Riot, we need to talk.

Chortle·Nov 20, 2014·7 votes·954 views

The amount of content you have put out after worlds ended is ridiculous! From the new summoner's rift, to Kalista, to champion updates, PORO SKINS!, and the changes to the jungle, you guys have been popping out some delicious content and I for one couldn't be happier!

**Thank you Riot for realizing the stagnancy of mid S4 and doing your best to spice things up! ** I can't wait to try out the new jungle! Also if Snoopeh's predictions are right, roaming supports?! Yes please!!!

Maybe even new meta supports arise that are gank oriented and roam the majority of the game DO WANT!

What is looking to be your favorite addition from patch 4.19? Any predictions for S5?

19 Comments

AGarnerNov 20, 20143 votes

I just played a game as Alistar vs a MF and Ahri level 2 ganks murdered them got the first blood and second kill.

SmokingPuffinNov 20, 20143 votes

Poro Rider Sejuani . I don't even care that she's totally awful in the new jungle.

ChortleNov 20, 20141 votes

Poro Rider HYPE!!!

I have yet to try her in the new jungle, but hearing this is really disheartening :X

I think they said they might be giving some champions that don't do very well in the new jungle some buffs to help them come into viability.

Well if she truly isn't working out in the jungle (might have to play with runes/masteries and where to start her clear), I'll still be taking her top/mid/supp haha

SmokingPuffinNov 20, 20142 votes

Sejuani had bad first clears in the old jungle, where most champions would come out at full health with a spare pot or two. The new jungle beats up most junglers, and now Sejuani is really really struggling.

Also, the best route for her uses smite on red for the heal, but that means you won't have blue buff forever and you know how bad her mana sustain is. It's basically like you got invaded level 1 every game now.

Expect buffs for Sejuani and her close friend Nautilus , because jungle tanks are not equipped to survive the new jungle. So far, it's looking like high sustain junglers are the way to go, with some use of greased lightning junglers and very little in the way of strong gankers or engagey tanks.

ChortleNov 20, 20141 votes

I would like to see Sejuani and Nautilus come into play as roaming supports like Snoopeh is predicting if you have a farm intensive jungler on your team.

Especially since the jungle is harder and more rewarding now, it kind of makes sense that heavy cc tank junglers would fall behind

SmokingPuffinNov 20, 20141 votes

I would like to see and come into play as roaming supports like Snoopeh is predicting if you have a farm intensive jungler on your team.

I wouldn't hold your breath for roaming supports. Remember that supports still have gold income items they need to get value from, and none of the item lines are good for roaming -- Coin wants minion kills, Edge wants to poke every 10 seconds, Relic wants to kill minions. None of these provide useful combat stats, either.

This is a long way from the roaming support meta, where Alistar started boots/ward/pots, rushed Mobis as first item, and was ganking like a jungler after first back.

Especially since the jungle is harder and more rewarding now, it kind of makes sense that heavy cc tank junglers would fall behind

The idea of the jungle changes is to promote jungler diversity, not shut a class of junglers out from the jungle.

C9 Scott Free Nov 20, 20141 votes

explain to me how less gold and xp overall is more rewarding. I mean you had more gold last season. You could farm without dying early game last season if you wanted to. And your camps weren't always gone and if a minor invade happened you weren't screwed out of a gold source for two minutes. In all honesty this season is just about forcing ganks if you can make it to level 3. By the way once bot lane players get into the groove and have their vision up they will probably burst most junglers because there will be no high health ganks unless you rush straight there.

insaiyanbaccaNov 20, 20141 votes

this skin is awesome however i like malz better as a champ so i'll probably get snow day malzahar, also void poro is so cute

AetherKingdomNov 20, 20141 votes

I can tell that you don't play melee champions.

ChortleNov 20, 20142 votes

why is that?

AetherKingdomNov 20, 20141 votes

why is that?

You are happy that Kalista came out.

ChortleNov 20, 20141 votes

That doesn't mean I don't play melee champions haha

I main Sejuani actually.

I find Kalista to be super cool just as a character in general.

AgidyneNov 20, 20142 votes

Maybe because they can't even touch ranged champions?

Especially if they don't have any gapclosers.

Riot just favors ranged champions wayyyy too fucking much.

I mean, look at Ryze . Amazing late game and probably the biggest top lane bully atm. You just can't get close to the creep wave without eating a full combo.

I had no trouble with bullies like Renekton, Garen and Darius, mostly because are meele and can be outtraded if they missplay and such.

But Ryze? How the hell do you missplay with that thing?

I wish we had another Yasuo who shits on ranged champions and his passive is "This champion cannot be banned while in Champion Select"

ChortleNov 20, 20143 votes

Ryze is on Riot's radar of who is too strong currently. They have already talked about monitoring him closely and adjusting accordingly.

I don't think ranged champions are too much of an issue with maybe an exception to Ryze.

