Why don't people play Olaf anymore?

MrBuffington··1 votes·3,213 views

EDIT: nvm ty ZionSpartan lol. In all seriousness, though, I'm mostly asking about Olaf being super popular in Korea (in Jungle) following the 3.13 rework, and why he's lost popularity, where in his change log, I've mostly only seen buffs (minor nerf to slow, but buff to slow duration to compensate, I think). Thanks.

I know he got "Olaf'd" way back when, but I was looking over his change log and he's received a number of buffs since then. I only have one team builder game on him right now, but as far as builds go, Feral Flare -> Tank items seems pretty decent. Most times I see people build Elder Lizard on him, which, besides mana regen and the CDR, I don't really understand (I didn't have any mana problems in my game, he doesn't really need CDR for his Q since he can pick it up). Olaf's clear speed is also ridiculous, so you can stack Feral Flare pretty readily, and he benefits a lot from attack speed (his passive and W all increase his attack speed). So long as you can hit your Q, his ganks are pretty good, he can duel a lot of champions in the game. So my question is, is Olaf still weak, or does is he just outclassed by other picks (Rengar, Lee Sin, etc.)? Thanks!

35 Comments

67chrome2 votes

Same reason every other champion "nobody plays" spawns nobody plays me threads.

If a champion isn't 100% pick/ban or very prevalent in the meta they don't appear often. If a player is bothering to fallow the meta and pick one of the best champions for a roll - they're just going to stick to whoever's considered the first, second, or third best pick. Nobody is going to play the 4th best pick if they're trying to pick the best.

Technically speaking, people do play Olaf. He's played a fairly average amount for being an average champion. LoL is one of the most played games in the world, so it's not like he isn't played. He just isn't as visible as champions like Kog'Maw, Braum, Morganna, Tristana, Maokai, Orianna, Elise, Lee Sin, Rengar, and Thresh because he's just not part of the top 10% must pick/ban crowd.

As for why - probability.

MrBuffington1 votes

I guess what I'm asking is why he has such a low win rate, since he was such a strong champion not too long ago, and, in my experience, he was actually pretty powerful even with one offensive item (feral flare). Is he just a sleeper pick, someone who's powerful but isn't "meta" (ie. Jayce, Karthus), or is he actually still weak?

Sunfield1 votes

Low pick rate = low win rate (not always, but pretty often)

MrBuffington1 votes

interesting, do you know why that would be?

Sunfield1 votes

Honestly no idea, following logic it should be that champions who have smaller but dedicated group of players have the highest win rates. But the rule is, if a pick rate goes up, so does win rate.

Its some serious sorcery. Anyway, I wouldnt be worried about statistics. With such a big champion rooster its only natural that you dont see him much

MrBuffington1 votes

Yea, it's very strange, I really only expect mechanically difficult FotM/meta picks to have low win rates (LeBlanc, Lee Sin, Vayne, etc.). I've been trying to find another jungler; Amumu is my only pick but I'm so afraid of meeting the other jungler early. I played Wukong for a while, but Elder Lizard + Brutalizer is a lot to invest in damage before going tank; you have no real utility aside from your ult, so it's either you deal very little damage or just stay sort of glass cannon for a while. I'm sort of split between Maokai and Rengar, but I think Maokai has some of the same problems as Amumu as far as being sort of weak early, and Rengar also has to build a ton of damage to be really relevant. Feral Flare Olaf seems like a good path to me (on paper, and with one game's experience), but I guess I'm just a bit nervous since I haven't seen anyone else do this.

67chrome3 votes

I guess what I'm asking is why he has such a low win rate, since he was such a strong champion not too long ago, and, in my experience, he was actually pretty powerful even with one offensive item (feral flare). Is he just a sleeper pick, someone who's powerful but isn't "meta" (ie. Jayce, Karthus), or is he actually still weak?

Olaf actually had a pretty low win rate when he was considered one of the best top-lanners.

