Vel'Koz seems weak now, until late game

Solo Q Nobody·May 5, 2016·3 votes·1,373 views

I saw that Riot is trying to make Vel more of a true damage dealer but in all honesty, it feels as if his damage output is even lower because of the raw damage loss and **AP **ratios. Vel's buffed passive was probably meant to make up for the loss of his Void Rift (W) and Tectonic Plate (E) combo and his ultimate seems so much better but, compared to the early damage other improved champions such as, , , , , it's as if Vel is weaker than they are simply because of his new reliance of his AP items instead of his raw AP damage on his W and E. Vel's ability to melt minions in the early game was one of the small things that I loved about him and now, he can't clear the wave without using his W again alongside his E and Q. I get that Riot is trying to balance out champions but the reduction on his W and E really does kinda screw Vel over since he can't snowball as much as other champions anymore. The only time that Vel feels like a good and useful champion is when its past 20 mins and has some items and leveled up his abilities or when the enemy team is worse than you, Kappa. I've already played over 5 games with Vel in this new patch and most reworked champions are able to easily out scale Vel with either higher damage or control over the area. If you went with a tankier build, your damage output wouldn't be that great unless you have ult to back up your combo. If you went with the mostly AP, simply getting cc'd and bursted is common with the larger range of cc such as ,, , and , sure you'll be able to burst them down without problems but I've noticed that I would use my **E W **combo and immediately follow up with the ultimate but I wouldn't deal the full true damage until the 2nd wave of the **W **would activate.

Maybe I'm just pure trash [slayer-pantheon-thumbs] ,_ KEK_, but it really does feel as if most champions now seem to be able to counter Vel with ease. It be great to have some of Vel's raw** W** damage back but I can see it being slightly unbalanced with his new passive.

13 Comments

MorgManBasherMay 5, 20164 votes

He was my go to mid laner and my nich pick support, but I'm dropping him now... Makes me sad. He feels like such a weak turd now. I like lane bullies and he is no longer a lane bully. Feels bad man. On that note though, zyra feels pretty good again which I am happy about.

SIaytonMay 5, 20163 votes

Diamond Velkoz main, have tons of games played on him. I can confirm that you're 100% right on the stuff you said. They pushed him into being even more reliant on his passive but his passive does less damage without AP and he lost some of his wave clearing power. Not to mention his ult doesn't apply stacks of his passive so it got all around worse for almost every situation other than landing your E>W combo, limiting it's uses and making him more binary and boring to play. He doesn't even really melt tanks any faster than he used to unless he's at FULL build at like 700 AP.

It's completely awful and pushed his power spike into late game when he really shined early and mid before. With games being shorter, I feel like the champion will fall even more out of favor. Wish they could just revert the changes as it seems like they basically just nerfed a champion into the ground that wasn't a problem before.

Vanic998May 5, 20161 votes

Gold VELKOZ main, have 600k+ mastery points, I completely disagree with what you said. Velkozs early game seems the same to me. They added AP to his passive and more AP for his ult so he could snowball and be relevant late game. If you use your ult on a squishy, it actually does about the same amount of damage as it did before. The only difference is the potential to melt a tank. With the old VELKOZ, there were tons of times that even if you're fed, you don't do the damage that you deserve to do even with the mpen build. Even bjergsen one said, "When I'm fed with VELKOZ, I don't feel fed" and at the end of another game as VELKOZ and ulting enemies he once said, "ahhhh I do no damage" even though he was fed both times. It's on YouTube on the channel called tekk if you want to see for yourself. I was able to destroy a full tank alistar late game with one combo with this rework. This rework didn't touch his early game but GAVE him a late game. I love this rework and believe that it's an improvement.

SIaytonMay 6, 20161 votes

I'm not sure how you can come in here and say things that are objectively false and use that as an argument. His early game is decidedly weaker. Passive does do less damage without stacked AP. His W also does MUCH less damage. If you really have that many games played on him I'm not sure how you don't notice W not deleting waves anymore.

