Zilean should be able to speed up healing-over-time effects like healing pot.

Solo Q Nobody·Mar 12, 2019·20 votes·10,720 views

Considering how Zilean is able to accelerate/slow characters, how come it doesn't extend to attack 'speed' or heal (in some form) like other support's abilities. , , , , and all have some way of speeding up allies with added bonuses: Lulu W grants MMS & AtkSpd or can turn enemies into bunnies, Nami and Bard have a speed boost & heal, Janna has MMS passive with hella supportive abilities, Sona is just like Zil's but is aoe with an extra boost from the additional buff given to those affected by it. I just feel like a time bending champion like Zilean should be able to speed up healing-over-time effects or influence how fast your arms move instead of just your feet. Maybe the atkspd would be loaded as heck, but the increased rate of healing wouldn't be all that bad.

34 Comments

Warlord RhinarkMar 12, 201912 votes

Honestly, Zilean should just accelerate everything about the champion.

Movement Speed.
Attack Speed.
Cooldowning.
Health Regeneration.
Mana Regeneration.
Heals Over Time (like you said).
Debuffs (so they go away faster).

In turn, casting it on an enemy would deaccelerate all of the above.

This would make him a lot more versatile, however, the amount he accelerates/deaccelerates by should probably be reduced, or else this might get out of hand.

I'd reduce it down to 10 / 20 / 30 / 40 / 50% from it's current 40 / 55 / 70 / 85 / 99%.

This will make it slightly worse early game, but it will give incentive to maxing it second instead of maxing his W second.

xDogMeatxMar 12, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AQGE05au,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-03-12T07:39:53.562+0000)

Honestly, Zilean should just accelerate everything about the champion.

Movement Speed.

Attack Speed.

Cooldowning.

Health Regeneration.

Mana Regeneration.

Heals Over Time (like you said).

Debuffs (so they go away faster).

In turn, casting it on an enemy would deaccelerate all of the above.

This would make him a lot more versatile, however, the amount he accelerates/deaccelerates by should probably be reduced, or else this might get out of hand.

I'd reduce it down to 10 / 20 / 30 / 40 / 50% from it's current 40 / 55 / 70 / 85 / 99%.

This will make it slightly worse early game, but it will give incentive to maxing it second instead of maxing his W second.

10% makes it kinda useless into a gutted state. 20 or 30% is a better start.

Warlord RhinarkMar 12, 20199 votes

{quoted}

10% makes it kinda useless into a gutted state. 20-30% is a better start.

I'm afraid that would be too overpowered.

Keep in mind that it lasts for 2.5 seconds, and you can have it up again in another 2.5 seconds if you use your W to reset the cooldown.

Besides, Zilean is supposed to be kind of weak early game anyway, and then scale to become better late game.

Plus, it's also meant to, like I said, give incentive to maxing it second.

xDogMeatxMar 12, 20192 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AQGE05au,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-03-12T07:44:31.381+0000)

I'm afraid that would be too overpowered.

Keep in mind that it lasts for 2.5 seconds, and you can have it up again in another 2.5 seconds if you use your W to reset the cooldown.

Besides, Zilean is supposed to be kind of weak early game and then scale to become better late game.

Plus, it's also meant to, like I said, give incentive to maxing it second.

what about adding a ap scaling then? per 100 ap gets X scaling.

Warlord RhinarkMar 12, 20192 votes

{quoted}

what about adding a ap scaling then? per 100 ap gets X scaling.

I mean, that's not a bad idea.

Maybe it could have +5% per 100 AP or something then.

xDogMeatxMar 12, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AQGE05au,comment-id=00000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-03-12T07:47:51.948+0000)

I mean, that's not a bad idea.

Maybe it could have +5% per 100 AP or something then.

only problem now is spear of shojin. im guessing at that point vayne/purposed zil change would make that item more broken. dang remove the cancer items so we can have league back to normal.

Warlord RhinarkMar 12, 20191 votes

{quoted}

only problem now is spear of shojin. im guessing at that point vayne/purposed zil change would make that item more broken. dang remove the cancer items so we can have league back to normal.

I feel like Spear of Shojin should either:

A. Be changed to it's Nexus Blitz version, where it was a Defensive item.

B. Be changed to Melee only.

xDogMeatxMar 12, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AQGE05au,comment-id=0000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-03-12T07:57:46.793+0000)

I feel like Spear of Shojin should either:

A. Be changed to it's Nexus Blitz version, where it was a Defensive item.

B. Be changed to Melee only

should be both. reduce essence flare effect by half entirely so it isnt hard abused where enemy player doesnt face oddball jax perma e ing people.

