Boards›Gameplay

Thoughts on Riven

Sheenanigans··5 votes·1,051 views
Riven

Disclaimer I am bias against riven, being in game with a riven ruins that game for me. If I'm top against her, sure it's probably me losing straight up. If I'm jungling I have issues ganking a riven before 6 because of her mobility, and after 6 it's most likely to turn into a 2 - 0 for her. There seems to be nothing I can do against a riven that's played half decently, her kit is too... perfect. (numbers are based off the wiki linked, as I do not own her)

Her kit just doesn't seem to have any weaknesses, it has heaps mobility, an aoe stun on a low cooldown, a shield to make her tanky that scales off her main stat and an Ult that is quite frankly, insane. I'm going to list what I feel are relevant points of her kit, based off the wiki linked. Then I'm going to point out things I feel would make Riven less soulcrushingly painful to fight in a match, while not gutting her completely.

Ability Rundown

  • Passive is pretty simple, it makes the next basic attack deal 20 (level 1) - 50% (level 18) bonus damage. This stacks up to 3 times, lasts for 5s and is produced by using an Ability. This bonus damage does increase lifesteal.

  • Q is on a 3 charge system, is pretty iconic of Riven's kit in general. Each charge moves her forward, and does about 60% of her AD in aoe damage around her, with the last in the combo knocking up enemies too. Each charge will reset her basic attack animation (which leads to abuse but I cannot see a feasible work around). The cooldown for this 'ability' is 13 seconds, with the cooldown counting down on the first Q, not the last (apparently).

  • W is a Point Blank aoe stun. A .75s duration stun with a cooldown of 11s at rank 1 and 7s at rank 5. This also does 50 / 80 / 110 / 140 / 170 (+100% Bonus AD) damage.

  • E is a simple dash with 325 range, which also shields Riven. The shield only lasts for 1.5s, but it shields for 90 / 120 / 150 / 180 / 210 (+100% bonus AD). It has a cooldown of 10s at rank 1 and 6s at rank 5.

  • R (First) not only increases her AD by 20%, it increases the range of her Q and W too! It has a cooldown of 110s at rank 1 and 50s at rank 3.

  • R (Second) fires an cone aoe 'skillshot' that does 80 / 120 / 160 (+60% Bonus AD) Damage. This damage scales by 2.67% per 1% of missing health, up to 200% increased damage if they are missing 75% hp. IN AN AREA! She can only do this once per Ultimate. (That bug got fixed.)

The Problem So I suppose after all that is said, what IS my problem with Riven? She has very good laning phase, decent defenses (that scale off offense stats), damn good damage, a long ranged aoe execute and mobility to get away from most attempts to stop her. The only thing that stops Riven in her tracks is hard CC like a Stun, Immobilise or Silence. Unfortunately most of these are skillshots which she can avoid with her mobility.

Interestingly enough, in spite of what I see as a flawless kit, Riven is not played much at the higher skill levels. This does not make sense to me as Riven is usually a force of nature in games I play, usually requiring a heap of CC and praying that my team can finish her before she kills someone (or all of us) and gets away with her mobility. I FULLY expect people to add thier knowledge on this apparent trend. Looking forward to it, because I am stumped.

Damage Riven's damage is deceptive in the fact that every ability she uses will give her a charge of her passive. If managed correctly this means that every ability may as well do +50% of her AD, assuming she can hit her target. For example her Q does 60% of her AD each Q, and gives you a charge of her passive for another +50% of her AD on the next basic attack. that's 330% AD on one combo of her Q. Additionally, most of Rivens damage that isn't from her passive is AoE, meaning say half her damage is done to everyone around her.

Potential Damage Changes Passive may need to have reduced stacks or reduced uptime. As it stands she can get 5 charges in a rotation, leading to an extra 2.5 basic attacks. In the time she attacks you 5 times, she's 'hit' you 7.5, not including ability damage! (at level 18, the % scales on level) Ultimate should be Single Target, range can be like half current range. Nobody needs an aoe execute, especially not someone with that much aoe.

Mobility Currently Riven has a LOT of mobility on relatively low cooldowns that allow her to not only dominate lane and fight on her terms most of the time, but roam very well and get fed that way. Ganks are usually ineffective, due to mobility.

