@IronStylus - On Irelia's Eventual VU

ManDudeMcDudeman·Jul 15, 2014·4 votes·16,249 views

Dunno if you're the Rioter for this, because I have a few non-VU questions as well, but whatever.

Irelia's model is starting to show its age. It's definitely not as bad as Taric, Mordekaiser, or the rest of what remains of the Pizza Feet crew, but you can definitely see the difference between her and a more recent champion. Especially her hair. It's like she has an octopus living on her skull.

So basically, I have a few questions about Irelia's VU when it eventually becomes pertinent to start working on it (if you're not already), namely;

Morello's mentioned his desire to rework Irelia's kit several times in the past to help get her away from her "ball of stats" nature, as well as stating that Irelia's core theme may be changed as a result. Does this impact her VU-wise? Would a new kind of Irelia require a new kind of visual theme than what is present already? Would Morello's kit rework get in the way of a potential VU, or even coincide with one? What are the chances of pushing both reworks out at once, making Irelia a full champion relaunch? I won't ask for specifics on her kit rework from you, since it's not your department - mainly just how it relates to her visual style and the possibility of that changing.
What do YOU think Irelia's theme is or should be, visually or in-game? Does the way you envision her match with the way she's portrayed now?
Do you have any plans for Ionia at large, in terms of visual theming and cohesion? Most of the Ionian champions vary widely in terms of looks, from bright pastel ninjas like Akali and Kennen, to heavily-armored warriors like Irelia and Zed (he's wearing light armor, but he has quite a lot of it on).
Relating to my last question, what kind of relations would you like Irelia to have with other League champions, namely other Ionians or enemy Noxians? I would imagine she wouldn't think too highly of Yasuo or Darius, for example.
Are there any Irelia skins on the pipeline for once a VU is done? I know you guys are wont to make skins for champions who are on the pipeline for VUs, since it's more work for no reason, on an inferior rig and model, no less. What are some skin options you could explore with Irelia, and have done any concepting for them already?
Lastly, and I'm leaving this at the bottom because it's not Irelia-related, but how much will Shen change were he to receive a VU? He's portrayed as a tank in-game, yet visually, he's the exact opposite of a tank. How would you go about bringing Shen's tank identity forward, without overpowering his ninja identity, and vice-versa?

I've attached an Irelia picture for some eye candy. Seriously; why isn't this her splash art over in the States? I know you guys don't like using the Chinese art for champions on other servers, but come ON. That art is friggin' gorgeous.

Edit: And I seem to be unable to add attachments. Sigh.

21 Comments

RiotIronStylusJul 16, 20145 votes

I feel you on the Octopus head..

Morello's mentioned his desire to rework Irelia's kit several times in the past to help get her away from her "ball of stats" nature, as well as stating that Irelia's core theme may be changed as a result. Does this impact her VU-wise? Would a new kind of Irelia require a new kind of visual theme than what is present already? Would Morello's kit rework get in the way of a potential VU, or even coincide with one? What are the chances of pushing both reworks out at once, making Irelia a full champion relaunch? I won't ask for specifics on her kit rework from you, since it's not your department - mainly just how it relates to her visual style and the possibility of that changing.

I think that we'd end up making the two coincide. As she currently stands she would fall under the VGU (Visual & Gameplay Update), which pretty much means "full relaunch", but we don't use that term any more. Chances are we'd approach her as that sorta chunk. Similar to previous VGU's. Now.. that COULD change, but my bet is that we'd save the two (or three, depending on theme changes) to be, as you've said, a relaunch.

What do YOU think Irelia's theme is or should be, visually or in-game? Does the way you envision her match with the way she's portrayed now?

I think she's a bit dopey, but honestly I love the idea of Irellia. Unobtanium blade wielding telekinetic ionian genera? Fucking sweet. Let's make her legit! Maybe I'm boring but I'd just like to see that solidified. I have a concept floating around (which may or may not be the final, who knows) which takes some aesthetics from Karma and Yasuo and merges them in order to get Irelia, a young, fiery, headstrong Ionian military commander. Not sure if what I've got on paper will stay, but it's where we'll start.

Do you have any plans for Ionia at large, in terms of visual theming and cohesion? Most of the Ionian champions vary widely in terms of looks, from bright pastel ninjas like Akali and Kennen, to heavily-armored warriors like Irelia and Zed (he's wearing light armor, but he has quite a lot of it on).

Relating to my last question, what kind of relations would you like Irelia to have with other League champions, namely other Ionians or enemy Noxians? I would imagine she wouldn't think too highly of Yasuo or Darius, for example.

I'm not sure about Ionia in general, but we'd probably end up visiting her corner or it when we address her specifically.

Are there any Irelia skins on the pipeline for once a VU is done? I know you guys are wont to make skins for champions who are on the pipeline for VUs, since it's more work for no reason, on an inferior rig and model, no less. What are some skin options you could explore with Irelia, and have done any concepting for them already?

