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Limiting support items to one item per team may fix funnel and enchanters skipping top laning.

bäd··7 votes·2,606 views

item 3854 item 3862 item 3858 item 3850 Limited to 1 item per team.

At the moment some people are cheating laning phase by playing with support items in solo lanes. It's an incredibly degenerate play style that removes an important skill from the solo lanes, which is killing minions under pressure from opponent.

The problem is two-fold. The "support" player is not under pressure to kill many minions and at the same time the enemy laner is often not pressured by the "support", thus giving each an easy laning phase. This creates a situation where each player is not interacting with their lane opponent, so it's not very fun.

Limiting support items to one per team would remove the strategies of Taric middle with Spoils of War passive and enchanters top lane with Tribute passive without change to the champions' current state of balance. A problem that may arise is if someone decides to do this strategy anyways they may steal the support item from the true support. However, doing this would be so sub optimal it's unlikely to be seen as anything other than griefing.

[sg-soraka] Please consider this.

30 Comments

Saezio3 votes

I think the best way to fix support item is the following combination of Passives.

Passive: Disables all passive gold income, and gold from last hitting. Passive: While within X units of an allied champion gain Y gold per 10.

The idea is to reward support for sticking with allies and punish them for being alone. It would also make roaming have at least SOME tradeoff unless you are close to your jungler.

I am not going to bother with numbers unless Riot paypals me :P

GinoSoldier4 votes

{quoted}

I think the best way to fix support item is the following combination of Passives.

Passive: Disables all passive gold income, and gold from last hitting. Passive: While within X units of an allied champion gain Y gold per 10.

The idea is to reward support for sticking with allies and punish them for being alone. It would also make roaming have at least SOME tradeoff unless you are close to your jungler.

I am not going to bother with numbers unless Riot paypals me :P

Except now you punish supports for roaming, ward clearing and backing alone. You punish champs like Bard for Meep hunting. Several other things besides those too.

I'm much more partial to linking Exhaust to the support items like Smite is to jungle items.

Saezio2 votes

Maybe support roams to mid at level 2-4 SHOULD have tradeoffs.

Exhaust is not the go to support summoner no matter how you look at it. ignite/heal are more common in pro for example.

Bard already gets XP for meep hunting, add a little bit of gold to that and it's fixed. (bard is easy to balance cause he is a special case)

Supports also SHOULDN'T ward clear alone. Other roles should fucking escort them cause it's fkin dangerous.

BTW you can just easily up the gold gen when NEAR the allies to offset the gold lost.

And maybe backing when at least 1 more of your FOUR teammates backs is a nice strategic skill to have anyway. So I don't think that's a bad thing.

Also, your team has an extra reason to come aid you when your fucking ADC just inted their face off because they though "their final auto after flash would kill".

I just think it's a nice touch to have to consider many things at once to take decisions. ATM support role feels extremely monotonous, especially in pro play. It's like watching the same support style EVERY game.

ZephyrDrake1 votes

{quoted}

Maybe support roams to mid at level 2-4 SHOULD have tradeoffs.

Exhaust is not the go to support summoner no matter how you look at it. ignite/heal are more common in pro for example.

Bard already gets XP for meep hunting, add a little bit of gold to that and it's fixed. (bard is easy to balance cause he is a special case)

Supports also SHOULDN'T ward clear alone. Other roles should fucking escort them cause it's fkin dangerous.

BTW you can just easily up the gold gen when NEAR the allies to offset the gold lost.

And maybe backing when at least 1 more of your FOUR teammates backs is a nice strategic skill to have anyway. So I don't think that's a bad thing.

Also, your team has an extra reason to come aid you when your fucking ADC just inted their face off because they though "their final auto after flash would kill".

I just think it's a nice touch to have to consider many things at once to take decisions. ATM support role feels extremely monotonous, especially in pro play. It's like watching the same support style EVERY game.

and your solution is to make it even more monotonous? love that logic of yours

Saezio2 votes

I don't think it would be more monotonous, I think it would be more strategic because you will always have to be with someone. Be it the jungler, top, mid or bot laner.

So each support pick's different synergies with the entire team would be more relevant as opposed to your support being dictated 90% by your team's bot laner and the enemy bot and support picks.

Supports could choose to spend more time with their mid/top/jg if they see that their adc isn't worth their time / can handle lane on their own.

I guess we see support position differently.

Maybe it would be a nerf for pre diamond supports, but I think it would make pro/ diamond1+ games more diverse.

It's just an opinion, you don't need to lash out. Not like riot are gonna listen to me LOL!

ZephyrDrake3 votes

{quoted}

I think the best way to fix support item is the following combination of Passives.

Passive: Disables all passive gold income, and gold from last hitting. Passive: While within X units of an allied champion gain Y gold per 10.

The idea is to reward support for sticking with allies and punish them for being alone. It would also make roaming have at least SOME tradeoff unless you are close to your jungler.