Potential Mobility Changes This is going to be controversial, people are going to read this and instantly think I want the worst for Riven. Remove her first Q combo. This will reduce both her ability to proc her Passive, AND her Mobility. If you must, add the damage to one of the other hits. This will hit her iconic ability HARD, but I feel if you rein in her mobility this much, it will make her less overbearing and you may even be able to (have to?) buff her in other places. Increase the cooldown of her E by about 4s. Double cooldown for E if used in the opposite direction of a champion. (called 'Valour', not 'Tactical Retreat')

Defense Defense-wise, I think Riven is in a fairly decent spot. The most important thing here I feel is that her passive effectively increases all her lifesteal purchases by 20% at level 1 up to 50% at level 18.

Potential Defense Changes Passive no longer increases Lifesteal amount. CD on E increased by about 4s (as mentioned in Mobility) E cooldown doubled if used in the opposite direction of a champion (as mentioned, will hit defense too)

The Point After going through all this I suppose you're wondering what I thought the 'Endgame' was here. I am hoping that by implementing some of these changes, Riven will be able to do less everything, and perhaps have power shifted / added (if need be) in a way that leaves her healthier overall.

Thanks for reading if you managed, apoligise for this being so long winded and probably hard to read. Feedback will be read, maybe replied to but may take a bit of time.

TL:DR Mostly nerfs, to try and leave Riven healthier. Hard to explain, skip to the 'Potental Changes' bit for a better explanation. Oh and I do not own Riven, I've played her once when she was free.

12 Comments

ModWulf Helhammer4 votes

Interestingly enough, in spite of what** I see** as a flawless kit, Riven is not played much at the higher skill levels. This does not make sense to me as Riven is usually a force of nature in games I play,~~ usually requiring a heap of CC and praying that my team can finish her before she kills someone (or all of us) and gets away with her mobility~~._ I _FULLY expect people to add thier knowledge on this apparent trend. Looking forward to it, because I am stumped.

hergheg......hehehehehe.....HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

TyroneWatermelon2 votes

{quoted}

hergheg......hehehehehe.....HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

The fresh laugh of a 13 years old kid

ModWulf Helhammer4 votes

First, that is really a stupid insult (I'm 18 btw). Second, my point is how he points out all these things from his opinion. He thinks that just because the Rivens he plays against in his Bronze 2 games are going to amount to Riven being an unstoppable pick at high elos (which she can be, but only when played with a very high skill level; in other words, that same as any other champ. Can you pick up Shen and pull of the same plays as the LCS? No, you probably can't. But they can, so they do). His entire central point in that was about how all the Rivens he plays against steamroll his team. Granted, that can happen. BUT: the only reason is does happen is because at our skill level NO ONE CAN FOCUS FOR CRAP. So say he's playing Vel'Koz (which seems to be a popular champ for him based on LoLking) and he lands the knock up on Riven before she gets the chance to do anything. Two things should happen. 1. Mid Vel'Koz unloads his burst on her, deleting her OR 2. Support Vel'Koz unloads his slightly less burst on her, and his team focus the CCed relatively squishy served up to them on a tectonic plate.

Unfortunately, neither of those situations occur (the second one a lot less than the first), so Riven just waits till the end of the CC, unloads her burst on the team, and then you have a complaint filed off to the Boards.

His sole point of how because he thinks that Riven would be amazing in high ELOs is completely absurd, and has absolutely no ground to stand on.

Also quick edit note: I have just recently picked up Riven, and she is NOT as easy as people say she is. Sure, once late game rolls around and you get the items you need, you're pretty hard to stop and pretty bursty (but I've been able to kill people faster with both my Quinn and my Xerath, two champs which are generally considered harder to play then most), but before that, she's pretty hard to do well with unless you get frequent successful ganks. So all the people saying "Riven such a newb champ rito nerf pls", you're far from being even remotely accurate.

Sheenanigans2 votes

You should probably ignore those Vel'koz games, don't usually play him it's just been the last couple days i've been enjoying him.

You're right that I'm only speaking from my perspective, because that's the only one I have. I've HEARD that riven isn't played at high level, I don't know why myself, aside from the 'focusing' you mentioned. But it's the same perspective as yours, correct?

Are you just suggesting I play someone with hard point and click CC and tell my team every match to focus the riven when I CC her?

