you focus on your decisions rather than mechanics).

Obviously, keep playing champions you enjoy. However, if you are looking to pick up new junglers, those would be a good place to start.

Regarding counter-jungling, I would generally recommend it in two main scenarios in lower ELO.

[1] You are cheesing the enemy jungler early by invading them at a buff camp to steal it and kill them. Many people don't watch out for this, so it is an easy way to set the enemy jungler behind.

[2] You see the enemy jungler on the opposite side of the map when one of their buffs are up. You can steal their buffs and camps while they are elsewhere with little risk (since your team has more people on that side of the map).

I would suggest watching videos by high-ELO and/or professional junglers (i.e. Nightblue3, Stonewall008, Valkyrin, and foxdropLOL). They will typically provide a lot of useful tips while playing and you can often see or hear their decision process and some optimizations throughout the game.

Off the top of my head, some basic optimizations may be:

  • Use hard-CC when the monster camps are about to attack you to cancel that attack and delay their next.
  • Each of the smite buffs are quite useful in different situations. Be sure to take proper advantage of them.
    • Raptor's buff is great for ganking
    • Gromp buff provides extra damage during clears and fights, especially for champions with a lot of health
    • Krug's buff reduces the damage you take while clearing and lets champions without CC kill Scuttle Crab faster
    • Wolf buff is useful when you are being counter-jungled or invaded (or after your initial towers have fallen).
  • If you have a weak early clear, Krugs -> Raptor's -> Red Buff is probably the route that conserves the most health.
  • Kill the little Raptors and the little Krug first on single-target clearers. They deal a significant amount of damage for their health value, so you will be healthier if they die early.
  • If you think the enemy jungler will invade you early game, it can be safer to start on a buff camp rather than a little camp since you are less likely to be where they are looking.
  • Attack Speed is extremely efficient at clearing on most junglers. I'd recommend using about 15% on champions when you need to speed up their clear even if they don't use the stat much later (with a few exceptions, such as Nidalee and Evelynn).
  • Keep a pink ward out (or in your inventory) whenever possible. This is important for every champion, but I thought I should emphasis it. There isn't really a good reason not to.

As far as ganking is concerned:

  • When possible, conserve your gap-closer while ganking. If you can get to the enemy champion without using your mobility spell(s), then you can save it to catch them after they try to escape (Flash, dash, blink, etc).
  • You should should try to stay between the enemy and their escape route. You should be trying to move backwards (towards their escape) in-between attacks so that you can body-block them and slow their escape. This also leaves you closer to them if they try to dash on blink past you.
  • Use Raptor's smite buff to determine if you have been spotted by wards when ganking to reduce the risk of them escaping or receiving a counter-gank.
  • It can be risky to gank top-lane while Dragon is up since the enemy team can just group and take it 4v3. I'd recommend ganking top-lane early if possible (after your initial clear) and when Dragon is down; that lane can be quite snowbally due to isolation, so you want to get your ally ahead.
  • Learn to recognize the general times when buff camps spawn during games. If you see the enemy gank bottom lane while their top-side buff is up, you can go steal it from them.
  • Watch when top and bottom lane initially go into lane. If that lane has leashed for their jungler (missing health, mana, or showed up to lane a bit late), then you know where the enemy jungler has likely started and where they will end their clear (where is closest for them to gank).
  • If you have killed the enemy laner, you can either allow your laner to freeze or shove the lane into the enemy tower. If you shove the wave under tower and the next minion wave is coming up, it can be helpful to proxy it to ensure that the wave fully resets and the enemy laner misses as much as possible. This is very situational though and you will have to learn when through experience.

Other tips:

  • Whenever possible, walk up to the enemy champion during a gank and save your gap-closer for after they use their escape abilities.
  • Watch the enemy laners when they go into lane. Whichever lane shows up later and/or missing mana will likely indicate which side of the jungle the enemy jungler started on (which is useful for predicting gank paths and for counter-jungling).
  • When against aggressive early counter-junglers (i.e. Shaco) it can be a good idea to start on your buff camp and/or to start on a different side than you usually do. If he invades your buff, you've already taken it and/or you aren't there to be killed.
  • Watch the minimap to see when and where the enemy goes to ward, which laners are pushing, which laners are vulnerable
  • Know, roughly, how most laning matchups go so that you can prioritize which lanes are the easiest to gank or require an early gank to decide the matchup.
  • If you have blown an enemy's Flash during a gank but haven't killed them, swing back around immediately after an gank them again. Many people don't expect it
  • If you've killed an enemy during a previous gank in top lane, kill them again immediately after they return to lane. They likely won't have wards up yet and a second back-to-back death can be enough to completely crush any chance that opponent has to recover the lane.
  • Top laners rarely bother warding the lane bushes. As such, lane ganks can be quite surprising and effective.
  • When you kill an enemy laner, shove the minion wave into the tower so they miss gold and experience and so that the minion wave will reset to the middle of the lane. If you can get away with it, clear the upcoming minion wave as well to ensure the reset and maximum missed minions.

You will learn a lot through experience, but these tips should help you at the start.

Rux1001 votes

this is all amazing. thank you!![slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

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