As for strong with a single offensive items - half the fighters in the game fall under that catagory. Shyvana, Mundo, Udyr, Warwick, Darius, and more really shouldn't be getting more than 1 major offensive item. Just how they're set up to scale.

I'm not sure why his winrate has always been low, you could speculate a lot of different things for the reason.

MrBuffington1 votes

Interesting, I didn't know that, thanks for the help!

Pyrobob42 votes

I think, generally, it's because there are other champs who "do it better" so to speak. Especially in the jungle. He lacks the kind of kill potential or utility of most current junglers. For example, his only form of CC is a skillshot, but its only a slow, compared to other skillshot CC like Elise cocoon. He also lacks mobility, unless you count the fact that he cant be stopped, which I suppose is a special type of mobility. While he can be pretty tanky, I'd say he doesn't offer the same kind of utility most other tanks do. And obviously his damage is pretty good (even when building tanky) but it's no where near as good as, say, Kha or Rengar.

Most of those points can be translated to top lane, just changes the names to relevant meta top laners.

Overall, when I really think about it, I'd say his real problem is that he tries to do a bit of everything, but as a result, comes up short in everything. A jack of all trades, master of none. In higher levels of play, that's just not the best way to go about things. That said, hes still probably a decent pick in lower ranks; especially in top lane where his weaknesses are less pronounced.

As an aside, he was actually picked in one of today's LCS games. He went top, and lost badly vs a lulu. So theres that.

MrBuffington1 votes

Zion was actually bullying Dyrus out for a good portion of lane phase, Dig lost the game overall but I don't think it was because of Olaf.

The question I'm asking is that not too long ago, Olaf was one of the most contested junglers in Korea, and I'm pretty sure I've only seen buffs to him since then, but he still fell out of favor, and I don't know why. Sure Elise can cocoon, but Olaf can perma slow an entire team, potentially.

Pyrobob42 votes

Only pretty early in the game. After a while it evened out, and by then, yeah, Dig had already pretty much lost. But it's not like Zion was able to dominate the lane and dictate Dyrus's play, like he was able to do with his other picks. It was a fairly even match, I'd say.

Olaf fell out of favor the instant he got Olaf'd, it just took a while to see the trend propagate. He could have a 3000 radius persistent slow aura and I'm still not sure he would be picked much. The mobility creep means slows just aren't worth that much these days. Hard CC is by far preferable, since landing one almost always leads to a kill.

Different meta, different needs.

MrBuffington1 votes

Do you know why he was popular in jungle in Korea a while ago? I heard something about a bug/exploit, but I don't know if that was from the same thing. Thanks

MrBuffington1 votes

Wow...that's really broken, thanks

12tales2 votes

Olaf fell out of favor when Sivir got nerfed out of the competitive champion pool. He's a solid lane bully, sure, but there are other lane bullies that transition into mid and late game much more smoothly.

MrBuffington1 votes

What about his popularity in Jungle in Korea?

12tales1 votes

Long passed, apparently. Olaf hasn't been played in OGN since the beginning of the spring season, and he's currently sitting at #103 for pick rate in Korean solo queue.

MrBuffington1 votes

Do you have any insight as to why that is? Why was he popular and why did he fall off? It doesn't seem like it's entirely due to Sivir. I've been trying to figure it out, honestly haven't found anything yet.

Saint Tyrone 1 votes

Because of the rework and nerfs.

Dralas2 votes

Alright, I'll bite.

So, basically the reason you don't see people play Olaf very often is because Olaf doesn't exactly have a good 'role.' What I mean by this is that it's difficult for Olaf to do either of the roles that most fighters look for (which is split pushing/dueling or teamfighting).

Olaf isn't good at either of those is the problem, and going full tank is a bad idea due to the nature of how his kit functions now. If you wanted to go full tank, you might as well have played Maokai, Alistar, or Jarvan because they all have the utility a tank wants since they aren't dealing much damage if they went full defensive itemization and also all have good defensive steroids to allow them to survive the frontline. Basically, they do the job exponentially better, and Olaf that's full tank doesn't really output enough meaningful damage to draw pressure. It's like full tank Riven diving, not really that scary.

