I was playing zed the other day and throughout the mid to late game I realized that Zed's AD is massive. I already knew that he has higher AD than most other champions but I reached 676 AD by late game. My build was: Bloodthirster Infinity Edge Ravenous Hydra Boots of Mobility Blade of the Ruined King and Last Whisper I also had baron, 3 dragons, and elixir of wrath
With aspect of the dragon (5 dragons) I imagine I would've had over 700 AD. This seriously needs a nerf.
Superdum26 votesThe build is full damage, if course he would have a lot of AD
Erockandroll10 votesThe Problem with this is that it's several standard deviations from most of the Zed Builds I have seen. Which is mostly BotRK, and large amounts of Armor Pen.
Drogmyre3 votesThe Problem with this is that it's several standard deviations from most of the Zed Builds I have seen. Which is mostly BotRK, and large amounts of Armor Pen.
More than Last Whisper+ Runes and Masteries is really just overkill though. Why have another 10 armor shred (which would only be really useful vs. tanks anyway, since you're stripping squishies naked) when you can have 100+ additional AD?
Kuroi863 votesThe armor pen is as good as pure AD for him, not to mention that brutalizer grants cdr which is like gold for Zed. Youmuu's and ionian boost plus cdr from runes/masteries can easily put you at 35% which is a big power spike for Zed. Heck I've seen some Zed builds have youmuu's, ionian and even BC. Going big on AD is nice, but it's also costly, armor pen items are a lot cheaper and you can snowball a lot faster with the stats they give.
asktiks7 votesinb4 all the zed mains telling you "build armor noob zed is underpowered l2p"
but lets nerf his attack speed right? that's the problem oh yeah syndra is too oppressive mid lane too, zed isn't , so lets gut syndra BEFORE even removing dfg ...umm lets see who else is good mid ap?
OH YEA
AHRI!
lets gut her dmg amp too and make her into a kite mage because we need more and she can lane bully zed mid too
also lets remove DFG but lets leave the abomination that is BOTRK in game , suck it
sincerely , Rito
Silents4299 votesNo Zed main has ever said that, and for the love of god Zed is still going to get more tweaks in upcoming patches, they have more for him then just an attack speed nerf, You people need to stop being so god damn impatient with everything, in a patch or two they are going to have mana fixed, Assassins in their place, and then your going to go bitch about something else, its tiring.
BakedLotion8 votesNo Zed main has ever said that, and for the love of god Zed is still going to get more tweaks in upcoming patches, they have more for him then just an attack speed nerf, You people need to stop being so god damn impatient with everything, in a patch or two they are going to have mana fixed, Assassins in their place, and then your going to go bitch about something else, its tiring.
They sure took their time looking for possible nerfs.
Meanwhile every other champion doesnt nearly have as much time to be "looked into."
The amount of favoritism rito has with zed and lee sin is real.
RIP
asktiks4 votesin a patch or two they are going to have mana fixed
see that right there is the problem
BEFORE tuning mages, removing dfg , assessing how any mana using champions bully lane potential , any of THAT they SHOULD HAVE worked on normalizing mana for EVERY mana user THEN tweak individual champs if they were oprressive, spammy , whatever that's part of the problem with that mentality of "it will be fixed in a patch or two" because then we get to wait another "patch or two" for them to fix the stuff they are inevitably going to break with this knee jerk balancing,
hey I don't play zed, but one look at his kit, stats , base dmg, scaling etc, plus having played COUNTLESS matches against him as every mid you could think its somewhat viable in this meta ,I can tell you where his problem is, up the energy costs a LITTLE on his early ranks of shadow and shuriken , remove so much ad scaling from his W , perhaps hurt his waveclear a bit by the AS nerf as intended but not so much that he is only a AA spam slash bot either I mean I get what hes supposed to be , you can keep that without him being so risk free, perhaps a small nerf on his commitment to ult kill you
that said, it IS pretty double standarded that they rush the ahri/mages changes so fast because "we don't like one shot no counterplay gameplay" yet they refuse to touch EXACTLY that ability on zed and not a word on their plans as to what they intend on doing to assasins that still posses this one button no counterplay gameplay themselves AND they don't have to worry bout resource ( only if you are playing shen and kennen and imho kennen is a perfect example of how energy champs should be done)
Silents4293 votesNo, You haven't played Zed your the person that hears how OP he is, reads his stats and thinks "Oh god he IS overpowered" without knowing any of his mechanics and how to actually play him outside of him stomping your ass.
