Camille's e should have an increased cooldown if she doesn't stun anything.

Newzzy··69 votes·2,683 views

Camille is way too strong when it comes to escaping. Her E is too low of a cooldown for how much distance she can travel, even with the reduced range if she isn't traveling towards an enemy. I think a way to solve this issue would be to punish the player for not coming into contact with someone. The same way Thresh hook works, if he is not accurate he gets punished by having an increased cooldown. Or Renekton dash, if he doesn't come into contact with anything he can only dash once. This could also be comparable to Fiora Q, Lee Sin W, etc. The cooldown that her E has right now is perfect for if she actually hits something, where as if she misses something the cooldown should be doubled. This will heavily punish players that are bad at landing the skill shot, and players that want to use it to escape.

Edit: Glad to see some people saw this. I guess I should've added that I would rather have a slight change to a champions kit rather than a typical damage lowered, armor lowered, sustain lowered, etc. Not necessarily a complete rework, but changes to the mechanics of a champion. Riot has done things like this in the past, but I feel as if they should do it more often.

35 Comments

Arcyyy6 votes

They're already gutting her next PBE patch so I don't see why you're actually asking for more nerfs.

Joxcab1 votes

She's already gutted anyways. She's 45% winrate right now lmao

Usernamehere12356 votes

Camille is quite balanced at the moment, so no reason for that nerf particularly. I would prefer this change, but I'd balance it such that if Camille lands the E, the cooldown is lower, and if she misses it, it's longer. But not a direct nerf; her cd on her e would be reduced on landing it if this change occured.

macromite4 votes

balanced but still not where you would want it.

It's like a crooked picture, it is staying on the hook but its still not what we are after here, which is a character that isn't infuriating to face while still being strong enough to be played.

Sugar Momma1 votes

Camille is extremely oppressive in high ELO, but that's mostly because of her ult (which is getting nerfed on the PBE currently).

GULAG 4 U5 votes

On top of what she currently has (Nerfs on the pbE) or instead?

Newzzy1 votes

Instead. I feel like nerfs in league are too black and white. "Oh a champ is busted? Lets reduce its damage, or its regen, etc." I think nerfs should come to the way a champions kit would work. I would rather have a change to the kit, than a damage nerf. Look at Udyr for example. The champion was stripped of damage, defense, regen, attackspeed and so on. I think if some of his nerfs were reverted and there were some changes to his kit itself, it would make him both viable and not completely overpowered.

Newzzy1 votes

Instead. I would much rather have a change to a champions kit instead of a damage nerf, or regen nerf. Not a full rework but just changes to how things work. Look at Udyr for example. He was gutted of damage, sustain, attackspeed, defense, and so on. I feel like if some, not all, of his nerfs were reverted, and slight changes to his kit were applied, he would become both viable and not completely overpowered.

GULAG 4 U1 votes

Okay, I see, thanks for the clarif

Keevalroy3 votes

Camille's e should**'nt have the second added dash, shouldn't stun but instead slow, shouldn't go over walls, should have a high cooldown to begin with, and should** have an increased cooldown if she doesn't hit anything - terrain included.

That looks a little better...there's still the rest of her kit, with the true damage, and the speedup, and the bullshit ult, the shield, and the attack speed, but this E change would be a good start I think. Totally unbiased to this design as you might imagine.

Ultîma13 votes

Yeah, let's just remove the entire kit. That'll make her balanced! /s

Keevalroy4 votes

Glad you agree, let's remove her from the game completely.

Wind Whistler2 votes

{quoted}

Yeah, let's just remove the entire kit. That'll make her balanced! /s

Removing a champion's entire kit is called a rework, apparently. Don't you know?

Eternal7911 votes

She actually is somewhat balanced right now. Her win rate is below 50%, so if anything she's unbalanced in the opposite way that everyone thinks she is. Making all those changes to her E would just be absurd. Even a longer cooldown for missing isn't necessary, as most of the time Camille uses it to go in. Its cooldown is already long enough that she often can't use it to get back out if she needs to.

Even her latest nerfs are pushing it a little, at least with the W.

Only Play Darius3 votes

Or just make it so E cannot go over walls. It doesn't make sense.

Chembaron Yamada3 votes

Again the sense in a fantasy game argument, huh? Vi Q shouldn't go over walls without breaking it, the name is Vault Breaker in the end. Shen E shouldn't go over walls, he is dashing in a straight line, not jumping. RekSai should be able to pass walls in burrowed form without using her E. She is digging. Braum W, straight dash again, shouldn't be possible. Thresh Same again for his Q and everyone grabbing his lantern.

I can call many more examples if you want. Oh and let's not forget: No skillshot should bypass walls at all. Because it doesn't make sense that for example Amumu is able to toss a bandage trough a wall.

Earl Eulrich2 votes

just common sense, she really doesn´t need that power.

Only Play Darius1 votes

No because it takes any skill out of getting in a good position with her when she can go literally ANYWHERE as long as she is NEAR a wall.