Olaf isn't the best split pusher due to 2 issues: He lacks mobility and lacks burst. The reason why you see champions like Jax, Tryndamere, Fizz, Zed, etc. split push and do well is that all of them have burst and/or mobility, so that way they can get to whatever target that tries to defend and kill them fast, creating pressure instantly as a result, or they can simple run away rather easily if a team tries to collapse on them (Also due to them being able to itemize much more offensively, they can break towers faster). If Olaf tries to split, he can get stalled for a while, or can be collapsed on very easily.

Olaf does do decent damage, but the problem is that it's sustained damage, not burst (This does not mean he needs burst in his kit), and without mobility to get to his target and actually get it off, it's very difficult to actually get a kill if the enemy player can waveclear/kite. Now, you can argue that it's harder to kite Olaf, and that can be true, but due to not having a defensive steroid when he dives in, it's not too hard to kill him if the enemy team decides to focus him down/can get screwed over by a well placed flash over a wall/tower kiting.

Now we move on to teamfights for the moment. Olaf is absolutely horrible in teamfights. He provides very little utility, has next to non-existing defensive steroids (he loses his only defensive bonus using his ultimate), and has to run at his target, so it's fairly easy to see Olaf coming. Now, you can add additional mobility into his kit (ghost, ghostblade, etc.), but he still has to run through a team in order to kill his target, and as a result he will end up taking a massive amount of damage. You could make the argument that Olaf could instead peel for his team and try to dps their frontline, but once again, Olaf has no real defensive steroids, so the enemy frontline will out-tank Olaf. And also the bonus stats Olaf receives from his W is rather mediocre to be perfectly honest. I'm not saying lifesteal is a bad stat on Olaf at all, but trying to use lifesteal as an argument for being a defensive stat due to his W isn't really good enough. Lifesteal is mostly used for 2 things: Sustaining while laning/pushing, or actually healing for a large amount often. If you want to heal for a large amount, you need armor penetration (more specifically, last whisper, which isn't the most efficient item on Olaf due to one of his abilities not benefiting at all). Lifesteal tanking just doesn't work well on Olaf since he takes too long to be in melee range of squishies and takes too much damage to stay in a backline if he built items to heavily lifesteal, and that's not even including the fact that ignite/exhaust would completely nullify lifesteal. If he tries to lifesteal tank off of a frontline, he'll heal for much less and would have to soak up the damage from a backline, which he won't out-heal. Might as well play Mundo if you want to regenerate tank since it's more reliable and scales better.

Basically to sum it up, Olaf doesn't really do anything that particularly well. He can stand toe-to-toe with any fighter/tank, but most of the time, why would they?

MrBuffington1 votes

Wow, thank you so much for your response. It's a shame that mobility creep really shuts out champs like Olaf (also he loses his resistances when he ults, wtf riot?). I really want him to be strong, feral flare on him seems amazing (worked really well in my game), alas, I guess I'll just play rengo (though I do like rengar, so nbd). Thanks again!

Cubism1 votes

Because he got Olaf'd

TecToNiiC1 votes

He worked better when sivir was popular as she gave him a really strong engage

MrBuffington1 votes

So is he just bad now? I didn't have much problem engaging on people with the slow on Q

Deep Terror Nami1 votes

I only tried him once (just the other day), and I think I know why people rarely play him;

His Ulti is by far the single most boring ability in the game.

MrBuffington1 votes

I agree his ult is a little lack luster, but with the popularity of high CC supports (ie. Morg), Olaf can literally take a binding to the face and not care.

Worgslarg1 votes

I actually love him toplane.

He feels like every other champ that isnt in the lcs roster. Fun, enjoyable, but a few more limitations than the current "meta" picks.

He gets easily countered by voli and nasus imo, but you deal respectable damage with just a bork and tank.