There's at least one that comes to mind that's concepted but I'm not sure it's really dependent on her VU. She's not in terrible art shape, she's just unhealthy for the game.. or so I hear.. She might get a skin before a VGU

Lastly, and I'm leaving this at the bottom because it's not Irelia-related, but how much will Shen change were he to receive a VU? He's portrayed as a tank in-game, yet visually, he's the exact opposite of a tank. How would you go about bringing Shen's tank identity forward, without overpowering his ninja identity, and vice-versa?

http://i.imgur.com/90s8ulv.jpg

I've attached an Irelia picture for some eye candy. Seriously; why isn't this her splash art over in the States? I know you guys don't like using the Chinese art for champions on other servers, but come ON. That art is friggin' gorgeous.

Edit: And I seem to be unable to add attachments. Sigh.

Lord Graves IIIJul 16, 20142 votes

Ooo. I don't know if you are the guy to tell this to, but something that always stood out to me about her is that she is technically an undead, or at least is from a certain perspective. When I read her lore I got a sort of lich vibe in the relationship between her and her swords. I read it as Soraka had to anchor her soul in her swords in order to keep her alive. This has been how I have (in my mind) justified her in game durability, shes sorta undead.

Irelia doesn't have much going on in terms of gameplay and theme synergy, but for some reason this aspect of her lore was something I felt was interesting. Shes an Ionian who escaped death. Gameplay wise shes a nearly unkillable killing machine (sorta like what Noxus tries to get with their undead soldiers).

I guess I always found that sort of neat lore wise and was curious if it was somthing you guys might play with, or something you'd more gloss over.

If glossed over, I figure it just frees up space to make her more of an Ionian martial archtype the way Garen is for Demacia and Darius is for Noxus. :D

LuninarephJul 16, 20142 votes

IronStylus, can you speak to the way Karma's lore revamp turned her into Irelia Mark Two and whether either one of them are going to be pushed away from the "revolutionary singlehandedly stopping an army and using the fame from her deed to empower her country to set aside their pacifistic beliefs and fight for their freedom" (to quote another post of mine) for some variety?

RiotIronStylusJul 21, 20142 votes

Not sure about Karma, I wasn't really around for that. But I think Irelia's bio and background are little too.. granular.. and she needs something of more broad strokes to make her into a character that truly matters. Again, if we can build around what she is at a glance, then we've got something. Not sure quite what that direction would be at the moment, but I think she's still a good place for elite Ionian general to have a space in the game.

EeyoreJul 22, 20142 votes

Please say she's going to remain a lich. That is one of the cooler little-known-facts, and perhaps the only interesting thing about her character. Her blades are a phylactery, the only thing Soraka could do to save her.

CuixJul 23, 20141 votes

I'm assuming that by "not really around for that" you mean "not in a position of influence while the main relevant work was being done", since you did chime in at least briefly.

Presumably, then, you've at least done a bit of research into the Karma Conundrum, like reading a bit of that thread and noting what players have had to say about her since then. In particular, I'm curious to know about the methods being used to gather information from players concerning things to keep, less important aspects, etc. RiotAmes mentioned some polling and questionnaires, which clearly did not suffice.

HemiPoweredDroneJul 16, 20142 votes

Personally I've always seen Irelia as a lich with her swords being her phylactery, as the began to float after she had died and Soraka tried to revive her. Is this the right interpretation? If it is, maybe it'd be cool to work with that idea of her, just a little, though? I'm not saying go full Karthus, but just some little bit of darkness might make her look cool.

Or maybe that would be a cool idea for a skin, to really lich her out. First idea that comes to mind for something like that would be something sort of like Marie from Skullgirls, though less maid-y.

http://www.fightersgeneration.com/nx9/char/marie-korbel-skullgirls-artwork.jpg

ManDudeMcDudemanJul 16, 20142 votes

I feel you on the Octopus head..

Almost as many tentacles as old Katarina. Ahh, the good ol' days.

I think that we'd end up making the two coincide. As she currently stands she would fall under the VGU (Visual & Gameplay Update), which pretty much means "full relaunch", but we don't use that term any more. Chances are we'd approach her as that sorta chunk. Similar to previous VGU's. Now.. that COULD change, but my bet is that we'd save the two (or three, depending on theme changes) to be, as you've said, a relaunch.

Figured as much. It makes the most sense when you think about it - doing one and then the other may completely invalidate the first one. I'm glad to see you've confirmed my suspicions, though. I'm both excited and nervous about Irelia's kit changes whenever they happen; on the one hand, she really does need some kit changes, but on the other... I've kinda grown attached. She and Olaf were two of the champions I first got into when I started playing League, and sadly they seem to be on the balance team's shit list. I should probably pick better next time...

I think she's a bit dopey, but honestly I love the idea of Irellia. Unobtanium blade wielding telekinetic ionian genera? Fucking sweet. Let's make her legit! Maybe I'm boring but I'd just like to see that solidified. I have a concept floating around (which may or may not be the final, who knows) which takes some aesthetics from Karma and Yasuo and merges them in order to get Irelia, a young, fiery, headstrong Ionian military commander. Not sure if what I've got on paper will stay, but it's where we'll start.

Definitely agree on the idea of Irelia. Floating blades of doom is badass.