Go load up a game as him, Post the results as the first time you Zed, I am just dieing to hear you tell me how overpowered and easy he is to use. Oh, I won't be hearing that? Zed has massive damage if he can land his abilities, But. And this is a big but, If he doesn't he loses a significant damage, He is a hard champion to play, and while that's not an excuse for his current state your blowing him way out of proportion and so is everyone else, he is worse right now from the Mana problems like you "subtly" brought up already.
Yes the order in which they have been doing things could have been better, but shit happens and I am sure they think its a good idea, afterall they are the game designers and you are not. But for the love of god, shut the hell up about him now, They said they are going to fix Zed, They have a small but larger change coming, along with more, Their is literally NO REASON to keep bringing it up over and over again in these threads unless your fishing for upvotes or to rile up everyone again, find something better to complain about.
cFlame2 votes{quoted} shut the hell up about him now, They said they are going to fix Zed, They have a small but larger change coming, along with more, Their is literally NO REASON to keep bringing it up over and over again in these threads unless your fishing for upvotes or to rile up everyone again, find something better to complain about.
You see, when the community doesn't react properly to certain things, Riot takes that as an important note on they're note pad and remembers it when making finishing touches for the next patch. If the community doesn't say something, the gameplay design team won't do anything unless they think they need to. If the community gives input on whats wrong and whats right, then they can fix that, or TRY to. So if they announced they would buff a certain champion, but very little of the actual community responds then they may very well decide: "Alright! No problems! We can take this off our lists for this year." What ends up happening is the community will then start giving its input and ask for changes, but Riot will not change it back. If not enough people respond then Zed will just receive a pat on the nipple and nothing will be solved. Besides, if your sick of this stuff you don't actually need to read it or go through these threads. :P Giving less attention to these supposed "QQers" would help make everyone stop giving them attention.
asktiks1 voteswow I don't even....
did I or did I not say I didn't play zed? also good job on ranting and going all " l2pzednoob hes underpowered , oh yeah ...I did say INB4 zed mains tell me l2p zed is fine didn't I?? thx for doing EXACTLY what I said you were going to do
also, zed loses a significant chunk of his dmg if he misses his abilities....do you not see the hypocrisy and the idiocy of such statement? YOU ARE ACTUALLY PROVING ME RIGHT!! so only if zed "MISSES HIS ABILITES" (two of wich are shadow and slash wich literally cant be fucking missed, the other is ultimate wich CANT be missed , and other is shuriken the only one that can miss... as opposed to ...velkoz? ALL his abilities are skillshots..I got plenty of games with him doing good actually , if he misses his skills he gets ZERO dmg, if you dodge his ultimate not only you got ZERO dmg ..IVE JUST ROOTED MYSELF FOR YOU!!
don't talk to me about skill using zed as a reference you putz, makes you look like exactly what I started with, a disgruntled zed main that wont listen to ANYTHING other than what he wants to hear
also , zed worse than the mana problems I subtly brought up...wow...just....wow...if you tell me zed has energy problems I will permalink this and even make a memed youtube video out of it for crying out loud
no zed is not "a hard champion to play" both his pick rate, win rate say otherwise
syndra? hard to play azir? hard to play tresh? hard to play effectively velkoz? yeah purely skillshot based champ much like ez , get a SLIVER of lag and good luck landing anything
zed? press R , do your combo, press R to return to safety also , don't worry about resource regen items, you can go straight to dmg ...
enemy building armor? NO PROBLEM you get passive AD and AS , all we need is LW !! zed hard to play....give me a break! lol
GigglingAngel1 votesNo Zed main has ever said that, and for the love of god Zed is still going to get more tweaks in upcoming patches, they have more for him then just an attack speed nerf, You people need to stop being so god damn impatient with everything, in a patch or two they are going to have mana fixed, Assassins in their place, and then your going to go bitch about something else, its tiring.