I am not going to bother with numbers unless Riot paypals me :P

how to make support be completely bad and one dimensional in a single move. How to completely destroy bard in a single move. How to completely negate and make it so that no support wants to roam ever in a single move. How to make it so that holding a wave and getting a couple of CS is pretty much always the wrong move.

Cind3rkick2 votes

What happens when the taric mid gets the support item?

bäd2 votes

{quoted}

What happens when the taric mid gets the support item?

I believe most people play to win. Denying the true support effective income would not be a good strategy to win. Not many people would choose to do this.

Daedric Etwahl2 votes

Idk man just kinda "trusting people not to completely fuck over their ally" sounds like a terrible safety net. They would 100% need to limit who can buy a support item at all before they could implement 1 supp item per team. Like sure, maybe real players won't do that but then that's just an extra new way for a troll to effortlessly ruin the game for their support

Cind3rkick1 votes

{quoted}

I believe most people play to win. Denying the true support effective income would not be a good strategy to win. Not many people would choose to do this.

All boosters would do this. The entire point of the funnel strat is to 2v5.

Saezio2 votes

Totally hypothetical scenario: Pre game lobby: Summoner A : Can I play support please? Summoner B : Sorry mate we are pre.

In-game (Summoner A Buys support item...) Summoner A: GL HF!

Summoner B: Come on man, please just play normally!

Summoner A: /all report Summoner B flamer.

Summoner B: YOU FUCKING MORON WHAT THE HELL IS THIS STOP TROLLING

Guess who is banned after this game.

Also, since there are no "hard rules" on who can build what. You can't report for buying an item.

DiveAlive2 votes

This might work if there were a support summoner spell like smite that was required to buy the supp item

Summoner SpeII1 votes

so how does the game know who is the troll and who is the support? imagine trying to support when ur top lane stole the support item. there needs to be something more specific

C0l0urless9 votes

They could give us official role swap in champ select.

Saezio2 votes

This is something we really need.

Like, press a button and see if they accept. Typing is so fucking troublesome and takes time.

P.S. it would still not fix the problem at hand since there is no hard rule to what items you can buy per role. But it would be a nice addition to at least be able to correctly punish those that "steal" roles.

C0l0urless1 votes

Just prevent other roles from buying support starting items like ranged champs are prevented from buying Tiamat items.

Saezio3 votes

Apples and oranges mate.

ROLES are not prevented to build tiamat items. CHAMPIONS are.

(I am not saying that more than 1 person should have access to support items, I am saying it is a bit more complicated than what you propose, riot need to just find a way to make those items NOT APPEAL to other roles in the first place)

C0l0urless2 votes

I think limiting the items to 1 per team would be the easiest way to balance them without hurting Support in the process.

RyzeRework1 votes

Yeah but then the problem is what happens when somone who isnt a support buys the item

C0l0urless1 votes

Allow only the Support to buy it. I didn't mention it previously because I thought it was obvious.

RyzeRework1 votes

But that's the problem you cant it's impossible lol unless you tie it into a summoner spell like smite

C0l0urless1 votes

Read my first comment in this thread.

They could give us official role swap in champ select.

RyzeRework1 votes

Lol make champ select even longer? The thing is the support items are pretty bad for anyone not a support so it would be a waste too. If your playing a support in lane your not taking support items unless you are funneling, if you want to fix funneling your going to have to have smite increase gold and xp for camps and reduce gold and xp from lane minions

C0l0urless1 votes

We don't need to increase time in champ select for this.

Support items being bad on non-supports is the main reason I want this change, since it nerfs funneling while causing little collateral damage.

ZackTheWaffleMan1 votes

Concept: Anyone can buy a support item, but they only work in/around the botlane for the first 7-10 minutes

Wordz8 for Jesus1 votes

From what I heard from i0ki, Supports hate being chained to the ADC. Also it wouldn't work in cases of lane swapping... admittedly Riot does NOT like that.

I think Perhaps a conditional like this: "if you have NOT been near an ally for 45 seconds, the support item stops functioning, except for reducing gold from minions."

This would hopefully, this would stop other lanes from taking the support item, but could result in non-support laners, who take it, to roam frequently or request ganks frequently.

IainG102 votes

Potential problem with this is if someone other than the Support took the item and screwed the Support over; it would all be down to implementation, but I don't know the optimal way of dealing with that (unlike Jungle items and Smite, there is no mandatory Support spell to tie the item to).

Love Anastasia1 votes

What about stop remove, you know, differente strategies?

Waaaarrrrgggghhh1 votes

Then I can just ruin bot lane's chance by buying a supp item and make the game unwinnable.

Wordz8 for Jesus1 votes

I think Perhaps a conditional like this: "if you have NOT been near an ally for 45 seconds, the support item stops functioning, except for reducing gold from minions."

Non-Support-laners, would have to roam or request ganks to benefit. ...Actually this would probably just move the non-supports-laner to mid lane, and they just move near their jungler early game. and I think most just roam after a few waves anyways...

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