Yasuo/Karma armor does sound pretty cool. I'd probably need to see a sketch or something to grasp the full idea, but I think I get it. Please tell me she's gonna keep the floating mantle-thingy. That thing's pretty iconic for Irelia, along with her sword.

I'm not sure about Ionia in general, but we'd probably end up visiting her corner or it when we address her specifically.

Fair enough. I'm assuming Yasuo and Karma fit into Irelia's corner of Ionia, then? They all seem to share similar aesthetic and thematic tones. Also, and I'm kinda assuming here, but where does Ao Shin fit into Ionia? Making the logistic stretch of Ao Shin being an Asian-styled dragon and Ionia being League's Asia here, but he seems Ionian to me.

There's at least one that comes to mind that's concepted but I'm not sure it's really dependent on her VU. She's not in terrible art shape, she's just unhealthy for the game.. or so I hear.. She might get a skin before a VGU

Awesome. I'm gonna try not to get my hopes up or expect one, but now I'm kinda stoked.

http://i.imgur.com/90s8ulv.jpg

Fat Shen would be the funniest thing on the planet.

Also, thanks for popping in and answering my questions. I definitely appreciate it.

Witch of OrleansJul 17, 20142 votes

I can't wait for Irelia to be ruined on both fronts, aesthetically and from a gameplay perspective.

Because that's what you're in for when you're leaving such things to IronStylus and Morello, respectively.

Edit: Sorry, I almost forgot to mention that I can't wait for them to ruin her lore as well by having some hack poorly rewrite it.

RiotIronStylusJul 21, 20147 votes

I can't wait for Irelia to be ruined on both fronts, aesthetically and from a gameplay perspective.

Because that's what you're in for when you're leaving such things to IronStylus and Morello, respectively.

Edit: Sorry, I almost forgot to mention that I can't wait for them to ruin her lore as well by having some hack poorly rewrite it.

This is the most broad generalization I've ever seen.

steelblackskyJul 21, 20141 votes

i avoided chiming in on the lich with orb portion of blade as phylactery when your first response came up (current assets need almost twice the animations of other champs based around hitens affect on that orb, and hitens dual blade arrangement to boot).

i think the less aggro way to get at what they mean is your short commentary on her sounded like.. well .. "Irelia, a young, fiery, headstrong Ionian military commander" which to give a visual comparison using popular media sounded like the younger edgier version of sg-1 skit from the stargate sg-1 "200" episode ( http://youtu.be/UAgODVbPq78 ).

i refrained from comment before on the basis that it IS you ironstylus, and we can trust you not to make it weird on the art side, but feel that parody centered on the impression might help clarify here and get some further clarification that is a little more targeted at defusing that impression which leads to things like the above broad generalization.

ManDudeMcDudemanJul 16, 20141 votes

I really wanna bump this, but I don't wanna do it without adding something to the thread...

Whatever. I don't even know if bumping works on these forums...

2dsystemJul 16, 20141 votes

Personally, I like her identity as a low health fighter, someone who thrives at that between 25-60% hp. I would like to see her w scale with her own missing health, that is if she keeps her sustain and true damage.

I like the idea of her e stunning targets with more health than her, but for some reason the skill as a whole just seems a little boring, a click to target melee range stun. As for her ult, I could do with something else. I really only find it useful for a little bit of healing in a fight, wave clear, and sheen procs, sheen procs being the most valuable to me out of those three. I dont think its a good thing to have an ultimate that only feels useful when you have a specific item, but maybe other people like the way her ult is.

I dont really feel strongly one way or another about her passive or q. I would like to see them stay, but just the same, if they were traded for something else, i dont think id be too broken up about it. Her built in tenacity is, imo, a core part of her identity, so I would like to see it stay in some part of her kit.

Also, a visual update would be really cool to see :D

SlashStrikerJul 16, 20141 votes

what bothers me about irelia is 2.5 seconds stun which is about 4 basic attacks for free while the stunned wont be able to do anything about it i see this is her escape option but she is using it offensively instead defensively he true damage doesnt scale and its a bit too much early lets say i am master yi where i dont heal using wuju style irelia not only does alot true damage early on but also heals twice as much i think the damage that irelia does should be similar to wuju style that is able to scale late game and i kinda dont understand that irelia gets 15 true damage per rank while wuju style gets 5 true damage per rank the flat difference is 3 times i think her Q needs some buffs

about shen personally i was disappointed when he was released as a tank instead being hyper assassin but thats my personal opinion i think shen fans must decide what they what shen to be but i think if he is suppose to be a tank he must have Tank Armor or something that symbolizes his tankyness right now he looks like he is wearing Cloth Armor instead Heavy Chainmail

Saint Tyrone Jul 17, 20141 votes

Nah, Sion goes first. http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/fancreations/emeGJGYk-sion-rework

loltruthJul 17, 20141 votes

I think Irelia is fine where she is although I'd love to see her ult mana cost scale up. Her ult costs 100 mana which chews up ~1/4 of her mana pool at lvl 6. I'd really like it to scale up like 80/100/120.

The InspectreJul 21, 20141 votes

From what I understand, any Gameplay updates for Irelia are really far off, and since the Gameplay and Visual updates would likely coincide, is there any chance of a texture update in the meantime?