Give some love to the AP champions please

How Do You Meta·Dec 19, 2015·42 votes·2,275 views

You nerfed every single AP item, made all of them more expensive, gave every AD user updated swag on their AD items and are even planning on making another AD assassin item, so now what? It seems that Riot always loves to nerf one class into uselessness and then buff the hell out of other classes and cycles their love/hate for them every other quarter of the year. If everyone all goes AD because AP is getting shittier by each patch, then that makes being a tank even easier because you would only need to build armor.

60 Comments

AuryielDec 19, 201520 votes

You know something's wrong when the only reason to bring a mage along is ''the enemy team will go full armor''

How Do You MetaDec 19, 20152 votes

{quoted}

You know something's wrong when the only reason to bring a mage along is ''the enemy team will go full armor''

Well either way you need a combination of magic and physical damage or else that is the problem you run into where the tanks easily can negate all sources of damage :/

AudiomancyDec 19, 20155 votes

Just play Corki mid :^)

KnoyleDec 19, 20152 votes

Enemy team: MasterYi Yasuo Caitlyn Riven Thresh

Rammus You can't hear it, but he's laughing so hard he accidentally R'd

Big LincolnDec 19, 20158 votes

mages are fine

Remlap1223Dec 19, 20151 votes

Yep, cuz it's not like the only mage that ever gets played is Brand and Ahri. Oh wait.

I Miss CannonDec 19, 20154 votes

NOT LIKE 8 MAGES ARE IN THE TOP 10 PLAYED MIDS, NOOOO

NekusenDec 19, 20151 votes

{quoted}

NOT LIKE 8 MAGES ARE IN THE TOP 10 PLAYED MIDS, NOOOO

MID is a "MAGE" lane, the fact that MOST matches you are facing either a Yasuo or a Zed in mid says something.

I Miss CannonDec 19, 20152 votes

No, Mid is a lane where those champions are played who need levels to scale plus are relatively weak in the first levels. Zed and Yasuo just happen to be also champions who have those attributes.

WalkingInACircleDec 20, 20151 votes

Zed and Yasuo weak in the first few levels. Is uh, that what you're going with? Really?

Mid is a lane that suits two types of champions - those that need its short distance for gank safety, and those that roam. Mages make it a home for the former, assassins for the latter.

I Miss CannonDec 20, 20151 votes

Yes they are pretty weak in the first levels. Zed can easily be bullied out of lane by many mages pre-6. Yasuo is another story because of his Wind Wall but anything that doesn't rely on skillshots should beat him up too, also he's the champion who probably has the most vulnerability to ganks in the game.

Big LincolnDec 19, 20154 votes

http://champion.gg/statistics/#?sortBy=general.playPercent&order=descend&roleSort=Middle

2 champs out of the top 10 played mid are AD

WalkingInACircleDec 19, 20152 votes

On the other hand, 7 out of 48 mid champs are AD.

chipndip1Dec 19, 20152 votes

{quoted}

On the other hand, 7 out of 48 mid champs are AD.

You'd say that even if there was only one ad champ in the top ten, huh?

Remlap1223Dec 19, 20151 votes

Do you even statistics? If there are one hundred AP mid laners in the game, but only ten AD champs, yet the AD champs are played at a higher percentage of games and in a higher spot in the top ten (like they kinda are now), it's a problem. Why is Zed and Yasuo more attractive options than 41 AP mid laners besides Ahri, Lux, and Fizz for obvious reasons?

Big LincolnDec 19, 20154 votes

2 AD mid laners who were always popular remaining to be popular is not an issue.

Yasuo is not outperforming mages, either. Zed is good in the current snowball meta.

And yet mages despite all their imagined suffering have not declined at all with the exception of Veigar and, iirc Mid Karma. Most of them are, at worst, slightly more barred by mana regen being less accessible (for good reason, they often have absurd utility).

I Miss CannonDec 19, 20157 votes

And yet they are still strong as always and the Mid lane Meta still favours every AP champ that isn't Trashkaiser, Feedarina or Nidanerf.

CatastropDec 19, 201511 votes

Those sound like legit Pokemon names.

RedagaDec 20, 20151 votes

meanwhile, Top, ADC and Jungle are main by AD / Hybrids champions, your point?

I Miss CannonDec 20, 20151 votes

If AD champs are so much more superior to AP champs then why are not even 1/3 of the top 20 pick rates AD mids???? Why are 11 of the top 20 win rates overall AP champs????????? Why are the people here so retarded??????????????

RedagaDec 20, 20151 votes

{quoted} If AD champs are so much more superior to AP champs then why are not even 1/3 of the top 20 pick rates AD mids???? so you have to straw man to only 1 rol out of 5 to try to make your point valid? thats sad bro

I Miss CannonDec 20, 20151 votes

You're sad "bro".

GlockHammerDec 19, 20156 votes

Uhm, recipe prices have been raised across the board, it's not something that has just affected apcasters.

RedagaDec 20, 20151 votes

if you sit and do the math, AP items got more Gold increase, WHILE some item even got a nerf of the starts.

most of the AD items that got gold increase, either remained the same or even got a buff

RisenDarkKnightDec 19, 20154 votes

Gotta love it when item 3092 is the most efficient ap/mana regen item :(

TheLastShadow45Dec 19, 20153 votes

they will in S6, The next "class" they are updating is mages.