TyroneWatermelon1 votes

{quoted}

First, that is really a stupid insult (I'm 18 btw). Second, my point is how he points out all these things from his opinion. He thinks that just because the Rivens he plays against in his Bronze 2 games are going to amount to Riven being an unstoppable pick at high elos (which she can be, but only when played with a very high skill level; in other words, that same as any other champ. Can you pick up Shen and pull of the same plays as the LCS? No, you probably can't. But they can, so they do). His entire central point in that was about how all the Rivens he plays against steamroll his team. Granted, that can happen. BUT: the only reason is does happen is because at our skill level NO ONE CAN FOCUS FOR CRAP. So say he's playing Vel'Koz (which seems to be a popular champ for him based on LoLking) and he lands the knock up on Riven before she gets the chance to do anything. Two things should happen. 1. Mid Vel'Koz unloads his burst on her, deleting her OR 2. Support Vel'Koz unloads his slightly less burst on her, and his team focus the CCed relatively squishy served up to them on a tectonic plate.

Unfortunately, neither of those situations occur (the second one a lot less than the first), so Riven just waits till the end of the CC, unloads her burst on the team, and then you have a complaint filed off to the Boards.

His sole point of how because he thinks that Riven would be amazing in high ELOs is completely absurd, and has absolutely no ground to stand on.

Also quick edit note: I have just recently picked up Riven, and she is NOT as easy as people say she is. Sure, once late game rolls around and you get the items you need, you're pretty hard to stop and pretty bursty (but I've been able to kill people faster with both my Quinn and my Xerath, two champs which are generally considered harder to play then most), but before that, she's pretty hard to do well with unless you get frequent successful ganks. So all the people saying "Riven such a newb champ rito nerf pls", you're far from being even remotely accurate.

Maybe next time explain to him instead of quoting and laughing like a child

TyroneWatermelon1 votes

Riven is support to be a beginner champion for unskilled players who can't manage mana,Trade in lane and farm. Then noobs like BoxBox and other riven mains too it to far that they say riven is high skill requirement champion when she's actually brainless

nananananacat1 votes

Try laning Cassiopeia against her. I had an amazing time against a Riven as Cassiopeia. As Cassopeia, do not let the lane push out. Freeze the lane in front of your tower and last hit the best you can. Just harass her with Q when she walks up to try and CS, until you get a tear to start harassing with E, or harass her with Q+E if she is getting really aggressive early. Try to land a Q and wait for her shield to go down before using E, if she uses shield to negate the DoT.

Sheenanigans1 votes

Interesting, but can't she obliterate you if she gets in on you? kinda like the Teemo issue

nananananacat1 votes

{quoted}

Interesting, but can't she obliterate you if she gets in on you? kinda like the Teemo issue

Well, that's the thing. Unless she flashes in on you after using her shield, she shouldn't be able to reach you and CC. From what I've experienced, she'll only obliterate you if you stay near her for triple Q and E stun post-6, and even then, it shouldn't be 100-0. Your ult also comes in handy, because if she tries to close the gap, you ult, drop a Q or W on her, and and spam E while backing away from her, which should obliterate her health bar. You'll want a healthy mana pool (I like starting Dorans into Tear) though, so that you can use your Q and E more.

Your Q also has nice range on it, which is why it is so amazing for harass (850 range is good for farming minions and harass). It's a lot farther than Teemo's range. You'll wanna farm up well too, because Cassiopeia's damage output with Q + E spam is insane with a bit of AP.

Sheenanigans1 votes

Will definately have to try it some time, though as I usually call fill it'll have to be when the stars align and I get top against a Riven >.>

nananananacat1 votes

Well, she'll have a lot of trouble closing the gap. Your Q has a huge range on it (850 range!!!), so unless she flashes and E's into a Q, she'll have trouble catching you.

Focus on last hitting with your E to keep your mana up early game until you can get a tear.

If Riven gets too close for a trade, turn around and ult her, use Q + E spam (remember to keep your poison DoT up on her) and her health bar will get shredded. The main thing you have to worry about is your mana and not running out. Once you get a good amount of AP, you'll shred through her HP and enemy HP like nobody's buisness (Try a Rylai's on her too, makes kiting Riven with your Q + E combo feel so good).

Focus on kiting away from her while using your E on her. She can do a lot of damage to you if she gets too close, but unless she's fed or close to full build in the lategame, she should not be able to 100 - 0 you with one rotation (including ult), and Seraph's Embrace + Rylai's + ROA + Zhonya's is typically enough to survive one, if not two rotations of her skills, and that should be all you need to shred through her HP.

E's range is 700, which Riven can close the gap on without flash using E + Q with boots, so be careful when trading with E

nananananacat1 votes

Lol, it looked like I didn't make a post one, so I made a repost. Just gonna keep both up xD

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by Sheenanigans

Darius Q
Gameplay10 comments
2
votes