If you weren't carrying with him when you were fed you probably weren't building him right before. Yes, he can blow up a single tank right now but he lost his ability to deal huge damage to everyone in front of him, just that one target. It's a really big nerf to his identity. If you want to delete single targets, there's Veigar for that. Bring back old Velkoz!

Vanic998May 6, 20162 votes

The passive got stronger. It's base damage was nerfed by only 2 per level but they gave it an AP scaling that more than compensates for the nerfed base damage. It does more true damage at lv1 and when you buy the new morrellonomicon. You don't need to stack AP to do more damage with his new passive than his old passive. ( his passive is better than his old one just do the math) The AP scaling is high enough. And yes I did build him correctly before. 3 magic pen items, sorc shoes, liandrys, and void staff. I always build those on the old VELKOZ. And it is still hard to do the damage you deserve to do. The reason why is because you can do near true damage, but VELKOZ had low AP scalings so he didn't benifit enough from being ahead. Riot even said it themselves (look up their thread if you don't believe me. It's called VELKOZ direction) they said that VELKOZ suffers from low scalings. And please, simply saying that what I said is false Doesn't make you right. I at least gave evidence here and before.

WngNutMay 5, 20162 votes

Something I've noticed with these updates is when they first come out you have the broken champions and the weak champions. Although it'll take time I'm sure it'll balance out like the other updates... well, for the most part anyway... I'm eager to try his new kit as support, perhaps he'll be better suited there until balancing.

MorgManBasherMay 5, 20163 votes

If anything he's worse in support because they nerfed his bases so much. He feels really really bad, but zyra will replace him because she feels very solid.

JezboMay 5, 20163 votes

Report back because sup Vel seems really really bad now. It was a fun pick before (and somewhat viable) but that was when you could live off CD runes to forgo some items and buy heavy AP stuff. The ult for me is worse because it lacks the quick on demand burst, making you HAVE to combo before using it (which is risky being low in items and gold as support).

I really got mad over this. I really don't see this being an improvement for mid laning either. (Who really needed the refund on Q? Honestly?)

SIaytonMay 5, 20162 votes

Let me save you the time. He's not going to work as support anymore because you have to build AP to do damage. He was good support before because he wasn't reliant on AP to do damage. Now he is, so he needs gold. Thus, he's going to be much worse bot lane.

XilixerMay 5, 20161 votes

actually malzahar isnt that good in midlane anymore. this update reduced his overall damage on his abilites by 50%. now he is mostly for jungle now. sadly.

Emerald FangMay 5, 20161 votes

I kind of agree...

They made Vel a late-game champ b/c of his true damage scaling; to be effective against tanks in late-game. But they kind of removed his usefulness early game, farming wise. Definitely made him more of an aggressive mid-laner b/c getting 3 stacks makes your ult deal true damage. But I like the new changes. Originally Vel's passive did nothing early b/c it was only 60-70 true damage. I think he has less early-game power but more snowball potential.

Did they shorten his ult range? B/c I recently played a game with him and I missed every single ult. Guess I'm not used to it.

XilixerMay 5, 20161 votes

actually malz got hit pretty hard in lane. while his jungling is pretty powerful due to his voidlings. his q and e have been reduced in damage SEVERELY. the channel from the ult itself doesnt seem to do damage but the aoe that spawns under it does.

Solo Q NobodyMay 5, 2016

{quoted}

actually malz got hit pretty hard in lane. while his jungling is pretty powerful due to his voidlings. his q and e have been reduced in damage SEVERELY. the channel from the ult itself doesnt seem to do damage but the aoe that spawns under it does.

The voidlings is what counters Vel, with the damage reduction from his W and E, I find it hard to kill them and when I try to use my Q to its advantage, it normally hits one of the voidlings that spawns near him. When I do land skillshots, Mal's new passive straight out blocks most of the damage and its frustrating. His damage isn't the issue, its his passive and voidlings that allow him to counter Vel.