C9 and TSM

Yxgl222HaX·Oct 16, 2015·2 votes·1,195 views

With the recent roster changes both teams are on shaky ground. 3 people on TSM stepping down, Lemon and most likely Hai going back into retirement from cloud9, both team rosters are really going to suffer with such a small pool to recruit from. But from what i can see both teams still have alot of POTENTIAL to rebuild. Tsm can rebuild around bjergson and C9 can rebuild around Sneaky, and trust to incarnations mechanical skill to hold down the mid lane. What i would like to see for cloud 9 is to either get a new top laner (no hate to balls but the competition is just beginning to out scale his improvement rate) and shotcaller, or they will fall lower than even this season. And TSM needs to find a shotcaller so that bjergson can focus more on making the plays and getting fed than watching everyone. C9 got better when hai could focus on shotcalling from the jungle and not worry about mid. Thats what tsm needs is their midlaner to have to worry about his opponets not his and everyone elses. A support or jungler would be ideal for this in my opinion. Again, this is all speculation and personal opinion so if you feel differently feel free to voice your own opinions.

8 Comments

FacyOct 16, 20152 votes

I hope that they will bring in some NA Talent and form it to be a worldclass player. I dont get why they r not trying it... there is like no risk in NA LCS to do it.

NA LCS is the weakest competition worldwide and the perfect place to bring in their own talent, cuz u will get away with this in this low lvl competition league. Then u have a whole year to form the talents and make them worldclass and those players will give everything to win something and might try harder than most pros will do when u buy them.

This is actually really low risk and could end in maximum reward if u formed that new guy to be a star player. I call BS to everyone who says NA has no talent, teams are just angry with no damn reason... their league competition cant fall lower anyways and teams like TSM and C9 will be top 5 at least even thoe they form their new talents to be great players.

Yxgl222HaXOct 17, 20151 votes

Its debatable. C9 had one single roster change and almost had to face relegation. Now 3 roster changes is daunting to say the least. Can TSM re-draft and form a team that is actually fun to watch again? Definatly. But i doubt they will do it in one split. Getting a team that works well together dosent just happen over night. I know they have the potential to win again and ill look foreward to seeing it, but in the mean time i can at least say for the first time in a long time, the underdog teams actually have a chance. I'll be looking foreward to seeing Renegades in the spring split 2016

TritanOct 17, 20151 votes

tsm wont suffer at ALL. they got rid of their 3 worst players, now they have a chance to rebuild themselves and truly tap their potential. and 2/3 are likely to be imports. all they have to do is find one na and then they have free choice. most likely for top/jg. id be interested in rush jungle. imagine facing rush + bjerg.

as for c9, they are gonna do really bad if they dont get a good jungler, because we saw what happened to them when they didnt have hai.

and this time around i think the lcs is gonna be closer then ever. renegades arent looking like a 10th place team at all, and i actually think c9 will finish 7th again. hai is literally their identity.

Yxgl222HaXOct 17, 20151 votes

Its true that they got rid of some of the weaker members but that is only a start. How they will preform entirely depends on what players they draft and lets face it, Loco really should not be coaching. Here is how Tsm suceeds - get Meteos or Rush as jungle, replace loco with someone not retardedly forcing the same stratagys over and over with someone who can adapt and do other strats when one no longer works, and get a top laner that can play champions like vlad and just play a safe non-feeding lane so the enemy does not snowball off them enough to take bjergson out easily. Honestly id like to see turtle go too. If Sneaky went to TSM and then they got a good support along with the other changes they would be the kings of NA with ease. There is no denying that sneaky is a world class ADC. What they need most of all, more than a tallented player pool is someone who can shotcall and make decisions for the team and have them followed instead of it being on bjergsons shoulders. Being tallented mechanically does NOT make you a good shotcaller that enspires faith plays from your team. Look at hai. Mechanically he was one of the lower tier midlaners yet his team made it to worlds and went 3/0 in week one off the back of his shotcalling. Bring a shotcaller with HALF of that potential to TSM, and you have yourself a dreamteam.

TritanOct 17, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Zed or Feed,realm=NA,application-id=9hBQwnEU,discussion-id=ylr6TtQA,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2015-10-17T02:10:37.877+0000)

Its true that they got rid of some of the weaker members but that is only a start. How they will preform entirely depends on what players they draft and lets face it, Loco really should not be coaching. Here is how Tsm suceeds - get Meteos or Rush as jungle, replace loco with someone not retardedly forcing the same stratagys over and over with someone who can adapt and do other strats when one no longer works, and get a top laner that can play champions like vlad and just play a safe non-feeding lane so the enemy does not snowball off them enough to take bjergson out easily. Honestly id like to see turtle go too. If Sneaky went to TSM and then they got a good support along with the other changes they would be the kings of NA with ease. There is no denying that sneaky is a world class ADC. What they need most of all, more than a tallented player pool is someone who can shotcall and make decisions for the team and have them followed instead of it being on bjergsons shoulders. Being tallented mechanically does NOT make you a good shotcaller that enspires faith plays from your team. Look at hai. Mechanically he was one of the lower tier midlaners yet his team made it to worlds and went 3/0 in week one off the back of his shotcalling. Bring a shotcaller with HALF of that potential to TSM, and you have yourself a dreamteam.

i agree with most of this.

however i dont think they need a super passive top laner. thats basically what dyrus was, he just sat top hoping to be carried. the thing is, that DOESNT work.

i definately agree with loco though.

i think if tsm gets something like rush, replaces loco, gets a standard sup, maybe xpecial/appolo, and then they get a top laner like impact. that would be the dream team, especially if impact could learn good english to shotcall, since he is super knowledgable and probably a good shotcaller.

if they were to replace the ad, i think freeze could definately be a good option as well as sneaky

Yxgl222HaXOct 17, 20151 votes

I personally would like to see xpecial, of all the people you mentioned i belive he would be the best shotcaller for tsm.

Mat7itanOct 17, 20151 votes

It's not that they were doing bad because they had a bad jungler. Meteos was a prety good jungler. The problem is that they had horrible shot calling (the shot caller also happened to be meteos after hai stepped down).

TritanOct 17, 20151 votes

{quoted}

It's not that they were doing bad because they had a bad jungler. Meteos was a prety good jungler. The problem is that they had horrible shot calling (the shot caller also happened to be meteos after hai stepped down).

well, the problem was that all of them were about average to below average. balls was mediocre, meteos was average, ( especially with the likes of rush, move, dom, and xmithie) incarnation AT THE TIME was below average, lemon was below average, and sneaky was good. their only player that was mechanically better then average was sneaky, and without a true leader and shotcaller they were nothing.

liquid, for example, was a team with really good players but really bad shotcalling and really bad communication. they were pretty much the opposite of c9. they still placed first in the summer split despite having terrible shotcalling and teamwork.

tldr: c9s problem wasnt just bad shotcalling, it was that their bad shotcalling was combined with bad individual skill, aside from sneaky. ( back then incarnation wasnt that great.)