You think mana is getting fixed in a patch or two? ROFLROFLROFL
Silents4291 votesI will be sure to respond to this comment when they fix it.
GigglingAngel1 votesI will be sure to respond to this comment when they fix it.
And I'll actually be thrilled if you do, because it does need to be fixed. But I highly doubt it will, and I'll continue to sadly laugh when it hasn't been dealt with properly.
GuilIermo6 votesThe reason why Zed has uber AD is because you are adding like 30 ad with the elixir (because of Living Shadow passive) and than another 16% AD than another 40 AD for baron. So for every 1 AD its about 40% more than regular. So for every 1 AD it is 1.4 AD on Zed or something like that. With that in mind if you do the math, you have exactly 300 bonus AD from items plus 112 AD at level 18. So with that item set you have 412 AD plus 40 from baron and another 25 from your elixir. With that you have 477 AD and than the extra 41% from dragon and living shadow. That means you should have 672 because of the passive. Without the dragon passive it removes almost 95 AD from his final AD. So without baron, the elixir and dragon you would only have 412 AD. It is just a matter of the bonus AD those 3 things give you. Most champions with those items would have like 300 AD
asktiks1 votesalso mastery that increases bonus dmg based on percentage too
JJI7441 votes[{quoted}](name=El Pollo Locco6,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=072dtJ5n,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2015-01-25T16:13:50.153+0000)
The reason why Zed has uber AD is because you are adding like 30 ad with the elixir (because of Living Shadow passive) and than another 16% AD than another 40 AD for baron. So for every 1 AD its about 40% more than regular. So for every 1 AD it is 1.4 AD on Zed or something like that. With that in mind if you do the math, you have exactly 300 bonus AD from items plus 112 AD at level 18. So with that item set you have 412 AD plus 40 from baron and another 25 from your elixir. With that you have 477 AD and than the extra 41% from dragon and living shadow. That means you should have 672 because of the passive. Without the dragon passive it removes almost 95 AD from his final AD. So without baron, the elixir and dragon you would only have 412 AD. It is just a matter of the bonus AD those 3 things give you. Most champions with those items would have like 300 AD
You forgot the bonus %AD from his W passive. 25% bonus AD~=75 bonus AD.
Then you add in dragon/baron/elixer.
junglerboy164 votesThat is indeed what he said right here:
With that you have 477 AD and than the extra 41% from dragon and living shadow.
Kuroi864 votesLooks great on paper, but going to lose out on a lot of early power going for 
over 
Drogmyre2 votesLooks great on paper, but going to lose out on a lot of early power going for
Could always swap out BT for a Youmuu's or Cleaver.
Kuroi864 votesTruthfully, he'd have been as strong if not stronger with a proper build.
grLKQ9ma0o1 votesWhy the heck would you build Cleaver with Ghostblade? You only get the armor pen from one of them, so while you get the passive of one, I'd much rather have a Hydra or BT instead of the cleaver.
Kuroi862 votesCDR, AD, health and armor shred from cleaver AD, CDR, a bigger pen passive and the active from ghostblade Yeah, there's a slight waste in gold, but it's really negligible. Though yes, hydra could be a good replacement for one. I wouldn't waste my time on BT though if I was you.
2 much sauuuce1 votesYou get the armor pen from both silly. It's a unique passive to the item, but not in general. Having Cleaver, Ghostblade and Brutalizer is maximum flat armor pen. They stack with each other, just not in multiples of themselves.
shadecrapper1 votesThats a great build, but its so troll. Mainly . But I guess most assassins should get it. The poor guy that finally kills Zed just to see him get back up lol
Kuroi863 votesIf you're ahead, then likely you're going to be a high priority target, having GA means even if you make a mistake, you've a chance to keep from getting shut down and avoiding the enemy team making a come back.