Warlord RhinarkMar 12, 20191 votes

{quoted}

should be both. reduce essence flare effect by half entirely so it isnt hard abused where enemy player doesnt face oddball jax perma e ing people.

Changing it to it's Nexus Blitz version would remove Essence Flare from the game entirely.

xDogMeatxMar 12, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AQGE05au,comment-id=000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-03-12T08:04:06.623+0000)

Changing it to it's Nexus Blitz version would remove Essence Flare from the game entirely.

i didnt see nexus version im saying tone down essence flare basically and yes a defensive item would be better plus the item pathing built into it are way to expensive/pointless except item 3067 the bf sword throws off the "flow" of the build pathing i would make it a pickaxe instead while still keeping the price slightly reduced due to essence flare being cut in half. now the defense option its pathing could have X resists inserted with hp then add in attack speed. still keeping the essence flare effect in there again cut in half.

Flavi KangMar 12, 20193 votes

......Ekko ult should rewind the entire progress of a game by 4 seconds. Yasuo should be able to throw nadoes as wide as the entire mid lane. Master Yi should be able to run at +300%movespeed and one shot 20 targets simultaneously with alpha strike. Asol's character model should be bigger than all of summoners rift. Why stop at zilean, amirite.

Warlord RhinarkMar 12, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Flavi Kang,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AQGE05au,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2019-03-12T15:13:11.694+0000)

......Ekko ult should rewind the entire progress of a game by 4 seconds. Yasuo should be able to throw nadoes as wide as the entire mid lane. Master Yi should be able to run at +300%movespeed and one shot 20 targets simultaneously with alpha strike. Asol's character model should be bigger than all of summoners rift. Why stop at zilean, amirite.

The difference is, these changes are actually overpowered.

General Esdeath Mar 12, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AQGE05au,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-03-12T07:39:53.562+0000)

Honestly, Zilean should just accelerate everything about the champion.

Movement Speed.

Attack Speed.

Cooldowning.

Health Regeneration.

Mana Regeneration.

Heals Over Time (like you said).

Debuffs (so they go away faster).

In turn, casting it on an enemy would deaccelerate all of the above.

This would make him a lot more versatile, however, the amount he accelerates/deaccelerates by should probably be reduced, or else this might get out of hand.

I'd reduce it down to 10 / 20 / 30 / 40 / 50% from it's current 40 / 55 / 70 / 85 / 99%.

This will make it slightly worse early game, but it will give incentive to maxing it second instead of maxing his W second.

Wouldn't that mean buffs also expire faster?

[sg-zephyr]

Warlord RhinarkMar 12, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Wouldn't that mean buffs also expire faster?

[sg-zephyr]

You could add that as a counter-balance if it ends up too overpowered, though that begs the question.

Would that make Zilean's E make itself expire faster?

ﬂooMar 13, 20191 votes

He could also decrease the time of enemies' buff timers i.e. Riven's or Aatrox' R

Warlord RhinarkMar 13, 20191 votes

{quoted}

He could also decrease the time of enemies' buff timers i.e. Riven's or Aatrox' R

Thematic wise, that would be accelerating the enemy, which is the opposite of everything else it does (deacceleration)
That would get in the way of the mechanics of another champion.

ﬂooMar 13, 20191 votes

His thematic is manipulation of time isn't it?
Lulu W? Yasuo W? Pretty much any form of cc?

Warlord RhinarkMar 13, 20191 votes

{quoted}

His thematic is manipulation of time isn't it?

Yes, but you can't just accelerate one thing about the person, and then deaccelerate something else.

The two would cave in on themselves.

Lulu W? Yasuo W? Pretty much any form of cc?

They don't directly remove (or otherwise tamper) with a mechanic of the champion.

ﬂooMar 13, 20191 votes

Considering he'd make the enemy "age" faster, he could slow them bc they arent able to move as fast with age and the buffs go by faster as well. I can see what you mean tho, just an idea.

Yasuo W makes i.e. Ezreal completely useless. Any kind of cc interrupts for charges for example Xerath Q or R. Kinda the same. Lulu W renders Riven in her ult useless for some time as well, I dont see the difference to making it pass faster.

Warlord RhinarkMar 13, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Yasuo W makes i.e. Ezreal completely useless.

