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Comments on the new jungle

Shalken·11/20/2014, 1:59:20 PM·3 votes·1,695 views

Hello there, I'm here to discuss the new jungle.

Being a silver V jungler main, I know that I'm no pro player, and miles away from being the best jungler or even understanding everything about the game. I have played the new jungle items, and I love the diversity that they bring to the jungle. The new enchantments are very strong and are almost as good (if not equally as good, or even better) than other laning items. However, I do have one point to make that nobody seems to have noticed:

Jungle items no longer give bonus gold in the jungle.

Is this intentional? I have no idea, Riot seems to be silent on this issue. I've played in the new jungle, and unless I'm snowballing extremely hard, I often find myself seriously behind in my item builds.

Also, although I do approve of the jungle reduction in experience, I find in practice it has some serious drawbacks. At one point in the game, I had entirely cleared my jungle (the jungle timers are also *drastically *longer, maybe a little too long?). Checking the other players' levels, I was the same level as the players in the bottom lane, but the mid and top lane players were two to three levels ahead of me at all times. I was under the impression that the reason why a person plays in the jungle instead of a duo top lane is mainly for three reasons: 1: To provide ganks to the team 2: To provide more map control 3: To allow the top laner and jungler to gain experience at approximately the same rate\

Once again, I would have to test this more (I might have waited a little *too *long for that perfect gank), but in the season 4 jungle, waiting a bit for a gank did not seriously affect my level. Now, I can barely keep up with the other players, and when I do go out to gank, the chance of my death due to being such a lower level is even higher. This doesn't even include counter-jungling. If the enemy jungler kills you in your own jungle, then quickly wipes out all but a small minion in most of your camps, you're basically screwed because you then need to wait another minute and several seconds before they all respawn again.

To summarize:

1: The new jungle items, while giving better combat stats, now no longer give gold bonuses. 2: New jungle timers are much longer than before. 3: New jungle does not give as much experience as before, and may be seriously affecting gameplay.

Once again, I am only a Silver V jungler. These are just some things to consider. I definitely need to play in the new jungle more before making a more definitive review.

-Shalken

12 Comments

Xtremey11/20/2014, 2:01:22 PM2 votes

it also beats you up a lot. I dc'd because of shitty internet and came back 10 minutes later and couldnt clear anything without getting killed.

KAODeity11/20/2014, 9:11:30 PM2 votes

I am a Gold jungler, and I agree entirely. i like the visual update, love the health display and find the additional buff choices to use smite on interesting. However, I mained ammumu, i laughed when riot nerfed his cry, cuz thats totally not his better jungle move. but after a few games on a few different junglers, and paying attention to enemy junglers. I have seen or palyed ammumu, rammus, elise, lee sin, nautilus, rengar, khasiz and warwick. only having two pots seriously hurts, even people like ww who didnt need them before since machette is so expensive i cant even buy a ward like i used to start. they healing buff on the machette is a joke compared to how much more damage you take with monsters having more health. and none of the jungle items are any fucking good. lets take tenacity of spirit of ancient golem last season and bring it back this one. you know how if you didnt want spirit stone and wanted to go wriggles you didnt have to dump gold into usless stats, too bad your getting health and mana regen. you remember those super cool wards you got on wriggles and ancient golem? well fuck them who need them. and by the way wriggles used to count your large mosnter kill before you finished it. tried that with new jungle item and had to delay finishing it in favor of some tankiness. only to finish it 16 minutes in be like wtf. and i know your gonna say, but you get the bonus magic damage right away it doesnt have to transform. and my answer will be did you even see udyr last season? even with the time it takes to farm it up to transform you paced SOOOOOOO much faster that it way outscaled the new version. and seriously the respawn time is off cuz my path is all fucked. and no matter how fast i clear even if i have a decent minion count i always hit 6 behind my mid an top lane and end my games 2 levels behind my support. and fuck trying to take the ones that let you gank because oh yea, you clear slow and have no pots so ive you wanna burn smite on a champ while at 200 hp good for you. wonder how that will play out. sink so much into using smite and then nerf the cooldown on it. what i wouldnt give to go back to any other season. cloth 5 start was so much better than this machette start because its absolutuely usless outside of your jungle. and the upgrades dont give any meaningful start soon enough to matter. which is compounded by the fact dragon doesnt give team gold. sure the stats are cool but do you really care about trading it for a tower now? cuz i feel like 3% movespeed is actually worse than the gold. and as a whole i feel like it punishes you for taking early dragons. since drag can totally fuck you up now and the buff you get is minimal compared to what minion gold you could get in lane and what that equates to in your build. sure late game 8% dps boost is huge, but early by the time you calculate resistance its what 4-5 bonus damage? no thanks. and counter jungling now is awful. because with the reduced buff timers my opponents camps arent there to steal. and that awful moment when you fight lvl 3 in the jungle and realize neither of you have any pots and are both damn near dead. so neither one of you even wants to take the risk. i think they were n the right path but way overdid it. preemptive nerfs before preseason even starts. cuz just letting ammumu get banned every game is so horrible