Alpharite1 votesHow the hell is that troll? It's standard...
JevelFaithful1 votesCorrection : troll for the enemy team. All damage, then you get to kill zed. Then GA pop in and you didn't kill him.
shadecrapper2 votesExactly, I didnt mean troll as in its bad for the game or something.
MrPerson102 votesYou built virtually full AD with no armor pen /CDR. what did you honestly expect when you swap out CDR for AD? is a huge part of zed's power spike and there's no reason not to prioritize it along with 
in any situation.
Totalis2 votes"I BUILT A LOT OF ITEMS THAT GIVE A LOT OF AD, AND, UNBELIEVABLY, I HAD A LOT OF AD! NERFFFFFF HIMMMMM"
really cant tell if i should be taking this seriously
cFlame3 votesBuild the same items on Fiora. Build the same items on Master Yi, build the same items on anyone else with massive base and scaling attack damage, you never have more than 530.
JustMyBassCannon1 votesWell, first, I just added up all of those bonuses, plus Zed's passive, and only got close to 636 after adding up masteries as well as the OP's runes. Either I'm missing something or they're missing something.
And second, with that same setup, Yi hits 583 AD. And, assuming I'm missing the same something, it could be higher than that.
cFlame2 votesHmmm.... That's stupidly ridiculous. I assumed it wasn't possible, never mind my bad, Riot really needs to pay more attention to these things ugh.
JustMyBassCannon1 votesWhat's so horrible about Zed or Yi hitting 600-700 AD?
It wasn't long ago that literally any champ could get that much. Buy six Bloodthirsters (or five and an SotO) and you have the highest AD possible.
The thing is, bonus AD does jack if you don't have AS, Crit and ArPen. Use the same champion, but get up to 300 AD while also building enough AS and Crit to multiply the DPS significantly higher than just having a large pile of AD can accomplish.
Yes, there are spells that scale on AD. Which means you can specialize an AD champion for burst by building AD and CDR, instead of AD, AS and Crit for high DPS.
Space Hitman2 votes"Using a far from optimal full AD item build other than the universally core BotRK and Last Whisper, alongside Baron buff, the first AD buff from Dragon, and the AD elixir... with all of these items amounting to an extreme amount of gold generally being much more than what one would acquire in any average or even above average length game, I had far too much AD on Zed."
This has to be the most well thought out, intelligently composed argument I have ever seen on the forums.
Sike.
chide da jungler2 votesbut LCS plays!
Sukishoo1 votesThat's nothing. I've had Riven up to over 1200 AD.
WhereTheNamesAt2 votesHow? the max AD i have ever had with riven was 875.
Sukishoo1 votesWell you can't do it now but take 5 old Bloodthirsters, Sword of the Occult and make sure to have GP & Sona on your team, pop rivens ult and you could push the AD up so high. Could probably get it fairly high still though if you get the right items.
WhereTheNamesAt1 votesahhh. I got 875 AD with full stacked sword of the occult and all the 80 damage items and her ultimate
Orangesilk1 votesFor zed to be balanced, he should be forced to build that kind of build to deal the damage he deals right now, he shouldn't be allowed to 100-0 people with only utility items.
JustMyBassCannon1 votesI would like for you to show a Zed killing someone with an all-utility build. I can believe the stories about a Zed with LW, BC and a quarter-ton of AD munching tanks and squishies alike, but a pure utility-built assassin isn't going to kill anyone with half a brain cell.
Orangesilk1 votesYou know why his core items are BotRK and Youmuus? They are UTILITY items that give him sticking power, splipushing ability, escapes and so on, he does this because his base damages are so stupid high he can get away with it, while Talon has to buy a pure burst item like Hydra, if Zed was forced to build damage in order to deal damage, he would be balanced.
Jefftiffy1 votesI don't think most people realize that the biggest problem isn't Zed its his lane opponents mana nerfs and being way too good of an item on assassins.