Asayake 5150glow2 votes

It should just have a huge cooldown - as a Diver, Camille shouldn't have a reliable escape.

That being said, some buffs to her first Q (not the true damage one) would be cool, to compensate.

LordGeovanni3 votes

except it does have a large cooldown for almost half the range a lee sin q can go and for at least 2 if not 2.5 or 3 times the cooldown of a lee sin q she already got hit for not hitting an enemy by not getting the attack speed (even though she misses out on the damage and stun) she got nerfed everywere in her kit except the one place where they need to nerf her. On release camille was perfectly balanced except for the fact that her second q does too much true damage if riot lowers the second q true damage to below 40% of the total damage and make the rest physical damage cammille would be a very strong champion while being fair.

Asayake 5150glow1 votes

{quoted}

except it does have a large cooldown for almost half the range a lee sin q can go and for at least 2 if not 2.5 or 3 times the cooldown of a lee sin q she already got hit for not hitting an enemy by not getting the attack speed (even though she misses out on the damage and stun) she got nerfed everywere in her kit except the one place where they need to nerf her. On release camille was perfectly balanced except for the fact that her second q does too much true damage if riot lowers the second q true damage to below 40% of the total damage and make the rest physical damage cammille would be a very strong champion while being fair.

That's because Lee's Q has a low cooldown because of his use of energy. Compared to Renekton's, it's two seconds shorter and conditional around aiming at an enemy - and honestly, the range only matters if you're aiming at an enemy, except for those rare instances with super sticky enemies.

LordGeovanni1 votes

as i remember we were compareing leesins dash to cammile not renekton not to mention that hitting a fast moving 'skill shot' (aka put your mouse on top on enemy model) and being able to move further than both or renektons dashes together

Asayake 5150glow1 votes

{quoted}

as i remember we were compareing leesins dash to cammile not renekton not to mention that hitting a fast moving 'skill shot' (aka put your mouse on top on enemy model) and being able to move further than both or renektons dashes together

You were comparing them, and I said that was dumb because Lee is restricted in other ways, like energy and a target. It also doesn't have CC.

LordGeovanni1 votes

restricted by energy when he gets more energy than he uses back on autoattacks after a spells while he he still has 10 energy regen persecond with bonus attack speed for those attacks. can keep that up permanently has an aoe slow and a root stun knock back nuke with % targets hp scaleing on other people it hits and knocks up. with hardly a cooldown reflecting its damage or utility.

Asayake 5150glow1 votes

{quoted}

restricted by energy when he gets more energy than he uses back on autoattacks after a spells while he he still has 10 energy regen persecond with bonus attack speed for those attacks. can keep that up permanently has an aoe slow and a root stun knock back nuke with % targets hp scaleing on other people it hits and knocks up. with hardly a cooldown reflecting its damage or utility.

He needs a target to hit to regen energy?

I don't know, but that's a Lee problem. Key word: Problem. We shouldn't be breaking champions just because everyone else is broken too. Pretty sure that was some guys theory how there became to be only a small pool of viable champions because Riot just kept buffing them to keep up with each other while everyone else is left in the dust, and that's also how power creep happened.

LordGeovanni1 votes

you cant compare camilles dash which is 40% less distance than leesins' massively less damage and much more cooldown. while cammile has one dash on a 14 second cooldown.

Ørdeal2 votes

If you stun camille mid E then shes pretty much fucked.

Chembaron Yamada2 votes

She already loses the damage, the stun and the extra attackspeed if she doesn't manage to hit her E. And now you want to punish missing that skillshot even harder.

IA9hRfpP5q2 votes

Camille is fine.

On this note, where are the camille compensation buffs?

LordGeovanni1 votes

Riot balance reads this (three of them die laughing) compensation is only for people with inherant range advantage and assassins

Wind Whistler1 votes

She SHOULD be removed from the game. She's the prime example of bad champion design. I could tell she was going to be bad news just by looking at her fucking name and splash art on the PBE. Riot tried to make the most oppressive champion possible. It's obvious.

I'd rather have Old Poppy ult me than Camille.

Automated Riven2 votes

You dont know how old poppy worked. I would rather teamfight a camille 5000 times over then an old poppy because old poppy didnt ult who she wanted to kill. she ulted whoever couldnt kill or cc her and then roflstomped the people who could stop her because immune to cc and damage.

Wind Whistler1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Automated Riven,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Awof0RRJ,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2017-03-25T22:37:40.310+0000)

You dont know how old poppy worked. I would rather teamfight a camille 5000 times over then an old poppy because old poppy didnt ult who she wanted to kill. she ulted whoever couldnt kill or cc her and then roflstomped the people who could stop her because immune to cc and damage.

That's not exactly how she worked. That was what people did with her, but it was SUPPOSED to be used for going after the person she wanted to kill, hence the increased damage. What they should have done instead of removing her was to make it so she could ONLY damage that target.

Ultîma1 votes

She's getting her sustain heavily hit next patch, and her laning will suffer quite a bit for it. She shouldn't be a problem anymore.

Raiyza1 votes

Hookshot shouldn't stun anyway.

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