MrBuffington1 votes

I guess I'm just concerned that his winrate is so low; it's at like 45%, where he isn't like LeBlanc or Lee Sin in being especially mechanically difficult so that you really need to have high mechanical skill to do well with him. His axes aren't too hard to land, and it's not so vital to pick up each one since it has a pretty short cooldown anyways (unlike Gnar).

67chrome4 votes

Well - mechanical difficulty isn't the only type of difficulty out there.

Look at games like Packman, Donkey Kong, and Pinball. The controls and avatars are incredibly simple. All packman can do is move in 4 different directions, yet that game is far from easy. A lot of people that beat it actually became famous due to how difficult that game is.

I mean - sure, you can argue champions like Lee Sin are difficult to play, because it is fairly difficult to make some of his skills do what you want them to. But the same can also be said for incredibly straightforward and simple champions like Olaf. A skill doesn't need to be a skillshot to be used poorly. You have to have a decent amount of foresight to optimally utilize Olaf's ultimate, you have to think ahead to make solid use of his passive. As opposed to Lee Sin - Olaf doesn't have an entire garage of tools to accomplish what he wants to either. Learning to use a screwdriver on screws, a hammer on nails, and a rake on leaves is one thing. Being stuck with a shovel to do all those things is another, and I'd argue takes significantly more skill to pull off. Finally, Lee Sin's kit is fairly forgiving when you do make mistakes. His mobility is tied to a really short cooldown and he has 2 mobility skills. If you dove into a loosing fight there's a decent chance you can safeguard out. If you didn't position yourself in a solid place when a fight starts, there's a solid chance you can resonating strike into that fight. If you didn't prevent twitch from turning invisible, 2 stealth reveals. If you ran out of wards - 2 stealth reveals with some solid range. Olaf's kit is not forgiving - either you made the right decision or the wrong one, there's not a lot his kit provides to take that back.

MrBuffington1 votes

I see your point but I would argue that simple controls aren't the same as being mechanically simple. Most platformers have incredibly simple controls, yet they are mechanically difficult since you have to be able to use those controls to maximum effectiveness, stringing together button presses and what not; Lee Sin is similar. His kit isn't conceptually difficult to understand, but to play him at the highest levels requires a lot of timing and coordination between your skills.

Sure, lacking the mobility and safety that Lee Sin has does put Olaf at a disadvantage, but does that just put him at a similar level as every other champion, where he needs to focus more on his decision making (like most champions), or is there something else in his kit that he's lacking?

Sneak Dog1 votes

I saw him picked top yesterday in the lcs as a counterpick against Lulu and he won his lane convincingly by going ham with axes (maxed first) and reckless strike whenever he could. Seemed very vulnerable to ganks though. He has a huge amount of power earlygame with his repeated axes against squishy ranged champions who will generally try to run in a straight line away from him, but is a bit of a situational pick and gankable in lane.

MrBuffington1 votes

Yea I watched that game (edited the post to reflect that), besides that point I'm mostly wondering why he disappeared from the jungle, since he was such a popular pick in Korea, if I remember correctly (I think this was after he got Olaf'd)

lojician1 votes

Because he's a steaming pile of crap that riot intentionally keeps weak because he 2v1ed two immobile, aoe based squishies that were two levels below him one time. (Then they go buff vayne.)

Everyone gets more popular immediately after reworks.

In the dig vs tsm game his jungler dived his opponent two times and he still couldn't force anything split pushing 1v1 vs a lulu because fighters with gapclosers are already easily kited garbage and not even having a dash amplifies that.

MrBuffington1 votes

What about in jungle? I'm just wondering why he fell off in Korea, when he was so popular before; he didn't seem to get any nerfs, and the other strong junglers (Elise, Lee Sin, etc), didn't get buffed or anything.

lojician1 votes

If you're talking way back then it was because sivir made him viable by helping him chase people down. Then sivir and olaf both got nerfed.

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