Jungle Lux God11/20/2014, 5:47:09 PM1 votes

I think the less experience may be from the increased camp timers.

I think the new focus on objectives, most notably the scuttler, gave a lot bigger importance on getting the jungler out of the jungle to pass the time between ganks. I found myself frequently passing by the scuttler in the river to kill it for vision in my recent games trying out the new jungle.

Also, keep in mind that the buffs from Krugs and Gromp also help make the jungle a little bit easier as well.

KAODeity11/21/2014, 4:15:36 AM1 votes

And on yet another jungle game being out leveled by mid and top ive decided one of two things. I either stop playing league or stop playing jungle. back to pre 30 bullshit of two top. thanks riot. mid laners everywhere are thanking you for making them a little safer.

Mr Wallet11/21/2014, 7:25:22 AM1 votes

I just played with a jungle udyr who was 5/1/3 and level 13.... and so were 5 other people. One person was 14.

Udyr has no particular problems in the new jungle and this one was getting fed out of his mind and he was barely keeping up in levels.

Meanwhile the anti-champion smites don't seem nearly strong enough even if you're going to gank a lot. Yeah, they're good, but are they "don't smite this camp before the gank or don't even take a camp on your way from base" and "don't smite the camp you go to after the gank" and "give up one buff from smiting a monster" and "don't have poacher/trailblazer whenever you happen to smite a non-champ"? Are they that good? Because I'm just not seeing it.

MrSexyHobo11/20/2014, 8:48:34 PM1 votes

any interesting or unusual picks will get you killed. this preseason has single handedly destroyed any chance at using off meta picks in the jungle. but hey we get to see warwick (the most boring champ in the game) all the time.

stronger monsters are ok but for the love of god tone it down a bit. lvl 3 ganks are all but impossible with any but a handful of champs and those are the ones that are busy clearing the jungle for 15 min.

i have never hated a patch as much as i do right now. they added really interesting strategies to the jungle then phase out 70% of the jungle champ pool. it just doesnt make sense to me

DJ Hatsune Miku11/20/2014, 2:43:37 PM1 votes

The fact the jungle items are much stronger means the bonus gold isn't really needed. You got conservation because it helped jungler gold be similar to lane gold and help them get their next items faster and stay on par. When you get a seriously strong item (Looking at you Warrior enchant) for a discount because you took smite giving them bonus gold on top of that means junglers are exceptionally strong and will snowball much easier. Timers are also longer because they want to promote interactions between junglers that farm. In something like WW vs Shyv it just consisted of both farming their jungles for 20 minutes. Now both will get poacher's items and have counter-jungle wars which gives interaction between two people that would otherwise not interact much before.

I also am not sure if they removed it but smiting camps give you extra exp I think? They want to make you think about your smites so if you get a ganking one you best get ganking. Junglers have always had extreme power in the early/mid and this is riot's way of trying to tone down the early and make them scale better into late. You know, because screw people who prefer playing strong early for weak late. No aggressive 20 minute rush games in their metas, nuhuh. Everyone has to have the same power curve!