MunchCrunchLunchDec 19, 20153 votes

the only problem with mages is yasuo. tbh. counters most of them hard core.

ZLbSwAR23IDec 19, 20156 votes

Yasuo doesn't counter anyone you muppet. He's an easy lane and if you can't beat him it's because you're not very good, sad but true.

Kilo of KozDec 19, 20153 votes

Can you honestly say Yasuo doesn't counter anyone? It's very likely that I'm just bad, but playing against Yasuo as Vel'Koz seems impossible. Whenever I try to damage him, he either has his shield up, blocks my abilities with his windwall, or simply dodges them with his dashes. I can't stay too far because I lose experience and can't push the wave (which leads to it building up and him being able to dash around even more), I can't go too close or I get dashed into and crit a billion times, and I can't just poke him down because of his shield passive. So if you could explain to me how to stop being a muppet and make this an easy lane, please do, as I'd like to improve however I can.

DunkinNoobsDec 19, 20151 votes

Vel'koz has a 56% winrate against Yasuo. If you can't make the matchup work, that's a "you" problem.

Also, have you guys been watching All Stars and IEM at all? If you'll notice, it's a mage on both sides the vast majority of games.

KnoyleDec 19, 20151 votes

It goes both ways. A Yasuo that is actually skilled is stuff of nightmares. The half decent ones are just nuisances but anyone with skill behind him are not something you can ignore for a second and I doubt anyone is going to outright win lane against him in this situation outside of his hard counters and tanks.

FrickendaChickenDec 20, 20151 votes

Yasuo's dash has a set range going to and away from you when he hits you, if you learn this range by either studying him or playing him you can easily knock him up into your other abilities, as he cannot use windwall during his dash. Poke with your autos HARD at level 1, and he'll have a hard time farming and fighting back as he has nothing at level 1. Be careful of his HUGE level two damage spike. If you have the reaction time, as he dashes into your minions or you, you can Q right on his face for poke. le Breathe in Your ult cannot be wind walled. But your W can, you can use 1 stack of your W at a time safely. And once his wind wall is down, you have SO MUCH opportunity to kill him. I fear for my life against a good Vel as Yas. Once I use my windwall, I have almost no way to defend against you, and that true damage is terrifying. Last thing. Don't use your ultimate until he has E'd on you already, or you have someone or someway to get enough hits off on him. His Dash can dodge the Lazer faster than you can move it, so it's best to use it when there're none of your minions near him, he has dashed on you already and just recently, and/or your jungler helps you with keeping him still. Hope this helped.

Kilo of KozDec 20, 20151 votes

Thank you, up until now my only strategy for Yasuo as Vel'Koz was to sit behind my turret, wave clear and hope for a good gank.

RedagaDec 20, 20151 votes

ALL range mages are Yasuo counter.

Yasuo is strong against hybrid (AD/AP)/ assassins mages. that goes into close combat,

NekusenDec 20, 20151 votes

{quoted}

ALL range mages are Yasuo counter.

this would be true if yasuo didnt have a gap closer, a free shield, a barrier that deletes most ranged damage and enough damage to delete any mage.

RedagaDec 20, 20151 votes

one well landed AA removes the passive shield Xerath Q E R W E Syndra W E Veigar W

All mages long range mages have a mean to poke Yasuo early game, he becames a pain in the ass once he build item 3087

NekusenDec 20, 20151 votes

{quoted}

one well landed AA removes the passive shield Q E R W E W E W

All mages long range mages have a mean to poke early game, he becames a pain in the ass once he build

and when you get close enough to AA him, he dashes and you are dead. that or he just wind wall's you... so many options.

YumaS2AstralDec 19, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Yasuo doesn't counter anyone you muppet. He's an easy lane and if you can't beat him it's because you're not very good, sad but true.

While Yasuo does not beat all mages, being unable to beat him does not mean you are not very good (unless you outright feed him).

Zed is also a big problem at mid lane. Zhonya is an incredibly innefective item to rush unless you are a Fizz (which is not an actual mage, but an assassin). Not only it is expensive, but it also lacks any mana regeneration or mana. Forcing a mage to rush it means setting him behind because he can't reach his powerspike. I don't even blame anyone for not rushing Zhonya against Zed anymore, since it is such an inneficient item.

I Miss CannonDec 20, 20151 votes

You're not supposed to buy Zhonyas, you're supposed to rush Seekers Armguard and finish it later if you became a target that's worth for Zed to assasinate.

GentzerDec 19, 20153 votes

Mages are doing just fine, you'll have a mid mage most of the time because they surprisingly are still good. The best mids are pretty much all mages.

Weasel KenseiDec 19, 20152 votes

Yes, its called flavor of the month.

Flavors of the month cause many in the player base to switch to meta champs, they often spend RP to buy them, and skins for them. So Riot tills over crap champs that few people play, and reworks them into money factories... I mean flavor of the month.

You know... for $$$.

FrickendaChickenDec 20, 20151 votes

Riot gets more money from having good gameplay over reworking someone. People won't buy their things unless they enjoy it. I have a poppy skin because I enjoy poppy, same for Aatrox. I don't enjoy Fizz, so I don't have a skin for him. People buy their new skins on new and reworked champs because they read/see the new playstyle and go "that's something I enjoy to look at and I would enjoy to play so I will purchase something for that and I will dedicate my time to them"