Most of them tend to be pretty squishy and with the amount of gap closers available to tanks/assassins these days, they can be dealt with pretty easily in many situations.

I think the fault lies more within the community not wanting to try changing things up and sticking to the meta too much. That's simply my personal opinion though.

AgidyneNov 20, 20142 votes

I think the fault lies more within the community not wanting to try changing things up and sticking to the meta too much. That's simply my personal opinion though.

The thing is, most ranged champions can be played somewhere else.

Quinn can go adc, she was designed for that role. She simply goes top lane because it's easy to poke someone who can't poke her back.

Same with many mid laners like Lissandra. Lissandra on the hands of a good player is really tough to deal with. But she doesn't go mid, she goes top because, again, it's safer to poke someone who can't poke you back.

Top lane has always been the lane were bruisers fought each other, but everything changed when the Ranged Meta Attacked.

Now they can't go top because they are 100% jungle reliant. They can't jungle because most of them don't have any sustain and the new jungle is brutal for those sort of champions. They can't mid because they be outclassed by another ranged champion.

And if they are sadistic enough, they can go bot to get poked down by a Caitlyn Morgana.

It simply is no fun to be a bruiser anymore. The only good one is Maokai and he already got nerfed countless times ever since he was first seen in the top lane.

ChortleNov 20, 20141 votes

Top lane has always been the lane were bruisers fought each other, but everything changed when the Ranged Meta Attacked.

Avatar reference +1

I do agree with you that bruisers have been getting the shaft in terms of meta favoritism. What champions are you referring to in particular? I know a lot of older bruiser champs are in line for gameplay updates

ChortleNov 20, 20141 votes

Really the only gold income item I can see working would be relic. Also I would see them starting in bot lane and after first back or so roaming if the situation called for it. Just increased viability for them as supports in general.

The idea of the jungle changes is to promote jungler diversity, not shut a class of junglers out from the jungle

I'm sure they won't be shut out. Like you said, they will probably be buffed to come back into play.

SmokingPuffinNov 20, 20141 votes

Quinn can go adc, she was designed for that role. She simply goes top lane because it's easy to poke someone who can't poke her back.

Quinn is a terrible ADC. She can go ADC like Jayce can go ADC.

It's natural to have some ranged anti-melee champions, and for melee players to complain about them. Quinn really suffers against opposing ranged champions in lane, though. Her laning profile is reasonably balanced; see if you can get your mid laner to swap you if you get counterpicked by her.

Same with many mid laners like Lissandra. Lissandra on the hands of a good player is really tough to deal with. But she doesn't go mid, she goes top because, again, it's safer to poke someone who can't poke you back.

Lissandra hates playing mid. Just like Quinn, she's naturally an anti-melee ranged champion and loses to most ranged champions in lane.

Top lane has always been the lane were bruisers fought each other, but everything changed when the Ranged Meta Attacked.

I think that top lane = bruiser, and mid = mage, was a bad thing about season 2. I would much prefer to see a game where there are members of each class of champions that can go in each role, so we have more strategic diversity. That is mostly happening these days - there are some mid lane fighters, jungle assassins, top lane mages, etc. We're not all the way there yet; in particular we have a problem where immobile melee champs mostly suck. I like this better than always bruiser top, always mage mid, always ADC/support bot. Way too stagnant.

Now they can't go top because they are 100% jungle reliant. They can't jungle because most of them don't have any sustain and the new jungle is brutal for those sort of champions. They can't mid because they be outclassed by another ranged champion.

Every class goes through ebbs and flows. At the start of the season, bruisers were crazy good. At the end of season 4, they were pretty weak. I don't have a good read on the preseason balance, so I'll refrain from commenting there.

In the event that your story of bruisers being banished from the game comes true, it will be fixed. Riot isn't going to leave 1/3 of the champions on their roster out of the game for long.

And if they are sadistic enough, they can go bot to get poked down by a Caitlyn Morgana.

Morg Cait is a terrible lane to take against bruisers. Need more damage and mobility. Morg excels at solving mages, not sustained damage stuff. I would expect a Jarvan/Pantheon sort of thing to beat that lane.

ChortleNov 20, 20141 votes

I wasn't speaking in terms of gold or xp as a reward. Riot is trying to give more options to junglers in S5. S4 was all about ganks with the exception of the few junglers who could make use of item 3160 .

By "more rewarding" I'm saying the difficulty of the jungle in turn gives a more rewarding feel when cleared optimally. More thought needs to go behind which camp you start at and which camp you smite. It's no longer brainless farming then gank or counter-jungle. The more difficult the jungle, the higher sense of achievement one receives from clearing it which I am totally behind. (similar to the Dark Souls games)

Tragically some champions are proving to have a hard time with the increased toughness of the jungle, but others will truly thrive with the new jungle items and summoner 11 options.