Not really, not only can he move and or teleport around the wall, but he isn't forced to shoot into it either.

It's the Ezreal player's own choice if he wants to waste his abilities.

Any kind of cc interrupts for charges for example Xerath Q or R. Kinda the same. Lulu W renders Riven in her ult useless for some time as well, I dont see the difference to making it pass faster.

CC is a different matter.

It can be reduced by things like Tenacity, and Cleansed with things like Cleanse, Quicksilver Sash, or Mikael's Crucible.

CC also works just as effectively against any champion in the game.

However, this Zilean change would only be effective against someone that has self-buffs.

When Riven's ability says it lasts for 15 seconds, it's problematic if another champion can make that 15 seconds into only 10 seconds.

Minimac2000Mar 13, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AQGE05au,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-03-12T07:39:53.562+0000)

Honestly, Zilean should just accelerate everything about the champion.

Movement Speed.

Attack Speed.

Cooldowning.

Health Regeneration.

Mana Regeneration.

Heals Over Time (like you said).

Debuffs (so they go away faster).

In turn, casting it on an enemy would deaccelerate all of the above.

This would make him a lot more versatile, however, the amount he accelerates/deaccelerates by should probably be reduced, or else this might get out of hand.

I'd reduce it down to 10 / 20 / 30 / 40 / 50% from it's current 40 / 55 / 70 / 85 / 99%.

This will make it slightly worse early game, but it will give incentive to maxing it second instead of maxing his W second.

Pretty sure all zilean players already max e before w

Warlord RhinarkMar 13, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Pretty sure all zilean players already max e before w

Perhaps I'm thinking back on a time when W was maxed second, but I still believe this change is fine.

Minimac2000Mar 13, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AQGE05au,comment-id=000000040000,timestamp=2019-03-13T06:52:27.510+0000)

Perhaps I'm thinking back on a time when W was maxed second, but I still believe this change is fine.

Yep, gameplay wise it is fine. Unfortunately, in terms of maxing out Ms on a Ms building Warwick, Quinn, or rammus, these changes are sub-optimal so I'm gonna have to vote against this idea in favor of optimal 99% speed up gameplay

ModAcademy KaynMar 13, 20191 votes

If you did this, there's no way it should remain point and click. Debuffs lasting longer...ugh.

Warlord RhinarkMar 13, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Academy Kayn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AQGE05au,comment-id=00000005,timestamp=2019-03-13T02:55:17.076+0000)

If you did this, there's no way it should remain point and click. Debuffs lasting longer...ugh.

Everyone was freaking out when it was said that Ornn could increase the duration of CC by 30%, but it didn't actually end up being that bad.

Looking on the bright side of things, with this change, Zilean will no longer have his 99% slow, which was basically a root.

BeatzBoyFTWMar 12, 20194 votes

DrMundo Singed Swain

No thanks.

Warlord RhinarkMar 12, 20191 votes

{quoted}

No thanks.

To be fair, this would only make Grievous Wounds even stronger against them, since it would reduce their burst of healing and they'll have less seconds left on their heal over time after Zilean's speed up wears off.

DrCyanideMar 12, 20191 votes

Would you still say no thanks if his slow also slowed their healing over time?

sad þoyMar 12, 20191 votes

If Zilean were to be reworked with their nowday technology, he could definitely be something great.

SpaghettiVaseMar 12, 20191 votes

As someone who mained zilean when I first started, I simply relish the idea of a zilean rework into making him a slighlty more unique champion. Outside of his ult he’s basically a diet-orianna without the ball management

SillaeMar 12, 20191 votes

Shh.. if you let Riot notice Zilean exists they'll nerf everything again.

eaglei3Mar 12, 20191 votes

Would this change cause an enemy's ignite or other DoT to kill an ally faster since tic damage could be speed up to?

StupaflyMar 13, 20191 votes

if you want it to speed up heals and such would it speed up other duration effects like a nasus ult and make it wear off faster?

On the flip side, Would it slow down heals and duration buffs like nasus ult for the enemy?

blademaster432Mar 12, 2019

I love the Idea but Zielan has one thing other supports don't,his W.Like he can simply reduce cooldowns by 10 seconds right?Already his E is a bit hectic due to this said W.Adding these buffs will severely make him too strong.I admit tho maybe a passive like the other supps won't hurt.But it's difficult since you got to take his W into account.But maybe Im wrong.I just want buffs for Tahm TahmKench ❤😂